Opinion We're On The Right Path

[Stigmata]

7 of our best 22 out we can't make finals but by round 14 we will be playing decent football

 

[Tomnat Tigers]

Right path?

Our game plan is shit and is never going to be successful. It's stunting the development of some players and making others go backwards at a rate of knots.

Were developing the wrong players. Lennon should already have 40+ games under his belt, rather he has 18 most of which were as sub, Todd Elton and Liam McBean should of had more opportunities so far and have been giving a run of games to give them a chance to adapt to the pace and bigger bodies at AFL level. Townsend also should be playing every game until we know for 100% certainty that he is or isn't going to make it. If all three turn out no good then fair enough but the only way you're going to find out is by giving them a big enough sample size.

I could go on and on but I really can't be ****ed given the shit we've seen so far this season.

 

[Jiska]

In the last 50 years, Richmond has averaged a new coach every 3 years. At some stage members need to stand up and admit that the coach isn't the problem. IMO the problem is much more deep seeded problem - it's a cultural thing.

At Melbourne, we had the same problem and we're only just starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel. A big part of getting there as the AFL forcing Peter Jackson to take over who wasn't beholden to the "inner boys club". Part of the deal with Roos was that he had complete and utter power to change whatever he wanted to change.

Stop blaming the coach; it's an easy scapegoat to dismiss the real issues - IMO.

 

[Colonel]

In the last 50 years, Richmond has averaged a new coach every 3 years. At some stage members need to stand up and admit that the coach isn't the problem. IMO the problem is much more deep seeded problem - it's a cultural thing.

At Melbourne, we had the same problem and we're only just starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel. A big part of getting there as the AFL forcing Peter Jackson to take over who wasn't beholden to the "inner boys club". Part of the deal with Roos was that he had complete and utter power to change whatever he wanted to change.

Stop blaming the coach; it's an easy scapegoat to dismiss the real issues - IMO.

Please enlighten us to the real issue? We have had 2 coaches in the last 12 years ffs.

 

[Brown Bottle]

I've defended Dimma for the last few years. It looks to me like he won't get the players back up again. I agree that we have turned to the kids and that isn't a bad thing of itself, rather than playing the recycled guys like Petterd and Hunt, but for some reason our kids never look like they're good enough to play at the level and at other clubs they do. Tonight was a perfect opportunity to stand up. No-one did.

Maybe our board does need another overhaul, but we've been pretty staunch in not sacking coaches for more than a decade and we're no better off.

 

[_Wang_]

In the last 50 years, Richmond has averaged a new coach every 3 years. At some stage members need to stand up and admit that the coach isn't the problem. IMO the problem is much more deep seeded problem - it's a cultural thing.

At Melbourne, we had the same problem and we're only just starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel. A big part of getting there as the AFL forcing Peter Jackson to take over who wasn't beholden to the "inner boys club". Part of the deal with Roos was that he had complete and utter power to change whatever he wanted to change.

Stop blaming the coach; it's an easy scapegoat to dismiss the real issues - IMO.

Pls

#eco

 

[_Wang_]

Dimmas coaching at the mo

 

["The Roar Is Back"]

In the last 50 years, Richmond has averaged a new coach every 3 years. At some stage members need to stand up and admit that the coach isn't the problem. IMO the problem is much more deep seeded problem - it's a cultural thing.

At Melbourne, we had the same problem and we're only just starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel. A big part of getting there as the AFL forcing Peter Jackson to take over who wasn't beholden to the "inner boys club". Part of the deal with Roos was that he had complete and utter power to change whatever he wanted to change.

Stop blaming the coach; it's an easy scapegoat to dismiss the real issues - IMO.

Can I ask if you have ever met Peter Jackson the person whom you appear to be provided way to much credit.

 

[Mr Magic]

In the last 50 years, Richmond has averaged a new coach every 3 years. At some stage members need to stand up and admit that the coach isn't the problem. IMO the problem is much more deep seeded problem - it's a cultural thing.

At Melbourne, we had the same problem and we're only just starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel. A big part of getting there as the AFL forcing Peter Jackson to take over who wasn't beholden to the "inner boys club". Part of the deal with Roos was that he had complete and utter power to change whatever he wanted to change.

Stop blaming the coach; it's an easy scapegoat to dismiss the real issues - IMO.

I agree.

Our problem is many in the club believe they think they can influence the performance on field off field. This is a total sank. Some seem to think they are entitled to success from some bullshit notion of history and a dumb notion they had a role in a lucky situation from the past!


They can't face the fact Graeme Richmond's recruiting won the premierships along with a fitness advantage for a while with Hafey.

That was it nothing more, no oh, this is nice coaching, oh, its culture. Its all bullshit.

Hawthorn won premierships based on zoning and the Saints lost them according for the same reason.

The biggest factor is pedigree of the player that is recruited, everything else is secondary, still important but secondary.

Hawthorn have always known good players ,make good coaches and A Jeans of John Kennedy Sr used to say as much!

 

[tgrs]

In the last 50 years, Richmond has averaged a new coach every 3 years. At some stage members need to stand up and admit that the coach isn't the problem. IMO the problem is much more deep seeded problem - it's a cultural thing.

At Melbourne, we had the same problem and we're only just starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel.

Where Melbourne are is seeing the light at the end of the tunnel? Seemed only a handful of hours ago I was watching some shemons sharply outplayed by the up and coming saints. Half a dozen teams began a rebuild after your club did and are advancing further in fewer years than Roo's management has been able to do.

I understand you're optimistic after your first back to back wins since 2011, most posters here are diehard tigs fans who watch the games every week, its ****ing plain to see the problem at this point in time at punt road is deeply rooted in the coaching staff and their game plan.

 

[_RT_]

Do you stand by your thoughts though? This club is in dire straights mate....

Yes I do and tonight as angry and as frustrated as I got at the game only reinforced my opinion. For if anything tonight stamped the papers of a number of experienced types who have in some cases given good service over the lat 3 years and in others haven't come on as expected. So the next step now, which Hardwick must 100% commit to is to embrace the kids and untried guys and see just who wants to be part of the future.

FWIW tonight I thought C.Ellis played his best game for the year 23 disposals 7 contested possessions 3 I50 5 R50 & 4 tackles. Castagna on debut was impressive at times with his attack on the ball and willingness to try and take the game on at stages. Menadue was quiet and might need a week or 2 to freshen up same with Rioli but I can't fault either in their willingness to work unlike a few senior blokes.

So I'm happy to have posters take their best shots it's happened before and it'll happen again.

 

[tigs2010]

In the last 50 years, Richmond has averaged a new coach every 3 years. At some stage members need to stand up and admit that the coach isn't the problem. IMO the problem is much more deep seeded problem - it's a cultural thing.

At Melbourne, we had the same problem and we're only just starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel. A big part of getting there as the AFL forcing Peter Jackson to take over who wasn't beholden to the "inner boys club". Part of the deal with Roos was that he had complete and utter power to change whatever he wanted to change.

Stop blaming the coach; it's an easy scapegoat to dismiss the real issues - IMO.

You just got pummelled by the Saints. Not sure we should play follow the leader with Melbourne.

 

[Tiger_4_Life]

Yes I do and tonight as angry and as frustrated as I got at the game only reinforced my opinion. For if anything tonight stamped the papers of a number of experienced types who have in some cases given good service over the lat 3 years and in others haven't come on as expected. So the next step now, which Hardwick must 100% commit to is to embrace the kids and untried guys and see just who wants to be part of the future.

FWIW tonight I thought C.Ellis played his best game for the year 23 disposals 7 contested possessions 3 I50 5 R50 & 4 tackles. Castagna on debut was impressive at times with his attack on the ball and willingness to try and take the game on at stages. Menadue was quiet and might need a week or 2 to freshen up same with Rioli but I can't fault either in their willingness to work unlike a few senior blokes.

So I'm happy to have posters take their best shots it's happened before and it'll happen again.

Mate I mean no disrespect, but where can I buy the same brightsidr glasses you have?

Agree on your points in regards to playing the youngsters and c Ellis looking OK

 

[Tony Stark]

Thought George looked good early but after trying to run the ball and getting caught he suddenly started going sideways and backwards too. Its happened to all the young players because they are being restricted in their natural style by our archaic game plan.

For Gods sake, here's an idea, let the players play their natural game in their natural positions and lets see natural improvement. Its called development and there is not much going on at the club right now or for some time for that matter.

 

[Nostradumbass]

Haha great thread, would read again. 10 /10

 

[Gosha]

Where Melbourne are is seeing the light at the end of the tunnel? Seemed only a handful of hours ago I was watching some shemons sharply outplayed by the up and coming saints. Half a dozen teams began a rebuild after your club did and are advancing further in fewer years than Roo's management has been able to do.

I understand you're optimistic after your first back to back wins since 2011, most posters here are diehard tigs fans who watch the games every week, its ******* plain to see the problem at this point in time at punt road is deeply rooted in the coaching staff and their game plan.

This

 

[Richmondayitis]

No matter who wins todays game between Blues and Bombers we will be bottom 4, even if it's a draw. I hold Peg, Benny and Dan Richardson responsible for this mess.
Maybe when 3 people turn up for the Dreamtime game they'll start to take us seriously. This kind of defence of Dimma's record is delusional. His teams have only ever performed
after digging themselves into a hole, then once qualifying for finals put the queue in the rack and dish up the most embarrassing finals capitulations I've ever witnessed!

Everyone's shattered, fans, members etc but what pisses me off is everyone keeps saying oh Dimma didn't have the cattle blah blah blah then why we're they recruiting to take a tilt at the flag? Point is they bought into their own BS and something has gone wrong at a higher level than Dimma and his coaching staff. I wouldn't blame the players either.
But to get our club back on track the board need to not only look at the coaching dept but higher up as well, otherwise we can turn over the coach and players and find ourselves back here in 7 yrs. So get the off field dept sorted then sort out coach and players.

 

[Rayzorwire]

As for the Hardwick can't coach brigade, how does a guy who can't coach take a side that had a 27.3% winning record in his first year and become a side that won 65.2% of games in 2013 & 2015? It happens because he got the most out of the list that he had at his disposal at the time.

Unfortunately that list wasn't god enough to take us where we wanted to get to...

So let me get this straight, RT.

You endorsed the sacking of our last two coaches who had proven they could win finals, despite the fact they ended up - mostly through injury - with worse lists than Hardwick to work with?

While Hardwick, who has not proven he can win finals, gets a pat on the head from you to start over again after 7 years, because he lacked the players to see through his master plan, despite having a comparatively charmed run with injuries and saying over and over and over again that he believes he has the right players?

Seems to me the only opinion you have is 'whatever the board thinks is best, is best'...

Logic and what is right being very much overrated concepts.

 

[jc12]

so basically another rebuild.. great, we hav had one under frawley, wallace and dimma, but hey this is the first time itll happen twice under the same coach! what a miracle

 

[wegetpumped]

So let me get this straight, RT.

You endorsed the sacking of our last two coaches who had proven they could win finals, despite the fact they ended up - mostly through injury - with worse lists than Hardwick to work with?

While Hardwick, who has not proven he can win finals, gets a pat on the head from you to start over again after 7 years, because he lacked the players to see through his master plan, despite having a comparatively charmed run with injuries and saying over and over and over again that he believes he has the right players?

Seems to me the only opinion you have is 'whatever the board thinks is best, is best'...

Logic and what is right being very much overrated concepts.

I wouldn't worry about it raz as the door knocking isn't answered at punt road. People are people and differences happen what will be will be just go along for the ride.
Some posters in fact are so much into it that they are going out of their way to push the mods to ban people that don't agree with them.

 

[guruisatiger]

In the last 50 years, Richmond has averaged a new coach every 3 years. At some stage members need to stand up and admit that the coach isn't the problem. IMO the problem is much more deep seeded problem - it's a cultural thing.

At Melbourne, we had the same problem and we're only just starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel. A big part of getting there as the AFL forcing Peter Jackson to take over who wasn't beholden to the "inner boys club". Part of the deal with Roos was that he had complete and utter power to change whatever he wanted to change.

Stop blaming the coach; it's an easy scapegoat to dismiss the real issues - IMO.

In the last 50 years, Richmond has averaged a new coach every 3 years. At some stage members need to stand up and admit that the coach isn't the problem. IMO the problem is much more deep seeded problem - it's a cultural thing.

At Melbourne, we had the same problem and we're only just starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel. A big part of getting there as the AFL forcing Peter Jackson to take over who wasn't beholden to the "inner boys club". Part of the deal with Roos was that he had complete and utter power to change whatever he wanted to change.

Stop blaming the coach; it's an easy scapegoat to dismiss the real issues - IMO.

Don't really give a shit what a melbourne supporter thinks

 

[brett_warne]

What makes me sad is that I have to take my kids to auskick today and they will want to wear their tiger jumpers. Even the Essendon kids are laughing at them now. They will ask why the other kids are laughing and I don't know what to tell them.

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk

 

[wegetpumped]

What makes me sad is that I have to take my kids to auskick today and they will want to wear their tiger jumpers. Even the Essendon kids are laughing at them now. They will ask why the other kids are laughing and I don't know what to tell them.

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk

Just tell them that they are laughing at the jumper and not them.

 

[Catscratch]

As it stands right now the majority on here are of the opinion that Hardwick has to go and it's an opinion that has merit. After 3 years of finals appearances and the expectation heading into this season that we'd be a finals team, possibly top 4 at seasons end and a shot at winning a flag.

5 rounds into the season the hopes of finishing top 4 are all but gone and we can forget about a flag as that isn't going to happen either. Despite being 1-4 the comments coming out of the club is that we still believe that we can make finals and have an impact and quite honestly I understand why that is being said. It's not solely because we still believe that we can make it, it's to ensure that we keep getting the crowds to turn up to games. If Hardwick and the players came out and said we've given up on the season, the fans and media would have a field day, going with an angle about how typical it is of Richmond to give up when things get tough. So until it is mathematically impossible for us to make finals I believe that we'll keep hearing that line pushed at every opportunity.

However the truth is that we are in the process of dropping back to go forwards in the future. Last year we moved on/retired off experienced types in Petterd Thomas Knights Newman & Foley as well as younger types in Arnot Dea McDonough & Gordon who just didn't come good after plenty of opportunity was afforded to them. Granted Petterd Thomas Knights Newman & Foley only played 21 games total but had they been retained and been fit this year chances are they would have been part of the 22 this year especially with the injuries that we have had to the likes of Deledio Edwards Grimes Conca Grigg Yarran & Vlastuin.

Instead of that happening we've played young draftees in Menadue C.Ellis Rioli Short & Lennon. The first 3 have played 5 & 4 games respectively, while Lennon and Short had taste and have gone back. Now it would have been nice to keep all of them in the side and pump games into them but we need to have these kids and others yet to get a game this year earning their place in the side, not just getting games given to them because they are young.

What we're doing at the moment is no different to what sides like Adelaide Bulldogs Eagles & Port have done in recent years. They put games into kids developed them for the long term future of their club. All of these clubs are coming of much more success than us in recent times so them taking a step back is a little less upsetting to their fans than us taking a step back is to us.

As for the Hardwick can't coach brigade, how does a guy who can't coach take a side that had a 27.3% winning record in his first year and become a side that won 65.2% of games in 2013 & 2015? It happens because he got the most out of the list that he had at his disposal at the time.

Unfortunately that list wasn't god enough to take us where we wanted to get to so things had to change and change they have. 2014 draft we pick up Corey Ellis Connor Menadue Nathan Drummond Daniel Butler Reece McKenzie Jayden Short Jason Castagna & Ivan Soldo who were all under 21 when drafted. Then in 2015 we go out and Daniel Rioli Oleg Markov Nathan Broad Callum Moore & Mabior Chol with only Broad being over 21. That is 12 players aged 21 or younger added to the list. So far 5 of them had been played and I fully expect a couple more to join that group in coming weeks with Castagna and Markov named emergencies this week.

So as the title of the thread says we're on the right track, it's just that to get where we want to go it's going to be a bit of short term pain to deliver longer term gain. I for one am going to enjoy being part of the journey because it'll make it all the sweeter when we get there.

Good luck with that i've only been waiting for 30 plus years myself.

 

[tugga]

The list is ordinary. Too many slow players. Maric is cooked and Hampson is barely a VFL player. Not enough miss who ooze class. No consistent forward options. We'll be takin five steps backwards this year not one as Hardwick suggested. St Kilda had the balls to move on dal Santo and McEvoy to get young talent. We don't.