Hartung, Stewart and Willsmore(to be rookied, due to contract) all delisted

[lickmerocks]

Billys decision making and finishing skills always were his biggest issue.

Brad Hill was nicknamed sheep dog because he hated contact but could finish and hit a target inside forward 50 which is the difference between the two.

I am sure someone will pull out a champion data stat to prove me wrong but I have many many memories where Bill had a chance to move the ball forward to a leading player and he either

A) had his head down bouncing the ball too much
B) took far too long to make the kick
C) stopped in his tracks and for whatever reason retreated and stopped any momentum we had.

His decision making and execution skills under pressure always hurt him.

 

[OnTheRocks]

Suckling was the sub, so Hartung was dropped for Suckling who was out for an extended period through injury.
Hartung was the safer option as he was fully fit and a better runner, for what was a warm day.
Just the facts.

Hartung might be a hound dog, but he ain't no friend of mine.

I think there are some suspicious minds about who you are.

 

[GilPender]

What on earth are you talking about?? Suckling played 25 games in 2015 including all the finals. He got moved to the sub position. Suckling ended up getting 8 touches and a goal in the last quarter - not a bad day out.

And we won that grand final by 46 points - so retrospectively questioning team selection is ******* baffling.

You're right - it wasn't injury that had him vulnerable - it was his shitty form.
Look up his numbers.
Hartung should have been in the team, especially as Suckling was known to be leaving.

I'm still right.
Hawthorn did not embrace Hartung.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

Billys decision making and finishing skills always were his biggest issue.

Brad Hill was nicknamed sheep dog because he hated contact but could finish and hit a target inside forward 50 which is the difference between the two.

I am sure someone will pull out a champion data stat to prove me wrong but I have many many memories where Bill had a chance to move the ball forward to a leading player and he either

A) had his head down bouncing the ball too much
B) took far too long to make the kick
C) stopped in his tracks and for whatever reason retreated and stopped any momentum we had.

His decision making and execution skills under pressure always hurt him.

Option C) happened a few times this year - I remember watching Hartung closely at a few home games this year and as I mentioned in another post his feet were vastly quicker than his brain so he'd get clear, panic when he saw no option and then either freeze and get tackled from behind or run backwards/sideways and turn the ball over or deliver it to a teammate in a bad position who'd then turn it over or get held with the ball.

I wasn't a Hartung hater - and I don't think he was doing it due to not wanting to get hit - as you've rightly judged he just didn't have the decision making that he needed and that Hill had.

 

[lickmerocks]

Ohhh and I forgot,

Willsmore and Orourke better be buying the clarkson kids Christmas presents.

Both extremely lucky to get another year.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

You're right - it wasn't injury that had him vulnerable - it was his shitty form.
Look up his numbers.
Hartung should have been in the team, especially as Suckling was known to be leaving.

So you're 'just the facts' post came up short of facts and you've retreated to just making shit up.

Played 25 games in a side that finished top 4 and won a premiership - was in shitty form all season.

Give up, Mr Hartung.

 

[Since 2001]

O'Rouke was looking really good at the start of the season.

Potentially best 22, well he was for the start of the season.

This guy has so much potential, just injuries, which we can fix

 

[GilPender]

So you're 'just the facts' post came up short of facts and you've retreated to just making shit up.

Played 25 games in a side that finished top 4 and won a premiership - was in shitty form all season.

Give up, Mr Hartung.

In his last 6 games, Suckling only had +15 possessions once!

Hartung on the other hand had 3/4 games in the low 20s when he played full games in round 20-23, then reverted to sub and finally dropped.
Hartung was dropped for one of the boys.
Hartung was not one of the boys.
Out.

 

[StillAtLarge]

Hartung regressed every year after a solid 2015. His refusal to absorb any physical contact became more noticeable as his ability to break lines and distribute the footy waned.
Has zero lateral evasiveness which kills you when you're a small outside runner who can't break a tackle

 

[Ned Ryerson]

In his last 6 games, Suckling only had +15 possessions once!

And he averaged 19 possessions all year playing as a rebounding defender. Seriously - you're not making yourself look any less foolish here. And I'm not going to rely on your memory of his form that year when 3 posts ago you claimed he was out injured for most of the season.

 

[StillAtLarge]

In his last 6 games, Suckling only had +15 possessions once!

Hartung on the other hand had 3/4 games in the low 20s when he played full games in round 20-23, then reverted to sub and finally dropped.
Hartung was dropped for one of the boys.
Hartung was not one of the boys.
Out.

Hartung couldn't kick through/over a zone/web

 

[Ned Ryerson]

Hartung couldn't kick through/over a zone/web

Mate, no use bringing facts to the table here with Mr Just The Facts. Next he'll be telling us about how only Hartung could have won us the 2015 grand final that we lost by 10 goals, all kicked by Kennedy.

 

[GilPender]

Hartung couldn't kick through/over a zone/web

You don't have to like him.
The coaches and players didn't.


My only contention is that Hawthorn did not embrace Hartung, but Hartung tried very hard to embrace Hawthorn.
We shopped him around for 3 years.

 

[Hawk Dork]

and no other club was willing to embrace him
Lets hope he gets embraced by a new club

 

[StillAtLarge]

You don't have to like him.
The coaches and players didn't.


My only contention is that Hawthorn did not embrace Hartung, but Hartung tried very hard to embrace Hawthorn.
We shopped him around for 3 years.

I was surprised at the time that schoey got the nod over him but in hindsight it was the right call. Hartung was good in 2015 but has been trash since.
Having said that I'd have him over Willsmore and rate him slightly higher than JOR...

 

[Luv_our_club]

This is just dumb.

Look, I get it, Billy has never set the world on fire, has disappointed many and he’s turned his back on a contract and been delisted...

But to make up stories about him “stopping and running away from contact” is some fanciful bullshit.

I have not heard this is the media yet. Where does the information about Hartung turning his back on a contract come from?

 

[Alite]

SPECULATION:
I think these delisting are more about the 2018 draft than anything else.

Wrighty said the Hawks will be going into 2018 with the minimum number of senior listed players (38 of a possible 40) and the maximum number of cat A listed rookies (6): Glass, Cousins, Hanrahan, Willsmore + 2 new Cat A rookies (and 1 Cat B rookie in Nash).

It feels like the Hawks are setting up for a significant influx of players in 2018 to both the senior and rookie lists. Having extra senior spots this year, which the delisting created, allows us to upgrade / retain more rookies next year.

With this in mind, I wouldn't be surprised if the Hawks offered to delist then re-rookie all three of Hartung, Stewart and Willsmore but only Willsmore accepted the perceived "demotion" back to fringe.

IMO both Billy and Kade have the potential to find their niche in AFL football. My guess is that GW wanted to work the system but Billy and Kade each decided to take their ball and go elsewhere.

 

[Mitchell54]

I think one of Heatherley or Willsmore had to be delisted. Think Willsmore remaining year on his contract might’ve saved him.

Stewart the most clear cut delisting imo

 

[Bedi]

I felt 2017 was Hartung's best year, so it's a very surprising move. A lot of very frustrating aspects to his game (Langford is lucky he's contacted!), but i do distinctly remember him being involved in some big moment acts during the year such as crucial marks and goals. I also remember him being chased down by Daniher. But surely he'll get picked up in the draft.

 

[A Diakos]

Moving on Billy rather than Willsmore or Heatherly is mind-blowing to me. Not only is he young, he gives us something that only one other player at the club gives us and that is elite endurance. I must be seriously out of touch with Clarkson and Wright's vision of the list if this is how it is being shaped. Billy will be snapped up very quickly by a club as a DFA. I hope he doesn't come to bite us on the arse.

...

the delisting of Bill Hartung was an excellent decision & imperative ....Fantastic list management...good luck to Bill for future

 

[A Diakos]

There is clearly something going on behind the scenes.

There's no way Billy would be de-listed on ability before Willsmore.....

Billy is a liability Period & reminds me in some ways of Tim Clarke...they played him in order to bolster trade potential...it didn't work...Fantastic list management..good luck to Billy for future

 

[A Diakos]

I find the Hartung delisting difficult to understand. He played 18 games for the season probably the last 10 games consecutively. Why keep playing him if he was going to be delisted. The 2015 GF was 2 years ago, don't think that is the reason. If there was something behind the scenes it must have been after he played his last game. I cannot remember a time when Hawthorn delisted a player after playing 18 games during the season. One of the strangest decisions from the club I can recall. I am bewildered.

.............
Billy is a liability...he can't tackle, break a tackle, and avoids physical contact at contest...his decision making is also poor...he was played as they tried to bolster his trade value---I find it baffling how some can't see this

 

[A Diakos]

And how does Miles, Vickery, Willsmore, Schoenmakers and Heatherly fit into that model exactly?

miles a slight chance...the others outside 22 depth but you'll always have them...Billy delisiting correct decision

 

[A Diakos]

How many times does it need to be spelt out though?

Hartung wanted out. He’s got his wish.

he was put on the trade table and no-one wanted him....will be fortunate to get picked up, hopefully he does

 

[Rioli magic]

You don't have to like him.
The coaches and players didn't.


My only contention is that Hawthorn did not embrace Hartung, but Hartung tried very hard to embrace Hawthorn.
We shopped him around for 3 years.

What do you think is the reason that Hawthorn did not embrace Hartung?

I'm talking about the coaches, players...etc.