Scandal Hawthorn player questioned over sexual offence allegation

[bigton08]

I wasn't saying it in a "f-society" way. Just pointing it out. If he ends up being right about who it is, it would be interesting. Ah well. Let's hope the police sort this out.

I was just being a smartass not having a go at you... Just over it the whole thing is a mess... Like another poster said feels like it's been going on for months... Just want an end to it!

 

[astro1212]

Would they know this if they waved the taxi down on the street and paid cash?

My guess is...

Conveniently the exact taxi will not be located/ identified before the cctv hard drive writes over itself.

You know how it goes, police hands are tied and very limited.... and taxis do not have gps that keep records of their movements.

how very very convenient...i mean unfortunate.

 

[madman]

I've only been paying attention to the trades in the last few days.

WTF!

 

[justlookingaround]

Who raids a house over "rape" allegations?

What are they looking for? Condoms?

They would've been looking for drugs consistent with the woman having her drink spiked and clothes involved in the incident.

 

[Bayer_]

I don't think players should be named but if they are it is hardly in the same ball park as naming a rape victim. Surely we want to do everything possible to support women to report the men who rape them? As for the poster who I quoted, he may claim not to be serious but he still believed enough to post it. I have no idea who the Hawthorn players are and quite frankly I don't care.

So it's OK to ruin a player's reputation when we don't even know if the complaint has the substance to proceed to trial?

 

[Bert Man]

Sauce? Or are you just throwing mud for fun?

And your proof officer?

Just mud for fun, fuelling the haters, great player and captain.

 

[jmac70]

So it's OK to ruin a player's reputation when we don't even know if the complaint has the substance to proceed to trial?

Where have I said it is OK to ruin a person's reputation? In an ideal world all the people involved would have their names withheld until enough evidence existed to proceed with a case. We don't live in an ideal world.
If this goes to trial the victim will most likely still have their identity withheld. This is absolutely necessary to ensure that women are supported to report rape. How many women do you think have been r*ped that were too afraid to report it on the basis that their reputation may be ruined? I cannot believe people are even trying to argue this.

 

[astro1212]

Hope this doesn't turn out to be like the Milne case, where a verdict is given but the masses still Bay for blood

Lol. Verdict given?

Police deliberately compromised the investigation and police internal complaints were ignored.

10 years later.... after evidence tampered with, victim is moving on with her life and some police involved have retired etc he pleads guilty to the lesser charge of indecent assault.

you cant see why "the masses still bay for blood"?

http://m.theage.com.au/victoria/fresh-claims-on-milne-rape-case-20100622-yvz7.html

http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2014-11-06/stephen-milne-rape-charges-dropped/5870710

 

[Bayer_]

Where have I said it is OK to ruin a person's reputation? In an ideal world all the people involved would have their names withheld until enough evidence existed to proceed with a case. We don't live in an ideal world.
If this goes to trial the victim will most likely still have their identity withheld. This is absolutely necessary to ensure that women are supported to report rape. How many women do you think have been r*ped that were too afraid to report it on the basis that their reputation may be ruined? I cannot believe people are even trying to argue this.

Is anybody here arguing to out the complainant? We're talking about the knuckleheads who think it's OK to call a pair of players rapists because of a complaint that has yet to even be substantiated to the point of going to trial.

 

[jmac70]

Is anybody here arguing to out the complainant? We're talking about the knuckleheads who think it's OK to call a pair of players rapists because of a complaint that has yet to even be substantiated to the point of going to trial.

The knucklehead I responded to was joking about it and I thought it was in poor taste. As for the incident I hope the truth is revealed.

 

[Bayer_]

The knucklehead I responded to was joking about it and I thought it was in poor taste. As for the incident I hope the truth is revealed.

That's a bit precious. He was simply using sarcasm to prove the point, and there wasn't anything nasty about what he wrote.

 

[jmac70]

That's a bit precious. He was simply using sarcasm to prove the point, and there wasn't anything nasty about what he wrote.

What point was he proving? Of course football players and anyone else with any sort of fame are going to get named when something like this happens. There is no way of stopping it. Rant and rave by all means but please don't compare it with the suffering of the victim. It is unfortunate that they have been subjected to unsubstantiated abuse but hardly surprising in these times.

 

[Bayer_]

What point was he proving? Of course football players and anyone else with any sort of fame are going to get named when something like this happens. There is no way of stopping it. Rant and rave by all means but please don't compare it with the suffering of the victim. It is unfortunate that they have been subjected to unsubstantiated abuse but hardly surprising in these times.

We have a complainant, we shall soon see who the victim is.

 

[jmac70]

We have a complainant, we shall soon see who the victim is.

True.

 

[Syphoncom]

The difference is there's two alleged rapists and one alleged rape victim.
A RAPE VICTIM, do you really think a rapist deserves the same niceties as the person they r*ped?
I don't think the names should be released until there's a case, but I'm almost certain it happened, the vast majority of rape claims are legitimate - so I don't really see any problem with people wanting to know who's been accused of this.

You mistakenly omitted alleged from your italicisation. And then followed it up by saying the alleged rapist is in fact a rapist, and the alleged rape victim is a rape victim. Also you're almost certain "it" happened. I'm not trying to be antagonistic, but it's important (and I really loathe most criminals in society) to understand the context. I suppose I just picked this post (where there's many from both sides of the discussion in this thread) to make a point that it's actually important that people aren't judged in the media prior to a trial.

Unfortunately the abhorrent actions that do occur sometimes aren't accounted for within the judicial system. It's unfortunate and something I think most decent members of society would fix if they could. But then there's also many circumstances of false reporting (not even concerning sexual abuse) that we risk ruining the lives on innocent individuals as well.

Probably due to the high profile nature of the case it's going to be known who is linked (publicly) if the pair are charged. You yourself mentioned this too (so I generally agree with the post), but I hope that's the overwhelming sentiment.

If this goes to trial the victim will most likely still have their identity withheld. This is absolutely necessary to ensure that women are supported to report rape. How many women do you think have been r*ped that were too afraid to report it on the basis that their reputation may be ruined? I cannot believe people are even trying to argue this.

Solid point. I'd say people in general too, it's not just women who would fail to report rape. There probably needs to be more education in schools regarding sex - I know most people my age (late twenties, early thirties) didn't really discuss it from what I've been told, nor their younger brothers e.g those now early-mid twenties. Having said that, I'd say there needs to be harsher penalties for false reporting.

 

[jmac70]

You mistakenly omitted alleged from your italicisation. And then followed it up by saying the alleged rapist is in fact a rapist, and the alleged rape victim is a rape victim. Also you're almost certain "it" happened. I'm not trying to be antagonistic, but it's important (and I really loathe most criminals in society) to understand the context. I suppose I just picked this post (where there's many from both sides of the discussion in this thread) to make a point that it's actually important that people aren't judged in the media prior to a trial.

Unfortunately the abhorrent actions that do occur sometimes aren't accounted for within the judicial system. It's unfortunate and something I think most decent members of society would fix if they could. But then there's also many circumstances of false reporting (not even concerning sexual abuse) that we risk ruining the lives on innocent individuals as well.

Probably due to the high profile nature of the case it's going to be known who is linked (publicly) if the pair are charged. You yourself mentioned this too (so I generally agree with the post), but I hope that's the overwhelming sentiment.



Solid point. I'd say people in general too, it's not just women who would fail to report rape. There probably needs to be more education in schools regarding sex - I know most people my age (late twenties, early thirties) didn't really discuss it from what I've been told, nor their younger brothers e.g those now early-mid twenties. Having said that, I'd say there needs to be harsher penalties for false reporting.

Very few women false report rape.

 

[nickrebellious]

A small Hawks player whos married was found in my mates missus bed a few yrs back. Cracking player.....dog person.

Are you a band member of TISM by any chance?

 

[YippeeYiYeo]

If you check Twitter, there are posts about it. You just have to search some pretty obvious keywords and then look at all tweets. Not sure if the two names are real or not, but that's what's being said. But to be honest, I'd rather wait until anything has been properly confirmed. Because if the two aren't guilty, then the court of "public opinion" completely f*cks them.

well im sure there is someone who lives in the footy community that knows the identity of the house that was raided today.

 

[Syphoncom]

Very few women false report rape.

That actually doesn't change anything I've said though. I also think domestic violence is seriously under-reported also. They're pretty serious issues that need to be addressed. At least we're definitely in a better position today than when I was growing up with so many societal issues.

 

[Snell1234]

Very few women false report rape.

Incorrect.

Just say a girl goes home with two players and cheats on her boyfriend. She wakes up the next day and realises what she has done. What better way to salvage your relationship and to not have people judge you as a skank than to claim you were r*ped.

Happens a lot more than you realise.

 

[Back One Out]

Very few women are demonstrably proven to have falsely reported rape.

EFA

The various surveys which show "between 2% and 10% of rape accusations are false" is a misleading stat often used by women's groups to imply that over 90% of rape accusations are valid. What this figure really represents is that the woman was proven to be a liar between 2% and 10% of the time where the accused is able to conclusively prove that it was impossible for him to have done it or the accuser admits she made it up.

More than half of rape accusations don't go to trial, either through lack of evidence or because no rape occurred by the legal definition.
So the percentage number of false reports to police would lie somewhere in between.

Not that I'm trying to suggest this could be a false accusation of rape, nor blindly defend the Hawthorn players. There is every chance she is telling the truth. I'll wait and see before I rush to condemn anyone.

 

[The_Anvil]

Incorrect.

Just say a girl goes home with two players and cheats on her boyfriend. She wakes up the next day and realises what she has done. What better way to salvage your relationship and to not have people judge you as a skank than to claim you were r*ped.

Happens a lot more than you realise.

Absolutely. At the very least, the fact she had a boyfriend and decided to go home with these two players is going to go against her. Before the mob come in and accuse me of saying she deserved what she got for possibly cheating on her boyfriend (if in fact what those two player's are accused of is the truth), hell no.
Girl sees famous footballers, goes oops I have a boyfriend but whatever, goes home with said footy players, wakes up to realise.. Damn all my friends watched me leave with these guys. It's an absolute shoe in that her bf will find out. Oh I know, I'll call him up, tell him my drink was spiked then just go take a stroll down to Box Hill police and clean up this mess.

 

[teddies]

Absolutely. At the very least, the fact she had a boyfriend and decided to go home with these two players is going to go against her. Before the mob come in and accuse me of saying she deserved what she got for possibly cheating on her boyfriend (if in fact what those two player's are accused of is the truth), hell no.
Girl sees famous footballers, goes oops I have a boyfriend but whatever, goes home with said footy players, wakes up to realise.. Damn all my friends watched me leave with these guys. It's an absolute shoe in that her bf will find out. Oh I know, I'll call him up, tell him my drink was spiked then just go take a stroll down to Box Hill police and clean up this mess.

the ****ed up thing? this seems like an entirely plausible explanation by today's social standards.

 

[pennypal]

Very few women false report rape.

I think you are wrong with that assumption. Not saying it is often but it isn't rare. This sad for everyone in each situation. Unfortunately the real stat is that so many rapes go unreported....

 

[Air_Chester]

False report is not as rare as it's made out to be in statistics used by activist groups.

However, while there is an (indeterminate) percentage of false claims, the real tragedy is that it casts aspersions on the (many) legitimate cases reported.

Half the reason rape is not reported as often as it should is because here we all are using "alleged", and while these are terms you can understand in relation to some crimes, and are technically accurate, in a situation where you're discussing someone's liberty it carries negative connotations and comes across as victim shaming and deters people from reporting. Especially when people put it in inverted commas (may as well add a *scoff* in after it).

We don't know anything and the system isn't perfect. But the system will decide who is guilty and of what crime, based on all the evidence presented to them.

For anyone to cast aspersions or give opinions on the honesty of the complainant or the guilt of the accused, at this point, with absolutely no knowledge of the case outside generic media reports, is not only ill advised, but morally disgusting, I'd have thought.

Short version: some people need to pull their ****in heads in.