Expansion NRL giving away free tickets again.

[Bone71]

Wouldn't worry about crowd figures when assessing NRL interest in any part of Sydney, with the exception of the State of Origin games and the GF, League has always drawn poor attendances in comparison to the AFL (even the SANFL & WAFL before the national league attracted comparable if not better crowds). No, whilst people don't tend to go to games, make no mistake they do watch it on TV and follow their clubs through the media. The League clubs have massive identities in their local areas and generate a lot of goodwill within the community. League is a lot more entrenched than crowd figures will point to.

The AFL also may find themselves with a similar problem soccer has battled for many years - plenty of kids playing the sport but it not translating into crowds and a high number of elite players

 

[ChrisFooty]

It's actually a good idea by South Sydney. Gets the young kids going to games. It would not surprise me if the Western Sydney AFL team does something similar.

 

[Doctor Jolly]

It's actually a good idea by South Sydney. Gets the young kids going to games. It would not surprise me if the Western Sydney AFL team does something similar.

It seems the NRL trolls here (although Littleduck has avoided this thread) seem to wholeheartedly agree:

The NRL should give away free tickets to games.

Thank you.
Bookmarked.

 

[littleduck]

It seems the NRL trolls here (although Littleduck has avoided this thread) seem to wholeheartedly agree:

The NRL should give away free tickets to games.

Thank you.
Bookmarked.

I think it's about free tickets to under 16;s, yeah?

 

[Doctor Jolly]

I think it's about free tickets to under 16;s, yeah?

Sometimes its under 16's, sometimes its NZ passport holders, sometimes its a free for all, sometimes is something else.

Doesnt seem to be a strategy thats well thought out.

 

[gostk86]

I love how arrogant AFL people are, sure bring another sydney team and also a gold coast team up.

They will both get support and will probably both survive the long run. And so will Rugby league, Rugby Union and Soccer.

Remeber the swans playing at ANZ is still a 'event' and the 40 000 were all swans supporters, not afl supporters.

 

[littleduck]

Sometimes its under 16's, sometimes its NZ passport holders, sometimes its a free for all, sometimes is something else.

Doesnt seem to be a strategy thats well thought out.

There is no free ticket policy in NRL.

However, as in all sports, sometimes individual clubs have promotions, eg freebies to under 16's. The rationale is a 12 year old might get in free, but its likely there parents will take them as full fee paying customers.

NZ passport holders were not free tickets. Mick Watson paid for them all !

 

[Hoops]

Wouldn't worry about crowd figures when assessing NRL interest in any part of Sydney, with the exception of the State of Origin games and the GF, League has always drawn poor attendances in comparison to the AFL (even the SANFL & WAFL before the national league attracted comparable if not better crowds). No, whilst people don't tend to go to games, make no mistake they do watch it on TV and follow their clubs through the media. The League clubs have massive identities in their local areas and generate a lot of goodwill within the community. League is a lot more entrenched than crowd figures will point to.

The AFL also may find themselves with a similar problem soccer has battled for many years - plenty of kids playing the sport but it not translating into crowds and a high number of elite players

1961: Rugby League's first televised game
Year -NSWRL, VFL
1957 - 10,100, 23,615
1958 - 9,462, 22,172
1959 - 8,531, 22,067
1960 - 9,262, 21225

So even before the advent of television for Rugby League, Football use to comand 2- 2.5 times the crowds of Rugby League, and if you look at the crowds since the same ratio pretty much applies. Myth Busted

 

[littleduck]

1961: Rugby League's first televised game
Year -NSWRL, VFL
1957 - 10,100, 23,615
1958 - 9,462, 22,172
1959 - 8,531, 22,067
1960 - 9,262, 21225

So even before the advent of television for Rugby League, Football use to comand 2- 2.5 times the crowds of Rugby League, and if you look at the crowds since the same ratio has pretty much applies. Myth Busted

That ratio will never change either!

RL is aiming for 20,000 average across the board in the near future, but the size of boutique venues and location of larger venues limits the scope to ever challenge AFL crowds.

 

[nescri]

Wouldn't worry about crowd figures when assessing NRL interest in any part of Sydney, with the exception of the State of Origin games and the GF, League has always drawn poor attendances in comparison to the AFL (even the SANFL & WAFL before the national league attracted comparable if not better crowds). No, whilst people don't tend to go to games, make no mistake they do watch it on TV and follow their clubs through the media. The League clubs have massive identities in their local areas and generate a lot of goodwill within the community. League is a lot more entrenched than crowd figures will point to.

The AFL also may find themselves with a similar problem soccer has battled for many years - plenty of kids playing the sport but it not translating into crowds and a high number of elite players

Edit: good post

 

[Professor Knowall]

... The AFL also may find themselves with a similar problem soccer has battled for many years - plenty of kids playing the sport but it not translating into crowds and a high number of elite players

That could be a problem if a second side wasn't placed into West Sydney to back up all the work being done on grass roots development - It gives the juniors a local club to identify with and aspire too, with the Swans being too remote from the Western suburbs to identify with.

There are presently 12 Sydney metro raised players with AFL clubs, but obviously the AFL will expect that figure to increase a lot in the future.

As to crowds, that's more of an unknown, but I wouldn't under-estimate the ability to attract reasonable crowds (at least by Sydney's standards), given a 3-4 year lead in period to the introduction of the new club into the AFL. But ultimately, at this stage, we can only speculate and wait and see.

 

[Ancient and Loyal]

1961: Rugby League's first televised game
Year -NSWRL, VFL
1957 - 10,100, 23,615
1958 - 9,462, 22,172
1959 - 8,531, 22,067
1960 - 9,262, 21225

So even before the advent of television for Rugby League, Football use to comand 2- 2.5 times the crowds of Rugby League, and if you look at the crowds since the same ratio pretty much applies. Myth Busted

Not really. Alot's changed in 40 years. For starters, clubs like Wenty and Guildford which drew rather large crowds in the 1950's for second tier clubs are at the bottom of the pile.

What hasn't changed is the nature of both cities and competitions. Sydney and its clubs remain highly decentralised, whilst Melbourne and its clubs are still centralised.

 

[Bone71]

1961: Rugby League's first televised game
Year -NSWRL, VFL
1957 - 10,100, 23,615
1958 - 9,462, 22,172
1959 - 8,531, 22,067
1960 - 9,262, 21225

So even before the advent of television for Rugby League, Football use to comand 2- 2.5 times the crowds of Rugby League, and if you look at the crowds since the same ratio pretty much applies. Myth Busted

I think you missed the point, in Sydney they never had, before of after the advent on TV, a large culture of attendance to League games but that doesn't mean they are not interested and/or do not have some sort of investment (emotional or otherwise) in their League clubs. Anyone who has been to Sydney for any length of time knows hardly anyone has been to a game but they all follow it.

 

[Bone71]

That could be a problem if a second side wasn't placed into West Sydney to back up all the work being done on grass roots development - It gives the juniors a local club to identify with and aspire too, with the Swans being too remote from the Western suburbs to identify with.

There are presently 12 Sydney metro raised players with AFL clubs, but obviously the AFL will expect that figure to increase a lot in the future.

As to crowds, that's more of an unknown, but I wouldn't under-estimate the ability to attract reasonable crowds (at least by Sydney's standards), given a 3-4 year lead in period to the introduction of the new club into the AFL. But ultimately, at this stage, we can only speculate and wait and see.

Hope you are right. Soccer has had plenty of grass roots development and have the most kids exposed to their code at an early age and plenty of clubs to aspire to, local or otherwise, but it still hasn't translated into consistantly large crowds or a high number of elite players. Mind you soccer did hamstring itself for many years and have only recently sorted itself out.

 

[Eel_storm]

They give away free tickets and they probably still won't match the AFL's crowds?!?! The AFL must be shaking in their boots.

In all seriousness I expect the AFL to give away free tickets to the Western Sydney side when they come to Sydney. Something like free three game memerships to school kids or something like that. Would grow the interest in a developing market. However, the NRL is in a completely different stage of development.

I am getting less concerned by the NRL everyday.

NRL is a TV market, so crowds aren't really a good judge of the interest in the game. I barrack for the Paramatta Eels and the Melbourne Storm and i can tell you both are well supported on TV if not in crowds.

 

[frankc]

The AFL has been overconfident before and it has cost them. While rugby league crowds are even worse than Nth Melbourne Melbourne games, you shouldn't forget that they rate much higher on television than Nth Melbourne Melbourne games. You should also remember that 85,800 people play rugby league in NSW, and the number of people that play rugby league in Sydney is far higher than the number of people who play Australian football. So in regards to which code has the highest community participation and strongest local image, rugby league wins hands down.

The strength of rugby league's community links are worth thinking about when you Victorians denigrate rugby league and preach how you will enlighten rugby league fans with the gospel of AFL.

So why don't people turn up to the games?

This is a simple question whcih no NRL fan seems to be able to provided an adequate answer. At the end of the day, no matter how you cut it, more people turn up to AFL - simple as that.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

So why don't people turn up to the games?

This is a simple question whcih no NRL fan seems to be able to provided an adequate answer. At the end of the day, no matter how you cut it, more people turn up to AFL - simple as that.

Culture is the difference why. The interest is there but the passion to turn up isn't. Sydneysiders have a bigger tradition of going to the leagues club and watching it there on TV.

Also weather plays a part. A decade or more ago, 2 or 3 years after I had moved to Sydney I spent a day on the harbour. It was mid July, 22 degrees and sunny. We pulled into Watsons Bay, tied up the boat at the dock, had lunch and beers at the pub for a couple of hours. Went back out on the water, ended up at Manly and picked up a female friend and went back to the Watsons Bay pub for a couple of more hours drinking. I said to myself then, why would you want to spend a Saturday arvo at the footy when you can do this. Ok so my footy team wasn't playing in Sydney that arvo, but it did make me see why you would want to be doing something else.

 

[genghiskhan]

So why don't people turn up to the games?

This is a simple question whcih no NRL fan seems to be able to provided an adequate answer. At the end of the day, no matter how you cut it, more people turn up to AFL - simple as that.

1) Sydney is a very difficult city to get around and all the stadiums are located at very hard to get at areas. (They are trying to remedy that problem now by getting clubs to play at Homebush). Melbourne is different. Not only is Melbourne easy to get around compared to Sydney, when the VFL broke from the VFA, it was the inner city clubs that broke away so all the stadiums were close together. If you want to compare rugby league crowds to aussie rules crowds, the fairest comparison is in Brisbane where the two national teams were established about the same time, and operate in the same city. In Brisbane, the two codes draw similar crowds.

2) Rugby league is a shit game to watch live. You cheer when a try is scored, but the rest of the time it is quiet. Also, you can't really see the action. On the other hand, Aussie rules is great to watch live. You can make noise all the time, and the ball is always flowing from end to end.

3) Rugby league has never had complete dominance of Sydney as Aussie rules has had in Melbourne. Rugby union has always had a strong presence, and Aussie rules had a presence as well.

 

[littleduck]

1) Sydney is a very difficult city to get around and all the stadiums are located at very hard to get at areas. (They are trying to remedy that problem now by getting clubs to play at Homebush).

Two responses:
1. Homebush is not readily accessible to fans of all teams like the MCG is to Melbourne AFL fans.
2. Homebush is not a football-friendly venue and does not provide the full RL experience at a live game unless capacity.

Melbourne is different. Not only is Melbourne easy to get around compared to Sydney, when the VFL broke from the VFA, it was the inner city clubs that broke away so all the stadiums were close together. If you want to compare rugby league crowds to aussie rules crowds, the fairest comparison is in Brisbane where the two national teams were established about the same time, and operate in the same city. In Brisbane, the two codes draw similar crowds.

Yeah.

2) Rugby league is a shit game to watch live.

Bollocks.

You cheer when a try is scored, but the rest of the time it is quiet.

Bollocks.

Also, you can't really see the action.

Bollocks.

On the other hand,

Bollocks.

Aussie rules is great to watch live.

True.

You can make noise all the time,

True.

and the ball is always flowing from end to end.

Sounds like basketball.... isn't the idea to play up your goal-scoring end for as long as possible?

3) Rugby league has never had complete dominance of Sydney as Aussie rules has had in Melbourne.

True.

Rugby union has always had a strong presence,

Strong?

and Aussie rules had a presence as well.

True, but under the radar type grassroots presence. VFL scores in fine print 10 pages in from the back type presence at the other higher profile end.

 

[littleduck]

So why don't people turn up to the games?

This is a ridiculous question that arises on BF time and time again. The reality is RL attracts about 3.5 million paying bums on seats annually at NRL level and above. The issue is simply why don't even more turn up, especially considering AFL crowds in Melbourne.

 

[zero]

i dont really understand the whole stigma associated with free tickets....hell i dont even like league but if the rabbitohs give away free tickets to any of their perth games i might get along, just to check it out and see what the deal is. if the code can afford to pay for people to come to games to promote it then fantastic, you have to think things are going pretty well if thats the case. letting all kids in for free is a particulary good deal, imo. makes it a very affordable day out for (say) a dad and a couple of kids, and it gets kids involved in the game. i would hope that the new western sydney team would have this in place early.

whats worse is actual lying about attendances to beef them up, which happened at least a few times at rabbitohs home games at ANZ stadium (and it wouldnt surprise me if it was a regular occurence)

 

[nescri]

So why don't people turn up to the games?

AFL crowds vs t.v figures suggest there are plenty of fans who dont turn up to games.

 

[Eel_storm]

if the storm gave away free tickets i'd still pay, go storm

 

[greenhat]

Rugby League isn't a shit sport to watch live, its just that its not bad to watch on TV. You can actually get a pretty good grasp of whats happening when you watch on TV, most of the action is in front of the cameras. The atmosphere is better at the ground, obviously, but home viewing still lets you follow the match well.

Aussie rules on the other hand, is crap on TV. You just cannot get a good grasp of what is happening without seeing most of the field. The TV cameras just zoom in on the ball and chase it around idiotically so you can't see all the off the ball stuff and it's hard to get an idea of the broader picture of how the teams are operating tactically. You see the individual stuff like big marks and goals but not much else.

If you want to really watch an AFL game properly, you -have- to be in the stands. Thats not really the case for Rugby League.

 

[yioughtta]

Aussie rules on the other hand, is crap on TV. You just cannot get a good grasp of what is happening without seeing most of the field. The TV cameras just zoom in on the ball and chase it around idiotically so you can't see all the off the ball stuff and it's hard to get an idea of the broader picture of how the teams are operating tactically. You see the individual stuff like big marks and goals but not much else.

If you want to really watch an AFL game properly, you -have- to be in the stands. Thats not really the case for Rugby League.

I agree with this to a fair degree. AFL will benefit enormously in the future when HDTV becomes the norm. When this happens, the broadcasters will have more scope to show wide-angle shots whilst still allowing the viewer to discern which players are which.

When you are the type of person who likes to analyse a game whilst watching, current TV really isn't good enough. You really do have to be there. A great deal of what is worth watching in football happens off the play. But TV broadcasters currently zoom in on the pack, and only zoom out when the ball is in the air. Sometimes, at a restart of play, you can't even tell who is starting in the centre square for either team.

Again, footy will truly benefit enormously from HDTV. Will Rugby?