Review Hawthorn v Cats - match sim - Thursday 23rd Feb, GMHBA

[OnTheRocks]

its never good to be thrashed especially with the kids in there as they lose confidence quickly

This will be the barometer for mine, keeping the confidence, being 4qtr competitive & avoiding 6+ goal beatings.
If we finish down near the bottom, so be it for a young rebuilding side as long as they continue to believe in the way

 

[Brishawk]

they'll all end up getting a run but for R1 it's looking quite possible Scrim is the odd one out. Especially if we want to play both DGB and Frost

Wait, does that mean scrim is less of a lock for best 22 and more of a privacy snip?

 

[Simon Crawshay]

that's only based on your opinion of them as players, which is fine, but not really reflective of what's coming out from the club

all the media from the coaches etc. seems to be suggesting Frost and Bramble will be best 22, and that Scrim is fighting with Denver for the last Spot. both were in the possibles, for example. I think Scrim will still play R1 but I also wouldn't be surprised if he's the one that's missing out based on what I've read and seen in the pre-season

I know stats aren't everything but like I said just taking a quick look at their stats last year for the three players in question shows one of them to be a good (bordering on very good) AFL player with above average stats for most categories for his position (Scrimmers) whilst the other two are battlers / good ordinary players.

And honestly from the eye test thats how I see it as well. Jack has talent galore whereas DGB and Frosty have limitations (obviously DGB is still young but I am doing a right here and now comparison).

 

[HedgeFund]

I know stats aren't everything but like I said just taking a quick look at their stats last year for the three players in question shows one of them to be a good (bordering on very good) AFL player with above average stats for most categories for his position (Scrimmers) whilst the other two are battlers / good ordinary players.

And honestly from the eye test thats how I see it as well. Jack has talent galore whereas DGB and Frosty have limitations (obviously DGB is still young but I am doing a right here and now comparison).


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Consider this - if you gave DGB or Frost the licence to play the way Scrimshaw plays (ie. pretty loose and never on a KPF) would they produce greater offensive output? I think the answer is it’s highly likely.

If you instructed Jack to play on a KPD and stick to him as tight as possible (lock down / defend) what do you think the chances would be that he’d be able to do that job? I’m not sure he would be able to do that effectively.

I think you’re comparing different players here and they’re not interchangeable.

If we have a fully available back 6 (+ 1) then Jack can, and should, play as a 3rd tall / hybrid forward.

 

[KermitJagger]

I know stats aren't everything but like I said just taking a quick look at their stats last year for the three players in question shows one of them to be a good (bordering on very good) AFL player with above average stats for most categories for his position (Scrimmers) whilst the other two are battlers / good ordinary players.

And honestly from the eye test thats how I see it as well. Jack has talent galore whereas DGB and Frosty have limitations (obviously DGB is still young but I am doing a right here and now comparison).


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Stats aren't just not everything in this case, they're next to nothing. You're comparing a loose man in defense to 2 blokes who have been asked to be way more accountable for a man in their roles.

 

[Yardie]

I've been thinking about the simulation. I wonder if we purposely shook up the backline to allow goals to be scored so that we had more centre bounce practice.

 

[TheFourPillars]

This will be the barometer for mine, keeping the confidence, being 4qtr competitive & avoiding 6+ goal beatings.
If we finish down near the bottom, so be it for a young rebuilding side as long as they continue to believe in the way

I think u need to prepare ureself for some blowouts mate especially as the season wears on and bodies, young bodies get sore

 

[peetoo]

And if young players who are losing their match up so badly it’s an internet ‘viral’, but are left there as a learning experience?

 

[TheFourPillars]

I know stats aren't everything but like I said just taking a quick look at their stats last year for the three players in question shows one of them to be a good (bordering on very good) AFL player with above average stats for most categories for his position (Scrimmers) whilst the other two are battlers / good ordinary players.

And honestly from the eye test thats how I see it as well. Jack has talent galore whereas DGB and Frosty have limitations (obviously DGB is still young but I am doing a right here and now comparison).


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Mate given that he plays a particlar role in the side and there are others who can play that role and the coaches want to inject players like bramble then u have Scrim competing with CJ and Sic and he will be nudged out

 

[Simon Crawshay]

Stats aren't just not everything in this case, they're next to nothing. You're comparing a loose man in defense to 2 blokes who have been asked to be way more accountable for a man in their roles.

I'm not totally sold on that theory.

Usually Sicily gets the number 1 key forward every week and still racks up 20+ possessions a game.

Also Scrimmers best weapon is his contested marking, backing into packs and that's hardly the trait of an unaccountable half back.

Flat out he's just a better player than the other two.

 

[KermitJagger]

I'm not totally sold on that theory.

Usually Sicily gets the number 1 key forward every week and still racks up 20+ possessions a game.

Also Scrimmers best weapon is his contested marking, backing into packs and that's hardly the trait of an unaccountable half back.

Flat out he's just a better player than the other two.

Yeah Dustin Martin plays midfield and still kicks 30 or 40 goals. Not every player is Sicily or Dustin Martin, some of them only play one role and you're comparing players who play different ones.

 

[Roger Rogerson]

I would be interested to know on the many occasions Geelong had 2 or 3 on 1 in their forward line if it was work rate or if it was because we pushed up the ground as we had the ball and they sat back and enjoyed the space that came from the usual turnover. Hard to say from TV

The one thing that did seem to happen at nearly every contest we would have too many sucked into it and there would be free Geelong players on the outside

It happened so many times got to think we were being very aggressive on the attack and getting numbers up in our fwd half to the detriment of our defense when we lost possession.

 

[KermitJagger]

I think u need to prepare ureself for some blowouts mate especially as the season wears on and bodies, young bodies get sore

I don't believe blow-outs are instructive to a team, so I reckon supporters have every right to be pissed off if they happen regardless of youth and inexperience.

 

[Blackhawk42]

I don't believe blow-outs are instructive to a team, so I reckon supporters have every right to be pissed off if they happen regardless of youth and inexperience.

Becoming a trend in Grand Finals too unfortunately.

 

[PT Bar None]

I've been thinking about the simulation. I wonder if we purposely shook up the backline to allow goals to be scored so that we had more centre bounce practice.

I love this. I've been trying to figure the difference between a simulation and a practice match. Given everything looked real on Thursday: tackles, kicks, marks, free kicks, centre bounces, etc.

But this would do it. Cheers!

(BTW, I'm going to quote you as "sources suggest" should I use this at work next week when some Carlton supporters start getting on my ****)

 

[KermitJagger]

Becoming a trend in Grand Finals too unfortunately.

Yeah there's something about Grand Finals, more blow outs than close games historically I'd imagine. Seems like a lot of losing teams start their off season at half time. The prelims have always been better games imo.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

I love this. I've been trying to figure the difference between a simulation and a practice match. Given everything looked real on Thursday: tackles, kicks, marks, free kicks, centre bounces, etc.

But this would do it. Cheers!

(BTW, I'm going to quote you as "sources suggest" should I use this at work next week when some Carlton supporters start getting on my ****)

“Source suggest we weren’t really trying” should go down a treat with some nuffy blues fans.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Everything coming out of the club since the trade period suggested that we think the early part of the season will be our biggest challenge, as we’ve got a new midfield trying to gel and connect and that we expect this and our performances to improve as the year goes on(Baring injury of course).

It’s been a common theme that anyone in the footy dept that’s spoken to media over the summer have touched on.

I think the recent comments alone from Sam and McCartney should have had people lowering their expectations of our early season form, yet so far I’m sensing that a lot of their words have fallen on deaf ears.
The connection may come quickly, but it may also take time.

Sam even spoken about it again after the match simulation, and players running to wrong spots or not knowing where their teammate would be, but I’m guessing that’ll all be forgotten by the time the Pies match rolls around, and we’ll have pages of people frustrated annoyed that our players with under 30 games aren’t connecting with their similarly inexperienced players like they’ve played 50+ games together.

It’s going to be bumpy early, but just keep watching for incremental improvement, particularly in the middle.

 

[H00t]

Also Scrimmers best weapon is his contested marking, backing into packs and that's hardly the trait of an unaccountable half back.

Scrim’s marking is strong when he’s able to float across a pack without body contact.

When he’s one on one with a key forward he generally struggles.

Different players play different roles. We are in desperate need of lockdown defenders. We have lots of players wanting to play loose.

For scrim to take the next step he needs to learn to lockdown an opponent or outperform our other rebounding defenders.

 

[H00t]

I don't believe blow-outs are instructive to a team, so I reckon supporters have every right to be pissed off if they happen regardless of youth and inexperience.

I don’t think anyone wants a blowout to happen. But even strong teams get blown out during the year.

It will be a monumental effort for us to keep the blowouts to zero. Even one or two will be a good effort. Given the youth on our list and that we will most likely be in the bottom 6.

What will be bad is if we do a North and lose like 10 games in a row by 40+ points.

 

[OnTheRocks]

I think u need to prepare ureself for some blowouts mate especially as the season wears on and bodies, young bodies get sore

Yeah I fear that. That's why I think it's of most importance that our leaders keep the faith and show them the way when all seems lost. Got to maintain a competitive spirit

 

[peetoo]

Ey? Geelong were strong and have topped up even more, only losing Selwood . They are clearly going full on this year and letting the next few years take care of themselves

And why wouldn’t they?

 

[HedgeFund]

I'm not totally sold on that theory.

Usually Sicily gets the number 1 key forward every week and still racks up 20+ possessions a game.

Also Scrimmers best weapon is his contested marking, backing into packs and that's hardly the trait of an unaccountable half back.

Flat out he's just a better player than the other two.

He isn’t taking contested marks against the bloke who is theoretically his direct opponent.

In fact he only took 19 contested marks (0.9 per game). If you’re only pulling out your best weapon 19 times a season, maybe it’s time to re-think how often you roll off to float across?

Opposition teams know that a good path to goals is through Scrimshaw’s opponent because there’s a good chance he will be standing in space a lot more than the other 5 players.

Sicily racks up 20+ because Blanck / Frost dink kick it to him as one of our designated kicks from the back half when we get control.

 

[The Spirit of Cricket]

I know stats aren't everything but like I said just taking a quick look at their stats last year for the three players in question shows one of them to be a good (bordering on very good) AFL player with above average stats for most categories for his position (Scrimmers) whilst the other two are battlers / good ordinary players.

And honestly from the eye test thats how I see it as well. Jack has talent galore whereas DGB and Frosty have limitations (obviously DGB is still young but I am doing a right here and now comparison).


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but again this has nothing to do with what I'm saying. You're just telling me that Jack is a better player than Frost and DGB. I don't necessarily disagree. But a less talented player can be more conducive to winning if their strengths suit a gameplan or their weaknesses are easily hidden.

I'm not saying anything about the players skill or even whether I agree. It's just that, what I've read and seen from the club, this pre season, suggests Scrim is fighting for his spot. That's literally it mate

 

[CHUBBSS]

I've been thinking about the simulation. I wonder if we purposely shook up the backline to allow goals to be scored so that we had more centre bounce practice.

So crazy it may just work