Memberships 2019 St.Kilda Membership Thread (FINAL TALLY 42,910)

[plugger66]

i think trav is right but i do think you have a point somewhat

trav is absolutely spot on about the supporter base. its a massive untapped potential. i see more st kilda fans over here than any other club bar wce/freo and maybe hawthorn. for example just the other week i was in some random perth pub in the hills and some bloke pointed out his kid had a saints bib on. you see oodles of car stickers, number plates, polos etc. but not all these people are members. i know of atleast 5 friends that are not and have never been members.

but i do think you have a point on the base taking a bit of a hit. factor in the birth rate/immigration/population increase and i question if our supporter numbers have actually grown. yes membership numbers have but i don't think its at a rate it should be. i think we've just burnt supporters for too long. poor administrations, not reaching ultimate success, the different sagas and finally the bubble trav mentioned.

turning that around will take time. the thing thats hurting us now is our inability to get the core of our business right, on field performance.

Again I don’t want to rude but the supporter base in wa isn’t where it’s needed. My suburb alone should have more supporters. It certainly did years ago but it’s not hard to see now the drop off. Still got more supporters than any other club but not like we had years ago. As for burning supporters well how do we know that. I’m being told by a couple we have a big supporter base but we have never had big memberships so I’m confused. Surely if we have burnt our supporters then the supporter base must be less but I get getting that’s wrong.

 

[sunny3193]

You're welcome mate. Very interesting too, I hope that our club has sussed all this out by now.

But even I could have told the Tigers that folks in inner Melbourne usually only identify with one side of the Yarra - and Richmond is one of the few places with a foot in both camps, which might explain their ignorance of this unshakable truth!

Back in the day, as a resident and frequent socialiser in Carlton and Collingwood, I looked down my nose at the Chapel St scene and I very rarely went southside apart from time spent at the Espy.

When I started working in hospitality, I relaxed my stance somewhat and met a lot of people who had healthy social lives in places like Brighton Prahran (sp?) and of course St Kilda and who never visited the scungy rockdog scene north of the river. Ahhh... Memories!

Anyway; Cragieburn? Really, Richmond? LOL

Glad you had the patience to find this.
As you noted, the most relevant part of the video is the map showing the migration flows from suburb to suburb.
North of the Yarra, the population migrated north and west.
South, the population migrated south and east.

Discussion about our supporter base cannot be limited to what’s happened over the last few years or even last year.
It is more nuanced than that.

We need to go back to pre 1926 and the establishment of the tribal hubs.
Then the 60 years of VFL existence until the advent of a national competition in the mid 80’s.
Then the national competition itself.

I don’t expect you in France, or our interstate supporters, to understand the significance of these phases.
Just as I don’t understand the difference between East and South Fremantle.
It’s a Melbourne thing.

But having the opportunity to experience both written and lived history when it comes to our club, I would argue that both George and St Trav are closer to the mark than not.

This is a discussion about support, not membership.
Membership is a completely different beast.
It is simply the monetisation of support.
Nothing more.

Something we have been decidedly incompetent in securing.

If you or anyone else is interested, I will put my thoughts together and explain why our support base is much higher than what many people believe.

 

[plugger66]

Glad you had the patience to find this.
As you noted, the most relevant part of the video is the map showing the migration flows from suburb to suburb.
North of the Yarra, the population migrated north and west.
South, the population migrated south and east.

Discussion about our supporter base cannot be limited to what’s happened over the last few years or even last year.
It is more nuanced than that.

We need to go back to pre 1926 and the establishment of the tribal hubs.
Then the 60 years of VFL existence until the advent of a national competition in the mid 80’s.
Then the national competition itself.

I don’t expect you in France, or our interstate supporters, to understand the significance of these phases.
Just as I don’t understand the difference between East and South Fremantle.
It’s a Melbourne thing.

But having the opportunity to experience both written and lived history when it comes to our club, I would argue that both George and St Trav are closer to the mark than not.

This is a discussion about support, not membership.
Membership is a completely different beast.
It is simply the monetisation of support.
Nothing more.

Something we have been decidedly incompetent in securing.

If you or anyone else is interested, I will put my thoughts together and explain why our support base is much higher than what many people believe.

Id be interested because I believe we have rose coloured glasses on when talking support. Google sporting clubs in Australia and their support. We are near the bottom in nearly all of the articles mentioned.

And why haven't this big supporter base ever transitioned into memberships. Ive heard excuses for 2010 but why not in 2018 after we fixed our supposed membership problems and were looking a very promising side.

 

[sunny3193]

Id be interested because I believe we have rose coloured glasses on when talking support. Google sporting clubs in Australia and their support. We are near the bottom in nearly all of the articles mentioned.

And why haven't this big supporter base ever transitioned into memberships. Ive heard excuses for 2010 but why not in 2018 after we fixed our supposed membership problems and were looking a very promising side.

I’ll put something together for you.
But it’ll be support focused, not membership.
As I mentioned, that’s a whole different beast and a whole different discussion.

 

[plugger66]

I’ll put something together for you.
But it’ll be support focused, not membership.
As I mentioned, that’s a whole different beast and a whole different discussion.

Yes I know the topic is on support but what is a supporter. Like I said everything on google regarding support has us right down very low. Just saying we have good support means nothing without at least some little proof.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

I’m not sure if you reading what I’ve said but the numbers might be up but that is only because the category for being a member has changed. Don’t believe it then look at membership revenue in 14 compared to 18 even the cost has gone up. If it’s fact that our supporter base is up with the bigger clubs I’m sure you can provide figures for that. Remember I’m using fact. You are using non fact as far as I can see. I’m reading what you are saying but whilst I provide fact you provide opinions.

And crowd numbers surely reflect supporter base. Why aren’t they up there with the bigger clubs especially the previous years of 16 and 17.

revenue is linked to the type of membership we sell ... more people are buying lower value memberships for a variety of reasons and in all of the cases the option of dropping to a lower membership is much better than not being a member at all .. im sure if we didnt have multiple membership options our membership numbers would be significantly lower obviously that would be the case but our membership number and our supporter number are differant things (something you still after all these posts you cant grasp)
we have low membership numbers in relation to our peers
we have low game day attendence in relation to our peers

how can you not grasp the basic concept that our supporters who identify as St Kilda as our club at this point have no interest in becoming members and in a large part have no interest in attending games ... George has already said he has seen the figures provided by the AFL to Matt Finnis around this so are you calling George a liar or are you calling Matt a liar for making a incorrect document or are you calling the AFL liars for producing a false document ?
your facts are correct our membership is low our attendance is low but its relavance to our supporter numbers is like saying our goal kicking is bad cause we have a bad sponsor on the uniform ...

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

i think trav is right but i do think you have a point somewhat

trav is absolutely spot on about the supporter base. its a massive untapped potential. i see more st kilda fans over here than any other club bar wce/freo and maybe hawthorn. for example just the other week i was in some random perth pub in the hills and some bloke pointed out his kid had a saints bib on. you see oodles of car stickers, number plates, polos etc. but not all these people are members. i know of atleast 5 friends that are not and have never been members.

but i do think you have a point on the base taking a bit of a hit. factor in the birth rate/immigration/population increase and i question if our supporter numbers have actually grown. yes membership numbers have but i don't think its at a rate it should be. i think we've just burnt supporters for too long. poor administrations, not reaching ultimate success, the different sagas and finally the bubble trav mentioned.

turning that around will take time. the thing thats hurting us now is our inability to get the core of our business right, on field performance.

see here is the thing the support of the team St Kilda hasnt taken a hit as such just the passion for the club and the want to be involved has taken a hit ... i know a former member who basically gave up on footy after the Watters debarkle he is not a member has no interest in being a member and has not gone to a game since 2013 ... but if you ask him he is still a st kilda supporter .. he is not happy with the club and wont be associated with them but he still checks their results he will still cheer us when we win the flag ... we have pleanty of those type supporters .... getting them back is the very hard part

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

Again I don’t want to rude but the supporter base in wa isn’t where it’s needed. My suburb alone should have more supporters. It certainly did years ago but it’s not hard to see now the drop off. Still got more supporters than any other club but not like we had years ago. As for burning supporters well how do we know that. I’m being told by a couple we have a big supporter base but we have never had big memberships so I’m confused. Surely if we have burnt our supporters then the supporter base must be less but I get getting that’s wrong.

again you are missing the point if you get burnt by the club you dont buy a membership you dont go to a game but deep down you still support the club ive met many a person who has given up on footy but they still will identify as a st kilda fan , they dont have a clue who the captain is but the support the jumper , they support the name they support the colours and the crest

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

Glad you had the patience to find this.
As you noted, the most relevant part of the video is the map showing the migration flows from suburb to suburb.
North of the Yarra, the population migrated north and west.
South, the population migrated south and east.

Discussion about our supporter base cannot be limited to what’s happened over the last few years or even last year.
It is more nuanced than that.

We need to go back to pre 1926 and the establishment of the tribal hubs.
Then the 60 years of VFL existence until the advent of a national competition in the mid 80’s.
Then the national competition itself.

I don’t expect you in France, or our interstate supporters, to understand the significance of these phases.
Just as I don’t understand the difference between East and South Fremantle.
It’s a Melbourne thing.

But having the opportunity to experience both written and lived history when it comes to our club, I would argue that both George and St Trav are closer to the mark than not.

This is a discussion about support, not membership.
Membership is a completely different beast.
It is simply the monetisation of support.
Nothing more.

Something we have been decidedly incompetent in securing.

If you or anyone else is interested, I will put my thoughts together and explain why our support base is much higher than what many people believe.

yes exactly !!!!

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

I’ll put something together for you.
But it’ll be support focused, not membership.
As I mentioned, that’s a whole different beast and a whole different discussion.

sunny honestly dont bother .... all you will do is enter a endless wirlpool of disagreement with him but if you want to take over im out i cant discuss this any more with him ... the pot plant on my desk understands the differance between supporter and member more than he does ...

 

[plugger66]

again you are missing the point if you get burnt by the club you dont buy a membership you dont go to a game but deep down you still support the club ive met many a person who has given up on footy but they still will identify as a st kilda fan , they dont have a clue who the captain is but the support the jumper , they support the name they support the colours and the crest

That's not a supporter. That is someone just saying they support a club because they have too. They aren't the ones who will buy a membership or go to games so basically no use to us. And if we have millions of supporters as I believe you claimed and they were burnt when members we must have had large membership numbers or huge churn. We have never had either of those so how are these non members being burnt.

Love your large post to sunny. Childish at best. I give you facts and you give me opinions and then crack it when I challenge the opinions and say I don't get it. I suggest you are not getting it because you are yet to provide anything at all that has some fact in it. if you come on here and don't like being challenged them maybe prove me wrong and I will shut up. And I completely understand the difference between a supporter and member. My dead grandmother would understand but you don't understand that you have provided no facts to back up these claim of a big supporter base. You even told me some strange story about our supporters don't follow local clubs. Based on what may I ask.

Get some confidence trav and don't tell another poster he is wasting his time because I don't understand. Luckily sunny will provide some sort of proof and then I can say sorry.

 

[StCicatriz]

see here is the thing the support of the team St Kilda hasnt taken a hit as such just the passion for the club and the want to be involved has taken a hit ... i know a former member who basically gave up on footy after the Watters debarkle he is not a member has no interest in being a member and has not gone to a game since 2013 ... but if you ask him he is still a st kilda supporter .. he is not happy with the club and wont be associated with them but he still checks their results he will still cheer us when we win the flag ... we have pleanty of those type supporters .... getting them back is the very hard part

i 100% agree with that. i know people who have turned away, but when they play here, they'll tune in or atleast check the score as you say or if we get on a roll i have no doubt they'll actively watch. but getting them to be members, ****ed if i know how you do that! they just dont seem to be interested in that

 

[StCicatriz]

Again I don’t want to rude but the supporter base in wa isn’t where it’s needed. My suburb alone should have more supporters. It certainly did years ago but it’s not hard to see now the drop off. Still got more supporters than any other club but not like we had years ago. As for burning supporters well how do we know that. I’m being told by a couple we have a big supporter base but we have never had big memberships so I’m confused. Surely if we have burnt our supporters then the supporter base must be less but I get getting that’s wrong.

interstate members are absolutely needed. they are money for jam. as someone at the club put it "you're effectively making a donation to the club". here's the other thing, they turn on their tv's to watch the game. tv ratings are an important metric which drives things like sponsorship.

but i do take your point, members in melbourne is very important!

as for the last part, i dont think you get what they are saying. they are talking about what club they identify as supporting. not active support or even going one step further, members.

 

[plugger66]

interstate members are absolutely needed. they are money for jam. as someone at the club put it "you're effectively making a donation to the club". here's the other thing, they turn on their tv's to watch the game. tv ratings are an important metric which drives things like sponsorship.

but i do take your point, members in melbourne is very important!

as for the last part, i dont think you get what they are saying. they are talking about what club they identify as supporting. not active support or even going one step further, members.

Of course interstate members are needed. They are probably better members than vic members but the real increase will come from Melbourne. And I totally get what they are saying. I’m saying who they identify with matters little if there is no hope at all in buying memberships watching game on tx or going to games. If you were asked a question who do you follow and then you said I don’t really care but I suppose the saints they aren’t supporting the club because that will amount to nothing. But the bigger thing is there has been no proof to suggest we have a big supporter base anyway. Google football supporter numbers and everything written has us near the bottom. Saying we have a big base without proof is just an opinion.

 

[StCicatriz]

Of course interstate members are needed. They are probably better members than vic members but the real increase will come from Melbourne. And I totally get what they are saying. I’m saying who they identify with matters little if there is no hope at all in buying memberships watching game on tx or going to games. If you were asked a question who do you follow and then you said I don’t really care but I suppose the saints they aren’t supporting the club because that will amount to nothing. But the bigger thing is there has been no proof to suggest we have a big supporter base anyway. Google football supporter numbers and everything written has us near the bottom. Saying we have a big base without proof is just an opinion.

i think thats the thing, they have proof. it sounds like the club has been given a detailed report into club supporter numbers

 

[plugger66]

i think thats the thing, they have proof. it sounds like the club has been given a detailed report into club supporter numbers

No idea why the afl would keep it secret and no idea why google searches suggest otherwise. And if only identifying a club then that means jack because those type will never become members of our club or any club whether you win a flag or not. These guys kids want instant gratification and the days of following your dads club are long gone.

 

[Saint Watto]

There's a detailed video explaining exactly how Richmond grew their supporter base. If someone can find it I'd love to re-watch it. I always say this but back in 2010 we had more members than they did, they only had about 30,000. One flag got them a 30,000 increase, but the rest? They went about it the right way.

As for the figures they are league issued figures. It had every club on there and their market size, latent supporter base, supporter demographic, etc etc...it had a lot of stuff on it.

I saw that vid link posted on here back in 2017......…..to say I was absolutely amazed at the detail that Richmond and their marketing company went to... to grow their membership base would be an understatement.

As you say st_trav and George.....the Saints are following that template too.....and it's starting to work....how else do you explain us in an absolute crap year nearly getting 47,000 members.

 

[plugger66]

I saw that vid link posted on here back in 2017......…..to say I was absolutely amazed at the detail that Richmond and their marketing company went to... to grow their membership base would be an understatement.

As you say st_trav and George.....the Saints are following that template too.....and it's starting to work....how else do you explain us in an absolute crap year nearly getting 47,000 members.

Easy. The Catogory to become a member is much easier. It’s explained that our revenue and reserved seating is the same as 2014 yet numbers are way up and the cost to be a member is also up

 

[Saint Watto]

One positive for me was what I saw at the open training session at the start of last July.

It was a cold afternoon and the school holidays were on but I was amazed at the huge number of kids running around in Saints jumpers and scarves.....in what was a huge crowd.

They'll be our members/reserved seats holders in 10-15 years.

We have to start somewhere.

Maxy King....Parker....Gresh...Members …Joshy Bruce.......they will be these kids hero's in years to come.

 

[Saint Watto]

Easy. The Catogory to become a member is much easier.

What's changed here tho plugger....you have to spend $50 or more to count as a member.

 

[plugger66]

What's changed here tho plugger....you have to spend $50 or more to count as a member.

No idea what has changed but it’s obvious something has changed because memberships in the afl go up every single year yet attendances don’t. Secondly how can we have the same revenue as 2014 when we had many less members and the cost of memberships were less. Don’t have to be Einstein to work out there have been big changes to count as a member.

 

[plugger66]

Just a question for most likely George or sunny. I just realised we got 2.9 million for membership and reserved seating last year. Even if that takes out costs that is only $60 a member. Even with different categories now that makes no sense. Surely I’m missing something. There is no way we are only clearing $60 a member. Surely it’s at least $100 especially when you include reserved seating.

 

[sunny3193]

Just a question for most likely George or sunny. I just realised we got 2.9 million for membership and reserved seating last year. Even if that takes out costs that is only $60 a member. Even with different categories now that makes no sense. Surely I’m missing something. There is no way we are only clearing $60 a member. Surely it’s at least $100 especially when you include reserved seating.

No idea plugger.
Can’t answer your question.

 

[StCicatriz]

Just a question for most likely George or sunny. I just realised we got 2.9 million for membership and reserved seating last year. Even if that takes out costs that is only $60 a member. Even with different categories now that makes no sense. Surely I’m missing something. There is no way we are only clearing $60 a member. Surely it’s at least $100 especially when you include reserved seating.

Geeze that ain't good

 

[gringo2011]

Can’t argue with you there Plugger66 . I don’t think we have a huge supporter base.
I think some people have got confused with a potential supporter base being the only team based in the southern suburbs and the actual number of supporters we have . Even in 2009-2010 a lot of times we were outnumbered by opposition supporters whenever we played the top sides . Maybe the years of losing have taken its toll . Younger kids don’t follow us much because we haven’t won a flag since 66 . Kids like winners .

Go Saints

We just came back from camping in NSW, we were in a National park where there are about 20 campsites, there were 5 campsites with St Kilda stickers or beach towels showing, another lot of kids came to hang out with our kids and they were Saints supporters, the people we were camping with there were 3 more. At my kids footy club in Caulfield there are more Saints supporters than any other club etc. I think they are out there, doesn't mean they buy memberships. We have plenty that are extremely half interested, at the kids primary school there were lots but not many that were buying memberships.