Opinion Sydney Swans Academy and Rebuild

[lionbear]

Why?

Because Sydney walk away with 2 top 10 picks which means a team struggling at the bottom misses out on a top 10 player.

I'm not saying Sydney done anything wrong, I am just saying I don't agree with the rule.

 

[BloodySwan]

Sydney have access to priority picks although the way the AFL has set up the academy scheme why or how would Sydney ever finish that low.

Do you think Melb would have won without signing May?

Suns drafted him, developed him and you picked up the linchpin of your defence and you offered pick 6.

The same year they lost their best defender they lost their best forward. They got 3 top 10 draft picks that year, Lukosius, Rankine and King.

It looks like after developing Rankine he'll be gone to. What do that get? Likely another draft pick so they can develop another player who will ask to leave.....

Or maybe they'll turn out like King, a good player who is continuously hounded to head home. No doubt the Suns signed him to a contract well above what he's worth in hope he stays but is every chance to leave at the end of his 2yr contract.

Or maybe they'll develop into Lukosius, a decent enough player but one not worthy of a top 2 pick (at least so far).

Instead Melbourne can pick their local Vic kids, don't have to worry about every club going after them from day dot so don't need to overpay them just to keep them entertained.

Swans recently lost Dawson, Jones, Mitchell to go home factors. Were lucky we didn't lose Papley and there's already rumours Hayward and McDonald are being sought after.

Academy's are a leg up to counter the disadvantage NSW and QLD clubs face, you're just too willfully ignorant to see it

 

[SM]

Because Sydney walk away with 2 top 10 picks which means a team struggling at the bottom misses out on a top 10 player.

I'm not saying Sydney done anything wrong, I am just saying I don't agree with the rule.

But we had to pay for the privilege? What's the difference between that and trading a player to a club for a top 10 pick? It means that we forwent picks later in the draft. As someone else detailed, we gave up a lot to trade up to get Mills.

 

[ChristianBoy]

Do you think Melb would have won without signing May?

Suns drafted him, developed him and you picked up the linchpin of your defence and you offered pick 6.

The same year they lost their best defender they lost their best forward. They got 3 top 10 draft picks that year, Lukosius, Rankine and King.

It looks like after developing Rankine he'll be gone to. What do that get? Likely another draft pick so they can develop another player who will ask to leave.....

Or maybe they'll turn out like King, a good player who is continuously hounded to head home. No doubt the Suns signed him to a contract well above what he's worth in hope he stays but is every chance to leave at the end of his 2yr contract.

Or maybe they'll develop into Lukosius, a decent enough player but one not worthy of a top 2 pick (at least so far).

Instead Melbourne can pick their local Vic kids, don't have to worry about every club going after them from day dot so don't need to overpay them just to keep them entertained.

Swans recently lost Dawson, Jones, Mitchell to go home factors. Were lucky we didn't lose Papley and there's already rumours Hayward and McDonald are being sought after.

Academy's are a leg up to counter the disadvantage NSW and QLD clubs face, you're just too willfully ignorant to see it

Is Buddy from NSW? What about Hall Tippett Locket?

 

[Maddo11]

Is Buddy from NSW? What about Hall Tippett Locket?

All of your rebuttals just boil down to "yeah nah"

Pretty convincing stuff.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

Is Buddy from NSW? What about Hall Tippett Locket?

?????

So because we were able to sign those big names by careful list management and making tough calls, that proves we don’t need the academy to help in nurturing the rare upcoming NSW talent that does appear?

 

[BloodySwan]

Is Buddy from NSW? What about Hall Tippett Locket?

We going that far back?

It was great when we drafted Anthony Rocca only for him to walk. We drafted his friend Licuria only for him to go as well. I thought it was cool how Grant asked to go home after 2yrs at the Swans as well.

But yes, we signed Lockett and Buddy by offering them the largest contracts around at the time. Read what I said before - we have to offer more to players to attract them than Vic clubs do. To counteract this the AFL introduced the COLA - it had nothing to do with Sydney being more expensive but everything with us having to pay more for a player. This is the same reason why Brisbane had it as well despite it being a cheaper city than Melb or Sydney.


Again, you are willfully ignorant of why the academies were introduced. It was to grow NSW talent after decades of no improvement from the AFL.

 

[ChristianBoy]

All of your rebuttals just boil down to "yeah nah"

Pretty convincing stuff.

Your argument is flawed though. Clubs gain and lose players yearly. The access to kids should be equal to all. At the moment it is not and Sydney are the beneficeries of this system.

Hard to ague other wise.

 

[ChristianBoy]

?????

So because we were able to sign those big names by careful list management and making tough calls, that proves we don’t need the academy to help in nurturing the rare upcoming NSW talent that does appear?

You were able to buy those big names is the correct answer.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

You were able to buy those big names is the correct answer.

Sorry, what?

 

[lionbear]

But we had to pay for the privilege? What's the difference between that and trading a player to a club for a top 10 pick? It means that we forwent picks later in the draft. As someone else detailed, we gave up a lot to trade up to get Mills.

I traded in two commodore's to get a Ferrari is what you are saying

 

[SM]

I traded in two commodore's to get a Ferrari is what you are saying

Yes that is indeed how the points system works. This isn't new. Otherwise you're saying that the Swans/Lions/etc. develop players and then if they aren't shit enough to have the right draft pick then they aren't allowed to compete with clubs to draft them.

 

[ChristianBoy]

Sorry, what?

You brought them.

 

[Maddo11]

You brought them.

Melbourne deliberately lost games of football to improve their place in the draft.

Just two different ideologies I suppose. Try and succeed or aim to lose.

 

[ChristianBoy]

Melbourne deliberately lost games of football to improve their place in the draft.

Just two different ideologies I suppose. Try and succeed or aim to lose.

Maybe if it didn't matter how high we finished we would still get gifted top 3 talent hey.

 

[BloodySwan]

Maybe if it didn't matter how high we finished we would still get gifted top 3 talent hey.

You drafted Gysberts, Trengrove, Scully and Tapscott in your first round. If top end talent is all it takes why did Melbourne continue to fail? They were real complimentry to Watts, Cook, Blease and Strauss. All mega stars of the best Melbourne team running around after loading up with draft talent

 

[Tulip]

They’ve also got pick 5 from 2020 waiting for his turn. Scary good. Their academy produces a disproportionate amount of players but you can’t blame them for developing guys well down there, nor can you blame them for their culture being so good that every kid who walks through the door at any pick is a good chance to reach their potential.

 

[Maddo11]

Maybe if it didn't matter how high we finished we would still get gifted top 3 talent hey.

We pay for it with millions of dollars and thousands of hours of development.

Your team paid for it with years of supporter depression and apathy.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

You brought them.

Assuming you mean "bought", what is your point?

 

[Toump Ass]

These days the northern academies are regularly delivering first round picks into the draft system... Charlie Spargo from GWS's academy

Spargo is a 4th generation AFL/VFL player, it's bullshit to say he's playing AFL because of the academy system.

 

[ChristianBoy]

We pay for it with millions of dollars and thousands of hours of development.

Your team paid for it with years of supporter depression and apathy.

Im positive if Melbourne had eclusive rights to Academy kids of the entire state theyed do the same. In fact all clubs would.

 

[sataris]

How many kids get drafted out of NSW before the academy and after? This is 'literally' the only metric that matters.

Btw the most successful kid to come out of the swans academy plays for the Seahawks in the NFL.

 

[Farm Boy]

You drafted Gysberts, Trengrove, Scully and Tapscott in your first round. If top end talent is all it takes why did Melbourne continue to fail? They were real complimentry to Watts, Cook, Blease and Strauss. All mega stars of the best Melbourne team running around after loading up with draft talent

Watts was good. The rest of them were pea hearted little potatoes. I think Watts shown at Port in a brief time there, that he’d have been a different player if Dees moved him on earlier.


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[Number37]

Clutching at straws if you have to dig up start-up concessions for clubs created out of thin air. When Sydney played GWS in Rd 1, 2012 the latter had 17 debutants. Let that sink in.

Make up your mind whether top end draft picks are valuable or not. I mean the contentious issue ITT is that Sydney are able to recruit players selected as top end draft picks regardless of ladder position "because academy".

Hawthorn: Franklin, Roughead, Hodge, Lewis, Rioli
Richmond: Cotchin, Martin, Riewoldt
Melbourne: Petracca, Oliver, Jackson, Brayshaw

None of these well run teams would've won flags without these players. And those teams were all hot garbage when they recruited them. Which is the whole reason we have a draft.

So draft picks are sometimes good, and sometimes they're not so good.
But if it is an academy kid, then they are good no matter what.


Campbell can't get a game.
McDonald is in and out of the team.
Pick 4 and pick 5 can't get a regular game. Pick 32 is cemented in the team.

 

[smeggaz]

So draft picks are sometimes good, and sometimes they're not so good.
But if it is an academy kid, then they are good no matter what.


Campbell can't get a game.
McDonald is in and out of the team.
Pick 4 and pick 5 can't get a regular game. Pick 32 is cemented in the team.

Not to mention another pick 5 in Dylan Stephens (2019) who took his time to get a consistent string of games and whilst serviceable, isn't exactly setting the world on fire when compared with Chad Warner from the same draft at pick 30 something.

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