- Apr 27, 2008
- 65,927
- 80,407
- AFL Club
- Port Adelaide
- Other Teams
- Chael Sonnen: Moral Champion
Remember too that for a long time Clone Wars was on Netflix too
Sent from my Nokia 7.2 using Tapatalk
Sent from my Nokia 7.2 using Tapatalk
Movie Star Wars - Episode IX - The Rise of Skywalker - Spoilers and Rumors
- Thread starter Exe Gesis
- Start date
- Tagged users None
SM
Bigfooty Legend
With respect you're talking out of your ass yet again. You use D+ figures to back up Mandalorian's popularity then dismiss the very same figures (that had TCW as one of the most watched shows across all streaming platforms) when they go against your argument.
Another article: https://www.businessinsider.com.au/...-week-outer-banks-clone-wars-2020-5?r=US&IR=T
One of the main reasons I would think TCW's figures declined is there was absolutely zero marketing for it in the mainstream, Star Wars was seen as 'dead' until the Disney purchase, and when Disney did purchase it, people presumably thought the show would be cancelled (which it was) so didn't bother with it.
- Sep 15, 2011
- 33,686
- 52,956
- AFL Club
- West Coast
That article has absolutely no numbers for Clone Wars whereas there are articles about the Mandalorian that do (Forbes crunched the numbers and it was a minimum 5.8 million). If your argument is that Clone Wars is mainstream and the majority of Mandalorian viewers have watched it, then you are just being flat out delusional. If you want to argue its storylines can be weaved in, fine, but to suggest it’s mainstream is nonsense. You might as well be calling for book characters to be included because they are New York Times bestsellers so everyone must know who Vi Moradi and Cardinal are.
Then you could articulate as much, without the need to be so dismissive of the shows in question.
For me, it dilutes whatever point you’re trying to make by repeatedly saying the same condescending thing over and over again (“they’re kids shows etc etc”) in the various Star Wars threads, something I poked fun at the other day. That’s that air of superiority that’s quite noticeable in your word choices and tone. I feel you’re a far better poster than that.
For what it’s worth, the animated shows are not particularly for me either. However I feel you’re massively overstating this so called problem you’ve been commenting on with the appearance of Ahsoka etc in The Mandalorian.
The audience was given enough to know why they’re there. And for those wanting greater detail, a simple google search would suffice (which is what I did with numerous articles available to fill in the gaps). For those wanting even more content, then there’s the animated shows available to explore. It’s pretty simple I would’ve thought, one can choose whatever method suits them.
- Sep 15, 2011
- 33,686
- 52,956
- AFL Club
- West Coast
Describing Clone Wars as primarily a children’s show is not condescending, it’s just a fact with some inherent consequences. They are less discerning than products aimed at mainstream adult audiences. The same is true of comics and books in varying degrees. Now, I read the books but if some of the shit that appears in them makes their way into the movies or TV shoes, I’ll be equally concerned (Boba Fett, anyone?). The genius of Marvel is that they have been able to balance their mainstream and hardcore audiences. I want Star Wars to do the same. The rush to jam things into only the second season of their first major TV show is a concern.
For mine, the issues are currently twofold. One is leaning on plot devices from niche media like books and cartoons. The other is leaning too heavily on nostalgia. Mandalorian was supposed to be fresh new material but at the first chance Filoni is cramming in Luke, Fett, Ahsoka, Thrawn etc. Take some damn time, blow your load and you’ll simply push the audience away. If it had just been Fett, it’d be easier to get on board. Or if it had just been Ashoka and they provided context, sure. Instead, what was supposed to be original an original story in the Star Wars universe became an ad for two nostalgia and niche driven shows.
SM
Bigfooty Legend
I think the only person I've seen on the entire internet with a negative reaction to Mandalorian Season 2 is Jack, but it's everyone else who is wrong for liking it.
SM
Bigfooty Legend
Oh no, a difference of opinion, what will we do
I largely liked season 2 but it had some issues.
Oh no, more narkiness from Jack after spending years crying that people didn't like TLJ. The hypocrisy is almost too much.
- Apr 27, 2008
- 65,927
- 80,407
- AFL Club
- Port Adelaide
- Other Teams
- Chael Sonnen: Moral Champion
I still think Jack is just channeling his anti Luke Skywalker ripping it up with a green lightsaber rhetoric in to Ashoka.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
No, it’s condescending with the word choices you’ve made. I feel like I’m repeating myself over and over. “Grown ass adults” for example. Some self awareness is perhaps overlooked here - the inference with such a dismissive comment is to suggest you’re “better” or “above” needing to lower yourself to an animated show for context or exposition. Like I said, it was cringe worthy and reflective of that air of arrogance etc
Secondly, I must have a very different definition of “cramming in”. Luke was is in it for ten minutes. Ahsoka one episode. And Thrawn? ****ing hell mate. His name was mentioned once, in passing. In one sentence.
Cramming in? Jesus.
What an extraordinarily bizarre thing to be hung up about. It’s absolutely palpable in his posting since.
- Sep 15, 2011
- 33,686
- 52,956
- AFL Club
- West Coast
The lack of self awareness in this comment is hilarious. Any comments about TLJ are in response to people whining non stop for three years about a film they don’t like. It’s embarrassing. I’ve given very little thought to TROS in the past year. That’s what people usually do when they don’t like a film. They move on.
SM
Bigfooty Legend
Uh I'm talking about at the time the big discussions about TLJ that you got very upset in. I can't remember the last time I actively discussed elements of TLJ on here.
Kind of weird to say you have given little thought about TROS while posting in the TROS thread.
Last edited:
- Sep 15, 2011
- 33,686
- 52,956
- AFL Club
- West Coast
You’d have a point if we weren’t talking about the Mandalorian in it
Yeah, I’ll stick with cramming in. Mandalorian is eight episodes, fully half were handed over to nostalgia, continuing storylines from niche content and back door pilots. The narrative of Din Djaren was sacrificed for callbacks to other products (so at least we know Filoni learnt at the feet of Lucas).
It’s funny you mention Thrawn because that was the dumbest one. Ahsoka growls out the question three separate times, there’s a soaring score when she mentions him by name, it’s the climax to the episode, they obviously thought they were delivering an earth shattering line that would be cheered by viewers everywhere. I still remember my wife looking non-plussed and saying ‘I thought it would be Gideon’. Well, yeah, that would have made sense in the context of the Mandalorian. But let’s wait for them to explain it. Nope, come back in 18-24 months for a new show whose narrative is obviously more important. Ham-fisted.
You’d have a point if we weren’t talking about the Mandalorian in it
Yeah, I’ll stick with cramming in. Mandalorian is eight episodes, fully half were handed over to nostalgia, continuing storylines from niche content and back door pilots. The narrative of Din Djaren was sacrificed for callbacks to other products (so at least we know Filoni learnt at the feet of Lucas).
It’s funny you mention Thrawn because that was the dumbest one. Ahsoka growls out the question three separate times, there’s a soaring score when she mentions him by name, it’s the climax to the episode, they obviously thought they were delivering an earth shattering line that would be cheered by viewers everywhere. I still remember my wife looking non-plussed and saying ‘I thought it would be Gideon’. Well, yeah, that would have made sense in the context of the Mandalorian. But let’s wait for them to explain it. Nope, come back in 18-24 months for a new show whose narrative is obviously more important. Ham-fisted.
I didn’t mention Thrawn.
You did.
SM
Bigfooty Legend
How dare they tease new story lines because your wife was uninterested!! The nerve of them..You’d have a point if we weren’t talking about the Mandalorian in it
Yeah, I’ll stick with cramming in. Mandalorian is eight episodes, fully half were handed over to nostalgia, continuing storylines from niche content and back door pilots. The narrative of Din Djaren was sacrificed for callbacks to other products (so at least we know Filoni learnt at the feet of Lucas).
It’s funny you mention Thrawn because that was the dumbest one. Ahsoka growls out the question three separate times, there’s a soaring score when she mentions him by name, it’s the climax to the episode, they obviously thought they were delivering an earth shattering line that would be cheered by viewers everywhere. I still remember my wife looking non-plussed and saying ‘I thought it would be Gideon’. Well, yeah, that would have made sense in the context of the Mandalorian. But let’s wait for them to explain it. Nope, come back in 18-24 months for a new show whose narrative is obviously more important. Ham-fisted.
SM
Bigfooty Legend
If only they knew the meaning of the word tease. That was stripping naked, shoving their junk in our faces and screaming ‘this is what you want’
Ah yes, using Thrawn's name is certainly overkill.
- Sep 15, 2011
- 33,686
- 52,956
- AFL Club
- West Coast
They should have left it to Timothy Zahn.
SM
Bigfooty Legend
And you would have cried about him shoving his character in like you do about Filoni with Ahsoka.
jdeezy
Premiership Player
- Jul 6, 2013
- 4,852
- 13,588
- AFL Club
- Port Adelaide
So tonight I finally decided it was time to watch Rise of Skywalker for the second time, and, a year and a half on, I come away with the same feeling:
It is unquestionably a dumb movie, and if I was given the reins of producing Episode IX there is no way I would've came up with any of the major story beats in this (especially not actively ignoring the obvious threads being dropped in the past 2 movies), but, if you allow yourself to just go with the story as it has been presented, you've got a pretty fun first half, but a messy, messy ending.
The thing is I think a reasonable - not great, but reasonable - movie is salvageable out of it, if you could just tap old JJ and Terrio and whoever else on the shoulder at times and tell him to reel it in a bit.
Essentially my big problems with it can be boiled down to:
- Rey being a Palpatine, which I feel not only outright kills the swerve of the nice "anyone can be a hero" angle of TLJ and instead closes in the universe immensely
- A massive amount of power creep; we've got people jumping over spaceships, blowing up spaceships, making force lightning big enough to cover a planet, and 10,000 ships out of nowhere just because that sounds cool
- Reylo romance angle.
Like, for me, that's it. You eliminate those 3 factors and the movie is ~fine~. Again, not great, but not "put the franchise in cotton wool nobody wants to see it for years" bad. There's an alright movie in there, and if it was found, we'd have a fun trilogy. Not amazing, and definitely squandered potential, but something I would enjoy watching.
It is unquestionably a dumb movie, and if I was given the reins of producing Episode IX there is no way I would've came up with any of the major story beats in this (especially not actively ignoring the obvious threads being dropped in the past 2 movies), but, if you allow yourself to just go with the story as it has been presented, you've got a pretty fun first half, but a messy, messy ending.
The thing is I think a reasonable - not great, but reasonable - movie is salvageable out of it, if you could just tap old JJ and Terrio and whoever else on the shoulder at times and tell him to reel it in a bit.
Essentially my big problems with it can be boiled down to:
- Rey being a Palpatine, which I feel not only outright kills the swerve of the nice "anyone can be a hero" angle of TLJ and instead closes in the universe immensely
- A massive amount of power creep; we've got people jumping over spaceships, blowing up spaceships, making force lightning big enough to cover a planet, and 10,000 ships out of nowhere just because that sounds cool
- Reylo romance angle.
Like, for me, that's it. You eliminate those 3 factors and the movie is ~fine~. Again, not great, but not "put the franchise in cotton wool nobody wants to see it for years" bad. There's an alright movie in there, and if it was found, we'd have a fun trilogy. Not amazing, and definitely squandered potential, but something I would enjoy watching.
StFly
Space to Rent
- Moderator
- #7,797
See on my end, if they kept the ST trend they double down on the economy for the first half of the movie.
You just spend two movies basically making the ruling republic moot, then made it a cripple fight between navies & ground forces where it needed to be character driven otherwise you have not much to work with as one is totally unknown as the other is a crater.
You spend time with pro republic forces, swindling, rallying, building a resistance whilst Poe grows into command structures, Rey grows further into the religious aspect and emotive response and Finn becomes the everyday turncoat guy who appeals to wider populace on both sides as social aspect guy building groundswell support. By association, you actually show how the FO exists, even if it's just 5 minutes of random planet jumps or a report, whispers.
That way you then build the power creep for both sides instead of the "pop" 10k ships here, 20k troops there, here's a montage to explain pulllLIGHTNING!!1
Your second half is then some skirmish as betrayal (Hux not obvious dead panning) to introduce a Moff or a Knight of Ren or some seniority to then hint at Palp actually living (instead of the fist 2 mins) and it ends with then say redeemed Ben striking Palp down in manufactured duel sequence (he's the religious conflict and as link to Skywalker, strikes Palp down -> redeemed by Rey) and it ends on that Rey Kylo romance moment.
Not a great movie at all, but to me, it then at least feels like all 3 then exist in the actual universe instead of being this pocket dimension where things just pop into existence for no reason at all.
Mara Jade rumored for Mando S3.
jdeezy
Premiership Player
- Jul 6, 2013
- 4,852
- 13,588
- AFL Club
- Port Adelaide
Just bouncing off this a bit, I reckon another way you could keep the status quo of a dwindling Republic (even though it is technically in power) and a growing First Order, and again, not contradict what has come before, particularly the end of TLJ, is going with the angle that systems in the republic actually do support the resistance, but the First Order is crushing them before they can help. (perhaps this is where you bring in the idea of the hidden Final Order fleet to explain how they are big enough to do this).
You could show the audience a couple of scenes of this happening - the characters that stay at the Resistance base (including Rose, because good forbid she gets a larger role in this movie) are contacting systems, but each time they do the FO intercepts them and overruns the planet. You could still have Poe believing that nobody wants to help during the mid point of the movie, so that later on you can still keep that big moment of all of the galaxy's ships showing up in the final battle. Hell, if you want to really push this angle, imagine that with the Kimiji scenes, when they land on the planet it is not involved in the war, but the FO realise a Resistance crew is on the planet and we see first hand the first order occupy it.
Again, not the movie I would create from scratch, but it might fix up a couple of issues.
