List Mgmt. Trade & Free Agency talk Pt 7

[Lore]

Hello Tiger fans!

The embedded resources below are kept up to date by the trade board mods (as much as possible – we are human after all). Enjoy!

Spoiler: 2023 Draft Order

Spoiler: 2024 Draft Order, aka Future Picks

Spoiler: Blue Tick Rumours

tugga you may like to sticky or merge this post, move it to the start of the thread (so the sticky post doesn't rotate if a post is deleted before it), or copy it to your draft thread.

 

[tiger_tough]

Although nominally a key forward, he is playing a lot different role to Riewoldt and Miller. Van Rooyen is basically playing as a receiver. Our guys are trying to do all the heavy lifting.

Wtf is a receiver? He played as a legit key position forward on both Balta and Young at times and beat them both.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

Wtf is a receiver? He played as a legit key position forward on both Balta and Young at times and beat them both.

Lol, he won one contest for the match. Demons had 30 scores his 4 goals were the only involvements he had. One was a dead set Joe the goose. Nothing wrong with what he is doing for a second year player, but he is not having any sort of impact that would help us. How many contests did Young win against him? Or Balta? or didn't you notice?

 

[NZ_Tiger]

Lol, he won one contest for the match. Demons had 30 scores his 4 goals were the only involvements he had. One was a dead set Joe the goose. Nothing wrong with what he is doing for a second year player, but he is not having any sort of impact that would help us. How many contests did Young win against him? Or Balta? or didn't you notice?

Balta out marked petty plenty of times but he also got 6 kicked on him.

4 goals from Van Rooyen was an excellent game regardless of losing a few contests. He had the last laugh.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[tiger_tough]

Lol, he won one contest for the match. Demons had 30 scores his 4 goals were the only involvements he had. One was a dead set Joe the goose. Nothing wrong with what he is doing for a second year player, but he is not having any sort of impact that would help us. How many contests did Young win against him? Or Balta? or didn't you notice?

I noticed the dees 2 key forwards kicked 10 between them and ours kicked 1.

Balta is great at intercepting but pretty poor one on one.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

I noticed the dees 2 key forwards kicked 10 between them and ours kicked 1.

Balta is great at intercepting but pretty poor one on one.

Balta had a poor start and for some reason he couldn't defend aerial balls today with his usual effectiveness. He is one of the leading contested marks in the competition this season so he is definitely not poor one on one. The Dees just seemed to have him figured out today, and probably got the drop of the ball just right as well.

Petty was enormous and played the exact sort of game we would benefit from up forward. But Van Rooyen would not be our answer at this stage.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

Balta out marked petty plenty of times but he also got 6 kicked on him.

4 goals from Van Rooyen was an excellent game regardless of losing a few contests. He had the last laugh.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I guess it is whatever impresses you, and not for me to tell you how to rate his game. But 1 contest win and 4 score involvements out of 70+ inside 50's and 30 scores is not a performance that will gain any great acclaim. Couple of nice conversions and a Joe the Goose and one nice grab. He would have struggled to get 3 disposals in our forward line.

 

[tigerfan1961]

I guess it is whatever impresses you, and not for me to tell you how to rate his game. But 1 contest win and 4 score involvements out of 70+ inside 50's and 30 scores is not a performance that will gain any great acclaim. Couple of nice conversions and a Joe the Goose and one nice grab. He would have struggled to get 3 disposals in our forward line.

I’m overseas so havent seen the game so this is just from looking at the stats. But 7 touches when it goes in there 73 times? That’s piss poor and he had one, yes one, contested possession. I’m not at all concerned we overlooked him in favour of Brown. If Jack played for them today, he’d have done a hell of a lot more damage than JVR imo

 

[tora tora tora]

That Van Rooyen kid would be handy....

Say hello to brother Sam

 

[tora tora tora]

Balta had a poor start and for some reason he couldn't defend aerial balls today with his usual effectiveness. He is one of the leading contested marks in the competition this season so he is definitely not poor one on one. The Dees just seemed to have him figured out today, and probably got the drop of the ball just right as well.

Petty was enormous and played the exact sort of game we would benefit from up forward. But Van Rooyen would not be our answer at this stage.

Our drafting is weird. Saved by free agency.

Had JVR been on our list, he would've had lots of opportunities to play AFL this year at Richmond. We lost Chol and CCJ with Ryan, Miller & Bigoa as depth, but strangely drafted Gibcus and 4 dwarves. Why not JVR and 3 dwarves? Miller's not a KPF. Lynch gets injured and Jack R struggling, we would possibly had a cheap replacement for Jack R in house and not been royally f@@d at the end of this season.

Brought in Tarrant, Young KPDs

Bauer looks OK but then would not have needed Bradkte.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

Our drafting is weird. Saved by free agency.

Had JVR been on our list, he would've had lots of opportunities to play AFL this year at Richmond. We lost Chol and CCJ with Ryan, Miller & Bigoa as depth, but strangely drafted Gibcus and 4 dwarves. Why not JVR and 3 dwarves? Miller's not a KPF. Lynch gets injured and Jack R struggling, we would possibly had a cheap replacement for Jack R in house and not been royally f@@d at the end of this season.

Brought in Tarrant, Young KPDs

Bauer looks OK but then would not have needed Bradkte.

Maybe let's have a look at the last 10 years Key Forwards - or anyone who may have looked a chance to play tall forward - drafted between say 9(where we took Gibcus in 2021) and 30. This may give us a more clear picture of what the recruiters are looking at.

2012

10 Joe Daniher
12 Kristian Jaksch
23 Marco Paparone
25 Spencer White
27 James Stewart
28 Tim O'Brien
30 Mason Shaw

2013

Pick
13 Cam McCarthy
17 Michael Apeness(200cm ruck/KPF)
25 Daniel McStay
29 Rory Lobb

2014

17 Kyle Langford
20 Jayden Laverde 193cm
21 Hugh Goddard


2015

9 Sam Weideman
10 Harold McKay
12 Charlie Curnow
14 Eric Hipwood
16 Harrison Himmelberg
19 Ryan Burton - kicked 5 for SA v WA u/18
21 Ben Mckay


2016

16 Todd Marshall



2017

9 Aaron Naughton
12 Darcy Fogarty
13 Jarrod Brander
20 Callum Coleman-Jones
21 Oscar Allen
25 Noah Balta
30 Tom DeKoning


2018

10 Nick Blakey
17 Sam Sturt(189cm 3rd tall)
29 Will Kelly


2019

18 Mitch Georgiades
19 Sam DeKoning
30 Harrison Jones


2020

17 Oliver Henry
23 Reef McInness
25 Brayden Cook(191cm 3rd tall)
26 Matthew McLeod Allison


2021

9 Josh Gibcus
19 Jacob Van Rooyen
22 Max Gruzewski
unsure of others but no impact.


So 10 years of tall forwards there who were drafted in the 9-30 range.

42 of them.

Played key forward in a Premiership: zero(0)

Played key forward in a Grand Final: Harrison Himmelberg(1)

Played regular key forward as a best 22 player consistently when fit: Daniher, McStay, Lobb, McKay, Curnow, Hipwood, Himmelberg, Marshall, Naughton, Fogarty, Allen(11)

Played regular key forward in a top 4 team: Daniher, McStay, Hipwood, Lobb, Himmelberg, Naughton, Marshall(7)

Been reliably and consistently high quality in their first 6 seasons on an AFL list: Naughton(1)

Seen as high quality Key Forwards now: Naughton, Daniher, McKay, Curnow, Allen(5)

Taken at pick 17(where we needed to take Van Rooyen)or below and seen as a high quality key forward: Allen(1)

Taken at pick 17 or below and seen as likely to be an above average key forward: Allen, Van Rooyen?(1 or 2)


Tall forwards in Premiership teams last 10 years and how acquired:

2013 - Gunston(trade) Franklin Roughead(top 5 picks)
2014 - Gunston, Roughead & Hale(trade)
2015 - Gunston, Roughead & Hale
2016 - Boyd(trade) Cordy(f/s, makeshift key forward) Stringer(pick 5)
2017 - Jack(pick 13) Townsend(trade, makeshift tall forward) Caddy(trade, makeshift tall forward)
2018 - Kennedy(trade) Darling(pick 26) Vardy(trade)
2019 - Lynch(free agent) Jack
2020 - Lynch, Jack
2021 - Brown(trade) McDonald(pick 53) Fritsch(mature draft pick 31) Jackson(pick 3)
2022 - Hawkins(f/s) Cameron(FA/trade) Rohan(trade)

Premiership KPF's last 10 years drafted 9-30 range by their Premiership club: Riewoldt, Darling(2)

Premiership tall forwards drafted by their club from pick 17 onwards in the draft and available to all clubs: Darling, McDonald, Fritsch(3)


That would be something like the picture our recruiters would be looking at, as well as their own struggles to land competitive key forwards from the draft and not to mention the fact they probably didn't rate Van Rooyen over Brown. I think they have just concluded that drafting KPF's in that type of range and developing them patiently over a number of years is a losing game. Especially when you look at the rogue's gallery of tall forwards teams have won flags with in the past 10 years. If they really rated Van Rooyen, maybe only then they take him.

 

[tora tora tora]

Maybe let's have a look at the last 10 years Key Forwards - or anyone who may have looked a chance to play tall forward - drafted between say 9(where we took Gibcus in 2021) and 30. This may give us a more clear picture of what the recruiters are looking at.

2012

10 Joe Daniher
12 Kristian Jaksch
23 Marco Paparone
25 Spencer White
27 James Stewart
28 Tim O'Brien
30 Mason Shaw

2013

Pick
13 Cam McCarthy
17 Michael Apeness(200cm ruck/KPF)
25 Daniel McStay
29 Rory Lobb

2014

17 Kyle Langford
20 Jayden Laverde 193cm
21 Hugh Goddard


2015

9 Sam Weideman
10 Harold McKay
12 Charlie Curnow
14 Eric Hipwood
16 Harrison Himmelberg
19 Ryan Burton - kicked 5 for SA v WA u/18
21 Ben Mckay


2016

16 Todd Marshall



2017

9 Aaron Naughton
12 Darcy Fogarty
13 Jarrod Brander
20 Callum Coleman-Jones
21 Oscar Allen
25 Noah Balta
30 Tom DeKoning


2018

10 Nick Blakey
17 Sam Sturt(189cm 3rd tall)
29 Will Kelly


2019

18 Mitch Georgiades
19 Sam DeKoning
30 Harrison Jones


2020

17 Oliver Henry
23 Reef McInness
25 Brayden Cook(191cm 3rd tall)
26 Matthew McLeod Allison


2021

9 Josh Gibcus
19 Jacob Van Rooyen
22 Max Gruzewski
unsure of others but no impact.


So 10 years of tall forwards there who were drafted in the 9-30 range.

42 of them.

Played key forward in a Premiership: zero(0)

Played key forward in a Grand Final: Harrison Himmelberg(1)

Played regular key forward as a best 22 player consistently when fit: Daniher, McStay, Lobb, McKay, Curnow, Hipwood, Himmelberg, Marshall, Naughton, Fogarty, Allen(11)

Played regular key forward in a top 4 team: Daniher, McStay, Hipwood, Lobb, Himmelberg, Naughton, Marshall(7)

Been reliably and consistently high quality in their first 6 seasons on an AFL list: Naughton(1)

Seen as high quality Key Forwards now: Naughton, Daniher, McKay, Curnow, Allen(5)

Taken at pick 17(where we needed to take Van Rooyen)or below and seen as a high quality key forward: Allen(1)

Taken at pick 17 or below and seen as likely to be an above average key forward: Allen, Van Rooyen?(1 or 2)


Tall forwards in Premiership teams last 10 years and how acquired:

2013 - Gunston(trade) Franklin Roughead(top 5 picks)
2014 - Gunston, Roughead & Hale(trade)
2015 - Gunston, Roughead & Hale
2016 - Boyd(trade) Cordy(f/s, makeshift key forward) Stringer(pick 5)
2017 - Jack(pick 13) Townsend(trade, makeshift tall forward) Caddy(trade, makeshift tall forward)
2018 - Kennedy(trade) Darling(pick 26) Vardy(trade)
2019 - Lynch(free agent) Jack
2020 - Lynch, Jack
2021 - Brown(trade) McDonald(pick 53) Fritsch(mature draft pick 31) Jackson(pick 3)
2022 - Hawkins(f/s) Cameron(FA/trade) Rohan(trade)

Premiership KPF's last 10 years drafted 9-30 range by their Premiership club: Riewoldt, Darling(2)

Premiership tall forwards drafted by their club from pick 17 onwards in the draft and available to all clubs: Darling, McDonald, Fritsch(3)


That would be something like the picture our recruiters would be looking at, as well as their own struggles to land competitive key forwards from the draft and not to mention the fact they probably didn't rate Van Rooyen over Brown. I think they have just concluded that drafting KPF's in that type of range and developing them patiently over a number of years is a losing game. Especially when you look at the rogue's gallery of tall forwards teams have won flags with in the past 10 years. If they really rated Van Rooyen, maybe only then they take him.

I see your response
and raise you a Heisenberg uncertainty

In seriousness
That would be something like the picture our recruiters would be looking at, as well as their own struggles to land competitive key forwards from the draft and not to mention the fact they probably didn't rate Van Rooyen over Brown. I think they have just concluded that drafting KPF's in that type of range and developing them patiently over a number of years is a losing game. Especially when you look at the rogue's gallery of tall forwards teams have won flags with in the past 10 years. If they really rated Van Rooyen, maybe only then they take him.

Our flag window was closed in 2021 IMO, when we took Gibcus. TT & JH a good idea that hasn't worked in 2023.

KPPs: Jack R. 32 y.o. when we took Brown over JVR.
Griffiths ~ concussion prone; Chol got a lot of games ~ didn't seem to like rucking, CCJ just started showing a bit. ( well enough to get a offer from North)

Tarrant, Gibcus no worries, straight in but misses the following year. Miller first game late 21. Been chucked fwd, better as a defender. Sampson debacle of a debut and has shown a lot this year, maybe slightly undersize.

I think we draft too skinny types. I've thought of BB mids that are playing sooner than our picks. Dow and RCD never bulked up Ward & Hobbs are going well.

JVR is solid enough Bauer is 7kgs lighter and had to play in the backline in the VFL.

 

[panatha1908]

But how do we get the suns 1st this year?

I don't see how we get sun's first when they need pics. Only thing they will do is trade their first pick for way more points (2 or 3 picks), which is really for a club looking to bring in one high quality young player. We are kn the other side and need multiple quality players, and we are starting from the second round. I think all we can do is trade out depth players like Hrs and solo, which just gives us a chance for a younger replacement. Whichever way you look at it it's a tough year, unless we bring in free agents and/or take a salary dump.

 

[Rioli2Rioli]

Say hello to brother Sam

The better brother

 

[beema limapep]

I'm not against us bringing in Jack Silvagni. He's a hard worker....

The Jason Cloke of the 2020's? It's a hard no from me.

 

[Bojangles17]

Cannot believe Silvagni is being discussed here for $400k+ a year but apparently Himmelberg is not worth $700k

I reckon HH command more than 700 in fact I think he’s already on that ,,,he’s had a bloody good year won’t sign for less than 800 ,,,if he was younger I’d be all over it , I worry long term deal at his age ,,,he’s a good player , make no mistake

 

[Bojangles17]

I noticed the dees 2 key forwards kicked 10 between them and ours kicked 1.

Balta is great at intercepting but pretty poor one on one.

He’s normally much better than that , so is young , our defenders didn’t get near a lot of those incoming , completely misread it , much of their marks were uncontested and high balls too not leads , was a ****img disaster

 

[tiger_tough]

He’s normally much better than that , so is young , our defenders didn’t get near a lot of those incoming , completely misread it , much of their marks were uncontested and high balls too not leads , was a *img disaster

Yeah. Dees midfield got tooany clean exits from centre bounce too. Can't afford that against the dogs or our season is done.

 

[Bojangles17]

Yeah. Dees midfield got tooany clean exits from centre bounce too. Can't afford that against the dogs or our season is done.

We got our share in first 3q shai scooting away , were level in clearances 3/4 time , flogged 4q

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

I reckon HH command more than 700 in fact I think he’s already on that ,,,he’s had a bloody good year won’t sign for less than 800 ,,,if he was younger I’d be all over it , I worry long term deal at his age ,,,he’s a good player , make no mistake

1 good year out of 10(albeit in his ooc year).
28yrs old yeah let's sign him for 700k plus per yr.

 

[Rioli2Rioli]

I reckon HH command more than 700 in fact I think he’s already on that ,,,he’s had a bloody good year won’t sign for less than 800 ,,,if he was younger I’d be all over it , I worry long term deal at his age ,,,he’s a good player , make no mistake

I agree with what you have posted but think he is good for another 5 years and would have no issue with a 5 year deal

Few months ago before Dimma pulled the pin a posted i would be happy to take him on around $750k and was told in no uncertain terms he was only worth $600k and same as McStay and not worth anymore. we shall see

Personally i think he now stays at GWS

 

[sante]

Van Rooyen will be a star. Disappointing that we didn’t select him

 

[The Mighty]

How about Oscar Allen

12

Oscar Allen

Age

25

Ht

196cm

Wt

96kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

9.8

2star

K

6.6

3star

HB

3.2

3star

M

3.8

4star

T

2.4

4star

G

1.1

4star

No current season stats available

D

8.6

3star

K

5.8

3star

HB

2.8

3star

M

3.8

4star

T

2.0

4star

G

1.2

4star

can we get that campaigner over here.

 

[Rioli2Rioli]

How about Oscar Allen can we get that campaigner over here.

No Chance

WA boy
Eagles supporter
Will be on $1 mil a year with all their older players retiring

He is not going anywhere

 

[tiger_tough]

Paddy Dow

15

Paddy Dow

Age

25

Ht

184cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.1

4star

K

7.0

3star

HB

7.1

4star

M

2.1

2star

T

2.9

4star

CL

2.6

4star

D

7.0

1star

K

4.0

1star

HB

3.0

2star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.0

3star

CL

0.0

1star

D

12.4

4star

K

5.8

3star

HB

6.6

4star

M

1.6

2star

T

2.8

5star

CL

2.6

5star

attended 6 centre bounces V pies and won 3 centre clearances plus 2 stoppage clearances in 40 minutes game time. I know it's fun to say he's shit but he'd add something different to our midfield mix with his burst from stoppage and he'd cost nothing.

Our midfield depth is horrendous but it'd also mean we'd have to keep Thomson on the list....

 

[fargothegreat]

Paddy Dow attended 6 centre bounces V pies and won 3 centre clearances plus 2 stoppage clearances in 40 minutes game time. I know it's fun to say he's s**t but he'd add something different to our midfield mix with his burst from stoppage and he'd cost nothing.

Our midfield depth is horrendous but it'd also mean we'd have to keep Thomson on the list....

He had 12 touches going at 42% DE. Has the exact same issue as his brother.

The two of them should go into business together selling meat.