Autopsy Round 4 = Collingwood 60-90 GWS

[danielnajdek]

Just saw that deliberate paid against Steele after kicking it out of mid air 40 metres out. If they are gonna start paying those then the game is ****ed.

 

[magpies42]

Pretty poor performance tonight, wasteful in the first quarter and that set the tone for the rest of the night. I’ve been saying for a long time, that our goal kicking issues are not to do with our personnel forward of the ball but our decision making and skill delivering the ball in transition and into the fifty. Our skills and IQ are at under 10’s standards at times, there were some really comical sequences tonight.

This was another winnable game, no injuries diabolical...the umps had a shocker which on the balance of it all was not in our favour surprise surprise.

Mihocek - in a tough night for our forwards (on account of our delivery and the conditions), although Finlayson did well...I though Brodie was one of our better performers. Could have kicked straighter. But competed well, took some marks...plays like he’s a footballer.

Moore - Again solid down back plenty of intercepts and just so assured even in the wet. We were led to the ball at times, and that’s largely due to really bad turnovers up the ground. Can’tblame the defence for that.

Howe - I thought had a great game, seems to be getting confidence back into his body. We should see him flying high before long.

IQ - played better than Toby’s stats suggest. It’s a team game and you aren’t always responsible for the player you’re matched up on. Rotations occur throughout the play and you get drawn to help out and fill gaps. That’s ourteam defence that generally stacks up well. He rebounded well and he’s one of the few I’m happy when he’s got the ball.

Madgen - his stats are flattering, he was ok but not impactful and was one that fumbled and turned it over. He’s too slow and I don’t think he’s a premiership caliber player.

De Goey - has the talent, but doesn’t throw it around enough. Needs to run in straighter lines and be harder at the ball and man, pulled out of a contest in the second term which I don’t like. Needs to be more damaging with his disposal too. Still did some nice things, in a tough night for the forwards.

Cox - has some real X factor about him, his little taps, back heels and the like are really impressive for man who’s foreign to our game. I like when the ball is in his hands. Needs to be stronger at the ball in the air and hang onto more marks, he’s getting to the right spots at least. Better delivery will help.

Sidey - plenty of stats not much impact. Turned it over too much for a player that is highly paid and credentialed. We were let down by our top line players tonight.

Pendles - was shocking tonight, it’s not by standards I’m measuring here it’s the relative salary cap space he takes up for his output tonight. Seemed to be carrying a foot injury, still no excuse for disposal.

Grundy - one of his worst games for the club I think. Improved late as he out ran his fat opponent. Was stiff not to be paid a mark in the last. Was clearly frustrated as evidenced by his slide tackle on Adams.

Adams - not his best game, but let’s hope he recovers. Not a confirmed rupture by the way he was testing it a 3/4 time.

Thomas - in a game like tonight when everybody is down I look at effort, and Thomas gave that. 6 tackles is a good return. Nice goal too.

WHE - he improved on last week which wasn’t hard. Showed us what can happen when he gets the opportunity to deliver into 50...we need to orchestrate more of these situations, that’s hard when we can’t clear the ball from stoppage properly. Makes it tough for a player such as Will. He competed well tonight, the focus should not be on him it should be on the higher paid players...those who are responsible as leaders and prime movers.

Maynard - haven’t seen much of his run and carry, not sure what happening there. I reckon we should have thrown him on ball when Adams went out. We needed to mix things up. It’s a more sophisticated game in the middle and perhaps it doesn’t have that awareness as a defender. something to think about in the future though, we can’t be beaten that badly with the silver service we get from the ruck.

Noble - shocking, a candidate to be dropped. I’ve been on that for a number of weeks.

McCreery - a shining light on ‘debut’. Tackled well, played his role to a tee. Great one hand grab in the last. Loved his aggression. We need more of that, perhaps the senior players can learn from him! 8 tackles

Sier - was ok, not prolific. If his injury is soft tissue I would delist, he doesn’t work hard enough.

Brown - runs into dead ends, he tries to take the game on at least...tries to make a play. Good effort, 4 tackles.

Mayne - I like him in our side, I know many don’t. He brings that selfless gut running that is so important in the modern game. Was one of the cleaner players on the night. 80% DE!!

Daicos - we need to manufacture more uncontested ball for him, he’s one of the smart users...similar to Pendles in that way.

Roughhead - didn’t really get a read on him during the game. Somebody was responsible for Finlayson...Howe got him late.

Greenwood - he always needs a few games to work himself into some form...typical of a low skilled player. He toils hard, but was not at his sharpest.

 

[Giddy Up]

Get Steve Symonds as coach. The girls have it all today, that’s all you can ask for!

 

[Kappa]

Just saw that deliberate paid against Steele after kicking it out of mid air 40 metres out. If they are gonna start paying those then the game is f’ed.

They've always paid those, he rushed the ball from 40 metres away, what else can the umpire do? That's the rule.

 

[danielnajdek]

They've always paid those, he rushed the ball from 40 metres away, what else can the umpire do? That's the rule.

It's crap that's what it is.

 

[Stripes B and W]

We could have stolen this game. We were 10 points down and had momentum; Crisp (one of our better players on the night) had 5 straight ineffective disposals (3 were inside 50s). Absolute momentum killer. Pendles sprayed 2 gettable kicks inside 50 during the same period. The opportunities were there.

Having said that, did we deserve to win? No.

The result reflected fairly that GWS was the better side.

As much as I agree that JDG did 4/5 of bugger all, the disposal to him was disappointing.

Things are never as good or as bad as they appear to be, so it's not all doom, but the club is underperforming; that's plain for all to see.

I felt the same, there were a few brief flickers behind the 'Game on' sign.
Also thought Crisp disposal to be atrocious and has been very patchy all year.

JDG had space to lead into, front position and a break on his defender and passes that should have been made fell short. This on top of the 3 in last weeks last quarter make me think we might be a touch harsh on JDG

I was particularly disappointed in the midfield effort in the first half, intensity lifted after 1/2T, Sidey notably. Felt our effort in the last 10 minutes was very poor, accepted the loss and almost chucked it in which is very hard to stomach

 

[Jafo]

This is the key.

In hindsight, the Grundy contract was the red line.

When he insisted on seven years at the size, we should have facilitated a move to Adelaide for 2 first rounders. It was time to send a signal to our players and their agents. We have want people playing for their teammates and the club, not for the largest contract they can get by forcing our hand. If that's what you want, we will assist you in getting out subject to a fair deal from your destination club.

We held our nerve with Daisy. What happened to that Collingwood?

We were always going to lose Daisy to Carlton after Mick went there; with the Father & Son rule in place.

 

[J Albert]

You go for a flag, you win or lose, you drop down and rebuild. That's how it goes. Relax ppl.

 

[Scritchyscroony]

Just saw that deliberate paid against Steele after kicking it out of mid air 40 metres out. If they are gonna start paying those then the game is f’ed.

Surely even YOU can't complain when a player kicks a ball 35m backwards for a point and an umpire gives it as deliberate. Exactly why the rule was brought in. Don't complain about the umpiring.. complain about our second most experienced midfielder making this error!

 

[ZEV]

You go for a flag, you win or lose, you drop down and rebuild. That's how it goes. Relax ppl.

We traded four first round picks for blokes no longer at the club that we are still paying for. I was speaking to a former Carlton premiership player who reckons the 1995 flag wasn't worth the penalties the club received and would rather have had the flag taken away than be penalised like that. We voluntarily did it...

 

[Jafo]

You go for a flag, you win or lose, you drop down and rebuild. That's how it goes. Relax ppl.

We just seem to drop down 10-20 yrs or more between flags.

 

[J Albert]

We traded four first round picks for blokes no longer at the club that we are still paying for. I was speaking to a former Carlton premiership player who reckons the 1995 flag wasn't worth the penalties the club received and would rather have had the flag taken away than be penalised like that. We voluntarily did it...

Treloar was worth it. Beams was a disaster. Our time will come again. Give it 3 years.

 

[Jafo]

Pipe dream.

Yeah, decriminalised and straight outta Canberra type pipe dream

 

[J Albert]

We just seem to drop down 10-20 yrs or more between flags.

Our problem isn't qualifying for GFs it's winning them on the day. On average we are in a GF every 3 years. Collingwood knows how to get back into contention. Anyone who thought we were a chance this year or next is deluded.

 

[ZEV]

Treloar was worth it. Beams was a disaster. Our time will come again. Give it 3 years.

Treloar is no longer at the club, and the pick 7 we traded (Hopper) won more possessions tonight than any Collingwood player.

In three years time we will be in a much worse spot.

 

[YouBeauty]

I feel like since the 08 grand final we have progressively got worse and our starting lineup is barely any different apart from certain players being gone. At least we had depth then.

 

[ZEV]

I feel like since the 08 grand final we have progressively got worse and our starting lineup is barely any different apart from certain players being gone. At least we had depth then.

Darcy Moore is a better player...

 

[J Albert]

In three years time we will be in a much worse spot.

We have to rebuild. Not winning a flag with this list. What do you think was going to happen? You drop down to go back up. Look at the dogs, swans. Just suck it up. If we'd snagged one in 2018/19 you wouldn't be upset with where the list was at.

 

[Scritchyscroony]

Darcy Moore is a better player...

Madgen is the new Nicky Winmar...
Ed's gone...
positives...

 

[cityslick1]

Bucks presser

We're pretty disappointed. We got belted up at contested Ball which we pride ourselves on, which we haven't been consistent at over the first month of the seasons.

Tonight was different in that we had more inside 50s. At one stage GWS had 12 goals from about 40 entries, so we didn't defend as good as we should. What do we put this down to? We didn't win enough contests.

In the third quarter it looked like we were going to be able to grind a result out.

The last ten minutes was really disappointing. The game was there to be set up in the first half. Not clean enough, not hard enough.

We were poor in round 1, played OK for the most part of round 3. Got ground (work rate) out of Round 3 and again tonight.

Need more intensity on the ground and in the air.

Do we make changes at selection and what are our options? (question asked): We don't sit on our hands. We think we have selected our best team to get results and we haven't. We have to look at that, but alluded to the fact it might not just be personnel.

Quick turnaround (6 days) to Perth.

Asked about IQ/Maynard. Gave IQ first look at Greene. Isaac played well in patches, wasn't helped by some bad turnovers. Did become clear they needed to make the switch, and suggested IQ will learn a lot.

Asked about I50 transition. Bucks suggested GWS played heavily man on man, but we had some good entries, and still unable to score. So something we need to address.

Fox Footy cut away from the presser before it finished.

Apologies if any errors, typing on phone!

Im shocked that Bucks looks shocked... does he really expect Brown, Madgen, Mayne, Thomas, WHE, Cox & Greenwood to win us games? We've spiralled into becoming an absolutely sh*t team. Has been on the cards for 2 years.

 

[KillerMagpies]

Hopefully the list of new coaching candidates is being finalised.

Clarko or Mitchell.
I’m praying.

 

[Jafo]

Our problem isn't qualifying for GFs it's winning them on the day. On average we are in a GF every 3 years. Collingwood knows how to get back into contention. Anyone who thought we were a chance this year or next is deluded.

Agreed. Again say (unfortunately) we are the most overrated club still living on deeds of the past in a lifetime long long long dead.

I’m sure we’ve lost more flags than we’ve won and for a club that boasts to be amongst the elite, we’ve not had a clear run since “the machine” era.

Clubs like Hawthorn, Geelong and Richmond in the modern era held the ascendancy on the rest of the league for a few years. Not us.

Our biggest rivals in Carlton and Essendon still hold more flags than us and haven’t even looked like winning a flag in the last decade between them.

The sad part is all the above is true, that I’ll always bleed black & white but the reality of being underachievers for what chances we should have grabbed is truly heart breaking.

 

[KillerMagpies]

No spirit.
No heart.
Boring.
Stodgy.
Absolute crap.

 

[domus]

Pretty poor performance tonight, wasteful in the first quarter and that set the tone for the rest of the night. I’ve been saying for a long time, that our goal kicking issues are not to do with our personnel forward of the ball but our decision making and skill delivering the ball in transition and into the fifty. Our skills and IQ are at under 10’s standards at times, there were some really comical sequences tonight.

This was another winnable game, no injuries diabolical...the umps had a shocker which on the balance of it all was not in our favour surprise surprise.

Mihocek - in a tough night for our forwards (on account of our delivery and the conditions), although Finlayson did well...I though Brodie was one of our better performers. Could have kicked straighter. But competed well, took some marks...plays like he’s a footballer.

Moore - Again solid down back plenty of intercepts and just so assured even in the wet. We were led to the ball at times, and that’s largely due to really bad turnovers up the ground. Can’tblame the defence for that.

Howe - I thought had a great game, seems to be getting confidence back into his body. We should see him flying high before long.

IQ - played better than Toby’s stats suggest. It’s a team game and you aren’t always responsible for the player you’re matched up on. Rotations occur throughout the play and you get drawn to help out and fill gaps. That’s ourteam defence that generally stacks up well. He rebounded well and he’s one of the few I’m happy when he’s got the ball.

Madgen - his stats are flattering, he was ok but not impactful and was one that fumbled and turned it over. He’s too slow and I don’t think he’s a premiership caliber player.

De Goey - has the talent, but doesn’t throw it around enough. Needs to run in straighter lines and be harder at the ball and man, pulled out of a contest in the second term which I don’t like. Needs to be more damaging with his disposal too. Still did some nice things, in a tough night for the forwards.

Cox - has some real X factor about him, his little taps, back heels and the like are really impressive for man who’s foreign to our game. I like when the ball is in his hands. Needs to be stronger at the ball in the air and hang onto more marks, he’s getting to the right spots at least. Better delivery will help.

Sidey - plenty of stats not much impact. Turned it over too much for a player that is highly paid and credentialed. We were let down by our top line players tonight.

Pendles - was shocking tonight, it’s not by standards I’m measuring here it’s the relative salary cap space he takes up for his output tonight. Seemed to be carrying a foot injury, still no excuse for disposal.

Grundy - one of his worst games for the club I think. Improved late as he out ran his fat opponent. Was stiff not to be paid a mark in the last. Was clearly frustrated as evidenced by his slide tackle on Adams.

Adams - not his best game, but let’s hope he recovers. Not a confirmed rupture by the way he was testing it a 3/4 time.

Thomas - in a game like tonight when everybody is down I look at effort, and Thomas gave that. 6 tackles is a good return. Nice goal too.

WHE - he improved on last week which wasn’t hard. Showed us what can happen when he gets the opportunity to deliver into 50...we need to orchestrate more of these situations, that’s hard when we can’t clear the ball from stoppage properly. Makes it tough for a player such as Will. He competed well tonight, the focus should not be on him it should be on the higher paid players...those who are responsible as leaders and prime movers.

Maynard - haven’t seen much of his run and carry, not sure what happening there. I reckon we should have thrown him on ball when Adams went out. We needed to mix things up. It’s a more sophisticated game in the middle and perhaps it doesn’t have that awareness as a defender. something to think about in the future though, we can’t be beaten that badly with the silver service we get from the ruck.

Noble - shocking, a candidate to be dropped. I’ve been on that for a number of weeks.

McCreery - a shining light on ‘debut’. Tackled well, played his role to a tee. Great one hand grab in the last. Loved his aggression. We need more of that, perhaps the senior players can learn from him! 8 tackles

Sier - was ok, not prolific. If his injury is soft tissue I would delist, he doesn’t work hard enough.

Brown - runs into dead ends, he tries to take the game on at least...tries to make a play. Good effort, 4 tackles.

Mayne - I like him in our side, I know many don’t. He brings that selfless gut running that is so important in the modern game. Was one of the cleaner players on the night. 80% DE!!

Daicos - we need to manufacture more uncontested ball for him, he’s one of the smart users...similar to Pendles in that way.

Roughhead - didn’t really get a read on him during the game. Somebody was responsible for Finlayson...Howe got him late.

Greenwood - he always needs a few games to work himself into some form...typical of a low skilled player. He toils hard, but was not at his sharpest.

You undid all of your good work with your comment on Noble. You Have been wanting him out for weeks? The season has only been up and running for 4 weeks and he was in our best in a couple of them!

 

[ZEV]

We have to rebuild. Not winning a flag with this list. What do you think was going to happen? You drop down to go back up. Look at the dogs, swans. Just suck it up. If we'd snagged one in 2018/19 you wouldn't be upset with where the list was at.

I thought we were going to responsibly manage our cap and player management like a $100 million organisation would....

I would also feel a lot more confident if we had a JUH or a Logan McDonald going forward instead of a Henry...