Preview Semi Final: Hawks vs Sydney Swans, Teams and Discussion

[Neville Bartos]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

Wow, what a weekend. Ups, downs and about 300 beers.

What'd I miss?

 

[Nich]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

yep - they were getting owned in the 3rd qtr. Were dead on their feet and Saints were all over them.

were very lucky to win for mine. everything went their way.

Normally I don't intrude but I think this is way off the mark, in my opinion. We beat a team for 3 out of 4 quarters and we deserved to win. They were lucky to get so close. We are generally poor in our 3rd quarters and most good teams will come back at you at one stage or another. The Saint's tried to come back and we repelled it. And as you should know, when you're hardest at the ball for a large % of the match, generally many things will go your way.

 

[Agent Smith]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

Wow, what a weekend. Ups, downs and about 300 beers.

What'd I miss?

Meh, boring weekend, very quiet in the forums, particularly the Hawthorn one. A few games played, all of little consequence.

By the way, we're three games away from winning a premiership!! Book your champers now!!

 

[DeadlyAkkuret]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

This is an idiotic comment.

The one thing I don't want to do is show no respect to the club with the best culture in the AFL.

The Swans play with total committment and unbelievable discipline - they rarely give away dumb free kicks, they don't carry on when they get a free paid against them. They remain cool under pressure and are always ALWAYS at the contest. Mick Malthouse said earlier this year that if you want to know about playing in finals just play against Sydney as they play like that all the time.

They don't have nearly the amount of talent we have but we disrespect them and what they have built at our peril. If we play with a quarter of their heart and spirit then we should win. But beware of Adam Goodes, the man is a freak and playing the very best football of his 300 game career - would like to see our boys, win lose or draw, clap him off the field as that kind of the sort of respect that should be showed to champions of the game.

Great post mate, and it's a shame many others can't follow your lead in terms of respecting the opposition.

Kudos.

 

[Big A]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

I think we're in bigger trouble than most are thinking. There was no spark against Cats and we were lame. It felt like a 10 goal drubbing to me as we were smashed that bad. I have a terrible feeling we'll go out in straight sets, to Sydney of all teams. I'd be happy with a 1pt win.

Alernatively, we could come out all mid guns blazing and smash them by 10 goals then roll the somewhat shaky Pies full of momentum. But, should we reach the GF against the Cats, how can we beat them? Would we have the cattle or 'adjusted' game plan good enough to beat them?

With Buddy out and us being exposed and given a reality check by the Cats, I feel we really need to change it up and also play some youngsters to both unsettle the opposition and to look forward to next year and this match is the one we need to do this in.

I could not fathom seeing another pathetic lame finals exit like last year again this year in straight sets at home, with Clarko sticking stubbornly to the same old tactics. I'd rather him be bold and have a go FFS and if we lose then we would do so with him having tried something else - the heat is on as he needs to pull a rabbit out of the hat now (and I think we have the cattle to do this). He needs to do this to also topple the Pies and Cats if we go that far so start now coz playing as is will not. Right now he needs to think outside the square and not suffer from tunnelvision. Take a calculated risk Hawks and go all the way!

Importantly and frustratingly, Burger is a complete and utter waste playing anywhere else than in the centre. FFS Clarko play him there for the full game this week. At least give it a go.

I'd like the following this week;

Ins: Stratton, Savage, Lisle, Bruce
Outs: Buddy, Whitecross, Bateman, Suckling

FB: Murphy Gibson Guerra
HB: Stratton Lisle Birchall
C: Smith Burgoyne Shiels
HF: Hodge Hale Lewis
FF: Rioli Shoey Bruest
R: Bailey Sewell Mitchell

Int: Puopolo - Osborne - Bruce (ROK)
Sub: Savage

Emg: Suckling, Whitecross, PJ

Bruce for Suckling is a toss up as is Bruce or Sav as the Sub.

Schoey to kick 5

 

[Beachy]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

Dissapointed that so much finger pointing is going on. Against the cats we were blooding 8 players without finals experience against a very experienced Geelong side. We had our opportunities in the 1st half to be 3-4 goals up but simply did not take them.

Ottens in the 3rd really stepped up, Bailey went off hurt and we got exposed. Our mid field was unable to stem the work of ottens, as they should have played much more defensive. It was tough for Shoey even through he got a smacking, pick himself up and still went at every contest. Geelong isolated him very well and in any team, if you can isolate your backman then your forwards tend to win the contest. In our forward line we bombed the ball in without the same structure to isolate defenders to our strength. Speed and spread. Bruest, Rioli & ossie all can kick bags but with kicked the ball up and under into our forward line for the second half of the game.

There will be many players who will lift this week. Smith was outstanding but just needed to readjust to the pace of finals. Poppy was good and hard at the pill. This week we need to play to our structures and I think we play better at times without buddy in the forward half in tough situations and spot up our forawrd players. The key is Bailey. Stay on the park and we will win the game. Hale needs to stand up in a final and clunk some of those marks and Sewell will be at it. The swans will be tough but I beleive that the boys will return the faith shown in them.

 

[lennonsdollars]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

Does anybody know exactly what the story is with Renouf? Is fit for consideration or injured?

He kicked four, I think when playing for Box Hill and then dissappeared.

 

[Buddy and Roughy]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

don't know why people still suggest dropping whitecross :/ . he's clearly been a top 18 player this year and will undoubtedly hold his spot through finals.

 

[Lethal44]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

B-Guerra Schoenmakers Gibson
HB-Birchall Stratton Murphy
C-Smith Hodge Lewis
HF-Burgoyne Lisle Whitecross
F-Osborne Hale Rioli
R-Bailey Sewell Mitchell
Int-Suckling Puopolo Sheils
Sub-Bruest
Emerg-Bruce Savage Cheney

In- Stratton Lisle
Out- Franklin ( knee ), Bateman ( omitted ).

Stratton's selection sure's up the defence whilst Lisle will help stretch an already undersized Sydney backline.

 

[Hawksgirl4eva]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

OUTS:

Now I still have some hope but... Buddy

Changa

Shoenmakers

INS:

Lisle (let's hope he can kick goals on the big stage)

Stratton ( BG for BH)

Savage

 

[RIOLIUSTAR]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

Its going to be very tough this game.

They're extremely disciplined and have some class on every line and are in great form. Far better than last time we met.

The talk about the top 4 prevail into prelim week, is complete crap for mine, sure history suggests that, but I won't believe until we progress.

I still have faith we can bounce back and win well, but I guess we won't really know until the first 10 minutes, to see if the real HFC has shown up.

I'm tipping we will stand up and get back into the race for the flag. Its a long shot but you have to be in it to win.

GET IT DONE FFS!!!

 

[burner1]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

Few observations:

-A key reason our side had appeared to improve this year was the pace injection brought on by the new guys. Yet we went into a crunch final with one outside runner (bateman as sub doesn't count) and a bunch of midfield plodders - and got cut up in the middle and on the transition and couldn't find players in space. We looked really slow on the weekend.

-Hodge and mitchell don't look fully fit - add that to lewis and sewell in the middle and we are treacle slow (and get dominated in the clearences). We need to give burgoyne more time in the middle - if hodge has to spend some time back and/or lewis up forward then so be it. WX should also be given some stints in the middle to provide a bit of energy. Lewis is not a winger

-Savage has to come in. It's a real pity bateman is out of form and TBH there's not much else. Suckling could also be pushed up onto a wing

-We need Rioli to spend more time in the middle but its clear he's either not fit or injured. Rioli was outstanding in the pre-season off half back - think we need to try it again. Will get him into the game and free up birch to be more attacking.

-Breust was really poor - doesn't attack the contest hard enough which was shown up by the cats and will likely again by the swans. Needs to be sub when the heat has gone out of the game.

-While I want Stratton back our backline looks too reactive with shoe, gibbo, murphy,guerra and stratts down back, with only birchall and maybe suckling providing any real run. Not sure murphy has a good match up - bruce may be a better option on ROK as can play further up the ground and has a big tank and can also play as a hitup fwd. We seem to have too many defenders - murphy, guerra, suckling and pops is a lot of small defenders who can't go into the midfield.

-Lisle is really the only tall option to replace buddy, however if plays fwd is more suited to a deep fwd role which conflicts with Hale. We may consider pushing lisle back and shoe to CHF at times. Hale will need to be on his game to neutrialise the rucks so I dont think we can expect him to play as the sole tall fwd and also 2nd ruck

-Other than goodes, mumford and ROK, mcglynn has been handy for the swans - a great matchup for puopolo

This is a bit out there but:

Suckling Gibson Stratts
Birchall Shoe Rioli
Smith Burgoyne Savage
WX Lisle Hodge
Ossie Hale Puopolo
Bailey Mitch Sewell
Int: Shiels, Lewis, Bruce, Sub: Breust

In: Savage, Bruce, Stratts, Lisle
Out: Bateman, guerra, murphy, buddy

 

[dan0z]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

hope you guys wipe the floor with the swannies, good luck..

 

[Agent Smith]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

Few observations:

-A key reason our side had appeared to improve this year was the pace injection brought on by the new guys. Yet we went into a crunch final with one outside runner (bateman as sub doesn't count) and a bunch of midfield plodders - and got cut up in the middle and on the transition and couldn't find players in space. We looked really slow on the weekend.

-Hodge and mitchell don't look fully fit - add that to lewis and sewell in the middle and we are treacle slow (and get dominated in the clearences). We need to give burgoyne more time in the middle - if hodge has to spend some time back and/or lewis up forward then so be it. WX should also be given some stints in the middle to provide a bit of energy. Lewis is not a winger

-Savage has to come in. It's a real pity bateman is out of form and TBH there's not much else. Suckling could also be pushed up onto a wing

-We need Rioli to spend more time in the middle but its clear he's either not fit or injured. Rioli was outstanding in the pre-season off half back - think we need to try it again. Will get him into the game and free up birch to be more attacking.

-Breust was really poor - doesn't attack the contest hard enough which was shown up by the cats and will likely again by the swans. Needs to be sub when the heat has gone out of the game.

-While I want Stratton back our backline looks too reactive with shoe, gibbo, murphy,guerra and stratts down back, with only birchall and maybe suckling providing any real run. Not sure murphy has a good match up - bruce may be a better option on ROK as can play further up the ground and has a big tank and can also play as a hitup fwd. We seem to have too many defenders - murphy, guerra, suckling and pops is a lot of small defenders who can't go into the midfield.

-Lisle is really the only tall option to replace buddy, however if plays fwd is more suited to a deep fwd role which conflicts with Hale. We may consider pushing lisle back and shoe to CHF at times. Hale will need to be on his game to neutrialise the rucks so I dont think we can expect him to play as the sole tall fwd and also 2nd ruck

-Other than goodes, mumford and ROK, mcglynn has been handy for the swans - a great matchup for puopolo

This is a bit out there but:

Suckling Gibson Stratts
Birchall Shoe Rioli
Smith Burgoyne Savage
WX Lisle Hodge
Ossie Hale Puopolo
Bailey Mitch Sewell
Int: Shiels, Lewis, Bruce, Sub: Breust

In: Savage, Bruce, Stratts, Lisle
Out: Bateman, guerra, murphy, buddy

Some good points here.

 

[disgruntled goat]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

yep - they were getting owned in the 3rd qtr. Were dead on their feet and Saints were all over them.

were very lucky to win for mine. everything went their way.

What an ignorant comment.

"Owned in the third quarter" ... how does that explain the second and fourth quarters?

It's amusing to see how this thread has fluctuated since Friday night/Saturday morning.

One thing about most Swans fans; we're not prone to complacency. You blokes are a far better side than St Kilda, but we're there and in good form. We're a chance.

 

[MinerBoy]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

"Owned in the third quarter" ... how does that explain the second and fourth quarters?

I'm not having a go because I didn't watch the game but in answer to your question here I would say that owning the 3rd Q has nothing to do with any explanations of the 2nd and 4th quarters.

 

[disgruntled goat]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

This is an idiotic comment.

The one thing I don't want to do is show no respect to the club with the best culture in the AFL.

The Swans play with total committment and unbelievable discipline - they rarely give away dumb free kicks, they don't carry on when they get a free paid against them. They remain cool under pressure and are always ALWAYS at the contest. Mick Malthouse said earlier this year that if you want to know about playing in finals just play against Sydney as they play like that all the time.

They don't have nearly the amount of talent we have but we disrespect them and what they have built at our peril. If we play with a quarter of their heart and spirit then we should win. But beware of Adam Goodes, the man is a freak and playing the very best football of his 300 game career - would like to see our boys, win lose or draw, clap him off the field as that kind of the sort of respect that should be showed to champions of the game.

You're a true football fan. Cheers, and may the better side win Friday night.

 

[disgruntled goat]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

I'm not having a go because I didn't watch the game but in answer to your question here I would say that owning the 3rd Q has nothing to do with any explanations of the 2nd and 4th quarters.

I was just making the point that the original post suggested we were extremely lucky to win largely based on being "owned" in the third quarter. Games are played over four quarters; and we were as dominant in the second and fourth quarters as St Kilda (arguably) were in the third. It just seemed an inane remark and no basis at all for the argument that we were "lucky".

 

[BigAl3001]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

Time to show some REAL ticker.

 

[hawkheart]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

Few observations:

-A key reason our side had appeared to improve this year was the pace injection brought on by the new guys. Yet we went into a crunch final with one outside runner (bateman as sub doesn't count) and a bunch of midfield plodders - and got cut up in the middle and on the transition and couldn't find players in space. We looked really slow on the weekend.

-Hodge and mitchell don't look fully fit - add that to lewis and sewell in the middle and we are treacle slow (and get dominated in the clearences). We need to give burgoyne more time in the middle - if hodge has to spend some time back and/or lewis up forward then so be it. WX should also be given some stints in the middle to provide a bit of energy. Lewis is not a winger

-Savage has to come in. It's a real pity bateman is out of form and TBH there's not much else. Suckling could also be pushed up onto a wing

-We need Rioli to spend more time in the middle but its clear he's either not fit or injured. Rioli was outstanding in the pre-season off half back - think we need to try it again. Will get him into the game and free up birch to be more attacking.

-Breust was really poor - doesn't attack the contest hard enough which was shown up by the cats and will likely again by the swans. Needs to be sub when the heat has gone out of the game.

-While I want Stratton back our backline looks too reactive with shoe, gibbo, murphy,guerra and stratts down back, with only birchall and maybe suckling providing any real run. Not sure murphy has a good match up - bruce may be a better option on ROK as can play further up the ground and has a big tank and can also play as a hitup fwd. We seem to have too many defenders - murphy, guerra, suckling and pops is a lot of small defenders who can't go into the midfield.

-Lisle is really the only tall option to replace buddy, however if plays fwd is more suited to a deep fwd role which conflicts with Hale. We may consider pushing lisle back and shoe to CHF at times. Hale will need to be on his game to neutrialise the rucks so I dont think we can expect him to play as the sole tall fwd and also 2nd ruck

-Other than goodes, mumford and ROK, mcglynn has been handy for the swans - a great matchup for puopolo

This is a bit out there but:

Suckling Gibson Stratts
Birchall Shoe Rioli
Smith Burgoyne Savage
WX Lisle Hodge
Ossie Hale Puopolo
Bailey Mitch Sewell
Int: Shiels, Lewis, Bruce, Sub: Breust

In: Savage, Bruce, Stratts, Lisle
Out: Bateman, guerra, murphy, buddy

Some excellent points here but there's no way in heaven and earth that either guerra or murphy will be dropped.

 

[Neville Bartos]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

People need to remember the 2007 Semi-final between Hawks and North. We looked a million bucks in the first week and North were weoful getting spanked by 80+ points by Geelong. Everyone talked us up all week and said North were already done. Sure enough the team that finished higher got the chocolates (and we got sleepy Cyril).

I'm starting to feel confident, I think we'll beat them in a close one without Buddy. If we were a 1-man team we wouldn't have only lost 4 games this year considering Buddy only kicked 70 odd goals.

 

[Gorlomi]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

What an ignorant comment.

"Owned in the third quarter" ... how does that explain the second and fourth quarters?

It's amusing to see how this thread has fluctuated since Friday night/Saturday morning.

One thing about most Swans fans; we're not prone to complacency. You blokes are a far better side than St Kilda, but we're there and in good form. We're a chance.

you were great in the 2nd and 4th quarters - ROK didn't miss a thing after kicking pretty poorly during the season. Meanwhile Riewoldt missed a couple of critical goals. Again everything went your way - you have those days which is why you won.

Your 3rd quarter was very average though and they looked dead on their feet.

This gives me confidence we'll run over the top of you. Especially given the game is at the G.

Not knocking Sydney - they're a dogged side. Just an observation. Saints had all the momentum in the 3rd and if they took their chances would have run all over you in the 4th. But they didn't and that's footy.

 

[Hawker_Ant]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

Changes:

Doubt Buddy will be playing, so Buddy out, Lisle in. That didn't use up many brain cells.

Bateman didn't do an awful lot ... Savage in for him.

Stratts the Lazarus! Are Hawks desperate enough to bring him fin or Schoey to cope with Reid?

Cheney may be given a go in front of the Smurf.

Wondering about Ellis and Bruce. I wouldn't mind the former if he is fit enough, the latter might get lucky, but I'm not sure who they could replace.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

Schoey won't get dropped.

Buddy out, Ellis or Stratton in.

 

[J0NNY B]

Re: Hawks vs Sydney Swans (Semi Final)

Quote from James Kelly:
But Kelly said the defensive forward press tactic made that a dangerous way to play and under first-year coach Chris Scott have taken a more direct, longer kicking approach.

“It’s been a very big change – we know with the modern defences against Hawthorn and Collingwood and West Coast – flicking the ball around with too much handball, you can have it taken off you pretty quickly,” Kelly said today.

“We’ve got a big strength of ours with the two big forwards down there (James Podsiadly and Tom Hawkins) and Brad Ottens and Trent West, we want to play to that strength and get the ball in there as quick as we can.


Come on coaching panel, take the risk, let em play!! Lisle, Hale and Bailey can all be used as long targets up the ground or in the fwd 50. give us some exciting footy to watch. Don't give us the chip around style anymore. The strategy against Adelaide in round 1 is the way to go ( i know we lost, Malcolm Blight liked the style and said if we persist we could be a chance this year) - throw caution out the window. Win or lose give us anything but the safe chip around strategy. Cats just proved you can change a game style in two weeks.