Banter Who will be Better in 2025, Collingwood or Carlton? Part 4

[Scritchyscroony]

I saw Carlton had 7 players make your unbiased cut of 23.
Which Collingwood players are the Captain and Vice ?

Cripps captain and Nick Daicos VC

 

[Fadge]

I understand that. I moved the topic a little, in what seems a reasonable progression to me. Bringing it back towards the thread topic. It's a grouping of say Williams , Saad (been good) and Cerra that haven't outperformed like say the Brissie trio. Missing these benefits hurt

Bottom line is, Carlton have NFI about how to build a list to contend for the premiership.

That's all there is to it.

 

[Scritchyscroony]

It makes complete sense that a team who finished 9th, would have 70% representation in one's combined team which includes a team that finished above said team.

I picked it on a best proven finals player per position basis. If I was talking Ng a team into finals that's the one I'd take..
So I guess Curnow probably shouldn't have been in there.

 

[Fadge]

I picked it on a best proven finals player per position basis. If I was talking Ng a team into finals that's the one I'd take..
So I guess Curnow probably shouldn't have been in there.

If it was a team based on finals performances, you'd probably have Mitchell in the guts ahead of Cripps.

Mitchell is possibly the best finals performer of both teams.

 

[Gone Critical]

It makes complete sense that a team who finished 9th, would have 70% representation in one's combined team which includes a team that finished above said team.

Of course when picking this team you would only want to consider the performances of 2024. I mean the 2023 performances just dont need to be thought about

 

[Worm4]

If it was a team based on finals performances, you'd probably have Mitchell in the guts ahead of Cripps.

Mitchell is possibly the best finals performer of both teams.

100% Mitchell ahead of Cripps. McStay ahead of any Carlton Fwd. I'm shocked.
Mitchell should be captain

 

[Chronz]

Who is Falcon?

Hi sweepy.

 

[Worm4]

Of course when picking this team you would only want to consider the performances of 2024. I mean the 2023 performances just dont need to be thought about

I can't believe Carlton are represented to be honest

 

[Worm4]

I picked it on a best proven finals player per position basis. If I was talking Ng a team into finals that's the one I'd take..
So I guess Curnow probably shouldn't have been in there.

Probably why Houston got a gig considering his 2024 finals campaign

 

[Fadge]

100% Mitchell ahead of Cripps. McStay ahead of any Carlton Fwd. I'm shocked.
Mitchell should be captain

Make the argument that Cripps is ahead of Mitchell on finals performances.

McStay also ahead of both Carlton key forwards based on finals performances as well. Thanks for reminding me.

Walsh may just be the only Carlton player who gets a spot on the ground, though who does he get on ahead of elite finals performers Mitchell, Pendlebury, De Goey, Daicos, Sidebottom and Crisp?

 

[doppleganger]

Oh boy. You lot are so far up your own asses it's hilarious. The recruiting of guys like Perryman & Houston are not Moneyball type recruits, it's legitimately the opposite. And once again, it goes so far beyond focusing on 'ready-made' players.

The premise of "moneyball" was identifying what is important to winning games. It was the next evolution of SABR, when combined with quants from harvard and finance who took an interest in understanding what was important to winning baseball games.

Then identifying which players are good at those metrics, and then getting those players onto the list to try and win games of baseball.

One of the key things identified was that high school kids were vastly over-rated. As Bean himself was a high school star who didnt become the MLB star many predicted.

Hatterberg was released from the Red Sox - he wasn't one of the most in-demand free agents in the league in his prime.

Sigh, Hatterberg was traded from the Red Sox. Sox traded him for Pokey Reese, the bloke who fielded the final out for the Sox in the famous 2004 ALCS win against the Yankees.

Wow, FA signing = Moneyball, right?

No, you asked to compare the pair. So an obvious similarity.

I'll remind you, Hatteberg was released from the Red Sox. Equivalent to delisted - you're better off using an example of a DFA - not a former 1st rounder in his prime.

Baggers love getting facts wrong.

No only did the Red Sox not release Hatteberg, but he too was also a star junior who was drafted early by the Sox.

A's have no choice but to try & contend, given the inequities of the MLB. You know that, though. Hatteberg went to the A's as they valued him despite his surgery & backed him to play first base, it was the most secure for his career - not because the A's were a good chance of winning.

He was redeployed as first base which was completely foreign. Perryman was a former 1st rounder & midfielder as a junior and in his prime. It ain't moneyball!

As made playoffs in 2000 and 2001, they were a strong team who wanted to stay strong.

Hatteberg was the junior star, an early draft pick who still had his best baseball ahead of him...just like Perryman.

Even if Perryman helps Collingwood achieve similar, it ain't near the same.

Yeah one was a baseball player and the othrt an AFL player.

Both were mature players targetted by respective strong clubs who they believed would immediately help them win games.

Or you could go the high school potential approach, and rarely have a winning season.

 

[Fadge]

I can't believe Carlton are represented to be honest

Fair point, if finals performances are the main criteria.

For a start, Cox and McStay are picked ahead of Curnow and McKay.

 

[Bale Dup]

Bottom line is, Carlton have NFI about how to build a list to contend for the premiership.

That's all there is to it.

Are you talking about Brian Cook and Graeme Wright, coz if you are, I think it's you who has NFI.

On SM-G980F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[CarmenSandiego]

The premise of "moneyball" was identifying what is important to winning games. It was the next evolution of SABR, when combined with quants from harvard and finance who took an interest in understanding what was important to winning baseball games.

Then identifying which players are good at those metrics, and then getting those players onto the list to try and win games of baseball.

One of the key things identified was that high school kids were vastly over-rated. As Bean himself was a high school star who didnt become the MLB star many predicted.


Sigh, Hatterberg was traded from the Red Sox. Sox traded him for Pokey Reese, the bloke who fielded the final out for the Sox in the famous 2004 ALCS win against the Yankees.


No, you asked to compare the pair. So an obvious similarity.

Baggers love getting facts wrong.

No only did the Red Sox not release Hatteberg, but he too was also a star junior who was drafted early by the Sox.

Nope. He was traded to Colorado for Rees, who then released him 2 days later due to his injury and got picked up as a FA by the A’s.

 

[Fadge]

Are you talking about Brian Cook and Graeme Wright, coz if you are, I think it's you who has NFI.

On SM-G980F using BigFooty.com mobile app

Denis Pagan
Mick Malthouse
......

 

[Worm4]

Fair point, if finals performances are the main criteria.

For a start, Cox and McStay are picked ahead of Curnow and McKay.

 

[Bale Dup]

Denis Pagan
Mick Malthouse
......

You seriously are clueless aren't you.
I'm sorry
I wasn't aware of your condition.
I'll leave you alone now. My bad.

On SM-G980F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Bale Dup]

Yep. Every coach in the league would choose those muppets over 2 Coleman Medallists.

On SM-G980F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Fadge]

You seriously are clueless aren't you.
I'm sorry
I wasn't aware of your condition.
I'll leave you alone now. My bad.

The difference between Cook/Wright and Pagan/Malthouse is the latter would have had MORE influence in building a premiership list than the former will.

 

[Worm4]

Yep. Every coach in the league would choose those muppets over 2 Coleman Medallists.

On SM-G980F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Scritchyscroony]

Probably why Houston got a gig considering his 2024 finals campaign

Jeez Worm chill.
You have a got at it then. Best player per position and based on winning finals.
So if you leave Sidey or Pendles out I know you"re trolling.
Let's see it Worm...go!

 

[Worm4]

Of course when picking this team you would only want to consider the performances of 2024. I mean the 2023 performances just dont need to be thought about

Of course, when picking this team you would only consider Collingwood players. Isn't that what you meant to say ?

 

[Worm4]

Jeez Worm chill.
You have a got at it then. Best player per position and based on winning finals.
So if you leave Sidey or Pendles out I know you"re trolling.
Let's see it Worm...go!

You have already started the selection process for others. Good for you.

 

[Arr0w]

That's the difference between a team that regularly contends for premierships, and one that never does.

View attachment 1000009749.mp4

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Anyone genuinely arguing for McStay and Cox > Curnow and Mckay should be booted off the thread. It's almost as dumb as arguing Nicky Squibcos could be the GOAT while remaining as tough as fairy floss