Mega Thread Port Forum General AFL Thread Part 29

[El Zorro]

Why didn't the Tassie government or footy club take the AFL to task over how unreasonable the condition of a new stadium was? I assume something to do with biting the hand that feeds them ie Victoria?

It was a bullshit request and the AFL was doing anything it could make it hard/easy for them to deny.

Sent from my Nokia 7.2 using Tapatalk

How much money is the AFL contributing to this stadium? I am assuming zero. As a professional organisation (business), it is time for professional sports to start paying their own way and stop leeching off taxpayers.

 

[El Zorro]

There is no economic case for me to keep buying more expensive Lego sets but it makes me feel good.

Looking at things through a purely financial lens when we're talking about a not for profit professional sports league is pretty sad. I don't care if the AFL has to financially support the Tassie team forever, it's good for the game that this 40 year wrong has finally been righted.

Do you really believe this?

 

[shewho]

It’s going to be hard enough for Tassie to retain players in any event. But asking them to play 11 games every year in a stadium with no roof would make the task of player retention next to impossible.

 

[Festerz]

Modern football is absolutely horrendous when it rains, turns the already ugly rolling maul into a total skill free shit show.

There's been around 7-8 games a year in Tasmania for many years. How many have been characterised by this?

 

[Capital Power]

The roof is way better for tourism and hosting non-sporting events. Hobart’s entertainment centre only holds about 5000 people. There’d be heaps they miss out on now because it’s not worth the trouble but that changes if they can triple/quadruple capacity.

If they build it without a roof they’ll be talking about how they should’ve done it for 40 years before finally doing it as an upgrade for triple the cost one way expressway style.

Whilst we here in the ACT can only dream. We have no entertainment centre, the largest theatre seats about 1500 and Manuka Oval about 15,000, most of whom will get wet and/or freeze in our winter.

If only local voters were smart enough to create a swinging electorate. Place is full of Chardonnay socialists...

 

[edgie]

Bring back the mud bowls before ovals had good drainage and rainy games will improve tenfold.

 

[It Just Is]

There's been around 7-8 games a year in Tasmania for many years. How many have been characterised by this?

Plenty. I can remember Ziebell kicking a ball that traveled backwards in the wind. As others have said, the lid is for the supporters as much as the players.

 

[snozulu]

I think if they use MCG turf at the new Tassie stadium that could get the deal across the line

 

[Scodges]

My AFL has still not updated to the latest players, whereas a few peeps I know have. I’ve tried to force an update, but nothing. You guys have the same issue ?


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Holden Hillbilly]

My AFL has still not updated to the latest players, whereas a few peeps I know have. I’ve tried to force an update, but nothing. You guys have the same issue ?


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

Correct. I expect an update after the pre season supplement period.

 

[Lagooner]

Whilst we here in the ACT can only dream. We have no entertainment centre, the largest theatre seats about 1500 and Manuka Oval about 15,000, most of whom will get wet and/or freeze in our winter.

If only local voters were smart enough to create a swinging electorate. Place is full of Chardonnay socialists...

I’ve been there a couple of times and yeah it was freezing. Coldest I’ve been at the footy apart from Ballarat bloody hell that was bad honestly thought I’d get frostbite.

 

[Capital Power]

I’ve been there a couple of times and yeah it was freezing. Coldest I’ve been at the footy apart from Ballarat bloody hell that was bad honestly thought I’d get frostbite.

And our game here this year I believe is scheduled under lights in July, so it is almost certainly going to be around or below freezing by kickoff. Genius.

 

[Grave Danger]

Is this right - I thought we might've had one more, ie Peter Burgoyne, Jared Poulton, Dom Whatsname, Robbie Gray and Dan Houston. Maybe not all of those were after the siren. Still, 4 ain't bad compared to some teams who've been in the comp since before Kevin Sheedy was invented.

Most goals to win after the siren​

8 – Geelong
6 – Sydney/South Melbourne
5 – Richmond
4 – Carlton, Fremantle, North Melbourne, Port Adelaide
3 – Gold Coast, Hawthorn, St Kilda, West Coast
2 – Adelaide, Brisbane, Collingwood, Western Bulldogs/Footscray
1 – Essendon, Melbourne
0 – Greater Western Sydney

Dreams realised: Your club's last win with a goal after the siren

Check out the last time your club won, and lost, with a goal after the siren

www.afl.com.au

 

[El_Scorcho]

Do you really believe this?

Oh I fully agree in reality, but the AFL should be spending their wealth to make the game better. The AFL is obviously incredibly money focused which has allowed them to become the biggest sports league in the country but has also entrenched inequality that can probably never be fixed.

Tasmania getting a team is good for football and talking about the Tasmanian team purely in dollars is missing the point for me. The AFL can easily afford to fund it.

I'm not particularly fussed about the AFL negotiating hard to make governments pay for stadiums, that's their job.

 

[El_Scorcho]

And it's the same mentality that will maintain the 10 Victorian teams forever and results in us having 19 and eventually 20 and who knows how many more teams with a talent pool that would support about half that in a competition where there is one prize and many supporter bases including ours will now likely go their whole lives without seeing their team win the thing. The continual expansion of the competition is rubbish and one of the things turning me off the sport the most.

Agree generally, but if we went back to say, 14 teams, i'd still want one of them to be in Tasmania. A heartland footy state should have always had a team.

Ultimately the issue is there being so many Victorian teams, but I very much doubt the AFL is going to have the stomach to kill or merge any of them. I would still prefer we get Tasmania a team however it has to happen, and worry about the greater issues of the league later. The league isn't suddenly going to become more equitable because Tasmania are there.

Also I dispute the talent pool argument. There are more Australians per AFL club now than there were in 2012, or 1995. More northern staters are playing footy than ever. The game is generally more talented than ever, it's just maturing tactically and that means defenses are getting better. If we want to see the product improve, they should switch to 16 players a side.

 

[Scodges]

[emoji6][emoji[emoji6]]" data-quote="Holden Hillbilly" data-source="post: 0" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch">

Correct. I expect an update after the pre season supplement period.

Doesn’t make sense that it’s updated for some & not all.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Festerz]

Oh I fully agree in reality, but the AFL should be spending their wealth to make the game better. The AFL is obviously incredibly money focused which has allowed them to become the biggest sports league in the country but has also entrenched inequality that can probably never be fixed.

Don't disagree with you in principle. (apologies for another War and Peace thesis incoming)

But I'm sure the AFL Clubs will ask this question - over the past century or more how many of Australia's sports stadiums have been funded by the codes that dominate their use? My thinking is most of the major sporrts stadiumsfacilities in each state have been funded by State Governments with relatively limited financial support from the Federal Government and, more recently, with commercial arrangements regarding to the operating lease. The codes themselves are almost always just the users or co-tenants rather than owners or major funders of what are regarded as State assets. And this was the basis of the Tasmanian Government proposal.

After reading the Independent Gruen Report - established and with terms of reference set by the Tasmanian Government btw - it seems pretty clear that it was the Tasmanian Government that lobbied the hand of the AFL to throw out the recommendations of the 2019 Taskforce Report that the “first 5-7 seasons” be played at UTAS and Ninja Stadium at Bellerive while a proper process is put in place to locate, design, cost and build a new stadium."

It was the Rockliff Tasmanian Government that lobbied against those recommendations and pushed for an early entry of a team to the AFL and it was THEIR proposal for a stadium to be built at Macquarie Point, with a roof that could be built with a capped Tasmanian Government investment of just $375m to support that proposal. All the AFL did (with the agreement of all the existing 18 teams) was accept that proposal as a justification from throwing out the recommendations of the earlier Taskforce Report and agree to an entry of a Tasmanian team with a news stadium far earlier than planned. That announcement was conveniently made in the lead up to the Tasmanian election which the Rockliff Government won.

There's been a lot of emotional comment on this topic, including from me, but after reading the Gruen Report it seems pretty clear that the overwhelming responsibility for this blow out and the false assumptions that created it should be levelled at the Tasmanian Government itself.

Cost blow outs due to poorly costed and overgenerous assumptions is nothing new for major infrastructure projects - it happened with our own Adelaide Oval redevelopment for example. But, as happened with the Adelaide Oval redevelopment, the funding of that blow out should be met substantially by the government responsible for the project - the State Government. If they don't have the money - they go back to the table and do some substantial redesigning and re-costing (including agreeing new terms with the Federal Government to cover the huge gap).

It is certainly not up to the AFL (i.e. the other AFL clubs) to fund this huge blow out. The Rockliff Tasmanian Government made the mess - it has the responsibility of fixing it.

All that I'm seeing is them sticking their collective head in the sand and pretending there are zero problems with their concept and costings, hoping the reality of the impending financial disaster created by the gap between dreams and reality is shouldered by another government or the AFL.

/rant.

 

[Willsy10]

Is this right - I thought we might've had one more, ie Peter Burgoyne, Jared Poulton, Dom Whatsname, Robbie Gray and Dan Houston. Maybe not all of those were after the siren. Still, 4 ain't bad compared to some teams who've been in the comp since before Kevin Sheedy was invented.

Most goals to win after the siren​

8 – Geelong
6 – Sydney/South Melbourne
5 – Richmond
4 – Carlton, Fremantle, North Melbourne, Port Adelaide
3 – Gold Coast, Hawthorn, St Kilda, West Coast
2 – Adelaide, Brisbane, Collingwood, Western Bulldogs/Footscray
1 – Essendon, Melbourne
0 – Greater Western Sydney

Dreams realised: Your club's last win with a goal after the siren

Check out the last time your club won, and lost, with a goal after the siren

www.afl.com.au

Dom wasn’t after the siren, was on the run with only a few seconds left, siren sounded back in centre square.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Willsy10]

Is this right - I thought we might've had one more, ie Peter Burgoyne, Jared Poulton, Dom Whatsname, Robbie Gray and Dan Houston. Maybe not all of those were after the siren. Still, 4 ain't bad compared to some teams who've been in the comp since before Kevin Sheedy was invented.

Most goals to win after the siren​

8 – Geelong
6 – Sydney/South Melbourne
5 – Richmond
4 – Carlton, Fremantle, North Melbourne, Port Adelaide
3 – Gold Coast, Hawthorn, St Kilda, West Coast
2 – Adelaide, Brisbane, Collingwood, Western Bulldogs/Footscray
1 – Essendon, Melbourne
0 – Greater Western Sydney

Dreams realised: Your club's last win with a goal after the siren

Check out the last time your club won, and lost, with a goal after the siren

www.afl.com.au

flipping west coast with 2 of their 3 in back to back games against us at AO. One in extra flipping time of an elimination final the other the loss also effectively eliminated us from the following years finals. It’s actually ridiculous how harsh that was.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[WillemDaDrew]

How much money is the AFL contributing to this stadium? I am assuming zero. As a professional organisation (business), it is time for professional sports to start paying their own way and stop leeching off taxpayers.

Fed election in 2025.
$trap in for lot$ of baby hugging, $port hand out$, and a gravy train of lie$.

 

[240volt]

AFL should be funding this, there’s no way they can expect an island state full of old age pensioners to find that sort of money.
If the state government puts in anywhere near what the amount is state taxes will go through the roof.
Ridiculous when you consider there hospital system is totally fk’d with 10 year waiting list for some surgery.

 

[SonOfKek]

Bring back smaller suburban stadiums! Let Tassie have their own subscription based streaming service for their games. Watch how much revenue will come in.

 

[El_Scorcho]

the “first 5-7 seasons” be played at UTAS and Ninja Stadium at Bellerive while a proper process is put in place to locate, design, cost and build a new stadium."

I absolutely agree in general, I don't think we're that far apart, I'm just more willing to take a financial risk to get it done.

There will ultimately never be a time where building a stadium is cost effective. The people who are currently against the MacPoint stadium will be against the next stadium and any future stadium proposals.

If they kick the can down the road, the same arguments against a stadium will still apply in 5-7 years, and the same people will gather their torches and pitchforks. There is literally no possible stadium that would be supported by Jacqui Lambie.

Bellerive still won't be suitable to support the new side full time.

While I'm certainly not arguing the Rockliff govt is perfect or doing everything ideally, I think the stadium location being so close to the CBD is key to its success and personally I'd like to see them get it done even if there ends up having to be a federal govt bailout down the track. We're a rich country who wastes money on all sorts of shit, I'm comfortable with some of that wastage being on a new stadium and an AFL side for Tasmania.

Sure, if they can get the AFL to contribute more, fantastic, but it has to get done.

 

[Papa G]

Just build the thing. Tassie isn't getting a Nuclear Reactor, so they shouldn't miss out on this as well. Those inbreds are very poorly treated by the rest of Australia, its time we threw them a bone.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Footy's getting closer.