List Mgmt. Tim Kelly remains a Cat for 2019

[DivideandMultiply]

Freo won't get Langdon. End of story.

How do you know this?

 

[thegerman]

But his ceiling is that of a mid aged B grade player.

What we would expect from him is what Redden finally delivered second half of this year when fit and firing. Guess what we traded for Redden?

yeah ok buddy. B grade doesn't get 19 disposals in a quarter and 13 brownlow votes.


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[DivideandMultiply]

yeah ok buddy. B grade doesn't get 19 disposals in a quarter and 13 brownlow votes.


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They certainly do and can. Brownlow votes is a terrible indicator.

For example Yeo had 2 more, but was a much much better player over the season.

Geelong have a stacked midfield. It makes things easier. His role would be similar at WC but chsnge slightly.

We aren't as high of a posession team as Geelong, and have very different stoppage setups. His numbers will probably go down, not up.

 

[Turbocat]

They certainly do and can. Brownlow votes is a terrible indicator.

For example Yeo had 2 more, but was a much much better player over the season.

Geelong have a stacked midfield. It makes things easier. His role would be similar at WC but chsnge slightly.

We aren't as high of a posession team as Geelong, and have very different stoppage setups. His numbers will probably go down, not up.

In the end ... it gets down to .. do WC rate him.. how much do they rate him $ wize... and what are they prepared to pay to get him out of a contract. WC coming of a flag ..where as we are coming off a quick exit and watching multiple teams load up... and a CEO who has said we will not entertain a trade.
If someone has been convincing him that Geelong will cave like they always do.. then they best be prepared for what happens if we don't. Id say its not so much what you think is overs... it has to be overs in our eyes.

 

[Max Milburn]

In the end ... it gets down to .. do WC rate him.. how much do they rate him $ wize... and what are they prepared to pay to get him out of a contract. WC coming of a flag ..where as we are coming off a quick exit and watching multiple teams load up... and a CEO who has said we will not entertain a trade.
If someone has been convincing him that Geelong will cave like they always do.. then they best be prepared for what happens if we don't. Id say its not so much what you think is overs... it has to be overs in our eyes.

Get the feeling you're wasting your logic on this one...

 

[Wellsy35]

Have any of the WA clubs actually come out and said they’re interested in him this year?

 

[DivideandMultiply]

Get the feeling you're wasting your logic on this one...

I have been posting in fairly good faith.

I disagree re turbocats logic. WC got to where they are by trading fairly, but being even handed and sensible with a long term view.

Simply look at the way they chose to debut 8 odd players this year. It's a process driven club and a great environment for Kelly. But I doubt they are going to be rash. They backed in their system in 2018, without NN, then Gaff then Sheppard. Shuey, Kennedy, McGovern and Darling also missed games.

The trade last year with GC was about long term planning, and I reckon they will have an eye on mids like Coniglio or Powell-Pepper for the future.

Point being, if Geelong were uncharacteristically unreasonable, I doubt it would sway the club, but may lead to drama in 2019 when trying to trade with say a Freo.

 

[DivideandMultiply]

Have any of the WA clubs actually come out and said they’re interested in him this year?

I think it's fairly well known WC are interested.

 

[foodles05]

Freo won't trade pick 6 for him.

Melbourne want 4+. Freo will need to do something with their pick, maybe trade for two second rounders.

One will be used as part of a Langdon trade, the other who knows.

You are wishing re Freo. Kelly for them isn't a high priority, they won't offer more than WC and will happily wait 12 months to play hardball.

This has been their pattern every single trade period.

There is no way Langdon is going anywhere. So I am not sure why you are trying to convince yourself Freo won't be able to make a play for Kelly with their high pics in the hope that you will be able to get him for unders

 

[foodles05]

Just to clarify, if WC traded 20 and 21, I think that would be overs.

Could I live with it, well I hope something would also be coming back.

Well you would be wrong and Geelong shouldn't accept that. It is definitely unders!!

 

[DivideandMultiply]

There is no way Langdon is going anywhere. So I am not sure why you are trying to convince yourself Freo won't be able to make a play for Kelly with their high pics in the hope that you will be able to get him for unders

I'm not sure it matters.

Freo aren't going to offer more than WC.

 

[DivideandMultiply]

Well you would be wrong and Geelong shouldn't accept that. It is definitely unders!!

It absolutely isn't.

 

[Goggin Our Best]

Well you would be wrong and Geelong shouldn't accept that. It is definitely unders!!

Disagree i think 20 and 21 is extremely fair - in fact i think its overs

Kellys no world beater - 40 metres is about his kicking distance

If i was either of the WA clubs - i would be extremely interested in Rory Lobb - he is a very good - strong 1 grab overhead mark - Where as Hogan - he has been inconsistent all through his career ( Weideman came in and was as good as him

Freo end up with McCarthy and Hogan hey - their supporters will be jumping off that Freo bridge - into the blue yonder below

 

[Turbocat]

I have been posting in fairly good faith.

I disagree re turbocats logic. WC got to where they are by trading fairly, but being even handed and sensible with a long term view.

Simply look at the way they chose to debut 8 odd players this year. It's a process driven club and a great environment for Kelly. But I doubt they are going to be rash. They backed in their system in 2018, without NN, then Gaff then Sheppard. Shuey, Kennedy, McGovern and Darling also missed games.

The trade last year with GC was about long term planning, and I reckon they will have an eye on mids like Coniglio or Powell-Pepper for the future.

Point being, if Geelong were uncharacteristically unreasonable, I doubt it would sway the club, but may lead to drama in 2019 when trying to trade with say a Freo.

The idea that .. trade with us or you will have to deal with the big bad Freo guys in 12 months ... it doesn't take into account how much the club would rate having him for another 12 months...

To me there is little doubt the WC have been in Kellys ear and therefore its they that have a duty to be able to get a deal done. it not like he is a FA for eg. So you go into talks with a player with a enough to get it done or you are just whiteants. Imo , If you approach and encourage a player , you best have the picks or have the ability to get the picks ..or that player will be the one who gets caught up in a storm of trouble .

If Geelong were unreasonable? as in asking a contracted player to fulfil his contract? Its not like we want to trade him out.

Trading fairly is in the eye of the beholder.. and absorbing a bit of pain is far easier when you have just won the flag.

So if Geelong "being unreasonable" a deal does not get done and you go back to kelly and say ..
Sorry Tim we we werent prepared to pay enough to get the deal done.
And he says.. so basically you have let me down ... again.

 

[Ratcat]

I reckon somehow we get him back west and get well compensated for the time and development we've invested.
Rather him go.

 

[foodles05]

Disagree i think 20 and 21 is extremely fair - in fact i think its overs

Kellys no world beater - 40 metres is about his kicking distance

If i was either of the WA clubs - i would be extremely interested in Rory Lobb - he is a very good - strong 1 grab overhead mark - Where as Hogan - he has been inconsistent all through his career ( Weideman came in and was as good as him

Freo end up with McCarthy and Hogan hey - their supporters will be jumping off that Freo bridge - into the blue yonder below

Yes I was worried with your first comment about Kelly and then you removed all doubt but somehow describing Lobb as superior to Hogan. No one in their right mind at any football club would take Lobb over Hogan. There is just no chance. It can't even be argued as an opinion because it is so far off the mark

 

[Stocks_go_Up]

Hogan is a spud.

 

[BlakeyNoFlakey]

It just has an inevitability to Kelly going now. Shame, players like him aren't common, and the Eagles are getting a future elite midfielder cheaply if they snare him now.

 

[Reg Hickey]

But his ceiling is that of a mid aged B grade player.

What we would expect from him is what Redden finally delivered second half of this year when fit and firing. Guess what we traded for Redden?

Nup. He's already exceeded that in his first year.

 

[frenchconnection]

Well you would be wrong and Geelong shouldn't accept that. It is definitely unders!!

He's no Dustin Martin or Dangerfieldhough so you can't ask for too much I wouldn't think?

 

[Wellsy35]

He's no Dustin Martin or Dangerfieldhough so you can't ask for too much I wouldn't think?

He’s also not your average role player - averaged 23 disposals, 368 metres gained, kicked 24 goals (equal 3rd with Danger) and averaged over 6 score involvements a game and 3.5 tackles. Will likely poll very highly in our B&F and would have easily won the Rising Star if he was eligible.

Besides, it’s not up to us to ask - it’s for you to satisfy what we want for a contracted player. 20 and 21 is unders for a ready-made Gaff replacement who outperformed him on everything bar disposals and metres gained.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Hogan is a spud.

You're kidding right?

3/4 seasons over 40 goals. The other was only 10 games and was on track to achieve that again.
3/4 seasons at 2.00 goals per game or more.

He'd comfortably be our 2nd best forward and will be a good pickup for Fremantle.

 

[Hinkley29]

But his ceiling is that of a mid aged B grade player.

What we would expect from him is what Redden finally delivered second half of this year when fit and firing. Guess what we traded for Redden?

The difference is that Kelly has already proven what he can do, with upside for better. Redden at time of trade had flamed out at Brisbane and was an afterthought of a trade. What Redden fetched at trade is of no relevance to the Kelly situation, why make yourself look stupid by even bringing Redden into the conversation?

If you are saying that Kelly’s ceiling is that of a B grade midfielder even though he has already shown better than that, then you just outed yourself as either somewhat clueless or a poor troll.

 

[Overhang]

But his ceiling is that of a mid aged B grade player.

What we would expect from him is what Redden finally delivered second half of this year when fit and firing. Guess what we traded for Redden?

You traded pick 17 for Redden, he gave the Lions 6 years and was 1 year from becoming a restricted free agent at the time, worth noting the Lions had acquired him with pick 25 so it was quite an upgrade after getting 6 years service out of him. Geelong on the other hand have had 1 year out of Kelly, we didn't win a flag so losing him after 1 year is quite costly when it means he kept a kid out of the side for 1 year, that's 1 year we don't get back.

 

[Tristan34]

Say worse case scenario we get a late R1 pick for Kelly.. We could use pick 11 and the compensation pick to try and improve our draft position by trading with a willing club.