Autopsy Round 3 = Collingwood 91-104 Geelong

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Jonno94 said:
Disagree, we can't keep up this style for an entire season. The players are going to be burnt to a crisp by round 10 and we'll only won 2-3 more games, calling it now. Bookmark it.
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Reminds me a bit of of Buckley’s style 2014-15.

All though that was more about agrressive pressure than aggressive ball movement and wasn’t as good efficient going forward. Both those years we looked liked finals team until it fell apart in the second half of the season where it all collapsed. We also had games where we pushed too team like Hawthorn but their class overun out pressure in the end.

It’s early days of McRae implanting a style so I won’t be to harsh and it still looks more effective than the example I put down but I hope as the year goes on we add another string to our bow. We have Daicos and Pendlebury at half back so I hope we can become are more composed back half possession team when we need to switch the tempo.
 
Jonno94 said:
Point me in the direction of teams that have lost by 2 goals after being 30 points up at the start of the 4th in recent history.
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2016
Round 21
3/4 time
Tigers 11.6.72
Cats 4.13.37

Margin 35 points

Full time
Tigers 12.6.78
Cats 10.22.82

Winning margin 4 points
39 point turn around.

Please remind me again just how the Richmond Football Club went after this shocking humiliating loss to Geelong?

I mean surely they must have self imploded and gone nowhere for the next 5 years based on your genius logic.

2017 - Premiers
2018 - Preliminary finalists (belted and embarrassed by Collingwood much more than we were against the Cats last night)
2019 - Premiers
2020 - Premiers

We were bottom 4 last year. The team is learning a new gameplan. Get a grip on reality and just sit back and enjoy watching the growth and improvement of players like Daicos, Mcreery, Henry etc etc over the next 12-18 months.
 

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Jonno94 said:
Show me how its the same, I'll wait for you to collect the data. We were a kick-mark retain possession side in 2018.
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Uh, no we weren’t. We switched to that in 2019 after WC used that game style to beat us in the GF. We weren’t quite as chaos ball centric back then as now, but we certainly weren’t what you’re describing here.
 
In a contest full of momentum shifts, Collingwood were unable to keep momentum in the final term to lose against Geelong by 13 points, after the Magpies had a lead of 37 points at the 29th minute of the third quarter, before relinquishing complete control of the game against the Cats. Collingwood peppered the goals for much of the first half without converting most of their opportunities at goal, which also contributed to the lack of scoreboard pressure that initially kept Geelong interested during the first two quarters. The third term saw the Magpies cash in with 9 majors for the quarter and build a lead that was almost unassailable, before the Cats overwhelmed the Woods with quick ball movement and superior goalkicking accuracy, which proved to be the difference in a high-scoring shootout on the night.

Collingwood won most of the key statistical categories from sources such as disposals by +36 (393 - 357), kicks were won by +7 (204 - 197), +29 for handballs, while contested possessions had an advantage of +23 (158 - 135), uncontested possessions had a margin of +34 (239 - 205) and intercept possessions had a differential of +7 (73 - 66). Hit-outs were won narrowly by +3 (34 - 31), clearances were up by +4 (41 - 37), with stoppage clearances won by +4 (26 - 22), while marks went Collingwood's way by +5 (80 - 75),uncontested marks were up by +9 (75 - 66), and +12 for Inside 50s (59 - 47). The only categories Geelong claimed were tackles by +4 (60 - 56), Contested Marks were won by +4 (9 - 5), while Marks Inside 50 proved hugely decisive with a differential of +13 (20 - 7). Centre clearances were all square (15 each), while Tackles Inside 50 were evenly shared (8 apiece).

Taylor Adams (30 disposals @ 63%, 220 metres gained, 13 contested possessions, 17 uncontested possessions, 10 kicks, 20 handballs, 4 marks, 3 tackles, 1 goal assist, 10 score involvements, 8 clearances, 3 centre clearances, 5 stoppage clearances & 4 Inside 50s) displayed his strengths with his contested ball work releasing teammates into space, which also commenced numerous scoring chains that did not always result in goals. Adams will be annoyed with himself for taking advantage of a free kick that was paid to Josh Daicos in the second term, and Adams decided to snap it off his left boot which hit the post. Adams needs to be smarter and wiser when taking advantage of free kicks by making sure of it.

Jack Crisp (24 disposals @ 71%, 494 metres gained, 6 contested possessions, 18 uncontested possessions, 4 intercept possessions, 11 kicks, 13 handballs, 5 marks, 3 tackles, 1 goal assist, 2 score involvements & 8 Inside 50s) provided great drive through the midfield to give the forwards plenty of opportunities to contest or mark the ball, unfortunately none of the forward entries Crisp had did not give the team much value for the work he did through the midfield.

Patrick Lipinski (23 disposals @ 78%, 206 metres gained, 6 contested possessions, 17 uncontested possessions, 2 intercept possessions, 10 kicks, 13 handballs, 4 marks, 4 tackles, 4 score involvements, 2 clearances, 4 Rebound 50s & 1 goal) accumulated his possessions nicely, but was not as effective nor influential as he previously had produced in his first two games.

Josh Daicos (21 disposals @ 76%, 317 metres gained, 7 contested possessions, 14 uncontested possessions, 4 intercept possessions, 10 kicks, 11 handballs, 3 marks, 4 score involvements, 2 Inside 50s & 1 goal) played his role solidly on the wing by giving team territory with his disposals, and bobbed up forward to crumb smartly for his only goal for the match.

Jordan De Goey (20 disposals @ 45%, 345 metres gained, 13 contested possessions, 7 uncontested possessions, 2 intercept possessions, 11 kicks, 9 handballs, 5 marks, 2 tackles, 10 score involvements, 4 clearances, 3 stoppage clearances, 2 Inside 50s & 1 goal) should've been the difference on the night had he kicked his goals in the opening term. De Goey started the game like a house on fire with 12 disposals but failed to finish his work where it counted most. Every chance that Collingwood wins the game if those goals get converted early. De Goey has been given a one-match suspension for his dangerous tackle on Patrick Dangerfield. Remains to be seen if the club will challenge the suspension on Monday morning.

Brodie Grundy (20 disposals @ 50%, 281 metres gained, 12 contested possessions, 8 uncontested possessions, 24 hit-outs, 11 kicks, 9 handballs, 8 tackles, 1 goal assist, 5 score involvements, 8 clearances, 4 centre clearances, 4 stoppage clearances & 5 Inside 50s) applied great effort with his work in ruck contests, impacted clearances and tackling pressure was very good. The only issue was, not many of his clearances were clean and effective. In short Grundy's numbers looked good, but his composure did not marry up with the contribution he had against Geelong's midfield.

Steele Sidebottom (19 disposals @ 68%, 426 metres gained, 3 contested possessions, 16 uncontested possessions, 3 intercept possessions, 14 kicks, 5 handballs, 5 marks, 3 score involvements, 4 Inside 50s & 2 Rebound 50s) had a very similar game on the wing as Josh Daicos had on the opposite wing, by providing the team territory with kicking that was largely effective to the team's ball movement.

Nick Daicos (26 disposals @ 73%, 278 metres gained, 9 contested possessions, 17 uncontested possessions, 3 intercept possessions, 13 kicks, 13 handballs, 4 marks, 2 tackles, 6 score involvements, 5 clearances, 2 centre clearances, 3 centre clearances, 2 Inside 50s & 1 goal) had an impact early with his first Collingwood goal being an exquisite kick from 45 metres in the opening term. From there, Nick was rotated from defence into the midfield for the first time this season, and proved he could win clearances from limited midfield minutes.

Isaac Quaynor (21 disposals @ 86%, 458 metres gained, 8 contested possessions, 13 uncontested possessions, 12 intercept possessions, 14 kicks, 7 handballs, 7 marks, 2 score involvements, 4 Inside 50s & 5 Rebound 50s) was the pick of Collingwood's defenders with a breathtaking display of intercept marks and penetrating kicks on the rebound which hit targets.

Scott Pendlebury (20 disposals @ 85%, 163 metres gained, 12 contested possessions, 8 uncontested possessions, 9 intercept possessions, 7 kicks, 13 handballs, 2 marks, 8 tackles, 1 goal assist, 5 score involvements, 2 clearances, 2 stoppage clearances, 2 Inside 50s & 2 Rebound 50s) was made to work for his possessions behind the ball, with Geelong reducing Pendlebury's ability to kick the ball and forcing him to handpass for the majority of the time, where Pendlebury was still able to hit his targets.

John Noble (18 disposals @ 78%, 357 metres gained, 17 uncontested possessions, 12 kicks, 6 handballs, 6 marks, 4 tackles, 3 score involvements & 3 Inside 50s) provided dash from the last line of defence all night, and looked to take the game on by kicking to advantage or to contests in the forward half that allowed the team to compete aerially for marks.

Jamie Elliott (26 disposals @ 50%, 281 metres gained, 14 contested possessions, 12 uncontested possessions, 3 intercept possessions, 13 kicks, 13 handballs, 3 marks, 2 Marks Inside 50, 5 tackles, 1 goal assist, 6 score involvements, 3 Inside 50s & 2 goals) had a highly prolific game as a high half-forward by accumulating possessions up the ground, before working back towards goal to boot two majors. Billy would be annoyed at his inability to snap a goal in the last quarter when the team needed it to be kicked. Geelong were able to score the last two goals to win the game after that behind from Elliott, which was the only score the Magpies had conjured for the quarter.

Will Hoskin-Elliott (15 disposals @ 60%, 195 metres gained, 7 contested possessions, 8 uncontested possessions, 8 kicks, 7 handballs, 7 marks, 2 tackles, 1 goal assist & 4 score involvements) won enough ball across half-forward from the marks he was able to take, but he was wasteful with his ball use and will need to correct that aspect next week.

Reef McInnes (14 disposals @ 71%, 284 metres gained, 2 contested possessions, 12 uncontested possessions, 7 kicks, 7 handballs, 5 marks, 2 tackles, 1 goal assist, 6 score involvements & 5 Inside 50s) had an impressive debut across half-forward by contributing to the team's ball movement, and looked lively whenever he won and gathered possession.

Darcy Cameron (13 disposals @ 77%, 119n metres gained, 8 contested possessions, 5 uncontested possessions, 2 intercept possessions, 9 hit-outs, 7 kicks, 6 handballs, 4 marks, 3 Contested Marks, 2 Marks Inside 50, 4 score involvements, 3 clearances, 2 centre clearances, 2 Rebound 50s & 2 goals) started poorly, before a strong third quarter where he kicked both of his goals set his game up for the night. Cameron was also able to pinch-hit in the ruck and won a couple of centre clearances, plus a handful of ruck contests when Grundy was unavailable.

Collingwood's next game will be against West Coast on April 9 at Marvel Stadium. The challenge for Collingwood is to maintain their intensity, pressure and brand for four quarters, while looking to convert goals when they are dominating in general play. The Eagles have continuity and availability issues in their playing group, which the Magpies will look to exploit to their advantage.
 
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Not being able to secure either Cameron or Lynch was a bitter pill to swallow especially when both players ended up going to teams who were in serious contention or had just won a Premiership.

People were rightly left wondering if they could afford them or maneuver that then why not us?

We seemingly dropped the ball on Lynch and left it far to late after Richmond were reportedly in his ear for a couple of seasons. After the 2018 season and addition of Beams (on top of Wells, Mayne etc in previous seasons) our salary cap was at bursting point and we left ourselves with little room to move when Cameron eventually became available.

Hard to argue it's not inferior list management when two rivals at a similar stage on the Premiership window can either still afford to add a big name key forward and/or do a superior job of laying the groundwork to get that player nominating them.

On the flip side quality key position/forward options aren't easy to come by despite what some people continue to believe.

Sometimes it's merely good timing like finishing low on the ladder in a season a quality KPP prospect is still available at your first pick (Melbourne with Jackson), others it's good fortune like when Hawthorn struck gold because Richmond overlooked both Roughead and Franklin or Gold Coast bypassed Max King with picks 2 and 3 and he landed at the Saints.

Sometimes it's a flip of the coin decision and you either look like a winner by taking Stephenson come the end of 2018 or a fool at end of 2020 because you didn't take Naughton instead. Hard to criticise Hine in terms of actual talent ID when Stephenson went on to win the rising star but when confronted with the choice of taking a good big man over a small that old adage probably exists for a reason and Hine ultimately made the wrong call and as a paid employee has to wear it.

No doubt also it sometimes just comes down to good planning, smart trading, drafting and salary cap management that allows clubs to make best use of the money or draft picks available in any given season and strike.

We clearly have room for improvement when it comes to the management of our list, our salary cap mess was an embarrassment and while it's easy to judge in hindsight giving up a secondary top 10 selection for a player no longer at the club hurts (as does continuing to pay part of his wage) while the much higher than anticipated cost of pick 2 for our ability to draft Poulter and McMahon in 2020 leaves us hoping at least one goes on to play 100+ games for the club.

With no ability to turn back time or make use of a crystal ball to nail every selection we can only hope that with Wright now in charge of list management and Hine returning exclusively to recruitment we put ourselves in a position to identify and gain that elite key forward we crave.
 
No SPIN said:
It’s complete and 100% justification.
The fact you are using hindsight to question it doesn’t alter the logic at the time.

A career ending injury can happen with a one year contract - you are clutching at straws.
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JEEZUZ NS

You just shot yourself in the foot.

If a career ending injury can happen with a one year contract how much more likely is it to happen with a seven year contract.

Pointless continuing to respond to your posts on this subject as you just can't grasp the essential facts.

Moving on.
 

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jathanas said:
There's a few kids that will be feeling the bruises and the cold months but clubs are more sophisticated with managing loads and recovery these days.

Can't see the side hitting a wall if we stay injury free knock-on-wood. The spine of the team is experienced.
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I hope you’re right about this, as I think we will hit a wall, or fall off a cliff, with the youngsters. And we still have potentially Johnson and Harrison to debut. The coach is already talking about managing ND.

Friday nights game was ferocious. Which makes Reef’s first game - where he seemingly picked up the pace at ease - even more impressive, let alone ND at three games in.
 
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Vicky Park said:
I hope you’re right about this, as I think we will hit a wall, or fall off a cliff, with the youngsters. And we still have Johnson and Harrison to potentially debut. The coach is already talking about managing ND.

Friday nights game was ferocious. Which makes Reef’s first game - where he seemingly picked up the pace at ease - even more impressive, let alone ND at three games in.
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Yes, Reef looked completely at home. He should be given a run of games to settle in fully. Nick can do it all - we all knew he was going to be a star. What we're seeing just confirms it.
 
Vicky Park said:
I hope you’re right about this, as I think we will hit a wall, or fall off a cliff, with the youngsters. And we still have Johnson and Harrison to potentially debut. The coach is already talking about managing ND.

Friday nights game was ferocious. Which makes Reef’s first game - where he seemingly picked up the pace at ease - even more impressive, let alone ND at three games in.
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Those kids (how ageist on our part!)... those young men have missed formative chunks of lower grade footy due to the pandemic. You couldn't tell by watching on Saturday night... well, during the first 3 quarters anyway. :)

2-3 games off plus the bye might be required for ND, which would be a blow to the club; he's that good. This might be what we have to do with 1st year players to avoid the fall off the cliff.

The 2nd year players (Ollie, Beau, Ginni) would be less likely to hit a wall as they have 2 preseasons under their belt.

I don't remember if Pendles and Daisy were managed during their first year at the club.
 
jathanas said:
Those kids (how ageist on our part!)... those young men have missed formative chunks of lower grade footy due to the pandemic. You couldn't tell by watching on Saturday night... well, during the first 3 quarters anyway. :)

2-3 games off plus the bye might be required for ND, which would be a blow to the club; he's that good. This might be what we have to do with 1st year players to avoid the fall off the cliff.

The 2nd year players (Ollie, Beau, Ginni) would be less likely to hit a wall as they have 2 preseasons under their belt.

I don't remember if Pendles and Daisy were managed during their first year at the club.
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Daisy was great from debut. Pendles was managed a little bit mainly due to glandular fever in the preseason.
 
NMBB said:
Maybe so but we've done it in finals more than other clubs over the years.

PS. on balance there were more +'s than -'s from Sat night
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Love your new avatar. Excellent!
 
jonbe54 said:
JEEZUZ NS

You just shot yourself in the foot.

If a career ending injury can happen with a one year contract how much more likely is it to happen with a seven year contract.

Pointless continuing to respond to your posts on this subject as you just can't grasp the essential facts.

Moving on.
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Career ending injury can happen anytime the contract length is irrelevant. A 10 year offer was made for McD - do you think longterm injury consideration was an issue? Many guns have signed cumulative multi year contracts - if injury was an issue they would have been on rolling one year deals.

It’s a completely moot point.
 
jathanas said:
I don't remember if Pendles and Daisy were managed during their first year at the club.
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Fair point, although recovery and individual training programs have come a long way since then.

Whatever happened to the altitude room?
 
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