Play Nice Referendum - Indigenous Voice in Parliament

[Gethelred]

Link to the proposed Referendum, from the Referendum Working Group:

(Edited 6 April 2023)

These are the words that will be put to the Australian people in the upcoming referendum as agreed by the Referendum Working Group (made up of representatives of First Nations communities from around Australia):

"A Proposed Law: to alter the Constitution to recognise the First Peoples of Australia by establishing an Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice. Do you approve this proposed alteration?"

As well as that, it will be put to Australians that the constitution be amended to include a new chapter titled "Recognition of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Peoples".

The details would be:


View attachment 1636890

The Prime Minister has committed to the government introducing legislation with this wording to parliament on 30 March 2023 and to establishing a joint parliamentary committee to consider it and receive submissions on the wording, providing ALL members of Parliament with the opportunity to consider and debate the full details of the proposal.

Parliament will then vote on the wording in June in the lead up to a National Referendum.

The ANU has issued a paper responding to common public concerns expressed in relation to the proposed Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice here:

Indigenous Voice to Parliament | Australian National University

Responding to common concerns about an aboriginal and torres strait islander voice First Nations portfolio Background

www.anu.edu.au

Summary details of the key points from this paper may be found in Chief post here:

The Uluru Statement from the Heart:

Not specifically No. In any case it does not form part of the Referendum proposal.

View attachment 1769742

Seeing as things have gotten a bit toxic in here, let's try to return things to a more civil tone.

The following will result in warnings to begin with, and if said behaviour continues will be escalated:

• referring to another poster as racist without direct provocation.
• dismissing or deriding another poster's lived experience.
• personal attacks or one line posts designed solely to insult or deride.

You might notice that the final rule is from the board rules. Thought we should probably remember that this is against the rules in case it's been forgotten.

Let's play nicely from here, people.

 

[jim boy]

it may well be. but do you find it strange this wasn't mentioned in the document aimed at helping people understand what it is and how it will work?

Do you really need to know the color choice of any government cars being issued? The target is to make up a 'council' representing different territories that can then contribute to the information that the goverment needs before they they make poor decisions based on ill-information. Questioning the details of how much staff they need or what colour their biros should be is just irrelevant.

the implementation of brexit following the referendum was and is being handled woefully. i expect a lot of people who voted leave regret it and would have changed their vote had they appreciated the consequences. it was obviously run by morons who must have thought it was no chance to get up or hadn't considered the fall out if it did.

Its still not comparable - Brexit was about the removal of a layer of government and the removal of Britain from Europe. Nobody denied it was going to have a profound effect on Britain. The only people predicting an end to our current way of life on the voice referendum are RWNJs attempting to politicise the unfortunately substantial racist proportion of the Australian population who dont know a dog whistle when there is one.

but that may be fine if all it will be is a "subservient" body limited to making "representations" that parliament is free to pay lip service to while ignoring, the same as most calls for "pubic consultation" in government processes now.

Cynical view, but essentially correct - that's all it is - it has no other powers.

 

[FRUMPY]

Do people who are thinking of voting no all of a sudden change their mind if they see their football club say to vote yes? That is true footy nuffy behaviour if true....

What if an essendon/richmond/carlton footy nuffy is voting yes and they see Collingwood is saying to vote yes.....do they then vote no?

 

[jatz14]

Do people who are thinking of voting no all of a sudden change their mind if they see their football club say to vote yes? That is true footy nuffy behaviour if true....

What if an essendon/richmond/carlton footy nuffy is voting yes and they see Collingwood is saying to vote yes.....do they then vote no?

People going to vote no from the start aren't changing their minds for anything. We could have the second coming and the resurrected Jesus could campaign for the Yes vote and he would just get called a woke libtard.

Some of the people intending to vote yes can be scared into voting no. The world will end, Aborigines will take your land, they will institute tribal law type shit.

Clubs advocating for the Yes vote aren't making anyone vote yes who wasn't already, but they may help shore up the support of the soft yes people.

Makes it worth doing imop

On moto g(6) plus using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Crankyhawk]

why not in the "obvious things were not explained, or even mentioned, in the document published to help people understand how the voice will work?" file.

because constitution is always kept quite broad, and then how one makes it work comes down to legislation and judical rulings.

there nothing stopping people such as yourself or myself saying "well, if the voice gets up I think that it should come from xx communities and be paid $y per hour and work would consist of a/b/c/d/e" and start that iterative detail process. But that is not the role of government trying to get a referendum up - that the fiddly bits detail. And nothing so far which seems difficult

as opposed to brexit where many bigfooty numpties like myself were telling all and sundry (well one pro brexit poster who has now vanished) at all the alws that would need to change, all the regulations and predicting the dogs breakfast that later ensured. Probably why that brexit poster has exited...

 

[Kram]

Public support shifting away from the Voice: poll

A Freshwater Strategy poll has found opposition to the Indigenous advisory body has risen 10 points since the end of last year.

www.afr.com

 

[Chief]

Looks like the cadaver running the LNP is earning his pay.

 

[Ghost Patrol]

Looks like the cadaver running the LNP is earning his pay.

I think you're giving Kram too much credit.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

Can't count your chickens before they've hatched, but my mind goes back to the Federal and Vic state elections over the past 12 months and all the major media outlets running with the "Look out, here come the Libs" stories and basically calling both coin flips by the morning of the polls.

It's almost like they don't want these votes to seem like foregone conclusions, to convince people to keep checking their rags daily to see what's the latest in this absolute cliffhanger race.

 

[FredLeDeux]

Can't count your chickens before they've hatched, but my mind goes back to the Federal and Vic state elections over the past 12 months and all the major media outlets running with the "Look out, here come the Libs" stories and basically calling both coin flips by the morning of the polls.

It's almost like they don't want these votes to seem like foregone conclusions, to convince people to keep checking their rags daily to see what's the latest in this absolute cliffhanger race.

On the other hand, it could just be that they don't have a ****ing clue

 

[10571z]

I will be voting YES because I am not a racist and I am educated

These sort of comments don’t gather support for anyone on the fence.

Just classic left type behaviour that anyones the worst extremity of a view if they aren’t 100% on board.

 

[10571z]

How are “the voice” members elected? Will it just be Lidia Thorpe types? Doesn’t seem to be defined?

 

[jim boy]

How are “the voice” members elected? Will it just be Lidia Thorpe types? Doesn’t seem to be defined?

These sort of comments don’t gather support for anyone on the fence.

Just classic right type behaviour that anyones the worst extremity of a view if they aren’t 100% on board.

 

[Gough]

If this doesn't pass it'll just be more evidence that we're this backwards looking racist country at the bottom of the world. I have friends overseas asking me why this is even an issue, and you trying explaining that Dutton makes Liz Truss look like Churchill.

 

[10571z]

These sort of comments don’t gather support for anyone on the fence.

Just classic right type behaviour that anyones the worst extremity of a view if they aren’t 100% on board.

It’s a genuine concern for many voters.

Would love an answer

 

[Dirty_banchez]

Can't count your chickens before they've hatched, but my mind goes back to the Federal and Vic state elections over the past 12 months and all the major media outlets running with the "Look out, here come the Libs" stories and basically calling both coin flips by the morning of the polls.

It's almost like they don't want these votes to seem like foregone conclusions, to convince people to keep checking their rags daily to see what's the latest in this absolute cliffhanger race.

Websites need clicks. What better way to generate clicks than a 'close' race.

Both campaigns should focus on Tasmania, as I suspect and recent polling suggests that QLD and WA will vote no.

I don't have a dog in this fight. I am just here as a voting/election enthusiast.

 

[Rob R]

Can't count your chickens before they've hatched, but my mind goes back to the Federal and Vic state elections over the past 12 months and all the major media outlets running with the "Look out, here come the Libs" stories and basically calling both coin flips by the morning of the polls.

It's almost like they don't want these votes to seem like foregone conclusions, to convince people to keep checking their rags daily to see what's the latest in this absolute cliffhanger race.

Not to mention a close contest means millions will continue to get spent on advertising for a yes (which is a forgone conclusion).

On SM-A125F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Festerz]

Would love an answer

Nah you don't.

Otherwise you would take the time to find it in the countless documentation that has been produced on the preferred model for the Voice.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Websites need clicks. What better way to generate clicks than a 'close' race.

Both campaigns should focus on Tasmania, as I suspect and recent polling suggests that QLD and WA will vote no.

I don't have a dog in this fight. I am just here as a voting/election enthusiast.

I don't know how you become one of those.
I'm kind of over it. Not really paying much attention to issues now, easier just to vote Y when the time comes, and i don't expect a lot of change from it, or they might use it as an excuse to do things they should already have been doing .

 

[Crankyhawk]

It’s a genuine concern for many voters.

Would love an answer

you already have the answer - those details are for later discussion and legislation IF the voice gets up.

Now my turn for a stupid question
Does the phrase "may make representation to executive government" actually mean anything? As far as I am aware, randoms on bigfooty can make representation to executive government (we can, after all write to the minister of a department), so it would be strange if there was something specifically barring the voice from being able to do the same (ie as a lobbyist, just like any other)
equally though, because any random can make that represntation, then theres no need to specifically odify it for the vocie?

i guess what I'm saying is that I don't think that phrase actually adds anything useful and also doesn't/ shouldn't be a source of fear

 

[Kyptastic]

Websites need clicks. What better way to generate clicks than a 'close' race.

Both campaigns should focus on Tasmania, as I suspect and recent polling suggests that QLD and WA will vote no.

I don't have a dog in this fight. I am just here as a voting/election enthusiast.

Even if they don’t think they’ll get a majority yes in those states they still need to expend some effort.

There could potentially be a scenario where you get 35% yes in Queensland and WA and under 55% yes votes in the other states, leading to them passing the 4 states requirement, but not the 50% of all voters requirement

 

[10571z]

you already have the answer - those details are for later discussion and legislation IF the voice gets up.

Now my turn for a stupid question
Does the phrase "may make representation to executive government" actually mean anything? As far as I am aware, randoms on bigfooty can make representation to executive government (we can, after all write to the minister of a department), so it would be strange if there was something specifically barring the voice from being able to do the same (ie as a lobbyist, just like any other)
equally though, because any random can make that represntation, then theres no need to specifically odify it for the vocie?

i guess what I'm saying is that I don't think that phrase actually adds anything useful and also doesn't/ shouldn't be a source of fear

So vote yes and if it gets up they’ll let us know how they decide who’s on the voice? Is it really unreasonable to have that planned prior?

 

[10571z]

Nah you don't.

Otherwise you would take the time to find it in the countless documentation that has been produced on the preferred model for the Voice.

I read the FAQ… preferred model? So what am I voting on…

 

[Crankyhawk]

So vote yes and if it gets up they’ll let us know how they decide who’s on the voice? Is it really unreasonable to have that planned prior?

Yes it is. Deciding on the how takes a shit tonne of negotiations and energy- why waste it if voice doesn’t get up first

 

[Chief]

Collecting boomer dickheads:

 

[10571z]

Yes it is. Deciding on the how takes a s**t tonne of negotiations and energy- why waste it if voice doesn’t get up first

I wouldn’t think it’s that unreasonable to tell people how the panel would be selected if you want people to vote on having a panel.

yes it takes a lot of energy and negotiations but your also trying to chance the constitution… so it should take a lot of energy than just “vote yes we will work out the finer details later”