POLL - Do you support KNEELING?

[iBeng]

Nice picture.

Now, explain what the systemic barriers are and what causes the inequity? How should they be removed to achieve a society that the BLM movement will be satisfied with?

There are plenty of sources of systematic racial inequality in America, you could google this. I would offer you some links but I dont know what you would consider acceptable and fake.

 

[Magma]

You're welcome to express your views. My entire point was that there are many players who have no choice but to take a knee irrespective of their view. My point being is that politics should have no place in the game. Let the players and the fans enjoy the spectacle without having to take political sides.

you dont have to take a political side. the human side is always preferable though.

 

[iBeng]

Used to love watching him play - his running game was top notch.

Remember when the President called him a son of a bitch, after a US veteran told him kneeling would be a respectful option instead of sitting?

 

[iBeng]

Nice picture.

Now, explain what the systemic barriers are and what causes the inequity? How should they be removed to achieve a society that the BLM movement will be satisfied with?

Hang on Biggy_Boy, you might be OK with this one, its a .org and has sources:

Systematic Inequality

The already large racial wealth gap between white and black American households grew even wider after the Great Recession. Targeted policies are necessary to reverse this deepening divide.

www.americanprogress.org

Feel free to say its their fault or something.

Edit: Wow, reading this article is actually quite alarming in terms of what America is.

 

[Wonderdog]

You're welcome to express your views. My entire point was that there are many players who have no choice but to take a knee irrespective of their view. My point being is that politics should have no place in the game. Let the players and the fans enjoy the spectacle without having to take political sides.

Aren’t players allowed to express an opinion on social issues.Are they just dumb jocks? That open a can of worms if sector of our society can’t express an opinion In their workplace. I have not been in a workplace like that And hope I never am.

 

[BF Tiger]

You're welcome to express your views. My entire point was that there are many players who have no choice but to take a knee irrespective of their view. My point being is that politics should have no place in the game. Let the players and the fans enjoy the spectacle without having to take political sides.

You have a source for this, right?

And I'm sure you'll be asking for the Cats to repay whatever government funding they have received for the Kardinia Park upgrades too, seeing as sport and politics don't mix.

 

[Maddo11]

I'd like to offer an alternative.

Players should have the choice. I don't support FORCING people to do it. Some players aren't political and just want to play the game.

Kneel in the privacy of your home. Players, in their workplace, should not be forced to kneel.

Take a moment to think if your workplace asked you to publicly commit to an act. Even if you disagree with it, what do you do?

“The players want us to understand why they have chosen to do this, tonight’s gesture is one of support, unity and respect driven by the playing group,” the statement read. “We stand in solidarity with our indigenous brothers and sisters for all people of colour. There is no place for racism. The knee is an expression of that support, we see strength in diversity, it makes us better as a football club and as a community. We will be there for each other always, especially at a time when many are impacted by what is going on around the world. We will continue to learn and walk this journey together.”

 

[Biggy_Boy]

Im actually really glad there are so many people who have gone through life and never faced a situation where they feel they've missed an opportunity for something like a job or something similar and then thought to themselves...Wow, I didnt get that because they thought I was X or Y or something. Not because you were not qualified or anything. Simply because the person presenting the option maybe didnt like how you looked or something.

Because that means they struggle looking at things like equal opportunity and think "Damn, Ive had that issue before, maybe we should look into that?"

Would happen all the time across many fields and professions, and it's not something that will be solved any time soon thing. And that wouldn't solely be a racial, or even a largely racial, thing now. Some people think some roles are better suited to attractive women (i.e. customer service roles, admin roles), some don't want to hire older people, some don't want to hire women in traditional male roles. There were always be prejudices because people are people.

Over the last few decades, here and abroad, many initiatives have been enacted to promote equality in hiring, admission in higher education, involvement in community groups/government. Some roles aren't available to you in Australia if you are white. In some cases, this has been achieved through lowering the standard of requirements for people who are not white.

 

[iBeng]

You have a source for this, right?

Ill lock in "Its an assumption Eddie" for my final answer.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

Then you don't understand, regardless of how good a person you want to be seen to be.
You're doing that weird thing of conflating the two situations, as if they're somehow bound.

Should people be forced to do, or say things just for show? Answer this question. It's not difficult

People should have the strength of character to say what they believe is right regardless of the consequences. Of course other people then have the right to comment upon that person's statements or actions.

 

[iBeng]

Would happen all the time across many fields and professions, and it's not something that will be solved any time soon thing. And that wouldn't solely be a racial, or even a largely racial, thing now. Some people think some roles are better suited to attractive women (i.e. customer service roles, admin roles), some don't want to hire older people, some don't want to hire women in traditional male roles. There were always be prejudices because people are people.

Over the last few decades, here and abroad, many initiatives have been enacted to promote equality in hiring, admission in higher education, involvement in community groups/government. Some roles aren't available to you in Australia if you are white. In some cases, this has been achieved through lowering the standard of requirements for people who are not white.

All true, but for America it isnt going to work with little changes. Did you see the article I linked? Its long, I dont expect you to read it all, but its all sourced with statistics and everything which highlights the problems currently in America that prevents them from going from fence 1 to either 2 or 3.

 

[Biggy_Boy]

There are plenty of sources of systematic racial inequality in America, you could google this. I would offer you some links but I dont know what you would consider acceptable and fake.

No, see, I want your interpretation. What you think. I can't Google what you think or believe. That's why I asked you. I wanted to know if your understanding of the issue was informed by anything more than pictures of fences.

 

[iBeng]

Then you don't understand, regardless of how good a person you want to be seen to be.
You're doing that weird thing of conflating the two situations, as if they're somehow bound.

Should people be forced to do, or say things just for show? Answer this question. It's not difficult

So people shouldnt be forced not to be racist, they should just be able to freely choose?

 

[iBeng]

No, see, I want your interpretation. What you think. I can't Google what you think or believe. That's why I asked you. I wanted to know if your understanding of the issue was informed by anything more than pictures of fences.

Yeah no, it doesnt work that way.

I read the article. I have provided you with ample source to read, digest and interpret that information.

YOU dont want to do any leg work that may change your attitude.

Thats not my fault. Thats your inability to process new information on a topic.

I can lead you to the water but you can tell me to get stuffed you dont want to drink it.

 

[HARKER]

So people shouldnt be forced not to be racist, they should just be able to freely choose?

How are you confusing these situations and you cannot force someone not to think themselves to be better than another
Force is not the answer and in fact it divides people more than it brings people together.....when you really think about it.

Back to this thread - If all players are indeed sincere about the matter and feel that kneeling will genuinely help, then fine but is this the case here?
This is a workplace and if you were told to do whatever your bosses told you to do, regardless of whether you wanted to do it or not, would you do it?

 

[iBeng]

How are you confusing these situations and you cannot force someone not to think themselves to be better than another
Force is not the answer and in fact it divides people more than it brings people together.....when you really think about it.

Back to this thread - If all players are indeed sincere about the matter and feel that kneeling will genuinely help, then fine but is this the case here?
This is a workplace and if you were told to do whatever your bosses told you to do, regardless of whether you wanted to do it or not, would you do it?

Alright disregarding my point, you are arguing that because no one can 100% know for sure all players knelt willingly then the whole thing is wrong.

If every single player personally contacted you and said "Hey mate, saw your concern, just letting you know I chose to join my team mates kneeling of my own free will."

Would that land you in the:
Yes Ok with it
Indifferent
No not OK with it

 

[Wonderdog]

How are you confusing these situations and you cannot force someone not to think themselves to be better than another
Force is not the answer and in fact it divides people more than it brings people together.....when you really think about it.

Back to this thread - If all players are indeed sincere about the matter and feel that kneeling will genuinely help, then fine but is this the case here?
This is a workplace and if you were told to do whatever your bosses told you to do, regardless of whether you wanted to do it or not, would you do it?

By bosses I assume You mean the AFL. From my reading, The AFLPA, Their union, have informed the AFL that their collective membership want to take a knee and theAFL have agreed in can occur.

Secondly even if it was the aaFL who wanted so what. A lot of companies have “Value statements” that employees have to agree to. All employers agree to abide by them or leave.

 

[Vintage]

No from me,sport and politics shouldnt mix .

Why is an issue like this considered politics? Seems to me it’s about equality and human rights

 

[iBeng]

Why is an issue like this considered politics? Seems to me it’s about equality and human rights

If you claim something is political then you dont have to face it I guess. Thats how it feels in this thread.

 

[Borough Blood]

No from me,sport and politics shouldnt mix .

Same, can’t wait until they get rid of all that crap for ANZAC Day

 

[Thrawn]

No from me,sport and politics shouldnt mix .

This issue transcends politics.

 

[Erick_the_Greatest]

Couldn’t care less what I cop for this

I was completely on board until the mass protests around the country last weekend

This showed a complete disregard for public safety, our livelihoods, businesses trying to reopen and survive and the financial prosperity of the country as a whole

Clearly this movement has no regard for the wider community that is struggling to stay afloat, and stay safe. So why the **** should I care about their cause?

As far as the knee goes? Do what u like. But I won’t be joining in

 

[Schnitzengruben]

I have no issue with kneeling before the game, even though I think it's stupid.

But I voted no under the assumption it delves down the path of the Kaepernick-style kneeling during the national anthem.

 

[iBeng]

I have no issue with kneeling before the game, even though I think it's stupid.

But I voted no under the assumption it delves down the path of the Kaepernick-style kneeling during the national anthem.

What was wrong with him kneeling?

 

[Schnitzengruben]

What was wrong with him kneeling?

Disrespectful. When I hear the anthem, I think of those who have fallen for our country to give us the freedom's we take for granted today. To kneel during to that comes off as ungrateful, regardless if that was the intent.