NFNL Div 3 2019

[HBFlanker]

Hearing Wallan almost a lock to re-join.

Will reservoir be okay for next year? 9 team comp next year is passable however 10 would be the ultimate goal one would think

 

[Dicko1979]

Hearing Wallan almost a lock to re-join.

Will reservoir be okay for next year? 9 team comp next year is passable however 10 would be the ultimate goal one would think

I think it’s the opposite about Wallan.

I’m hearing that the players have been told that they will be staying in the RDFL next year while the club looks into it further.

The way there travelling in the finals series at the moment, why would they wanna come to div 3.

From the outside, it sounds and looks like a lot going right at Greenhill off the field and on field in both football and netball departments.

 

[10571z]

I think it’s the opposite about Wallan.

I’m hearing that the players have been told that they will be staying in the RDFL next year while the club looks into it further.

The way there travelling in the finals series at the moment, why would they wanna come to div 3.

From the outside, it sounds and looks like a lot going right at Greenhill off the field and on field in both football and netball departments.

Surely the could drop Epping back and Wallan could go into D2

 

[Blueboy67]

Running a footy club is like running a small business, 400K turnover, employees etc. There can be a range of reasons why you can't service any of your suppliers trading terms, not just NFNL. Delays in sponsor monies coming through, poor results means less supporters turning up & bar/canteen sales down Vs forecast turnover. For the league to threaten pay by set time or we will drop your salary cap even further for following season means you put your other creditors under pressure - players, coaches, club staff, bar/canteen suppliers etc. This just shows you how far removed from club land that nfnl management are. Maybe the league could reduce some of their profit margins i.e: 25% mark up on jumpers for starters & you're forced to buy from their approved suppliers. Or maybe work with clubs (not just Div 1), instead of the salary cap reduction & further threat of sanctions for 2020 laid on clubs on 29/08, that conversation could of been April or May. Yes clubs should work within their financial restraints & service all their suppliers trading terms, but don't move the goal posts mid stream. Everyone working in club land want their club successful both on & off field & work towards that every day.

Do you think it's fair though, if one club does their budget planning and doesn't pay up to the salary cap limit to ensure they pay their league fees but miss finals, then another club throws caution to the wind, pays up to the full salary cap limit, don't pay up their league fees and play finals?

 

[Sports_Support]

Just putting it out there what's everyone's thoughts on training and work life with young kids coming into senior footy. If a young bloke is having to work and has to miss training would you drop him or give the the benefit of the doubt if they have contacted the coach with a valid reason? It's been a discussion point around a few clubs and I have my opinion just want to hear what this forum has to offer.
Good luck to Morang and Hilliers this weekend.

25% Tuesday
25% Thursday
40% Game Day
10% Functions

Have to work any of those, that’s ok...

Your work comes first but, like casual staff. No show, no pay.

Up to the coaching department if he plays or not based on attendance

 

[Sports_Support]

Running a footy club is like running a small business, 400K turnover, employees etc. There can be a range of reasons why you can't service any of your suppliers trading terms, not just NFNL. Delays in sponsor monies coming through, poor results means less supporters turning up & bar/canteen sales down Vs forecast turnover. For the league to threaten pay by set time or we will drop your salary cap even further for following season means you put your other creditors under pressure - players, coaches, club staff, bar/canteen suppliers etc. This just shows you how far removed from club land that nfnl management are. Maybe the league could reduce some of their profit margins i.e: 25% mark up on jumpers for starters & you're forced to buy from their approved suppliers. Or maybe work with clubs (not just Div 1), instead of the salary cap reduction & further threat of sanctions for 2020 laid on clubs on 29/08, that conversation could of been April or May. Yes clubs should work within their financial restraints & service all their suppliers trading terms, but don't move the goal posts mid stream. Everyone working in club land want their club successful both on & off field & work towards that every day.

Hmmm... Let’s see if that theory stacks up.

D3, 4 wins in two years... lowest suburban median house prices in the leauges boundries, no junior feeders, ageing and diverse demographics, blank piece of paper basically... $65k turn-around in 24 months... Clubs are not budgeting correctly or responsibly, simple.

Maybe... I should have used one of the excuses above to kid myself it was someone else’s fault for poor management and play outside our means to win...?

 

[Sports_Support]

Do you think it's fair though, if one club does their budget planning and doesn't pay up to the salary cap limit to ensure they pay their league fees but miss finals, then another club throws caution to the wind, pays up to the full salary cap limit, don't pay up their league fees and play finals?

I think it’s a breach of the rules with the blessing of the league...

Don’t think a reduction in salary cap will achieve anything either to be honest... the club management need to be accountable... supporters, members and players will do that if there is a reduction in points available to play OR positions on a ladder in jeopardy.

 

[MLloyd]

I think the netball competition should be played and run like the country leagues as opposed to the current model. Same fixtures, courts in the sports precinct. Big

 

[Les429]

Do you think it's fair though, if one club does their budget planning and doesn't pay up to the salary cap limit to ensure they pay their league fees but miss finals, then another club throws caution to the wind, pays up to the full salary cap limit, don't pay up their league fees and play finals?

All clubs should be budget planing to meet all their obligations. Some clubs will operate to 100% of the cap some clubs maybe 40%.
The league has set rounds during the year that clubs need to be financial to the league by or risk not playing for points, so its not just finals.
I think it's a bit rich when the league come out last week & reduce salary cap you have to work within from 90K to 80 after only 12mths earlier reducing it from 100K to 90K without any for-warning & also add be completely financial by Oct 31 or risk having yr salary cap reduced even further.
(No need for the big stick)
But they gave Div 1 Clubs 2 yrs notice of their cut they got last week. What are we? The poor cousins?
If your club signed players early this year on 2 yrs based the the salary cap, your club could now be in breach of contract. So the league has now put yr club in a financial situation it couldn't for-see. All I'm saying is, the league should be working with & working for the clubs to help them be viable instead of putting any road blocks in the way.
I'm not saying clubs shouldn't be paying their bills to meet salary cap, but the league should be giving all clubs the chance to budget properly by not having decisions & veiled threats issued so late before the start of the following season.

 

[Les429]

Hmmm... Let’s see if that theory stacks up.

D3, 4 wins in two years... lowest suburban median house prices in the leauges boundries, no junior feeders, ageing and diverse demographics, blank piece of paper basically... $65k turn-around in 24 months... Clubs are not budgeting correctly or responsibly, simple.

Maybe... I should have used one of the excuses above to kid myself it was someone else’s fault for poor management and play outside our means to win...?

It's not about not paying the league.
It's poor management, poor governance by the league
A club could be financially responsible and operate within 100% of the salary cap, but if overnight the goal post are moved & you have multiple players on 2 yr contracts, the league has now put yr club at risk of being in breach of contract if you legitimately can not meet yr contract obligations.
Communication is key

 

[Rusted nuts]

Honestly I’d be staggered I’d any div 3 club was anywhere near 90k to begin with. If you are that is poor management because other than PH the lists are nowhere near that sort of money especially with teams such as SM Kilmore and laurimar being quite young.

 

[10571z]

Honestly I’d be staggered I’d any div 3 club was anywhere near 90k to begin with. If you are that is poor management because other than PH the lists are nowhere near that sort of money especially with teams such as SM Kilmore and laurimar being quite young.

While I agree...90k goes pretty quick.

For example Laurimar have 2 ex AFL players half the cap could nearly be gone there

Young or not there is always another club chasing kids which can drive the price up

 

[Wastin time]

Honestly I’d be staggered I’d any div 3 club was anywhere near 90k to begin with. If you are that is poor management because other than PH the lists are nowhere near that sort of money especially with teams such as SM Kilmore and laurimar being quite young.

80k is $218 a player over 18 rounds.. with EDFL div3 budget at $135k its gona be tough to keep lists together..
if AFL Vic were serious they'd have , at least all metro leagues, on the same cap...

 

[Wastin time]

Depends... if he trains regularly and this is a once off then I’d believe him.

If he has a new excuse every week then again that would be a different story.

There isn’t a one size fits all but it’s usually the same blokes making the same excuses i find.

Depends what job as well.

Depends is the kid of $800 a game or $50

But no missing training because of work doesn’t mean instant dropping

Agree in part , to a degree.
Work is of course priority, family too. But it's amazing how many players work later than 7pm every Tuesday & Thursday night.
So I'd say there's leeway, but there's also some taking the piss.
Imagine most clubs have jnrs training every night of the week , so there's 5 days of opportunity to train.
If it's genuinely work commitments then I guess it comes i)down to affect on rest of playing group & ii) FORM.

 

[Sports_Support]

It's not about not paying the league.
It's poor management, poor governance by the league
A club could be financially responsible and operate within 100% of the salary cap, but if overnight the goal post are moved & you have multiple players on 2 yr contracts, the league has now put yr club at risk of being in breach of contract if you legitimately can not meet yr contract obligations.
Communication is key

Most have known there would be a reduction... The notification and method of inclusion with clubs is horrendous. We can agree on that.

Back to not paying the bills though... if your club priorities are “players payments” over “solid management” then I can’t see why responsible practices are disadvantaged against breaches of league fees... There really is zero excuse.

Player payment budgets need to be formulated AFTER the cost of running your club is factored, NOT BEFORE.

 

[Sports_Support]

Agree in part , to a degree.
Work is of course priority, family too. But it's amazing how many players work later than 7pm every Tuesday & Thursday night.
So I'd say there's leeway, but there's also some taking the piss.
Imagine most clubs have jnrs training every night of the week , so there's 5 days of opportunity to train.
If it's genuinely work commitments then I guess it comes i)down to affect on rest of playing group & ii) FORM.

Lots of overtime on Tuesday night yet membership/rego is a strech... it’s a similar story across all clubs.

 

[Sports_Support]

While I agree...90k goes pretty quick.

For example Laurimar have 2 ex AFL players half the cap could nearly be gone there

Young or not there is always another club chasing kids which can drive the price up

It makes retention virtually impossible...

Development or project players get contacted fairly easily with social media... Put lots of work into a player and they quickly get offered double at D1 or 2 what the budget allows at D3.

Points and caps should be standardised, reduced AND “means tested”

A. Payment plans for affiliation fees is a breach - shouldn’t qualify for finals (that’s if this is an issue, I’m only going on what the league has communicated)

B. Salary caps need to consistent across all metro comps
B.1 $150k
B.2 $100k
B.3 $75k

C. Points need to be “means tested” in a sense
C.1 Finals year prior 35
C.2 Out of finals year prior 40
C.3 promotion 45
C.4 U19 need to be considered as senior games

D. Clubs acting outside the rules get stripped of all points (this makes committees accountable)

I wonder how a promotion/relegation idea would work around the metropolitan comps and VFL...?!?

 

[Doona2]

Reading the last block of posts, its a crying shame when learned and passionate football figures like Ben are often ignored or simply not listened to or included in conversation that could lead to constructive learnings.

And herein lies one of my biggest concerns going forward for the local football landscape, as I sit here waiting replay to an email a week ago regarding what criteria should I be working off in regards to the 2020 NFNL junior rep programs.

A lot of leagues all around the state could benefit greatly from insight and inclusion from those on the front line, many who have lived and breathed the game, albeit voluntarily for years ... whilst those earning the quid (from club raised fee's) may not actually always possess such knowledge to tell you all how to run your (volunteer) clubs and leagues, and boast the experience and in some cases the human element to build genuine community sporting relationships.

And in regards to clubs not being financial, surely this doesn't affect this division? Reckon I'd be pretty pi$$ed off if Panton Hill or South Morang were allowed to run out this week having not met their financial commitment to the league, and even now be raising the alarm and making some noise on the topic ... simply not cool if players are being paid at the detriment to you blokes who have covered their umpire fee's, not to mention other things across 2019.

 

[Top deck]

It makes retention virtually impossible...

Development or project players get contacted fairly easily with social media... Put lots of work into a player and they quickly get offered double at D1 or 2 what the budget allows at D3.

Points and caps should be standardised, reduced AND “means tested”

A. Payment plans for affiliation fees is a breach - shouldn’t qualify for finals (that’s if this is an issue, I’m only going on what the league has communicated)

B. Salary caps need to consistent across all metro comps
B.1 $150k
B.2 $100k
B.3 $75k

C. Points need to be “means tested” in a sense
C.1 Finals year prior 35
C.2 Out of finals year prior 40
C.3 promotion 45
C.4 U19 need to be considered as senior games

D. Clubs acting outside the rules get stripped of all points (this makes committees accountable)

I wonder how a promotion/relegation idea would work around the metropolitan comps and VFL...?!?

Great ideas what’s thoughts on this
Eg a player transfers to your club if he plays 10 games off 19s footy before a senior game
Can he be reduce to 3 points

I know a few clubs that struggled with this a little this it made it to pick their best side
And kids at 18 19 have a different outlook on life they want to play with their mates

 

[Sports_Support]

Reading the last block of posts, its a crying shame when learned and passionate football figures like Ben are often ignored or simply not listened to or included in conversation that could lead to constructive learnings.

And herein lies one of my biggest concerns going forward for the local football landscape, as I sit here waiting replay to an email a week ago regarding what criteria should I be working off in regards to the 2020 NFNL junior rep programs.

A lot of leagues all around the state could benefit greatly from insight and inclusion from those on the front line, many who have lived and breathed the game, albeit voluntarily for years ... whilst those earning the quid (from club raised fee's) may not actually always possess such knowledge to tell you all how to run your (volunteer) clubs and leagues, and boast the experience and in some cases the human element to build genuine community sporting relationships.

And in regards to clubs not being financial, surely this doesn't affect this division? Reckon I'd be pretty pi$$ed off if Panton Hill or South Morang were allowed to run out this week having not met their financial commitment to the league, and even now be raising the alarm and making some noise on the topic ... simply not cool if players are being paid at the detriment to you blokes who have covered their umpire fee's, not to mention other things across 2019.

I enjoy helping club volunteers and will always be available for suggestions/support/advice... Have been for over a decade.

I love community footy for so many reasons but the way it’s all heading is so far removed from the environment I grew up around.

 

[Sports_Support]

Great ideas what’s thoughts on this
Eg a player transfers to your club if he plays 10 games off 19s footy before a senior game
Can he be reduce to 3 points

I know a few clubs that struggled with this a little this it made it to pick their best side
And kids at 18 19 have a different outlook on life they want to play with their mates

There needs to be some restrictions around U19 to avoid the player poaching and enticement to leave.

At the moment, the age group is void of being a junior pathway or identified as a senior division

 

[Doona2]

I enjoy helping club volunteers and will always be available for suggestions/support/advice... Have been for over a decade.

I love community footy for so many reasons but the way it’s all heading is so far removed from the environment I grew up around.

100% with you on this mate, and I've just said to my local junior club recently that due to some constraints I simply can't do my role without a direct link to the NFNL so it's best they source a fresh face. Besides we don't need a role or a badge to hopefully still impact young footballers, keen coaches and willing volunteers.
Two different coffee catch ups with club presidents from neighbouring leagues last week, simply just to chew tha fat, and be a bit of a removed/neutral set of eyes and ears on a few topics.

I see every chance like that an opportunity to learn and grow, and if we both leave with the table with something that can help each other then I always see it as a great outcome. Not everyone has all the answers, but collectively there are a lot of people around the traps who love community footy and just want to try and find a way to sustain and keep it relevant.

Personally, I just want local footy/netballs clubs to still be an option for my 3 kids should they choose to partake in it once they're at an age to make their own decisions - as growing up with it until now what I have the privilegde of doing I continually tell them how lucky they are to meet the people they have and get to experience some of the things my football allows them too.
Plus we must as parents put the skillset into them so that they can integrate and meet new people respectfully should work/study/life take them into foreign territory and sporting environments where they may not actually know anyone.

 

[Keptindark]

Reading the last block of posts, its a crying shame when learned and passionate football figures like Ben are often ignored or simply not listened to or included in conversation that could lead to constructive learnings.

And herein lies one of my biggest concerns going forward for the local football landscape, as I sit here waiting replay to an email a week ago regarding what criteria should I be working off in regards to the 2020 NFNL junior rep programs.

A lot of leagues all around the state could benefit greatly from insight and inclusion from those on the front line, many who have lived and breathed the game, albeit voluntarily for years ... whilst those earning the quid (from club raised fee's) may not actually always possess such knowledge to tell you all how to run your (volunteer) clubs and leagues, and boast the experience and in some cases the human element to build genuine community sporting relationships.

And in regards to clubs not being financial, surely this doesn't affect this division? Reckon I'd be pretty pi$$ed off if Panton Hill or South Morang were allowed to run out this week having not met their financial commitment to the league, and even now be raising the alarm and making some noise on the topic ... simply not cool if players are being paid at the detriment to you blokes who have covered their umpire fee's, not to mention other things across 2019.

I think you know the reply to your email will get " LOST " in mail trail and they never received. Thats tyhe usual excuse I have been hearing. Im sure 1 of the clubs running out on Saturday are run by the league and have no idea what goes on there. Thats whyt they apparently agreed on people runniong the club that have been involved in all the Rubbish that went on a few years ago. Anyway good luck to both sides, we know which club is ready for promotion.

 

[Half a mongrel]

Just putting it out there what's everyone's thoughts on training and work life with young kids coming into senior footy. If a young bloke is having to work and has to miss training would you drop him or give the the benefit of the doubt if they have contacted the coach with a valid reason? It's been a discussion point around a few clubs and I have my opinion just want to hear what this forum has to offer.
Good luck to Morang and Hilliers this weekend.

So what is your opinion swooping??
There is only two clubs left so your young kid must play for SM or PH
There is also two training nights left surely he can tell the boss he can’t work OT TUESDAY & THURSDAY night
Every one a winner

 

[Doona2]

I think you know the reply to your email will get " LOST " in mail trail and they never received. Thats tyhe usual excuse I have been hearing. Im sure 1 of the clubs running out on Saturday are run by the league and have no idea what goes on there. Thats whyt they apparently agreed on people runniong the club that have been involved in all the Rubbish that went on a few years ago. Anyway good luck to both sides, we know which club is ready for promotion.

I so wanna help identify the correct kids in my area, but wanna know what criteria they need to meet first. Club nominations are lazy, as the correct one's are often missed - as is the cut and past job from the 2019 squad to automatically invite those kids back, especially in the cases of some not improving or developing at all this past season.

$hit I hope the second bit to your post doesn't mean that it is in fact a grand finallist in this division that is not compliant in terms of 2019 leagues fee's ????