List Mgmt. Contracts, trades, draft - 2022 superstar edition

[Keys]

Link to contract status of all players -

The Contracts Thread

2024 List Changes : Out: Retired- Gaff Delisted - Jones, Trew(R), Baker(R), Witherden, Burgiel, Culley(R), Rotham, L Edwards Traded - Darling (NM) Barrass (Hawthorn) In: Trade/FA acquisitions - Graham (Richmond) Baker (Richmond) Owies (Carlton) Draft - Allan (Pick 16) Shanahan (Pick 30) Gross...

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[boondy]

The problem with signing up all these oldies and carrying them into 2023 for "leadership", is that you just know they won't be taking a back seat.

Anyone thinking "It's ok gaiz, they're going to stay on and mentor the young group and only play a handful of games"



Simpson doesn't operate that way. Hurn still hasn't spent a second in the WAFL, neither did JK. There's the odd "managed" game every so often, but they always get straight back and the kids always get shown the door, and i don't expect that to change. See Cripps coming straight back after his huge layoff. There's a point where it's not supposed to be about form, but about getting the new generation into the system at the expense of the old servants. Hurn can keep carrying on racking up 22 disposals a game, where his young replacement might get 12 touches, but to what end? He's 35, our window is slammed shut.



Come round 1, it'll be Shuey, Redden, Gaff, Sheed with Kelly and Naitanui at the CBD's, as per usual. Culley won't feature and i doubt Chesser or this years draftees will either. Just like Clark, XON, West, if they finally manage to snag a spot, they'll be pushed into a role they don't play on the wing or flank.

Anyone would think yet another basket case season that has netted us only 2 wins and finally signified where our list is at, would mean this wouldn't be the case, but no doubt Simpson will back in the vets/stars/club servants, etc and think it'll all click again like 2018


We going to see any of Shuey, Redden, Naitanui, Hurn, run around for the Beagles in 2023? Apparently this is what they're signing up for, to play minimal games and be getting phased out, right? Cool story.


If they stay, they'll play. If they play, it only pushes more young players to the Beagles instead of them, where they're destined to get flogged.

The young players we put in the Beagles do play their position tho . Culley had a go in there . Winder is doing ok . Jamieson gets ruck time . Trew and O'Neil could attend plenty of centre bounces . West was prolific when he played Beagles . Bazzo , Hedwards got plenty of experience with ball coming in . What good prospect have we got that suffers in the Beagles ? Forwards would suffer in the Beagles perhaps but J Williams needs to build his fitness and he can run around on ball if he gets fit enough in the ruck . With some decent picks coming in and hopefully less injuries it must improve .

 

[Happy Mastenator]

I was 50/50 on Phillipou vs Wardlaw before Wardlaw re did his hammy, but the injury pushed me fully onto the Phillipou train as well.

My concern is that the average height of the gun midfielders is increasing each year. in 5 years time imagine we'll see a lot of gun mids at 190cm+ (or thereabouts) in the league. Wardlaw is 182cm. Not saying he can't make it and can't be a gun. It's just going to get harder for small midfielders.

 

[Dark Sharks]

The arguement for both Shuey and Hurn is that there is a lot of deadwood we can cut from the team before getting to them. We can only replace so many players in one year, so i'd rather have Hurn and Shuey for one more year than a mid 20's player that is going nowhere. SHuey and Hurn as depth are fine, they can be cycled out next year with Redden and potentially Nic Nat.

This just means instead of staggering the exit of all these seniors, you're losing all that experience at once at the end of 2023?

Only when that time comes, alarm bells will go off and they'll give someone an extra year longer than they should to avoid it.

The list turnover needs to start now and be a gradual process IMO.

Shuey isn't needed. Clark, West, XON, Culley, Midfielder draftee can all step straight into that position from next year. We lose little.

 

[Hook461123]

I personally don't want to go through another 2 win, multiple 100 point loss season.
Develop the kids in a win first mentality and make them earn their spots. Hopefully they push the senior guys out of the team. We might get pick 6/7 instead of pick 1/2 but I think we should be striving to put the best team on the park that we can. If that involves Hurn, Shuey, Nic then so be it.
We should try and win as many games as possible and create a winning culture rather then hand games to players just because they are younger. As long as Simpson has the balls to drop the senior guys if they aren't performing (which is still the big ?). If he doesn't he should be pushed out the door.

I can't imagine losing JK, Shuey, Hurn, Shep, Redden, Nic all at once will benefit the team. Unless we want the #1 pick next year I guess.
Theres enough deadwood around the sides to cut before you cut out the core.
People suggesting we just cut all the senior guys and somehow it wil expediate our rebuild to three years. I don't see that happening.
I think it will happen in stages and there is plenty of time to retire our champions.

 

[JackOutback]

Out of Redden, Hurn and Shuey it really should be Shuey who walks away, given he can't stay on the park.

Hasn't he played 16 games this year?

 

[Eastcoasteagle]

Good listen.

Kids very honest and I did love the sound of "The Eagles " that came out of his mouth.
I knew his day played for them, but I wasn't aware that his grandfather Peter also played over 200 games for them.

Also liked that he gave a shout out to Phoenix Foster, who is one of my favourites for a latter pick, our third rounder would be about where he comes into play, IMO , in the draft.

Port supporter but said, would be happy to go anywhere to pursue his dreams and isn't phased by going inter state.

I will be tracking his progression and development in the last part of the season for Woodville West Torrens.

He speaks well and there is an inner strength and confidence that comes through.

Kicked 3 in the reserves the other week!

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

Hasn't he played 16 games this year?

Played the last 12 straight games.

Fingers crossed he might actually have gotten his body right.

 

[Dark Sharks]

The young players we put in the Beagles do play their position tho . Culley had a go in there . Winder is doing ok . Jamieson gets ruck time . Trew and O'Neil could attend plenty of centre bounces . West was prolific when he played Beagles . Bazzo , Hedwards got plenty of experience with ball coming in . What good prospect have we got that suffers in the Beagles ? Forwards would suffer in the Beagles perhaps but J Williams needs to build his fitness and he can run around on ball if he gets fit enough in the ruck . With some decent picks coming in and hopefully less injuries it must improve .

Yeah fair point.

The real problem is around the fact they get annihilated each week partnered up with amateurs as teammates.

The lack of senior experienced players playing alongside them (because Simpson doesn't drop them, as well as injuries) means they're thrown in the deep end with players like Nelson, Rotham and Petrucelle to lean on.

Culley might have played mid, but he didn't get the quality midfield support around him. He had spuds to learn from and play with at the CBD's.

It's not good for a draftees development to be flogged each week. Jack Williams is constantly outnumbered and barely gets an inside 50 to show his wares, let alone a clean delivery.

 

[JackOutback]

Played the last 12 straight games.

Fingers crossed he might actually have gotten his body right.

There's no question his running has been affected, but his ability to step around opponents is still probably the best in the team. If he remains fit and they transition him to a forward flank with bursts in the middle, he could prove very valuable. Playing him on-ball the whole time, not so much.

 

[Eastcoasteagle]

I think Winder has improved over the course of the year too and is worth retaining at this point. Was worried about his tank and low impact but he’s been running out games well in the WAFL recently and has been one of our only bright lights in the reserves.

Definitely worth persisting with

 

[Ambrose Burnside]

It's not good for a draftees development to be flogged each week.

Flogged in the WAFL, or flogged in the AFL, neither ideal.

Jack Williams is constantly outnumbered and barely gets an inside 50 to show his wares, let alone a clean delivery.

So no different to Kennedy or Darling?

 

[shooshka]

The arguement for both Shuey and Hurn is that there is a lot of deadwood we can cut from the team before getting to them. We can only replace so many players in one year, so i'd rather have Hurn and Shuey for one more year than a mid 20's player that is going nowhere. SHuey and Hurn as depth are fine, they can be cycled out next year with Redden and potentially Nic Nat.

Shuey and Hurn would be the last 2 players on the list - as would the final 2 of the dead-wood players you refer to.

The question really is do we want another year of Shuey + Hurn, or 2 of West, Winder, Dixon, Foley, Witherden and JJ (I'd think JJ is safe regardless - but primary list spots are at a premium).

None of those listed are going to get to the heights of Shuey and Hurn, but I'd argue 4 of the 6 have shown improvement this year (Foley and Witherden not as much). I'm not advocating for any more than a 1-year deal for those who 'may' come on, but the time does seem right to take that risk - rather than getting a final year out of a few club champions (and there is no question those 2, plus Redden and Nic are champions of the club).

It's harsh - but if the club is being brutal (and brutally honest) then we have more than enough leadership through other players in the 25-30yo age bracket that we don't need any of the older brigade for that. So keeping them for leadership is not a valid argument, it would purely be that we see them as continuing to be B22 (agreed), and that we want to play our B22 ahead of developing youth (this is where I disagree).

My view is we likely lose all 4 (Shuey, Hurn, Redden and Nic) by the end of 2023. Add Kennedy that is 5. We should look at splitting that 2/3 or 3/2. So basically with Kennedy already retired we would ideally want 1-2 of those 4 moving on this season.

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

-Club standards (have they slipped?) Things that filter down to WAFL level like if you give away 50m or get justly suspended you should be hauled in front of the whole playing group, smashed on the track, have to go a few rounds with Hurn, whatever. If Sicily played for us he either learns not to mouth off or he's out the door.

Simpson has been very defensive when there have been calls that standards at West Coast have slipped. A number of pundits (not just the shock jock Corns) have highlighted players weight, our ability to run out quarters (not just 2022), preparedness to chase, difference in speed and willingness to run once way more than the other, etc. I have gone to most games this year and have witnessed players being outrun by their opponents. Loads of pointing but not enough "that is my responsibility". It was refreshing to see in the derby that we won the pressure acts, especially 1st half. Where has that been?

Darling was interviewed before his milestone game saying how things are more fun at the club and that he had noticed a real increase in intensity and increase in standards at training.

Great to hear that but for standards to have significantly increased, they had to have slipped. Simple. And it is across the board.

Your solution is pretty old school and can only be used on a limited number of occasions.

Your proposal is on the assumption that their is integrity at match committee. Clearly there has been a change mid this year where Simmo finally agreed that players need to come back via WAFL.

The dropping of XON after our Collingwood win and one of his best games should be replayed to Simmo's at his year end exit interview. Drop XON and bring in all three of Yeo, Shuey and Kelly. Simmo has since admitted they were underdone but and he was playing them to get fit in AFL.

Gaff is another example. He is obviously carrying an injury and having a very poor impact on games. How can you look at Winder this week and tell him based off his WAFL performance that Gaff is keeping him out of the side.

There were concerns stated publicly about Shuey's injury and his ability to be captain when it was known he would be missing chunks of the year. Simmo then said it was Shuey's total leadership that got him the gig. Not sure what you think but Shuey looks to me to be the worst captain we have ever had. I love the guy as a player but he should have not been appointed in 2022 and I hope like hell it goes to Barrass as he looks to be the shining light as a leader.

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

Tough one, as I really think the evenness between 3-15 is really close so when he was at 12 it was so line ball. Much harder to separate them this year than previous years.

I had Keeler as the premier key forward early days, loved the way he moved for this size - rare 200cm guys can move like that. But he faded a bit through the champs, so you could almost swap him and Cadman purely based on Cadmans consistency. I think 5-8 is about right for the moment.

I absolutely love the way he plays, great forward! I am a little concerned he's only 194cm as that's a bit undersized, but he could grow a few cm's and be perfect size still. He did play some weaker opposition in terms of key defenders, so I'm going to hold my final opinion until after he plays Vic Metro and hopefully lines up against Hayes! Hayes is a jet defender and is the perfect match up, both are a great mark, incredibly nimble for their size when the ball is on the ground and have some pace. So if he can do a number on Hayes, I might even put him top 2.

Cadman is now 196 cm and possibly still growing


He is looking like the Pieman's pick.

 

[bh90210fan]

Cadman is now 196 cm and possibly still growing

View attachment 1479322
He is looking like the Pieman's pick.

Trade our first next year and grab him and Phillipou

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

So the rumour is going about a contacted player wanting a trade - who?

I am thinking Petruccelle, Rotham or Waterman. Not going to get worried or excited about any of the three as I see them as in our best 18-30 range and not showing huge upside, but likewise not going to net us much.

FWIW - Fat X on hard ball gets was intimating that Shuey was not going to be playing next year. He did not articulate why and shut down the chat. Not sure if he is sh1t stirring or giving a hint.

 

[kane249]

So the rumour is going about a contacted player wanting a trade - who?

I am thinking Petruccelle, Rotham or Waterman. Not going to get worried or excited about any of the three as I see them as in our best 18-30 range and not showing huge upside, but likewise not going to net us much.

FWIW - Fat X on hard ball gets was intimating that Shuey was not going to be playing next year. He did not articulate why and shut down the chat. Not sure if he is sh1t stirring or giving a hint.

Someone mentioned Rotham earlier might have wanted a trade?

Ellis and Shuey are very close mates, so X might know the inside scoop

 

[Dark Sharks]

So the rumour is going about a contacted player wanting a trade - who?

I COME IN PEACE....

It's Barrass

 

[Chump Change]

So the rumour is going about a contacted player wanting a trade - who?

I am thinking Petruccelle, Rotham or Waterman. Not going to get worried or excited about any of the three as I see them as in our best 18-30 range and not showing huge upside, but likewise not going to net us much.

FWIW - Fat X on hard ball gets was intimating that Shuey was not going to be playing next year. He did not articulate why and shut down the chat. Not sure if he is sh1t stirring or giving a hint.

The only players I'd be worried about is OA, Sexual, Chesser, Culley. Anyone else, GTFO.

 

[Ambrose Burnside]

Someone mentioned Rotham earlier might have wanted a trade?

Ellis and Shuey are very close mates, so X might know the inside scoop

No real loss.

Downside is we won't get much for him.

Thought he was drafted with a pick in the 50s like Nelson. Unfortunately:

Pick 37: Josh Rotham
Pick 38: Sean Darcy
Pick 40: Tom Stewart

 

[SumaGodCoach]

I COME IN PEACE....

It's Barrass

That's totally fine because we will get Josh Schache and Jason Johannisen in return to kick start our rebuild.

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

With 2 second rounders, I am hoping the AFL start the process of weaning clubs off FA compensation. They can do this without consultation as they just push back the compensation picks.

In discussion between the premier's first round pick will be:-

1. Norf's possible poor performance as a club price
2. McStay FA compo - I am hoping that Pies are still in salary cap squeeze so don't offer overs
3. Amon FA compo - supposedly the Hawks but cannot see the logic on a high price given where they sit
4. de Goey - does he stay or go?
5. Buddy - does he stay or go? It cannot seriously be a big compensation given Hawks got pick 20 compo when they lost him the first time and this would possibly force a change in process due to outcry.

Ashcroft is a sure bet in the top 2 to get bid on and Fletcher is looking like the bid would be justified at end R1. That drops us back another 2.
So we sit at picks 20 and 26 and this could easily slip to 24 and 30 which would hurt as I see the depth falling off as it reaches 30.

 

[RookiePick]

Hasn't he played 16 games this year?

He's been out on the field 16 times. He has been much better at limiting his effort to avoid injury. Watching our captain go at sub 90% is hardly inspiring.

I think this weekend he made the first full sprint chase without injuring himself in 3 seasons. Although SJOGIU could always spring a surprise on us.

Would I love to see one more season of Boots going flat out - of course! It's just very much in the lower probability end of the spectrum.

He is high risk.

 

[Keys]

So the rumour is going about a contacted player wanting a trade - who?

I am thinking Petruccelle, Rotham or Waterman. Not going to get worried or excited about any of the three as I see them as in our best 18-30 range and not showing huge upside, but likewise not going to net us much.

FWIW - Fat X on hard ball gets was intimating that Shuey was not going to be playing next year. He did not articulate why and shut down the chat. Not sure if he is sh1t stirring or giving a hint.

There were suggestions earlier in the year that Simpson had lost the players and that he was disliked particularly among the younger players

Now if that was true to any significant extent, then I’d expect there’d likely be more than one player asking to be traded

If there was one contracted player set to be asking for a trade my first guess would be Rotham. I don’t think he’s been used or developed correctly and there’s a better footballer lurking there than what we’ve seen - this year especially

 

[DickDunn]

Waterman hinted in an interview recently that he wasn't too pleased with being thrown around too. Said his best position was full forward from memory