Opinion We're On The Right Path

[SumTingWong]

Unfortunately that list wasn't god enough to take us where we wanted to get to so things had to change and change they have. 2014 draft we pick up Corey Ellis Connor Menadue Nathan Drummond Daniel Butler Reece McKenzie Jayden Short Jason Castagna & Ivan Soldo who were all under 21 when drafted. Then in 2015 we go out and Daniel Rioli Oleg Markov Nathan Broad Callum Moore & Mabior Chol with only Broad being over 21. That is 12 players aged 21 or younger added to the list. So far 5 of them had been played and I fully expect a couple more to join that group in coming weeks with Castagna and Markov named emergencies this week.

So as the title of the thread says we're on the right track, it's just that to get where we want to go it's going to be a bit of short term pain to deliver longer term gain. I for one am going to enjoy being part of the journey because it'll make it all the sweeter when we get there.

Let's have a look at our future then:
CEllis - underwhelming/soft. played out of position but nowhere near physically AFL ready.
Menadue - huge upside, gone backwards after only 6 rounds. Another skinny kid who may not make it due to lack of size.
Drummond - had a poor first game then did his knee. not highly rated as a junior. meh
Butler - poor first year although injured for quite a bit of it. up and down this year, mostly down.
McKenzie - i thought he had a great first year. Personal issues look like he will be delisted
Short - v promising as a forward, now playing at hb in the VFL. wtf?
Castagna - no composure, kicking poor
Soldo - needs alooooooooooooooooooooooooooot of time. massive bonus if he makes it.
Rioli - in name great. On field looks way out of his depth. Drafted way too high.
Markov - toss of a coin. Unknown, not doing that much yet at VFL level yet.
CMoore - love the look of this guy. Could be a steal
Chol - Same as above
Broad - absolute rubbish. An indictment on our recruiting dept.

Doesn't look that great to me. 13 players, only 1 genuine midfielder. Also, Townsend looks terrible and AMoore was the recruiters way of reminding us they have no idea. If this is what we're hinging our future on then we are in for a bleak 5-6 years.

 

[Tigers_fan24]

Let's have a look at our future then:
CEllis - underwhelming/soft. played out of position but nowhere near physically AFL ready.
Menadue - huge upside, gone backwards after only 6 rounds. Another skinny kid who may not make it due to lack of size.
Drummond - had a poor first game then did his knee. not highly rated as a junior. meh
Butler - poor first year although injured for quite a bit of it. up and down this year, mostly down.
McKenzie - i thought he had a great first year. Personal issues look like he will be delisted
Short - v promising as a forward, now playing at hb in the VFL. wtf?
Castagna - no composure, kicking poor
Soldo - needs alooooooooooooooooooooooooooot of time. massive bonus if he makes it.
Rioli - in name great. On field looks way out of his depth. Drafted way too high.
Markov - toss of a coin. Unknown, not doing that much yet at VFL level yet.
CMoore - love the look of this guy. Could be a steal
Chol - Same as above
Broad - absolute rubbish. An indictment on our recruiting dept.

Doesn't look that great to me. 13 players, only 1 genuine midfielder. Also, Townsend looks terrible and AMoore was the recruiters way of reminding us they have no idea. If this is what we're hinging our future on then we are in for a bleak 5-6 years.

this is depressing

 

[rideclutch]

Sort of agree with the OP - hard to say we're on the right path when you've gone from a 15 win team to close to worst in the comp. Some of the kids haven't come on quite as quick as I hoped either.

I do think it can be turned around quicker than a full blown rebuild though.

 

[Bruce Monteath]

ALL the evidence available would suggest we are one of a few teams clearly on the wrong path.

 

["The Roar Is Back"]

Rebuild or not Reiwoldt , Cotchin and Rance are the only ones I would be marking as potential RFC premiership players . Everyone else should be up for trade .
Unfortunately Shane Edwards and Lids despite remarkable service have had their opportunities limited by FJ not being able to get others around them . They are unlikely to be around when the club is next in a position to finish top 4.
Cut them loose and let them the opportunity to go elsewhere to a club that is truly on the verge .
If Lennon can't make that side cut him whilst he has a chance elsewhere .
The list needs honest assessment of who is going to be in a age bracket and is good enough potentially to make the next RFC top 4 side .
Keep Rioli , Menadue, Cellis , Grimes , mcintosh. Chol and McBean the rest can go.
I stated openly at the time and think I have been proven right that the Yarran trade was stupid for a second rounder and that he was unlikely to play 75% of games in 2016 . He is exactly the type we didn't need .

 

[tigs2010]

Only a carlton fan would think we are currently on the right path. Got my eye on you EAD

 

[Tiger_4_Life]

this is depressing

No not really

It's one guys opinion.

It would be good if STW would back up his statement in regards to Mckenzie... This is the first I've read that we'll be delisting him. Sounds like horse shit to me.

Drummond... Already written off as well because he wasn't rated as a junior? ....if this a thumb rule to determine future viability then half of the Afl players wouldn't be around.

Cellis actually looks good now and is increasing his numbers with each game... But let's write him off

 

[DeseRigs]

On the right path to..... To the number 1 draft pick


Amirite fellas?

 

[RockJobster0312]

I do believe we were on the right path absolutely. We have tried to take a short cut, and it clearly hasn't worked. But its not to late to backtrack and get back on track.

Im not happy with the way we are playing. Let me make that clear. But, in a way Im glad. We have been crippled by injuries and key players out of form. But in an alternative reality with no injuries and no players in a form slump, hiw would we go? We may have made top 4. May have won a final, but I cant see how we would have won a premiership. So Im glad because we are not yet too deep down the rabbit hole to pull ourselves out. It means throwing caution to the wind and making some bold decisions, but it can be done.

- play CEllis, Menadue, Lennon, Rioli and Castagna to the end of the year. Get on their ass when they don't do the non-negotiables, but take away their fear of makig mistakes.
- play Elton and McBean. Im the first who says that McBean needs to do certain things to get into the team, but as we are now from what ive heard is that he has done them relatively well. Plus our standards at the moment are lower. Play them both. If they fail, move them on.
- play Astbury every game. IMO, he gets an unfair write up from many. He is solid 75% of the time, but there is a moment or a decision that lets him down and magnifies that 25%. Keep him in the team, if he doesn't go up to scratch, go hard after Hurley (do that anyway).
- play Conca to the end of the year when injury free. Its his last chance as much as I hate to say. If it doesnt work out, let him go.
- play vlastuin in the guts. Good as a 4th tall hbf who is fearless, but those kinda guys you can get more than (potentially) elite inside midfielders.
- Play Griff at CHF ONLY. Drop Vickery. Tell him to lead hard, crash aerial packs and kick goals. If he doesn't do this, he can go.
- look to play Markov and Butler and Drummond earlier rather than later.
- look to bring in Chol if/ when a spot opens up.
- stick with McKenzie. A year off and re evaluate next year.
- go hard in the offseason. Look at trading Vickery, BEllis, Astbury (if applicable), Conca (if applicable), Griffiths if applicable. Be agressive in free agency, keep first round pick but look at trading next years first rounder. We have young Naish who we could get with the bidding system. Its risky, but we have been to conservative in years past.

 

[_RT_]

So we've seen twice in a row that coaches don't get things back on track but you want to try for a third time?

Frawley started off with a successful couple of seasons and then went backwards for 3 straight years. TW started of somewhat successfully taking us from last to 9th in 2 seasons then went back to the bottom despite claims he was missing most of his best players when he did, climbed back for a season, then coached us to a 2-9 record after stating we were locked and loaded before the season started, scratch that I forgot coaches aren't supposed to talk up their teams chances before a season begins.

Hardwick has taken us from the basket case we were at the end of 2009 to a team that made finals 3 years in a row. As good as that was history would show that we weren't good enough to go deep into the finals as we wanted to. Heading into this year there were changes made to how we were going to line up. With a full list to pick from the side we would have had to start the season would have been:

B: Grimes Astbury Conca
HB: Houli Rance Yarran
C: B.Ellis Grigg McIntosh
HF: Deledio Riewoldt Martin
F: Vickery Edwards Griffiths
R: Maric Cotchin Miles
INT: Vlastuin Lennon C.Ellis Menadue

Last night we lined up:

B: Batchelor Astbury Morris
HB: C.Ellis Chaplin Houli
C: B.Ellis Grigg Menadue
HF: Deledio Riewoldt Edwards
F: Vickery Martin Maric
R: Hampson Cotchin Miles
INT: Rioli Castagna Lambert Lloyd

Replace those in bold with Rance Grimes Conca Yarran Vlastuin McIntosh Griffiths and the result may end up different, at the very least we would have been a lot more competitive than we were.

This is what I was trying to get across when posting this thread, we're not as bad as we've been playing, it's just that circumstances aren't allowing us to play with the team that we want to play and the way that we want to play.

 

[_RT_]

Last night port were without 6-8 players of the best 22. This injury excuse is getting a bit ridiculous! Conca has given nothing, yaran is unknown, vlas has been shit all year. Playing kids is good but not at the expense of thier development and the whole season!

The week before Port had a number of those half a dozen best 22 players in their side and were humiliated by Geelong after leading by 5 goals early in the game.

 

[SnakeMan86]

Its not often ill agree with BT but hard to argue with him here...
http://www.triplem.com.au/melbourne/sport/afl/news/2016/4/bt-has-absolutely-unloaded-on-the-tigers/

 

[Tigerbob]

Its not often ill agree with BT but hard to argue with him here...
http://www.triplem.com.au/melbourne/sport/afl/news/2016/4/bt-has-absolutely-unloaded-on-the-tigers/

That is actually brilliant.

 

[Tiger71]

That is actually brilliant.

100% spot on

 

[Handsuper47]

Its not often ill agree with BT but hard to argue with him here...
http://www.triplem.com.au/melbourne/sport/afl/news/2016/4/bt-has-absolutely-unloaded-on-the-tigers/

Heard it when I chucked on the radio this morning.. couldn't agree more with him

 

[partycorolla]

Where Melbourne are is seeing the light at the end of the tunnel? Seemed only a handful of hours ago I was watching some shemons sharply outplayed by the up and coming saints. Half a dozen teams began a rebuild after your club did and are advancing further in fewer years than Roo's management has been able to do.

I understand you're optimistic after your first back to back wins since 2011, most posters here are diehard tigs fans who watch the games every week, its ******* plain to see the problem at this point in time at punt road is deeply rooted in the coaching staff and their game plan.

I think it's pretty obvious to see that it isn't that simple. Players are struggling to execute basic skills that they have previously done.... they haven't been coached to do that... they are just down on confidence.

Having said that.... I think the gameplan is an issue. I think the decision to try and play faster was reactionary to what was happening in the early rounds. I don't think the team have been working on it for 6 months.... they seem indecisive and with that, the mistakes are coming. I would almost rather see us play slowly but assuredly than fast with no idea...

Our biggest issue in the game plan though isn't anything to do with possession. Our players seemingly have no idea what to do or where to go when we don't have the football. The number of end to end scoring shots is alarming and our general inability to stop the opposition once we have lost possession. This wreaks of players not being able to understand their role... Ultimately the coach needs ensure his players know their role or if they can't, then use a different style. Personally, given our lack of accountability issues, I would just go man-on-man until we can learn the other system (if that is even what it is).

So the players are sucking at basic skills and the game plan looks a little like the players don't get it....

 

[partycorolla]

Brilliant post.

I disagree.... but then I am still of the opinion that Plough was generally crap for the club (and the club for Plough)... he certainly had plenty of time and not even close to a final to show for it. Frawley had 1 good year and then thought we were closer than we were....followed by 3 years of crap.

DH has made us better consistently up until this year. 2014 we treaded water. So he'll see out the year but he needs to try stuff. Team defence is crap. Need to try man on man or something, our players don't seem to understand their roles without the football.

I would put some better people around him though. Actually invest in our footy dept.... novel idea

 

[Rayzorwire]

Frawley had injuries that is correct, he also had 3 straight seasons winning 7 or fewer games to end his coaching career. So he was given the chance to try and get things back to where they were in 2001 but couldn't do it.

At which time, according to yours and the board's current logic, we just admit he didn't have the players, then sign him on for a few more years to oversee the rebuild. The players loved him, he was a successful coach who won finals. Frawley lost most of his spine and midfield over the last couple of years, had to buy in a captain from elsewhere we were so devoid of leaders and our drafting in the years prior to him coming was the worst run of dud bombs the club has ever had.

Surely he deserved more of a chance to redeem himself than Hardwick if we square their records and circumstances off against each other?

As for TW, in 2007 he got his first win in round 12 despite having the majority of his best 22 available at the time, Brown and Simmonds the only 2 that were missing for most of that year.

Short memory mate, take a look at the rd.1 side for 2007. Pattison and Polak are playing in the ruck because we had lost the FOUR other ruckmen we considered ahead of them for selection - Stafford, Knobel, Simmonds, Hall. How would Dimmer be travelling if we were down to our 5th and 6th best rucks each week? The midfield was horrible beyond imagining when you consider Foley was still green and Johnson moved like a crab by then.

Here's the lineup:

B: Bowden McGuane Bowden
HB: Deledio Moore Newman
C: Howat Foley Tivendale
HF: Tambling Gaspar Pettifer
F: Schulz Richardson Polak
Foll: Pattison Johnson Tuck
Int: Raines Polo Hyde Krakeour

Say it loud and proud..."Why didn't you take us to more finals, Terry, you sneaky lying dog who can't coach for shit?!!!"

Like Frawley before him he was given another chance to make amends improving in 2008 to an 11 win season before once again going backwards in his final year which ultimately led to his sacking.

He was given the 'finals or else' command from President March and during the 11 games he coached in 2009, at the part of the year before he became a dead man walking, we ran Geelong to an unlucky 3 goal loss at Kardinia with the following side:

B: Polo, McGuane, Rance
HB: Bowden* Moore Newman
C: White Deledio Richardson*
HF: Morton Reiwoldt Brown*
F: Nahas Schulz King
Foll: Simmonds* Tuck Jackson
Int: Foley Hislop Graham Edwards

* Denotes barely able to still play or in last season before retirement.

Take a look at the premiership list Geelong had, then put Dimmer in the box and see how well he goes with the above lot. Finals or else. Richardson went down rd.6 for good, Brown was cooked, Graham played 16 games and Tuck spent time in the ruck because Simmonds was cooked, Cotchin was sidelined early, Rance, Reiwoldt and Edwards were all babies.

Wallace had every opportunity to succeed in 4 1/2 years, Hardwick lacked the players to have a genuine chance of success after 7 years and deserves more time, because he CAN coach - it's everybody else's fault he hasn't won anything yet.

Luke McGuane was apparently a good enough key defender under Wallace to play finals. Under Dimmer, he has a mystical form dip and ends up being traded as virtually worthless. Schulz, Nahas, Polo, Graham, White, Hislop - all also considered of little or no value under Dimmer, Wallace was supposed to coach them to finals.

They tried to get things back on track by relying on their better players to haul them back into contention.

Mate, that summarises Hardwick's coaching career very neatly.

Imagine a head coach coming out preseason or mid season and saying my list sucks and isn't capable of going anywhere.

Hardwick arrived wheeling in a billboard that said exactly that.

How long do you think it would be before that coach was sacked?

7 years and counting is a really lousy answer, isn't it?

We've boned more proven coaches for far less and you cheered it on as the right decisions.

Like I said, for you, whatever the board decides is right, must therefore be right.

Hardwick's record stinks with a better list and much better circumstances compared to our last two coaches, there is zero case for him continuing beyond the board having their collective heads up their arse and being frightened to admit they made a huge mistake because they lack judgement and football intelligence.

 

[Tigerbob]

I disagree.... but then I am still of the opinion that Plough was generally crap for the club (and the club for Plough)... he certainly had plenty of time and not even close to a final to show for it. Frawley had 1 good year and then thought we were closer than we were....followed by 3 years of crap.

DH has made us better consistently up until this year. 2014 we treaded water. So he'll see out the year but he needs to try stuff. Team defence is crap. Need to try man on man or something, our players don't seem to understand their roles without the football.

I would put some better people around him though. Actually invest in our footy dept.... novel idea

This putting better people around him thing Hardwick supporters are calling for to have him remain as coach is so hilarious.

If the senior coach has no idea, what good will it be to have people around him? His match day planning is horrendous and he plays favourites with players. What's an assistant coach to do? Speak up?

Yeah like that will help with the boys club going on.

Plus, the assistants we have assembled are all at the request of Hardwick. They are his mates. Imagine getting an outsider in. He'd be useless in trying to get a message across.

If you are changing the whole coaching panel, you have to include the senior coach.

What BT said was absolutely spot on. Time for the club to act.

 

[tgrs]

I think it's pretty obvious to see that it isn't that simple. Players are struggling to execute basic skills that they have previously done.... they haven't been coached to do that... they are just down on confidence.

Having said that.... I think the gameplan is an issue. I think the decision to try and play faster was reactionary to what was happening in the early rounds. I don't think the team have been working on it for 6 months.... they seem indecisive and with that, the mistakes are coming. I would almost rather see us play slowly but assuredly than fast with no idea...

Our biggest issue in the game plan though isn't anything to do with possession. Our players seemingly have no idea what to do or where to go when we don't have the football. The number of end to end scoring shots is alarming and our general inability to stop the opposition once we have lost possession. This wreaks of players not being able to understand their role... Ultimately the coach needs ensure his players know their role or if they can't, then use a different style. Personally, given our lack of accountability issues, I would just go man-on-man until we can learn the other system (if that is even what it is).

So the players are sucking at basic skills and the game plan looks a little like the players don't get it....

Because there is a large disconnect between the players and coaching staff in regards to the game plan, resulting in horrible losses. If the gameplan wasn't an issue we would have come out Round 1, confident off the back of 15 wins in 2015 and thumped Carlton, that "win" was the first warning sign the club internally overrated the list, coaching staff and finals chances. It really is as simple as these players are professional AFL footballers; They know how to kick and handball, they know how to play, and they should know how to deal with mental challenges, if they dish up the performances they have then without any attempt to try something different, something is seriously wrong with the direction given to the players each week and the excuses that are papering over the cracks are just extending Dimma's time in office.

Confidence is an issue stemming from the game plan or lack of, not the other way around.

 

[Rubber Hips]

We are sitting 15th on the ladder with 1 (lucky) win from 6 games

...are we really on the right path?

 

[Tigerbob]

We are sitting 15th on the ladder with 1 (lucky) win from 6 games

...are we really on the right path?

The answer is obviously no, but let Hardwick fans hold onto something.

 

[Tiges1229]

We are sitting 15th on the ladder with 1 (lucky) win from 6 games

...are we really on the right path?

We have problems at the moment, so not on the right path .

 

[Capitano_Cotch]

No pace. No skill. No creativity. No hunger. No leadership.

No idea.

Pathetic.

 

[_RT_]

At which time, according to yours and the board's current logic, we just admit he didn't have the players, then sign him on for a few more years to oversee the rebuild. The players loved him, he was a successful coach who won finals. Frawley lost most of his spine and midfield over the last couple of years, had to buy in a captain from elsewhere we were so devoid of leaders and our drafting in the years prior to him coming was the worst run of dud bombs the club has ever had.

Surely he deserved more of a chance to redeem himself than Hardwick if we square their records and circumstances off against each other?

Frawley had 3 straight seasons with 7 or fewer wins, just how many more losing seasons did he warrant before moving him on was right?

Short memory mate, take a look at the rd.1 side for 2007. Pattison and Polak are playing in the ruck because we had lost the FOUR other ruckmen we considered ahead of them for selection - Stafford, Knobel, Simmonds, Hall. How would Dimmer be travelling if we were down to our 5th and 6th best rucks each week? The midfield was horrible beyond imagining when you consider Foley was still green and Johnson moved like a crab by then.

Here's the lineup:

B: Bowden(22 games) McGuane(14) Bowden(3)
HB: Deledio(19) Moore(7) Newman(22)
C: Howat(15) Foley(22) Tivendale(19)
HF: Tambling(20) Gaspar(5) Pettifer(22)
F: Schulz(12) Richardson(22) Polak(22)
Foll: Pattison(18) Johnson(22) Tuck(22)
Int: Raines(22) Polo(8) Hyde(13) Krakeour(9)

Say it loud and proud..."Why didn't you take us to more finals, Terry, you sneaky lying dog who can't coach for shit?!!!"

I've put the amount of games played by those players from the above side in brackets. As I said we had plenty of best 22 players from that era playing that season and won 3 games for the season. Missing from that side that played plenty of footy that year were King(19 games) Edwards(16) Thursfield(15) & Jackson (15). That's 21 players who played more than half of the games that season.

BTW Stafford had retired at the end of 2006. Knobel had been injured the majority of the 2006 season so a bit of a stretch to say he would have been 2nd choice ruck heading into 2007 and Hall was more of a CHB than ruckman. But hey it sounds good to claim things as fact.

Other notable players missing in 07 were as I said Brown who was still struggling to come back from the broken leg, Simmonds who had blood clots on the lung and Coughlan whose career was effectively ended the day our medical staff and TW put him back on the field after he ruptured his ACL. Outside that there weren't many of our best 22 that year missing.

He was given the 'finals or else' command from President March and during the 11 games he coached in 2009, at the part of the year before he became a dead man walking, we ran Geelong to an unlucky 3 goal loss at Kardinia with the following side:

B: Polo, McGuane, Rance
HB: Bowden* Moore Newman
C: White Deledio Richardson*
HF: Morton Reiwoldt Brown*
F: Nahas Schulz King
Foll: Simmonds* Tuck Jackson
Int: Foley Hislop Graham Edwards

* Denotes barely able to still play or in last season before retirement.

Take a look at the premiership list Geelong had, then put Dimmer in the box and see how well he goes with the above lot. Finals or else. Richardson went down rd.6 for good, Brown was cooked, Graham played 16 games and Tuck spent time in the ruck because Simmonds was cooked, Cotchin was sidelined early, Rance, Reiwoldt and Edwards were all babies.

Wallace had every opportunity to succeed in 4 1/2 years, Hardwick lacked the players to have a genuine chance of success after 7 years and deserves more time, because he CAN coach - it's everybody else's fault he hasn't won anything yet.

We were lucky it was a 3 goal loss, Geelong had 30 scoring shots to our 20 kicking 15.15 to 13.7. Geelong kicks straight and its a 7-10 goal loss, but lets ignore that because again it doesn't suit the narrative you're going with.

However if you want to go down the path of throwing up a poor side to highlight a coaching performance. Lets look at Dimmas best win of his debut season. He takes a side that averaged only 64 games per player into a game against a Swans side averaging over 100 games per player and coaches the side to a 4 point win, this was not long after that same side was described as worse than Fitzroy as it lost it's first 8 games of that year on the way to a bottom 2 finish. What was our reward for that bottom 2 finish, surely it was a top 2 pick like TW had access to when we finished last in 2007 and second last in 2009.

Nope we end up with pick 6 & 30 when we should have had 2 & 20 if it wasn't for the Suns entering the comp. Imagine in 2007 instead of getting those 3 top 20 picks that we had we ended up with picks 6 and 30 instead. That would mean no Cotchin and Rance instead we'd have David Myers and Jarran Jacky(taken 6 & 30 that year).

In 2011 we finish bottom 6 and by all rights should have had pick 6 which means access to one of Patton Coniglio Tyson WHE Buntine or Wingard, not knocking B.Ellis who has been very good since coming in but there are a couple in that top 6 that would make a massive difference to our side. But yeah you're right Hardwick has had every chance to rebuild a side that was in such poor shape when he took over. Given the loss of access to those top picks it's little wonder we have had to gone down the retread path to be competitive and get us into the finals.

Mate, that summarises Hardwick's coaching career very neatly.

Name a coach that it doesn't apply to.

Hardwick arrived wheeling in a billboard that said exactly that.

Gee I don't know why given he was left such a stellar list when TW departed according to your previous claims of Hardwick is riding the coattails of TWs rebuild.

7 years and counting is a really lousy answer, isn't it?

Board needs a sarcasm font.

We've boned more proven coaches for far less and you cheered it on as the right decisions.

If winning less than 7 games a year for 3 straight seasons andsacking a coach after giving him a chance to rebuild after a poor season only to take us backwards again 2 years later is less than a coach having his first poor season in 4 years then I want some of what you're on.

Like I said, for you, whatever the board decides is right, must therefore be right.

Hardwick and Richardson were on radio today saying that we're not rebuilding and will continue to pick their best possible side each week, and I'd say the board is backing Hardwick in that decision as well, yet I'm suggesting that we should be rebuilding by playing the kids. Looks like I'm not agreeing with what the board/Hardwick have decided.

Hardwick's record stinks with a better list and much better circumstances compared to our last two coaches, there is zero case for him continuing beyond the board having their collective heads up their arse and being frightened to admit they made a huge mistake because they lack judgement and football intelligence.

3 finals appearances in 3 years, granted no wins in those finals, coming after a couple of years of the draft being pillaged by the Suns and Giants. As for the better circumstances I wonder if that has anything to do with Hardwick and Gales presentation to the board saying that we needed to invest in the football department and bring in more development coaches/recruiting thus creating the FTF to help remove debt that stopped us from spending what we should have while also helping fund the rebuild of PRO and establishment of our own VFL side.

How moronic of our board to tick off on all of those things to help turn the club around and fancy giving the first coach in 40 years to take us to 3 straight finals appearances an extension. How well did it work out for us the last time we didn't give a coach who took us to finals an extension? We went from top 4 to bottom 4 within 2 years. What's that saying about those not learning from history?