Autopsy Round 21, 2023: St.Kilda v Carlton

[PoppedCorn]

Higgins too for me
Although he has a good conversion rate ( I think), but everytime he has it and he isn't drop punting I always yell out miss to the tv

 

[Saints43]

Most of those are going back years. We have had major midfield issues for ages but haven't looked to address it recently apart from Crouch and that's still three years ago.

We tried to recruit JDG for this season.

 

[Saints43]

i was told the presentation we gave to shiel under gags was embarrasingly bad

Haha. Of course.

 

[Diehard Saint]

Game time out weighs it all, look at Geelong they get Bowers from GC & has looked like there 23rx player on the list gets a game to save face & pushes out Parfitt I know who is take.

If Flanders moves he will come to us knowing he can play m/field get good pay & improve us we maybe 1-4 players from being a really good side.


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Lot of talk about Flanders.
Who else would be chasing him?
Why do we think we’re a chance?

 

[Diehard Saint]

His last actual year of footy he was in and out of the side and averaging 14 touches a game. How long do you wait until you pull the pin?

Plenty others we can delist before Coff.
Of course he gets a decent chance to prove he can do it. You don’t throw a top 10 draft pick out without giving him the opportunity to get back.

 

[Premium]

67% tog tells you he's in luke dunstan territory. i'd be offloading him ASAP in the hope a club will cough up something decent before he ends delisted like dunstan was

He has not signed and there has not been any talk about him signing so he could well be gone because we know Nth were looking at him last year.
Same goes with Gresham - he most probably knows the club he is heading to next year.

 

[Diehard Saint]

Higgins too for me
Although he has a good conversion rate ( I think), but everytime he has it and he isn't drop punting I always yell out miss to the tv

Oh so you’re the one to blame!
You only yell out “miss” when the opposition are running into goal.
Sheesh!

 

[Premium]

I think Gresh lost kicking distance after his last major injury, plus he looks a tad slower too.

Over a distance he is slow , in a short burst he got a bit of speed but in todays game you need to be able to run both ways and a player who is slow and don't have the endurance required you are a liability - this goes with Clark as well.

 

[gringo2011]

Plenty others we can delist before Coff.
Of course he gets a decent chance to prove he can do it. You don’t throw a top 10 draft pick out without giving him the opportunity to get back.

I'm not delisting him this year. If he doesn't fire next year we'd have to start to move on though. 50 games in 6 seasons and you have question his physical resilience.

 

[Premium]

His last actual year of footy he was in and out of the side and averaging 14 touches a game. He was still getting 5 marks per game but he looked pretty meh. He now has to get back to his best footy after 2 years out. Paton has never been the same since his leg break. It's getting to the point that both are on the brink. If he doesn't perform or breaks down next year it will be a big call to pay for him to stay on the list. He was drafted in 2017. How long do you wait until you pull the pin?

He is now a different beast - reverse to Clark - if he can stay on the park he is going to be a very good player.

 

[AirWinmar]

I'm a bit of a broken record on this, but your midfield will struggle when your best mid looks like he is playing off 1 leg. Steele is a gun player, he has a big enough body of work that you know he is a very good mid, but he is way of it this season and you can't have 1 of your main mids playing so average. Asides from Crouch we don't have another mid who can come in and kill it. Young fellas are doing well, but they're still young so you can't expect them to consistently take the load

 

[bergholt]

I'm a bit of a broken record on this, but your midfield will struggle when your best mid looks like he is playing off 1 leg. Steele is a gun player, he has a big enough body of work that you know he is a very good mid, but he is way of it this season and you can't have 1 of your main mids playing so average.

I was willing to believe he’s playing injured but RTB and the club keep asserting that that’s not true, so maybe he’s just lost his motivation.

 

[Premium]

I'm not delisting him this year. If he doesn't fire next year we'd have to start to move on though. 50 games in 6 seasons and you have question his physical resilience.

If you get a full season out of the guy we will see if he is worth keeping - the problem is a team could see him as a cheap trade and pick him and we miss out on all the work we have put into him.
I don't care if Clark goes but Coffield has massive upside - the kid is level headed and could easily be leadership potential if he comes good on the park.

 

[gringo2011]

I was willing to believe he’s playing injured but RTB and the club keep asserting that that’s not true, so maybe he’s just lost his motivation.

I think he's banged up but so are plenty of others. He's not been as bad as people are making out on top of that though.

 

[Premium]

I was willing to believe he’s playing injured but RTB and the club keep asserting that that’s not true, so maybe he’s just lost his motivation.

On Saturday he was one of the reasons we were beaten - you need a midfield to dominate and he was poor.

 

[Mowman]

I think he's banged up but so are plenty of others. He's not been as bad as people are making out on top of that though.

He was yesterday
Not just the game on the line season on the line
11 touches for the game
ZERO touches in the last quarter
He was putrid

 

[Premium]

I think he's banged up but so are plenty of others. He's not been as bad as people are making out on top of that though.

11 touches till 3/4 time on Sunday is shocking for a mid who was a All Australian.

 

[gringo2011]

If you get a full season out of the guy we will see if he is worth keeping - the problem is a team could see him as a cheap trade and pick him and we miss out on all the work we have put into him.
I don't care if Clark goes but Coffield has massive upside - the kid is level headed and could easily be leadership potential if he comes good on the park.

I doubt they are lining up for his services outside of St Kilda. There are heaps of good players out there who aren't broken down. If we delisted him I think there would be a few keen to have a go at him though. Heaps of guys go first round and never get their body right. Kade Kolodjasnij, Nath Freeman, Scharenberg etc.

 

[gringo2011]

He was yesterday
Not just the game on the line season on the line
11 touches for the game
ZERO touches in the last quarter
He was putrid

Yeah, for sure but I reckon they must have sat on him to get that shit. If you have a gun midfield you can sacrifice a couple for the good of others. Otherwise perhaps he was why Cripps hardly had any effect.

 

[Diehard Saint]

I'm a bit of a broken record on this, but your midfield will struggle when your best mid looks like he is playing off 1 leg. Steele is a gun player, he has a big enough body of work that you know he is a very good mid, but he is way of it this season and you can't have 1 of your main mids playing so average. Asides from Crouch we don't have another mid who can come in and kill it. Young fellas are doing well, but they're still young so you can't expect them to consistently take the load

Maybe he needs to put on some of that weight RTB made him lose?
Why change a good thing - running team or not. We need him in and under with strength to clear the ball - let the others run.

 

[Premium]

He was yesterday
Not just the game on the line season on the line
11 touches for the game
ZERO touches in the last quarter
He was putrid

He has to be looked at, he had a few good quarters in games but has gone missing in big games - he is currently a liability - give him a break to freshen up or something , Bytel would had more of the ball on Sunday.

Love the guy but being a midfielder you got to be winning the ball and atm he getting beaten.

 

[Premium]

Yeah, for sure but I reckon they must have sat on him to get that s**t. If you have a gun midfield you can sacrifice a couple for the good of others. Otherwise perhaps he was why Cripps hardly had any effect.

Gringo we love Steele but let's face it he has been s/it this year - having a mid clearly getting beaten in the middle is not helping us to win a game.

 

[SteeleSaints]

Getting belted in contested possessions, but 22 points up at the half, should have been 28.
So they move out Clark and Owens, Crouch is now ineffective because the pressure they took was on him. Steele was non existent. Both had zero possessions in the 4th.
Result? 1 goal.in a half and 7 goal turnaround.
Couple that with substituting a forward with a back pocket while we can't score and no matter what you say the coaches completely screwed the pooch.
Clark 16 possessions in the first, SFA in the second. Crouch BoG in the first, blanketed in the second. Sinclair ineffective after being moved for HBF, Steele useless all.day.
The coaches destroyed us in the second.

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Losing to Carlton obviously has brought out your ire, but its not the end of the world. In reality if Carlton can get their full list on the ground before the finals they are a good chance to push a lot of higher rated sides. You must have been watching a different game to the coaches, as I hardly believe they would have moved Clark & Owens if they thought they were doing a good job. Clark never plays more than 70% of TOG, thats why they moved him into defence he cant run out games. I just looked and he attended 11 centre bounces and had 0 clearances. Owens played 93% TOG but also tired as the game progressed, he had 1 clearance and attended 14 centre bounces. Thats why they moved short and simple...

 

[AirWinmar]

I think he's banged up but so are plenty of others. He's not been as bad as people are making out on top of that though.

He's played a couple of decent games, but mainly very average with some poor ones like yesterday. Over the last few years he has been our gun mid. Our equivalent of a Bont, Neale, etc. - maybe not exactly the same class. We don't have him in there to play not bad. Not sure whether he is banged up, struggling with new game plan, loss of weight, but naturally our midfield which already isn't deep will struggle when our best mid is going at somewhere between 25% and 75% all year and he is in the midfield rotation near full time

 

[AirWinmar]

For the record, I love Steelo and think he is a gun - just struggling this year for some reason