Mega Thread VICBias - Genuine Discussion

[AstonSouffle]

Surprised the revenue chat without gambling profits didn't get brought up in this thread, general gist of it is that the WA clubs are too rich already, and bigger than all the Vic clubs bar Collingwood so they're effectively cash cows.

Wider chat has to be whether some Victorian clubs are actually ready for a soft cap increase i.e Bulldogs or Saints, not whether there's VicBias or not.

Is still arses me off though that precisely because Freo who have been wallop on the field forever will most certainly never get financial assistance due to getting off field right, yet also North who aren't doing too bad off the field still got assistance... it's not VicBias but I can't help but think that no one gives a damn if Freo wins or not despite what they contribute to the AFL. Is that VicBias or just bad admin? Probably the latter, would be nice if fans didn't think everything outside of Victoria was mud however.

 

[Freomaniac]

Who gives a stuff?

Work it out? What's to work out? If you have Ninety eleven billion people in WA it doesn't matter didly sh*t if no one is going to support the club.

You really think wc and freo fans are gonna jump ship? You reckon all those wafl fans don't follow freo or wc now? Yeah nah, you're dreamin.

your team has existed since 1892. How many people lived in Victoria back then?

I think all non vic sides should exist for 100 seasons at a bare minimum

 

[Freomaniac]

The AFL refuses to Fixture ALL 11 of Melbourne's HOME games at the MCG.

It is AFL policy that ensures Melbourne lose their home ground advantage.

Melbourne's choice is to then make some $$ instead of losing $$.

It is pretty clear Melbourne is disadvantaged by not getting a home ground advantage game.


Yes, it is not Freo who are disadvantaged.

Land rights mate, Land rights.

 

[Freomaniac]

Have been over that back in the thread.

The council wanted us out, they didnt approve upgrade proposals to the stadium.

The AFL also wanted to ensure we play games at their new Docklands venue.

The AFL forced us out in the 1990s.

You are not Brainwashed by the Victorian Media that North Melbourne saved the AFL from being broke by getting 8,000 people at docklands?

 

[Engimal v3]

Is still arses me off though that precisely because Freo who have been wallop on the field forever will most certainly never get financial assistance due to getting off field right, yet also North who aren't doing too bad off the field still got assistance... it's not VicBias but I can't help but think that no one gives a damn if Freo wins or not despite what they contribute to the AFL. Is that VicBias or just bad admin? Probably the latter, would be nice if fans didn't think everything outside of Victoria was mud however.

What assistance are you referring to? Fremantle receive AFL distribution, as do North Melbourne and all AFL clubs.

 

[AstonSouffle]

What assistance are you referring to? Fremantle receive AFL distribution, as do North Melbourne and all AFL clubs.

West Coast and Freo do, but due to their wealth receive on the lower end of the scale.

Reality is, the richer you are the less likely you are to get priority picks and onfield assistance. The two shouldn't be linked, but seemingly they are.

Why is it that West Coast haven't already received a priority pick?

 

[Elixuh]

Freo and Melbourne play twice in 2024.

1st game is in NT, no advantage to either team

2nd game is in WA, at Freo's home ground Optus Stadium. Where Freo will enjoy a full home ground advantage.

Advantage Freo.

I love in these arguments that you pretend these vfl clubs haven’t voluntarily sold games, which in itself says they’re so comfortable with the advantages they have that they can afford to do so and it not impact their season.

 

[jakson68]

West Coast and Freo do, but due to their wealth receive on the lower end of the scale.

Reality is, the richer you are the less likely you are to get priority picks and onfield assistance. The two shouldn't be linked, but seemingly they are.

Why is it that West Coast haven't already received a priority pick?

Because they won a premiership only 5 Grand Finals ago.
Then made list decisions that didn't go as hoped.

There are teams that haven't tasted success in decades and you expect the AFL to give priority picks to a team with recent success.

I look forward to the calls for Priority picks for Richmond next year.

 

[Jibroni]

Richmond dont travel also.

The reason nobody is able to give an answer as to what advantage Collingwood gets from playing Richmond at the G, is beacuse we dont get any advantage.

Tomorrow, Fremantle plays Melbourne in the NT and there is no disadvantage to either as both teams are travelling. But then later in the year Melbourne have to travel to Perth to play Freo who get to sit home wake up.in own bed, have coffee with misso and actually enjoy a proper home ground advantage game.

It is the Melbourne based team that is shafted.

We chose to sell the game as we cannot get enough supporters to attend our home games, that's not an issue for Fremantle as we essentially "asked" them to play in Alice.

Without the KB and Anzac games we would probably have to sell at least two home games per season; the end result of a saturated Melbourne market.

 

[Underarm]

West Coast and Freo do, but due to their wealth receive on the lower end of the scale.

Reality is, the richer you are the less likely you are to get priority picks and onfield assistance. The two shouldn't be linked, but seemingly they are.

Why is it that West Coast haven't already received a priority pick?

They were shit because they had injuries, and the AFL aren't stupid. No injuries this year and suddenly they're winning and are competitive.

Surprised the revenue chat without gambling profits didn't get brought up in this thread, general gist of it is that the WA clubs are too rich already, and bigger than all the Vic clubs bar Collingwood so they're effectively cash cows.

Wider chat has to be whether some Victorian clubs are actually ready for a soft cap increase i.e Bulldogs or Saints, not whether there's VicBias or not.

Is still arses me off though that precisely because Freo who have been wallop on the field forever will most certainly never get financial assistance due to getting off field right, yet also North who aren't doing too bad off the field still got assistance... it's not VicBias but I can't help but think that no one gives a damn if Freo wins or not despite what they contribute to the AFL. Is that VicBias or just bad admin? Probably the latter, would be nice if fans didn't think everything outside of Victoria was mud however.

This has alot to do with West Coasts grip in WA and on 'the West'. If everyone important in Perth thinks of Fremantle as an afterthought, can you blame the Vics for just following the trend?

 

[littlecreatures]

West Coast and Freo do, but due to their wealth receive on the lower end of the scale.

Reality is, the richer you are the less likely you are to get priority picks and onfield assistance. The two shouldn't be linked, but seemingly they are.

Why is it that West Coast haven't already received a priority pick?

There is absolutely no reason why WCE should be talking about assistance. This was the most profitable sports side in all of Australia just a few years ago, god forbid you want to even try get a reserved seat at their games. They have more than enough resources to get themselves out, only have themselves to blame regarding their list management.

I’m not sure what assistance you’re referring to. I support Saints and we haven’t had a priority pick since these rules were changed and were lucky to grab Windy and Mitchito at 47 and 33 respectively before academy rules were changed further as a result of Jamara UH.

In terms of financial assistance, be careful what you wish for, however the reality is if Freo can’t be self sustainable as a 2 team state, that’s quite alarming in itself.

Saints receive an AFL subsidy as a result of Marvel, which is an absolute nightmare, and we continue to go back to the AFL to get away from this subsidized arrangement with most recently just asking for 2-4 games at the MCG each year. It’s not rocket science to figure out that it’s the same Melbourne clubs travelling each year and to the contrary, the same clubs not travelling so AFL can amp up revenue for the big 4-6 sides.

I’m all for equality, I just think we need to be careful not to paint all Melbourne sides with the same brush when we talk about competitive advantages.

 

[JackOutback]

They have more than enough resources to get themselves out

I don't think the Eagles should get priority picks now, but this simply isn't true. We had historically one of the worst seasons on record and our draft picks were 1 and 30 thanks to assistance being offered via academies and father-son selections to teams that finished above us. The draft is supposed to give you the opportunity to get yourself out of trouble but is now fundamentally compromised. Then there's the soft cap that means having money and resources equals diddily squat because we're not allowed to outspend the teams that can't afford it. Just saying West Coast are a rich club so don't need support ever is lazy analysis.

 

[Farang83150]

There is absolutely no reason why WCE should be talking about assistance. This was the most profitable sports side in all of Australia just a few years ago, god forbid you want to even try get a reserved seat at their games. They have more than enough resources to get themselves out, only have themselves to blame regarding their list management.

I’m not sure what assistance you’re referring to. I support Saints and we haven’t had a priority pick since these rules were changed and were lucky to grab Windy and Mitchito at 47 and 33 respectively before academy rules were changed further as a result of Jamara UH.

In terms of financial assistance, be careful what you wish for, however the reality is if Freo can’t be self sustainable as a 2 team state, that’s quite alarming in itself.

Saints receive an AFL subsidy as a result of Marvel, which is an absolute nightmare, and we continue to go back to the AFL to get away from this subsidized arrangement with most recently just asking for 2-4 games at the MCG each year. It’s not rocket science to figure out that it’s the same Melbourne clubs travelling each year and to the contrary, the same clubs not travelling so AFL can amp up revenue for the big 4-6 sides.

I’m all for equality, I just think we need to be careful not to paint all Melbourne sides with the same brush when we talk about competitive advantages.

So you start with...."There is absolutely no reason why WCE should be talking about assistance"

Then go on with....I’m not sure what assistance you’re referring to.

 

[Carringbush2010]

your team has existed since 1892. How many people lived in Victoria back then?

I think all non vic sides should exist for 100 seasons at a bare minimum

What has this got to do with anything?

 

[AstonSouffle]

There is absolutely no reason why WCE should be talking about assistance. This was the most profitable sports side in all of Australia just a few years ago, god forbid you want to even try get a reserved seat at their games. They have more than enough resources to get themselves out, only have themselves to blame regarding their list management.

I’m not sure what assistance you’re referring to. I support Saints and we haven’t had a priority pick since these rules were changed and were lucky to grab Windy and Mitchito at 47 and 33 respectively before academy rules were changed further as a result of Jamara UH.

In terms of financial assistance, be careful what you wish for, however the reality is if Freo can’t be self sustainable as a 2 team state, that’s quite alarming in itself.

Saints receive an AFL subsidy as a result of Marvel, which is an absolute nightmare, and we continue to go back to the AFL to get away from this subsidized arrangement with most recently just asking for 2-4 games at the MCG each year. It’s not rocket science to figure out that it’s the same Melbourne clubs travelling each year and to the contrary, the same clubs not travelling so AFL can amp up revenue for the big 4-6 sides.

I’m all for equality, I just think we need to be careful not to paint all Melbourne sides with the same brush when we talk about competitive advantages.

Nah in short what I'm saying is that assistance for on field performance has to be to that criteria, just because they're sensational off the field (and Freo is btw - third across all sporting entities in Australia if you don't include pokies revenue).

If anything it's a swift kick in stick that the poor teams get rewarded with priority picks, and naturally whether they're at risk of falling apart off the field if continued poor performances happen is factored in. I'm saying it shouldn't be.

Freo clearly get it right off the field, but also haven't made finals - at what point is that even worth it if fellow cellar dwellers who aren't as wealthy will get a super team of draft picks handed to them and they'll likely slingshot past them?

 

[dont bowl there]

I don't think the Eagles should get priority picks now, but this simply isn't true. We had historically one of the worst seasons on record and our draft picks were 1 and 30 thanks to assistance being offered via academies and father-son selections to teams that finished above us. The draft is supposed to give you the opportunity to get yourself out of trouble but is now fundamentally compromised. Then there's the soft cap that means having money and resources equals diddily squat because we're not allowed to outspend the teams that can't afford it. Just saying West Coast are a rich club so don't need support ever is lazy analysis.

It's a soft cap, just go over and spend more than the poor clubs. Not the AFLs fault West Coast would rather have 80mill in the bank than use it on extra resources.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

It's a soft cap, just go over and spend more than the poor clubs. Not the AFLs fault West Coast would rather have 80mill in the bank than use it on extra resources.

I agree, the Eagles could spend an extra million and just pay the tax. It would be a big FU to AFL house.
Ash tray money

 

[dont bowl there]

I agree, the Eagles could spend an extra million and just pay the tax. It would be a big FU to AFL house.
Ash tray money

No idea why the big clubs aren't just smashing the soft cap.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

No idea why the big clubs aren't just smashing the soft cap.

They would rather look good and be seen as responsible with their money than doing what they are there for which is to win footy matches.
Football clubs only have one job! If you have the money then spend it.

 

[doppleganger]

I love in these arguments that you pretend these vfl clubs haven’t voluntarily sold games, which in itself says they’re so comfortable with the advantages they have that they can afford to do so and it not impact their season.

I love that the non-vic wowsers are too daft to understand that their are competing priorities with the fixture - the commercial and the onfield.

AFL house policy forces Melbourne away from the G, they already have lost the onfield home ground advantage.

Melbourne then make a commercial decision, do they lose $$ at Docklands or make $$ by travelling.

As with most decisions, the commercial and $$ wins out.

But it means they lose an on-field advantage, and their opponent sees a disadvantage also be removed.

It is why the H&A ladder is dominated by teams that retain a strongest home ground advantage.

 

[AstonSouffle]

They were shit because they had injuries, and the AFL aren't stupid. No injuries this year and suddenly they're winning and are competitive.

This has alot to do with West Coasts grip in WA and on 'the West'. If everyone important in Perth thinks of Fremantle as an afterthought, can you blame the Vics for just following the trend?

Probably and I can understand that but riddle me how a team that's third for revenue before pokies comes into account across all Australian sporting organisations, is somehow viewed the same as Gold Coast over there. End of the day, it's on Freo to start winning and that will change that. We shall see, things change fast - wasn't that long ago everyone frothed Hawthorn, now they don't. Everyone frothed Richmond, now they don't. Is what it is really.

But perhaps my main gripe is that when it gets down to it, West Coast found themselves in the exact same position as North and were treated completely differently - wealth shouldn't come into it, the competition uses the money from wealthy clubs and distributes it around - that's the model they want to use to help the clubs in need... well West Coast was a club in need. It's not VicBias, it's the AFL focuses on what could or couldn't lose them money and currently the WA teams absolutely will never lose them money - so therefore they aren't a focus.

 

[littlecreatures]

So you start with...."There is absolutely no reason why WCE should be talking about assistance"

Then go on with....I’m not sure what assistance you’re referring to.

Assistance is a broad term, wasn’t exactly specified whether it was financial or draft related.

 

[littlecreatures]

Nah in short what I'm saying is that assistance for on field performance has to be to that criteria, just because they're sensational off the field (and Freo is btw - third across all sporting entities in Australia if you don't include pokies revenue).

If anything it's a swift kick in stick that the poor teams get rewarded with priority picks, and naturally whether they're at risk of falling apart off the field if continued poor performances happen is factored in. I'm saying it shouldn't be.

Freo clearly get it right off the field, but also haven't made finals - at what point is that even worth it if fellow cellar dwellers who aren't as wealthy will get a super team of draft picks handed to them and they'll likely slingshot past them?

So, by poor teams are you referring to North? I think we need to be mindful there’s still a variety of teams who have consistently finished mid to low table and are yet to receive draft assistance. Fremantle aren’t alone unfortunately. I just think the AFL picks and chooses who it goes to.

 

[AstonSouffle]

So, by poor teams are you referring to North? I think we need to be mindful there’s still a variety of teams who have consistently finished mid to low table and are yet to receive draft assistance. Fremantle aren’t alone unfortunately. I just think the AFL picks and chooses who it goes to.

It's all relative though, yeah I could say Lions, Saints, North, Bulldogs, Suns, Giants because that is the order of the bottom six... but strictly speaking they aren't poor, it's that the rest are just that more wealthy. None of them are at risk of folding that's for sure - which underlines and reinforces my ultimate point, why do some of those clubs get help with on field assistance when the off-field risk is low? But others do not?

Then again I say all these things and then logically I'm asking for Carlton and Freo to get assistance who are 4th and 3rd for revenue respectively, which probably doesn't sound right. Actually think I've talked myself out why I'm slightly miffed and now no longer care lol

New rule - if you want to be talked about, get good it can happen.

 

[littlecreatures]

It's all relative though, yeah I could say Lions, Saints, North, Bulldogs, Suns, Giants because that is the order of the bottom six... but strictly speaking they aren't poor, it's that the rest are just that more wealthy. None of them are at risk of folding that's for sure - which underlines and reinforces my ultimate point, why do some of those clubs get help with on field assistance when the off-field risk is low? But others do not?

Then again I say all these things and then logically I'm asking for Carlton and Freo to get assistance who are 4th and 3rd for revenue respectively, which probably doesn't sound right. Actually think I've talked myself out why I'm slightly miffed and now no longer care lol

New rule - if you want to be talked about, get good it can happen.

But, several of those teams you’ve just mentioned haven’t received draft assistance if that’s the assistance you’re referring to, so I’m not quite sure what the point being made is then.