Society/Culture Why I blame Islam for the fact it's raining today.... part 2

[Chief]

Reminder: This isn't the Israel/Hamas thread. Go to the Israel/Hamas thread if you want to talk about that. Thanks.

Mid East - Israel declare war after Hamas attack II

Part I: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/israel-declare-war-after-hamas-attack.1371828/page-47#post-81443295 Thread Rules: Alright. I recognise that this is a fraught topic for any number of you posting here. Some of you will have family in Israel or Palestine. Some of you will have...

www.bigfooty.com

 

[Gralin]

Show me an example of here liking Australia.

you claimed she hated Australia without any evidence

 

[faible]

Show me an example of here liking Australia.

Do you even know what this means?

 

[Carringbush2010]

Show me an example of here liking Australia.

Here?

If you mean her, I'd thought it obvious.

She's an Australian citizen, afaia if you're a citizen, you like the country you live in.

 

[faible]

This would be Peter Dutton dog whistling


This would be an article about the recent racism in australian media in relation to Payman

Payman triggers a racist upwelling from deep in the political media psyche

Why has Fatima Payman elicited such a ferocious reaction from our mainly white media and political class? The reason points to the lie behind 'social cohesion'.

www.crikey.com.au

The irony being Western Sydney is a bastion of religious folk with conservative views.

 

[10571z]

Here?

If you mean her, I'd thought it obvious.

She's an Australian citizen, afaia if you're a citizen, you like the country you live in.

I wouldn’t agree with that whatsoever

 

[10571z]

you claimed she hated Australia without any evidence

In yet to hear a positive thing come out of her mouth about the country.

 

[faible]

I wouldn’t agree with that whatsoever

She probably likes the country enough to run for a minor party that's unlikely to be in power but might make a difference to the lives of people. Likely the younger, poorer, coloured types moreso than the older, wealthy, white ones.

 

[faible]

In yet to hear a positive thing come out of her mouth about the country.

Politician in opposition criticises the policies of party or parties in power? That's unheard of.

 

[Jazny]

You can disagree with her position if you like, but it's not unclear or hard to understand what her position is. Especially when you consider that she very directly addressed that interviewer being more interested in trying to drag her in to a discussion around a remote hypothetical and being entirely unwilling to discuss the actual reality of what's going on right now and the Governments' lack of action of on.



If you genuinely cannot understand what her position is, as distinct from simply disagreeing with her position, then I'm not sure anything anyone would say will clarify it for you.

Why do you accuse me of being obtuse, but refuse to tell me how any of her statements answer the question. Like I said, you can hold all her the positions that she attempted to answer with and still believe Hamas either should or shouldn't be dismantled.

 

[Gralin]

I find this interesting from the Government's own press release today


So one is to combat Antisemitism and the other is for Islamophobia

Oh and Segal is on record saying that Universities should be punishing students that protest the ongoing genocide, so we know where she is coming from

In yet to hear a positive thing come out of her mouth about the country.

that is not evidence of her hating Australia just an anecdote regarding what you pay attention to

 

[faible]

Why do you accuse me of being obtuse, but refuse to tell me how any of her statements answer the question. Like I said, you can hold all her the positions that she attempted to answer with and still believe Hamas either should or shouldn't be dismantled.

She gave you all the nuance and context you need in a video that's 2 and a half minutes long to understand her position.

It's this thing where even though she condemned Hamas by calling them a terrorist group, you want her to condemn them harder. Much like the interviewer, you'd rather fixate on whether her answer to the hypothetical that's a long way off even being a possibility was satisfactory to you or not, than the reality of what Israel are doing right now.

All of this she raised in the video where the only thing the interviewer cared about was getting her to condemn Hamas harder based upon a made-up hypothetical, but refused to discuss the reality of the situation, which again, she said in the video.

 

[Carringbush2010]

This would be Peter Dutton dog whistling


This would be an article about the recent racism in australian media in relation to Payman

Payman triggers a racist upwelling from deep in the political media psyche

Why has Fatima Payman elicited such a ferocious reaction from our mainly white media and political class? The reason points to the lie behind 'social cohesion'.

www.crikey.com.au

1 While the spud is blunt it does point to an inconsistency IF his hyperbolic claims come to pass, which they probably wouldn't. Last time I checked, the majority of Australians aren't interested in muslim / islamic values, they're more interested in the liberal democratic values they currently live with, this isn't gonna change anytime soon.

If that's dog whistling then 'oh the humanity, quick batton down the hatches, Armageddon is coming', sigh.

Whoopdy phuqin doo.

2 The crikey is opinionated (not surprising)

It’s been the greatest eruption of overt racism in the Australian media in years.

Talk about hyperbole.

Honestly the sensationalism, not only on here but from offence seeking sycophants like crikey and the nut jobs that claim senators hate the country is just off the charts and should be laughed at.

I'm rofl now.

 

[Carringbush2010]

I wouldn’t agree with that whatsoever

Another interesting take.

Could you please explain why an Australian citizen would hate the country so much?

In yet to hear a positive thing come out of her mouth about the country.

Nor have we read anything positive from you.

It's like I can read your mind 'Australian hates Australia just coz'

 

[Ghost Patrol]

1 While the spud is blunt it does point to an inconsistency IF his hyperbolic claims come to pass, which they probably wouldn't. Last time I checked, the majority of Australians aren't interested in muslim / islamic values, they're more interested in the liberal democratic values they currently live with, this isn't gonna change anytime soon.

If that's dog whistling then 'oh the humanity, quick batton down the hatches, Armageddon is coming', sigh.

Whoopdy phuqin doo.

2 The crikey is opinionated (not surprising)

It’s been the greatest eruption of overt racism in the Australian media in years.

Talk about hyperbole.

Honestly the sensationalism, not only on here but from offence seeking sycophants like crikey and the nut jobs that claim senators hate the country is just off the charts and should be laughed at.

I'm rofl now.

Being against genocide isnt a religious position. Why do you think the media are pretending it’s because she is muslim?

 

[Carringbush2010]

The irony being Western Sydney is a bastion of religious folk with conservative views.

Is that right? Last time I looked it's been claimed (not sure how reliable those claims are) by msm and social media and people on here that Western Sydney has a strong minority population of those with islamic / muslim faith.

Also, there's increasing claims that Australians by and large are moving away from faith in religion, I'd argue that's reflective of Jan and Joe public.

'Religious folks with conservative views (read old white folk)' - hardly an overwhelming majority.

 

[Gralin]

1 While the spud is blunt it does point to an inconsistency IF his hyperbolic claims come to pass, which they probably wouldn't. Last time I checked, the majority of Australians aren't interested in muslim / islamic values, they're more interested in the liberal democratic values they currently live with, this isn't gonna change anytime soon.

If that's dog whistling then 'oh the humanity, quick batton down the hatches, Armageddon is coming', sigh.

Whoopdy phuqin doo.

2 The crikey is opinionated (not surprising)

It’s been the greatest eruption of overt racism in the Australian media in years.

Talk about hyperbole.

Honestly the sensationalism, not only on here but from offence seeking sycophants like crikey and the nut jobs that claim senators hate the country is just off the charts and should be laughed at.

I'm rofl now.

oh so you've gone from not knowing what dog whistling is to being an expert

shame you got the dog whistle wrong in your analysis

you also didn't rebut or acknowledge any of the discussion points of the article

no in both cases you just went to mud slinging, and you moan in other threads about the lack of debate on here

 

[Carringbush2010]

Being against genocide isnt a religious position. Why do you think the media are pretending it’s because she is muslim?

Think you have the wrong poster.

I haven't mentioned anything about 'genocide isn't a religious position' or 'Why do you think the media are pretending it’s because she is muslim?' Whatever TF that means.

 

[faible]

Is that right? Last time I looked it's been claimed (not sure how reliable those claims are) by msm and social media and people on here that Western Sydney has a strong minority population of those with islamic / muslim faith.

Also, there's increasing claims that Australians by and large are moving away from faith in religion, I'd argue that's reflective of Jan and Joe public.

'Religious folks with conservative views (read old white folk)' - hardly an overwhelming majority.

Islam is also a religion isn't it? Conservative in terms of things like views on SSM.

 

[10571z]

She probably likes the country enough to run for a minor party that's unlikely to be in power but might make a difference to the lives of people. Likely the younger, poorer, coloured types moreso than the older, wealthy, white ones.

Or it’s the huge money and a lifetime pension.

 

[Carringbush2010]

oh so you've gone from not knowing what dog whistling is to being an expert

Not sure how you come to that conclusion, but not surprising coming from you.

I did state in the post you replied, I don't know what this dog whistling is, now I know it's a nothing burger

shame you got the dog whistle wrong in your analysis

Who cares, looks like dog whistling is a nothing burger.

you also didn't rebut or acknowledge any of the discussion points of the article

Didn't need to, if you write an opinionated article making hyperbolic claims, well that's all you need to know.

But here you go,

'Almost as one, and led by their supposedly elite political journalists, media companies have gathered, chanting, around a straw man called “Muslim Sectarianism” and proceeded to denounce it as an imminent threat to civilization'

Yeah not hyperbole

'The young WA senator seems to have unleashed something ugly lurking deep in the unconscious minds of both the Labor Party and the media.'

^Quick, run to the hills!!!

'There was the groundless claim from the ABC that Payman was a religious zealot allowing herself to be “guided by God”, later quietly downplayed in amendments to the article. Then the insistence from the prime minister that Payman was engaged in sectarian politics that will undermine multiculturalism and end up hurting minority groups — a statement that in its media form sounded more like a threat than a warning.'

^Only a *n moron would believe this.

“One senior minister says it will be a ‘disaster’ for Australia’s almost 1 million Muslim population and in time spark an Islamophobic backlash,”

^ Like every non muslim is gonna gather their pitch fork and jerry cans in search for muslims, or minimum, ready to spew vile hatred from behind a keyboard.

'Here, The Muslim Vote — a hitherto unknown outfit that examines politicians’ voting records on issues notionally of interest to people of Islamic faith — has been beaten up into a nascent political party that Fatima Payman would be joining (inconveniently, she’s sitting as an independent) and has become the emblem of the dreaded sectarianism that is poised to destroy Australia’s social cohesion. '

^I've seen this movie before, seems the scared morons on the right (like someone in here) have this stupid belief the islam / muslim are gonna take over Straya, and we'll all live like muslims against our will , yeah how'd that pan out last time?

I could go on or just pasted the whole article, it's click bait opinionated bullsh*t intended to suck in offence seekers.

I think you get the picture.

no in both cases you just went to mud slinging, and you moan in other threads about the lack of debate on here

Mud slinging? What claiming sensationalism is mud slinging?

Ok then, who *n cares then.

If whatever you wanna claim is dog whistling, only offence seeking d*ck heads care about it.

 

[faible]

Or it’s the huge money and a lifetime pension.

Same goes for every other politician, I assume you'll question their love for their country?

 

[Carringbush2010]

Islam is also a religion isn't it? Conservative in terms of things like views on SSM.

So you didn't mean this then.

'Religious folks with conservative views (read old white folk)'

Or this.

'The irony being Western Sydney is a bastion of religious folk with conservative views.'

Also, no religion in this country is reflective of the majority, Islam or any other religion are definitely minorities.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Or it’s the huge money and a lifetime pension.

See you still don't have evidence this person hates the country or it's citizens.

 

[faible]

So you didn't mean this then.

'Religious folks with conservative views (read old white folk)'

Or this.

'The irony being Western Sydney is a bastion of religious folk with conservative views.'

Also, no religion in this country is reflective of the majority, Islam or any other religion are definitely minorities.

Western Sydney doesn't have religious folk? They don't have conservative views?

For example, Bankstown was amongst the highest No voting electorates on SSM, and is about ~ 1/3rd Islamic population.

I'm not too sure what is it you're trying to argue here? I never said 'white' or that it was Australia-wide.

 

[Gralin]

Not sure how you come to that conclusion, but not surprising coming from you.

I did state in the post you replied, I don't know what this dog whistling is, now I know it's a nothing burger

Who cares, looks like dog whistling is a nothing burger.

Right so you don't know what it is but given your incorrect analysis of one example you are not confident it is a nothing burger

So what is it? What's the definition of this nothing burger?

Didn't need to, if you write an opinionated article making hyperbolic claims, well that's all you need to know.

I seem to remember you saying that we should listen to a bad faith actor for the 0.1% of their argument that could be important recently
in fact you spent pages arguing that we should not dismiss what is being said

it seems that you don't extend that to written opinion from journalists that you don't like

But here you go,

'Almost as one, and led by their supposedly elite political journalists, media companies have gathered, chanting, around a straw man called “Muslim Sectarianism” and proceeded to denounce it as an imminent threat to civilization'

Yeah not hyperbole

No not hyperbole its a common refrain

The arguments put forth were that Payman's religion was the issue here, that she crossed the floor because she was Muslim, Wayne Swan made a press release about how that would weaken labor for the far right and left extremists

When they are suggesting the reason she crossed the floor is because she is Muslim, and that it threatens our democracy, they are saying exactly what you claim to be hyperbole

btw, have you got that definition of dog whistling yet, it comes in handy here if you actually read the articles I am sure you are about to dismiss

'The young WA senator seems to have unleashed something ugly lurking deep in the unconscious minds of both the Labor Party and the media.'

^Quick, run to the hills!!!

You don't think anything ugly happened this week with the labor backgrounding and media focus not on Payman's position but her ethnicity and religion being the reason for her position?

'There was the groundless claim from the ABC that Payman was a religious zealot allowing herself to be “guided by God”, later quietly downplayed in amendments to the article. Then the insistence from the prime minister that Payman was engaged in sectarian politics that will undermine multiculturalism and end up hurting minority groups — a statement that in its media form sounded more like a threat than a warning.'

^Only a *n moron would believe this.

Here's the thing Carrie, this website and social media is full of people who believe this, they regurgitate it, they tell their friends its true

they talk about it at the pub

just because you don't think anyone would believe it doesn't make it the case, it also doesn't make it not dangerous

“One senior minister says it will be a ‘disaster’ for Australia’s almost 1 million Muslim population and in time spark an Islamophobic backlash,”

^ Like every non muslim is gonna gather their pitch fork and jerry cans in search for muslims, or minimum, ready to spew vile hatred from behind a keyboard.

Ah the old nothing happens in the real world right? Or if it does its not with pitchforks so its ok right?

'Here, The Muslim Vote — a hitherto unknown outfit that examines politicians’ voting records on issues notionally of interest to people of Islamic faith — has been beaten up into a nascent political party that Fatima Payman would be joining (inconveniently, she’s sitting as an independent) and has become the emblem of the dreaded sectarianism that is poised to destroy Australia’s social cohesion. '

^I've seen this movie before, seems the scared morons on the right (like someone in here) have this stupid belief the islam / muslim are gonna take over Straya, and we'll all live like muslims against our will , yeah how'd that pan out last time?

So you've seen these arguments used before in the media but you don't thin they are an issue because they haven't come true?

I could go on or just pasted the whole article, it's click bait opinionated bullsh*t intended to suck in offence seekers.

I think you get the picture.

Yes you think the problem is people being offended by racism, not racism itself

you think no racists are going to be stirred up by this because "only morons would believe it", its not true so why does it matter if they say it

all you have done, is dismiss an opinion you don't like with no evidence to back up why, because you don't like it

you've been insulting and belittling and done all these things you take great offence to elsewhere on this forum

Mud slinging? What claiming sensationalism is mud slinging?

Ok then, who *n cares then.

If whatever you wanna claim is dog whistling, only offence seeking d*ck heads care about it.

offense seeking dickheads would be another example of your mud slinging

really the hypocrisy on display after your little soap box efforts in another thread last week are quite something

you've gone full pretzel here well done