Opinion Sydney Swans Academy and Rebuild

[Callums_Guns]

its funny how some people start crying when a team does well...

when they are sh*t no one cares about the academy

just like when a team does sh*t its not the umpires

That's a fantastic post - thread can be closed now









Side notes related to the Swans / GWS Academy but junior AFL in Sydney

Inner Sydney Junior Clubs have always had higher numbers due to the Swans and AFL NSW hard work with local clubs, junior clubs capping numbers Oct / Nov the year prior because clubs are full

Ground shortage and facilities reported in 2017, but was happening prior and is still an on-going issue

Swans Academy trials start U11's / GWS start U13's

Swans Academy affected by job cuts last season like so many but also cutting back the number of players they take into the system, which I know 1st hand some players that have switched to Rugby in U12's due to the cut-backs

Junior numbers in Sydney both inner city and city west are booming and have been for 7+ years

AFL NSW job cuts during COVID in relation to junior development and development of skills for volunteer coaches for local clubs

Some of the above makes me think the conversations relating to both SYD / GWS Academies will be quite different including the number of players lost to the system / sport between the ages of 11+ over the next 5-6 years

 

[Elixuh]

I wish to tackle the problem of inequality and fairness in the competition by applying my own definition of equality and fairness, as such we will only be taking away your academies. All other structural inequalities will remain because they benefit my team.

Thank you for listening to my TED talk. End thread.

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

I think it’s fair as long as the Vic clubs get all the access to Vic kids. And that’s considerably diluted by the fact they have to be shared by 10 clubs.

I think the upshot of all of this is state-based drafts would be best. There’d be little measures required to even it up but think it’d work if done the right way.

Sydney did actually make this suggestion, to withdraw from the draft and rely on development of local talent and the AFL knocked it on the head.

 

[Sphynx]

Look forward to a deconstruction of Footscray's NGA. Have invested sfa and scored the number one pick.

You mean this?

AFL scraps top-20 NGA picks, new mid-season draft plan

The AFL has changed its Next Generation Academy rules for top-end talent

www.afl.com.au

 

[Sphynx]

Ah fair enough. Far too early for picking up on nuance on here, lol. Apologies.

With that said I do agree on some of those points, but I've gotta highly disagree on the 'pillaged' part when it comes to us. While all and sundry from Vic have picked up Giants players, this is actually the first Giants player we've picked up. We also only ever got Ablett back from GC, and that was literally because his sister was mentally unwell and unfortunately we know what happened there.

In the case of Cameron, we gave up literally all our draft collateral to get him, so it wasn't a FA 'heist' sort of deal - we definitely had to pay through the nose in both salary and draft capital, to get him across.

I digress though, as it's not really important to the discussion.

Coniglio reportedly has media/sponsorship deals tied in with his salary, Buddy made an absolute packet just with marketing alone in Sydney, and Ablett was paid a metric sh*t ton for all the sponsorship/marquee player branding deals he got on the side. Not to mention players like Ward and Griffin when they came across to the Giants, Stevie J etc. Although the media side was not the same - paid segments and what not - I feel that has more to do with the media landscape in those rugby dominated areas - where no-one is really that interested in a bunch of AFL segments, when they just want to talk Rugby.

Agree that a national comp is probably the way forward, but still not sure how it works yet, or even if WA or SA would even want that - as it would take away their edge even more when it comes to their draft pool. That's a long way off though, lol, and a conversation that's probably for a different thread.

Forget it mate.

SM and his cronies aren't interested in genuine debate.

There's always caveats with every discussion.

We will get rid of our academies when:

- We can pay our players millions more
- Kill off three Melbourne clubs
- Have the GF in Sydney
- We aren't allowed to lose a player to outgoing trades, ever
- Remans until the NSW talent pool mirrors the VIC talent pool so we are guaranteed the #1 pick equivalent every year via our academy


They know how good they have it and how unbalanced the current system is, they will fight to the death in any discussion to move the narrative.

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

3,000 kids have gone through the Swans Academy and suspect similar numbers from the other 3 northern clubs.

How many got support via NGA?

 

[Sphynx]

3,000 kids have gone through the Swans Academy and suspect similar numbers from the other 3 northern clubs.

How many got support via NGA?

You realise NGA academies don't have the ability to annex the entire talent pool like the Northern academies?

You realise the AFL didn't change the entire talent pathway of the state junior football system, abolish the state sides and replace them with the Northern academies to funnel every representative footballer in the state into them?


That's what the NAB League, the SANFL u/19's and the WAFL u/19's are there to function as.

The AFL even went as far as the nationalise the NAB League and the VFL to improve the pathway for your academies.

Anything else the rest of the comp can do for you and accommodate you?

AFL Victoria and the suburban mum and dads fund the development pathway of the NAB League for the betterment of the entire AFL competition.


Every single able body footballer has no other pathway into the AFL system in NSW other than via the Sydney or GWS academy. Unless they move to a Victorian boarding school and play NAB League and are thus developed by AFL Victoria but still remain eligible for Academy selection (another fantastic loophole for the academy system)

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

You realise NGA academies don't have the ability to annex the entire talent pool like the Northern academies?

You realise the AFL didn't change the entire talent pathway of the state junior football system, abolish the state sides and replace them with the NGA academies to funnel every representative footballer in the state into them?

WA and SA junior systems and the Northern systems get sfa AFL support. The TAC ???

 

[SM]

Forget it mate.

SM and his cronies aren't interested in genuine debate.

There's always caveats with every discussion.

We will get rid of our academies when:

- We can pay our players millions more
- Kill off three Melbourne clubs
- Have the GF in Sydney
- We aren't allowed to lose a player to outgoing trades, ever
- Remans until the NSW talent pool mirrors the VIC talent pool so we are guaranteed the #1 pick equivalent every year via our academy


They know how good they have it and how unbalanced the current system is, they will fight to the death in any discussion to move the narrative.

Why the pot shot at me directly? You seem unnecessarily triggered by this and by me.

 

[DeadlyAkkuret]

Forget it mate.

SM and his cronies aren't interested in genuine debate.

There's always caveats with every discussion.

We will get rid of our academies when:

- We can pay our players millions more
- Kill off three Melbourne clubs
- Have the GF in Sydney
- We aren't allowed to lose a player to outgoing trades, ever
- Remans until the NSW talent pool mirrors the VIC talent pool so we are guaranteed the #1 pick equivalent every year via our academy


They know how good they have it and how unbalanced the current system is, they will fight to the death in any discussion to move the narrative.

Other than the two you made up, and the hyperbole, what’s wrong the the GF in Sydney if we make it after finishing on top and why shouldn’t the aim be for the talent pool to at least be as close to even as possible around the country?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Taylor]

How about the academy players are able to be picked up by any of the clubs in that state and when one of them is bid on both those clubs are required to submit their points to buy them like an auction?

No discounts, priority access to local talent is enough. Imagine if the Eagles and Dockers were able to veto another club picking a WA player in the draft to pick them up themselves instead, with a discount - the ability to access the player without having to call their name is value enough. I'd argue it's the highest value.

 

[SM]

How about the academy players are able to be picked up by any of the clubs in that state and when one of them is bid on both those clubs are required to submit their points to buy them like an auction?

No discounts, priority access to local talent is enough. Imagine if the Eagles and Dockers were able to veto another club picking a WA player in the draft to pick them up themselves instead, with a discount - the ability to access the player without having to call their name is value enough. I'd argue it's the highest value.

Probably because if it's a player from the Swans Academy, it's a player the Swans have invested time and money in, so why should GWS be given equal access? May as well just have a single NSW academy that both clubs fund.

 

[Sphynx]

WA and SA junior systems and the Northern systems get sfa AFL support. The TAC ???

What the hell are you on about?

The AFL nationalised the NAB League, your acadamies compete in the NAB league, you know?

The AFL nationalised the VFL so your reserves now have a higher standard of competition?

What else would you like?

 

[Taylor]

Probably because if it's a player from the Swans Academy, it's a player the Swans have invested time and money in, so why should GWS be given equal access? May as well just have a single NSW academy that both clubs fund.

Sounds like a great idea, let's do that. After all it's about local talent development.

 

[Sphynx]

Probably because if it's a player from the Swans Academy, it's a player the Swans have invested time and money in, so why should GWS be given equal access? May as well just have a single NSW academy that both clubs fund.

As apposed to the NGA acadamies that from 2022 onwards will be open to everyone inside of the top 40 picks?

Is the time and money argument only relevant to Northern Academy clubs and not the rest of the competition?

 

[Taylor]

What the hell are you on about?

The AFL nationalised the NAB League, your acadamies compete in the NAB league, you know?

The AFL nationalised the VFL so your reserves now have a higher standard of competition?

What else would you like?

I think West Coast would like to not cough up millions of dollars every year to prop up the WAFL.

 

[Sphynx]

I think West Coast would like to not cough up millions of dollars every year to prop up the WAFL.

I hope in the near future, even if it's in a limited format of a month or so, we have some form of fully nationalised u/19's club football format, so we see a little more of the draft pool outside of 3 national carnival games every season.

Even if it's just a SANFL mtro/country all-stars and WAFL metro/country all-stars vs the NAB League sides.

 

[BloodySwan]

You realise NGA academies don't have the ability to annex the entire talent pool like the Northern academies?

You realise the AFL didn't change the entire talent pathway of the state junior football system, abolish the state sides and replace them with the Northern academies to funnel every representative footballer in the state into them?


That's what the NAB League, the SANFL u/19's and the WAFL u/19's are there to function as.

The AFL even went as far as the nationalise the NAB League and the VFL to improve the pathway for your academies.

Anything else the rest of the comp can do for you and accommodate you?

AFL Victoria and the suburban mum and dads fund the development pathway of the NAB League for the betterment of the entire AFL competition.


Every single able body footballer has no other pathway into the AFL system in NSW other than via the Sydney or GWS academy. Unless they move to a Victorian boarding school and play NAB League and are thus developed by AFL Victoria but still remain eligible for Academy selection (another fantastic loophole for the academy system)

Why do you act like the NSW pathways were working before the academies?

Meanwhile the AFL has been changing the pathways in Victoria. They've been gutting it so it's a private boys league. This article was from 2 years ago and the AFL has just further cut funding

How private schools have taken over the AFL

Research shows boys who go to a private school are almost four times more likely than those educated in the government system to be on an AFL list. The national draft will reinforce the trend.

www.theage.com.au

What's your argument here? There has been more NSW talent since the AFL introduced these changes but you're arguing it's a bad thing?

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

Sounds like a great idea, let's do that. After all it's about local talent development.

I know you are having a crack but it is a not a bad idea. Both Clubs to get a priority pick from their Academy if they wish - order determined by ladder finish.

 

[Sphynx]

Why do you act like the NSW pathways were working before the academies?

Meanwhile the AFL has been changing the pathways in Victoria. They've been gutting it so it's a private boys league. This article was from 2 years ago and the AFL has just further cut funding

How private schools have taken over the AFL

Research shows boys who go to a private school are almost four times more likely than those educated in the government system to be on an AFL list. The national draft will reinforce the trend.

www.theage.com.au

What's your argument here? There has been more NSW talent since the AFL introduced these changes but you're arguing it's a bad thing?

I don't have an issue with the acadamies existance to generate talent.

I have an issue with the way you can double up on top end talent, how you can bid on players with garbage picks and how you can continually harvest top 20 prospects.

You can keep any top 20+ prospect as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Sphynx]

I know you are having a crack but it is a not a bad idea. Both Clubs to get a priority pick from their Academy if they wish - order determined by ladder finish.

So do the 10 Victorian clubs get a PP for the top 10 Victorian prospects?

SA clubs get the top 2 SA prospects?

WA clubs get the top 2 WA prospects and so on?

 

[juddy_Like]

North have the Aylett curse. No player with talent wants to go there, players with talent want to exit and fewer North fans go to your games. The Karma bus is slowly backing over this stain of a club.

Poor post mate and not required.

The game is for the better when we have 18 strong clubs.

 

[Callums_Guns]

Sphynx more than happy to send you Zach Sproule end of the season

 

[BloodySwan]

I think West Coast would like to not cough up millions of dollars every year to prop up the WAFL.

Eagles and WAFL are both run by the WAFC.......

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

Poor post mate and not required.

The game is for the better when we have 18 strong clubs.

Aye. Not my usual style.