Game Day JLT2 - Carlton vs Collingwood - Monday 11th March 2.10PM @ Morwell - Final Team Post #777

[cfc4life]

In: LOB, Kreuz
Out: Polson, Lobbe

 

[Stamos]

I would pick whichever ruckman gives us the best chance if winning.

Obviously Kreuzer, if he's fit.

 

[JustaBattler]

I think ruck 'ratings' are going to get a real work over this year - Kreuzer has a knack of getting on top of most ruckmen as the game goes on at worst. Kreuzer can change his approach to contests seen it way too often to dismiss it. Lobbe showed similar traits late last year as well - started off getting smashed and then worked his opponent over and ended up breaking even or beating them - Witts (IIRC) was the classic example of this. but Phillips is the better first touch and at the margin better marking target - saw that last week in JLT1. I think Kreuzer pips both - because he is definitely a big mid around contests- the other two are not in the same class with ball on ground or in congested situations - and whilst kids are developing Kreuzers bruising presence and ability to push the ball forward gives them a relief - BUT is he ready to go ?

 

[Arr0w]

Sure it doesn't make sense if they do nothing else. But that wasn't the case the other evening.
Phillips's game didn't appear to fall away last week; he spent time on the bench, i assume to let Lobbe get some game time.
I don't see how the 666 will benefit MK. He strength has been his ability to negate opposition ruckman from gaining a clear tap rather than winning the tapouts.

Firstly I was very happy with Phillips's game, which was limited so really doesn't give you a full picture in terms of fatigue and given it was a JLT game. Surely you are not suggesting, that the game he played the other day is better than anything MK put out last year, even with having an interupted season

As for why I believe MK will benefit from the 666, compared to other ruckmen:

2017 - 3rd in disposals, 3rd in tackles, 2nd in clearances, 3rd in centre clearances
2018 - 10th in disposals, 3rd in tackles, 10th in clearances, 6th in centre clearances (in an injury interrupted game/s, season)

Given his higher averages in these 4 areas, compared to other ruckmen, but especially in centre clearance, it will allow him to have even more room to execute, thus helping us to win the centre clearance differentials, to one on ones in our forward 50

Phillips is a very good ruckman, but he is not the player MK has shown

 

[AndyWalkersGirl]

Just watching the replay of the * game. I’d rest Charlie so he has longer to “recover” from whatever happened. I’d drop Polson because I don’t think he does much. Keep Kruezer for round 1

In: LOB, Stocker, Kennedy
Out: Polson, Curnow, Cripps (give him a week off, he’ll have a massive season again).

 

[TooBlue14]

In: LOB, Kreuz
Out: Polson, Lobbe

In: Obrien, Kruezer, Kennedy
Out: Schumacher, Lobbe, Polson

 

[Mr_Plow]

Fasolo too, my Carlton friends.

 

[RedFury]

Kreuzer is very underrated by some people on this board.
When fit, he's in the top 5 rucks in the League.
2017 he was the best ruck in the game.

Absolutely, when match fit with some continuity he's nigh unstoppable and clearly our number 1 choice.

However to be fair though, a lot of recent comment here regarding ruck choices have probably been taking into account the fact that Kreuzer is starting this season quite a bit behind in terms of fitness, is still relatively injury prone and isn't getting any younger.

Of course, of the other three ruck choices two of them also aren't young, and the third is probably not ready yet.

 

[Blue__Balls]

Really keen to see how Fas goes in our forward mix. And surely a game against his old club gives him a perfect opportunity to fire up and show them what he'c capable of doing, maybe prove them wrong about his defensive intent.

O'Brien needs to come in and get a full game against senior opposition ahead of round one, just to make sure he's accustomed to the pace again.

Would like to see Kennedy and Kreuzer if they're deemed 100%.

IN: Fasolo, O'Brien, Kennedy, Kreuzer
OUT: Polson, Schumacher, Curnow, Lobbe

Which Curnow? Either. If Charlie needs some extra time to recover from that corkie, give it to him. Otherwise, give Ed a spell, he doesn't need the extra prep.

Simpson, Jones, Plowman
Garlett, Weitering, Newman
Walsh, Setterfield, O'Brien
Kreuzer, Cripps, SPS
Cuningham, McGovern, Curnow
Fasolo, McKay, Gibbons
INT: Fisher, Murphy, Dow, Kennedy, Thomas, Silvagni, Phillips

 

[Mr_Plow]

 

[ESKIE]

Yeh kick a goal Faz

 

[JustaBattler]

Yeh kick a goal Faz

He will kick PLENTY

 

[Big Red is back]

Its not as if Phillips or Lobbe were poor around the ground last week either. Both had a good game. Anyone that says otherwise is watching the game through algorithm obscured glasses.

Pillips was outstanding around the ground, it might of been his best ever half for us.

 

[Soapy V]

Kreuzer is very underrated by some people on this board.
When fit, he's in the top 5 rucks in the League.
2017 he was the best ruck in the game.

The bonus of having Phillips & Lobbe fit and playing well is there is no need to rush Kruezer. Last year he played injured.

Take the time and get him 100% fit and ready. Benefits everyone

 

[THE_GUN]

Which players played well in the VFL practice game , Is there a thread on that game ?

 

[gbatman]

Watched the VFL practice match replay. I don't think anyone there put their hand up for JLT2. DeKoning was our best but we aren't looking for a ruck are we? Not saying they played bad but they weren't games at the standard to push form players out of a winning team. I would not have Kennedy in at all. He's improved but he still looks slow and imobile, he's only a clearance player and I didn't think he was anything special in that area, to be honest I think his inability to apply pressure with a more open center due to the 666 rule will be a liability at AFL level. We are also looking pretty good in clearance play without him.

I might roll the dice on O'Brien and give him a go, he wasn't poor, he just had a moderate game. At this level he might go ok although I don't know if there is a spot for a winger come round one with the current team.

I would think Fasolo definitely gets a chance. I think there's another opening for a forward.

Kreuzer is a chance although I really liked Phillips game against Essendon, it was every bit as good as what Kreuzer can do. I'm leaning towards Kreuzer playing the second half of JLT2 but Phillips playing round 1 if he plays another good game and pulls up alright. Bring Kreuzer in when he's 100%. Play the in form and fit player.

I think we are looking like this round 1

B: Plowman Jones Newman
HB: Simpson Weitering Garlett
C: Walsh Cripps Murphy
HF: Gibbons Curnow Fisher
F: Cuningham McKay McGovern
OB: Kreuzer Dow SPS
IC: Setterfield Curnow *** ***

I think there are two spots.

More Likely
Silvagni Fasolo Thomas

Less Likely
O'Brien Kennedy

Kreuzer?
Phillips

If I was a betting man, Phillips will play round 1, Kreuzer will miss. Fasolo and Thomas will make up those last two spots. Silvagni, O'Brien, Kennedy, Kreuzer/Lobbe as emergencies.

Collingwood should be a good test as they are quick and should be pretty good. I think the new rules will suit them and us so it will be interesting.

 

[ESKIE]

LOB to play I would’ve thought

 

[katmanblue]

Obviously Kreuzer, if he's fit.

Nice image of Walsh in your avatar.

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[gbatman]

Which players played well in the VFL practice game , Is there a thread on that game ?

In our VFL thread there is a youtube link. IMO... DeKoning best but we aren't looking for a ruck, tall forward or forward ruck. Kennedy second but didn't do heaps and his only good work was clearance work and IMO it was just ok. I think his lack of pace/mobility, while improved will be a liability at AFL level and we aren't looking for inside clearance players IMO that seemed a strength V Essendon. O'Brien was just ok off a wing, not sure he pushes anyone out on his efforts, his game would translate to AFL better. Casboult went pretty well but again see DeKoning. Stocker was quiet at half back. The rest didn't do enough and don't play roles we are looking to fill.

Incoming players will likely come from the injury recovery group. Kreuzer, Fasolo (JLT). Marchbank, Williamson (Early season). Some quality will drop back come round 1.

 

[katmanblue]

I think ruck 'ratings' are going to get a real work over this year - Kreuzer has a knack of getting on top of most ruckmen as the game goes on at worst. Kreuzer can change his approach to contests seen it way too often to dismiss it. Lobbe showed similar traits late last year as well - started off getting smashed and then worked his opponent over and ended up breaking even or beating them - Witts (IIRC) was the classic example of this. but Phillips is the better first touch and at the margin better marking target - saw that last week in JLT1. I think Kreuzer pips both - because he is definitely a big mid around contests- the other two are not in the same class with ball on ground or in congested situations - and whilst kids are developing Kreuzers bruising presence and ability to push the ball forward gives them a relief - BUT is he ready to go ?

How good is it that we can finally have this discussion?

I love the fact that we have viable options no matter which the match committee chooses any given week.

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[Laphroaig]

No, but surely you cant select a ruckman on his prowess as a potential spare midfielder. If you have 3 ruckman ready to go, and 2 are better hitout performers than the third,you don't select the third because he can potentially play as a midfielder. You want your ruckman to dominate at tapouts. If he is a midfielder then play him as a midfielder. I want our rucks to dominate the ruck craft above all else.

I think you're missing the point.

Kreuzer at his best might be called "an extra mid", but that's not a really accurate label. Yes he does make second, third and fourth efforts and even wins some clearances.

But the gold of those second third and fourth efforts are that the larger proportion of them are not ball chasing efforts. Kreuzer is the best in the business at blocking, shepherding and barging holes open for the inside mids. Doing these effectively requires the big body to be down there a the coalface, not drifting around a meter above the action.

A "pure" tap ruckman is a mostly useless commodity. Even so called "taps to advantage" only create a real advantage now and then. It looks great when it happens, but it's not a match winner.

A ruckman with ground level credentials doesn't even have to break even in nullifying the superior tap ruck. So long as he doesn't get dominated, his overall contribution is often superior.

 

[Nori]

Kreuzer is still our number one ruck, but they need to manage him smarter. Phillips or Lobbe should be played more often to rest Kreuzer when he's sore.

 

[Iamcarlton]

No, but surely you cant select a ruckman on his prowess as a potential spare midfielder. If you have 3 ruckman ready to go, and 2 are better hitout performers than the third,you don't select the third because he can potentially play as a midfielder. You want your ruckman to dominate at tapouts. If he is a midfielder then play him as a midfielder. I want our rucks to dominate the ruck craft above all else.

Can certainly understand where you're coming from here . With new rule changes maybe making centre bounce tap outs more critical your suggestions certainly have merit . Given how our midfield has performed over the past few years Kruezers work at stoppages and around the ground has been invaluable especially after the departure of Gibbs . However as our midfield improves and the load is spread more evenly one would think taking into consideration Kruezers age and injury history his effectiveness may dissipate somewhat with his around the ground work .

 

[FootyGeek]

Anyone know what the ground conditions will be like? Will we be going for the high top moccasins or the ankle highs?

 

[manang magoos]

Anyone know what the ground conditions will be like? Will we be going for the high top moccasins or the ankle highs?

Mate don’t dis Morwell although it is bad moccasins are about MOE moccasins on everyone
no I don’t live in either town in live Traralgon area