Official List Management Thread

[Eastern Crow]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

Sellar has shown desire and competitiveness. That was something he worked on so hard over the pre season.

He's 19 or 20 now, why would we just get rid of him? That would just be such a waste.

yes he improved over the pre-season, however he lacks consistency in this area and has dropped off remarkably during the season, this is the key reason why he is playing 2's at the bay, this has to be a concern

at some stage people need to forget about his rating as a junior, serious questions need to be asked and he needs to demostrate that he has the ticker, hunger, work rate and desire to be a successful long term key forward for the AFC

bottom line, he needs to turn his potential into performances and club patience may be starting to wear a bit thin

no one expects him to be a start right now, seriously playing 2's for the bays

remember Sellar was once rated a potential #1 pick in competition to Gibbs, he needs to put everything on the line

 

[SydCrow]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

Correct i dont mean to Harp on it but Gill is the Forward that needs to be delisted

sorry to harp on it but Gill is our best CHF

if you think Sellar is better value than Gill then good luck to you

 

[Eastern Crow]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

Rubbish. The coach can, and the good ones do. Mick Malthouse has turned lazy arse Medhurst into top line palyer, just as one example. Dont tell me coahes like Blight, Malthouse, Lethal, Sheedy and the like havent turned lazy young men into professional, elite AFL footballers. Theyve done it time and time again. Thats what good coaches do. FFS motivating and bringing the competative nature out of players is the bread and butter of coaching. I remember hearing Kerley give a speach one day at West Adelaide way back in the early 80's, and I tell you I would have charged the beach at Galipolli after it. If Craig cant make a player feel like he can do it, that he wants to do it and he has to do it, he isnt a football coaches arse.

what coaches now can do heart transplants

usually it is not the coach that has turned them around, it is the kick in the arse after being traded or delisted

lets look at Medhurst, he is driven by a second chance, ultimately it comes from the player

 

[Crowboy#32]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

sorry to harp on it but Gill is our best CHF

if you think Sellar is better value than Gill then good luck to you

I didnt say that at all. Watched Gill vs Walker both playing at CHF in an SANFL game this year and the difference was huge. Walker is as quick as Gill got stronger hands and amazing foot skills. Yes Gill is better than Sellar now BUT his skill too often let him down and he WONT get any better

 

[Eastern Crow]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

no one is arguing that Sellar was going to take time

however it is the way he is going about it that is causing the concern

 

[Sanguinarius]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

yes he improved over the pre-season, however he lacks consistency in this area and has dropped off remarkably during the season, this is the key reason why he is playing 2's at the bay, this has to be a concern

at some stage people need to forget about his rating as a junior, serious questions need to be asked and he needs to demostrate that he has the ticker, hunger, work rate and desire to be a successful long term key forward for the AFC

bottom line, he needs to turn his potential into performances and club patience may be starting to wear a bit thin

no one expects him to be a start right now, seriously playing 2's for the bays

remember Sellar was once rated a potential #1 pick in competition to Gibbs, he needs to put everything on the line

lacks consistancey? find me one 19/20 year old KPP who doesn't

dropped off over the year? He's a young player - that happens.

One of the reasons he dropped off was becasue he wasn't going to be able to ruck at AFL level. He wont. So he's starting from scratch to learn a new position - and he's had improvement. People forget that last year was basically a write off for him because of injury. This might of well have been his first season for all intents and purposes. You simply do not give up after 2 seasons on a junior that was so highly rated, especially after he has had some setbacks and is improving. I'm not saying he'll make it, but some of the expectations, or should I say critisisms are un-reasonable!

 

[Sanguinarius]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

however it is the way he is going about it that is causing the concern

if there is anything other than his on-field performance to go by, do tell?

 

[James23]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

I hope the club do not part ways with Sellar. It will also be unacceptable for the club to simply delist him without throwing him on the trade table. The same thing happened to Pfeiffer last year, when surely he had some value.

IMO it would be unforgiveable by the AFC to delist Sellar without agressively attempting a trade involving him. (that is only if they choose not to renew his contract.)

 

[Eastern Crow]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

I didnt say that at all. Watched Gill vs Walker both playing at CHF in an SANFL game this year and the difference was huge. Walker is as quick as Gill got stronger hands and amazing foot skills. Yes Gill is better than Sellar now BUT his skill too often let him down and he WONT get any better

than why wasn't walker picked before gill

Walker will not play CHF for adelaide in his initial years, he will play deep in the forward 50

 

[King Elvis]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

Sellar is still young enough to persist with - but a one year contract is the go.

 

[SydCrow]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

I didnt say that at all. Watched Gill vs Walker both playing at CHF in an SANFL game this year and the difference was huge. Walker is as quick as Gill got stronger hands and amazing foot skills. Yes Gill is better than Sellar now BUT his skill too often let him down and he WONT get any better

If Tex is as quick as Gill and has better hands then he will be a gun

Maybe he is a FF though?

 

[Crowboy#32]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

than why wasn't walker picked before gill

Walker will not play CHF for adelaide in his initial years, he will play deep in the forward 50

Not really sure why he hasnt been played. Everyone that has watched him play this year seems to be askin the same question

 

[PAFC04]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

Rubbish. The coach can, and the good ones do. Mick Malthouse has turned lazy arse Medhurst into top line palyer, just as one example. Dont tell me coahes like Blight, Malthouse, Lethal, Sheedy and the like havent turned lazy young men into professional, elite AFL footballers. Theyve done it time and time again. Thats what good coaches do. FFS motivating and bringing the competative nature out of players is the bread and butter of coaching. I remember hearing Kerley give a speach one day at West Adelaide way back in the early 80's, and I tell you I would have charged the beach at Galipolli after it. If Craig cant make a player feel like he can do it, that he wants to do it and he has to do it, he isnt a football coaches arse.

Spot on Crowked.....

If the coach can't get his chargers ready to play then he shouldn't be coaching.....full stop. Choco is another coach who took on Josh Mahoney from the Bombers who threw him on the scrap heap, only to be picked up Choco and gave him a new lease in footy life who was a very important cog in team to bring home our last premiership.

You don't need to be a scientist to be a great coach, what you do need is a way to came across to your chargers that makes a difference........does Malcolm Blight bring back some memeries.....

 

[Eastern Crow]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

if there is anything other than his on-field performance to go by, do tell?

no it's his approach to training, we all knnow how much emphasise Craigy puts on track form

the key reason the bays have dropped him to the 2's is his lack of competiveness and desire

post season 2007 the AFC made it very clear to James that this was the area that they expected greater consistency, his pre-season was improved however he has not maintained the expectations

personally I hope the lad gets another year, and I think he should, however he needs to take his training to another couple of levels

if we could combine tippett and sellar, we would have a player

 

[SydCrow]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

Spot on Crowked.....

If the coach can't get his chargers ready to play then he shouldn't be coaching.....full stop. Choco is another coach who took on Josh Mahoney from the Bombers who threw him on the scrap heap, only to be picked up Choco and gave him a new lease in footy life who was a very important cog in team to bring home our last premiership.

You don't need to be a scientist to be a great coach, what you do need is a way to came across to your chargers that makes a difference........does Malcolm Blight bring back some memeries.....

duh

I think you mean charges

yelling at players, sorry "motivating" them, went out with Neil Kerley

was 2004 really your last premiership? Don't be such a pessimist

 

[Eastern Crow]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

Spot on Crowked.....

If the coach can't get his chargers ready to play then he shouldn't be coaching.....full stop. Choco is another coach who took on Josh Mahoney from the Bombers who threw him on the scrap heap, only to be picked up Choco and gave him a new lease in footy life who was a very important cog in team to bring home our last premiership.

You don't need to be a scientist to be a great coach, what you do need is a way to came across to your chargers that makes a difference........does Malcolm Blight bring back some memeries.....

Josh Mahoney always had the desire and work rate however struggled for an opportunity at the WB

At the Power Josh improved his game, his committment was always first class

it is a different kettle of fish

 

[Sanguinarius]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

no it's his approach to training, we all knnow how much emphasise Craigy puts on track form

the key reason the bays have dropped him to the 2's is his lack of competiveness and desire

approach to training?

the same appraoch that Crow*Girl has reported as staying behind with coaching staff to work on problem areas?

and he needed to be dropped to the 2's to get game time, he can't compete with 3/4 other KPP all in their prime when he is still learning his position.

 

[PAFC04]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

Josh Mahoney always had the desire and work rate however struggled for an opportunity at the WB

At the Power Josh improved his game, his committment was always first class

it is a different kettle of fish

I stand corrected, but I heard in an interview with Josh that he was ready to give up playing only to get a call from Choco.......he was 28 when he was picked up.....

 

[-CG-]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

approach to training?

the same appraoch that Crow*Girl has reported as staying behind with coaching staff to work on problem areas?

and he needed to be dropped to the 2's to get game time, he can't compete with 3/4 other KPP all in their prime when he is still learning his position.

From memory, over the pre season he was always almost the last to leave the track, often staying behind to work on his tackling, mainly involving just him and a few trainers.

What I've noticed during the season though, is that at training, as he is not a required player as such, he has missed out on that one on one time and has received less attention.

 

[Mego Red]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

Ugh - ENOUGH with the talk of delisting Sellar.

None of the key position players from the 2006 draft have shown much. MAYBE Mitchell and Nathan Brown and Jack Reiwoldt - but Thorp and Gumbleton and Everitt and Leuenberger and Reid and Hansen etc etc all have bugger all runs on the board so far.

Relax. Sellar is younger than all of these.

 

[King Elvis]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

What are the chances Sellar will request a more from Glenelg, purely to chase more League opportunities?

I'd say pretty high.

 

[Crowing Around]

Re: End of season thoughts, changes and grades.

A strong year, but nothing 'special' from the coaches box.

GRADE: B-


#3 Kris Massie: Personally, he frustrates me. He will show great courage and have blinders by locking down players and going back with the flight to take good contested marks but then the week after he will show a lack of awareness, skill and intensity. I like him but I believe he will fall under the "unlucky we're being agressive this year" category. Torney II

GRADE: C STATUS: Delist

#12 Robert Shirley: Started slow as well but came along with the tagging side of his game well in the second half of the season. For mine, he just doesn't do enough on the other side of the ball to be worth his spot. Harsh indeed, but....

GRADE: C+ STATUS: Delist

Neil Craig - wrong! What more do supporters want?! Last year it was he's too robotic, this year he makes the changes and he's still criticised?! Damned if you do, damned if you don't i guess...

Kris Massie - wrong! Gives his all, solid at contests, good disposal and is accountable for his actions...

Shirley - wrong again! Takes the hardest tag, often shuts the opponent down while creating effective posessions himself - needs to be retained for at least another year...

Apart from that, mostly agree

 

[Coopers]

Re: The definitive 2008 player cull.

Sellar is 2 years younger than Ktip...

And Tippet is just beginning to show some nice stuff.

Sellar will definately get the opportunity again to show something. I'd say he has 2 years to start getting into the 22, and only then does talk of delisting make sense.

You guys are being ridiculous, expecting a 1st year player to be J Brown.

 

[relapse]

Re: End of season thoughts, changes and grades.

Neil Craig - wrong! What more do supporters want?! Last year it was he's too robotic, this year he makes the changes and he's still criticised?! Damned if you do, damned if you don't i guess...

Kris Massie - wrong! Gives his all, solid at contests, good disposal and is accountable for his actions...

Shirley - wrong again! Takes the hardest tag, often shuts the opponent down while creating effective posessions himself - needs to be retained for at least another year...

Apart from that, mostly agree

If you get the ball and give it to a player under the hammer it is still called an effective handball, but definately not a quality one. I am not the worlds biggest shirley fan which is obvious but IMO he is nowhere near damaging enough with the ball, he is usually good as a stopper but can you afford to have a 28 year old tagger who is a honest trier, but has no real damaging offensive side to his game ??

I think he will be kept for one more year, but if the club offers him any more than a 1 year deal I would be very disappointed.

 

[pjcrows]

Re: End of season thoughts, changes and grades.

Can't be bothered doing grades for every player and coach, but I'm OK with what happened this year. At the start of the year, whether you thought we'd finish bottom 4 or lower half of the 8, we knew it'd be an inconsistent year (it was), we'd play in patches (we did), we'd debut some youngsters (we did), and that we'd hope towards the end of the season we'd keep play these younger players rather than bringing in older hacks ala previous years (we certainly did).

You can get caught up in all the hype you want, rue all of the chances missed, but at the end of the day we finished 7th. Shoot me down and call me a "Yes Man", but I'm satisfied with it. Not satisfied in the effort yesterday - I certainly tipped us to win - but overall. A month ago we were staring down the barrell of an away final, or not even finals at all.

Heard it all before, but it takes balls to play MacKay ahead of Reilly in a final. And the young kid was fantastic. A 13-player turnover indicates a genuine rebuilding phase. 2008 was one step in that phase.

Having said that, we'll go nowhere if we don't develop Walker into a 50-goal forward in 2010. Nor if Dangerfield doesn't turn out to be the spark in our slow, blue-collar midfield.

I'm proud of the teams ability to come back and win 5 of their last 7 games when we could have done what every other team does.