Memberships 2019 St.Kilda Membership Thread (FINAL TALLY 42,910)

[austinnn]

Winning fixes nearly everything especially if you have the house in order. It’s just about that matters. You win and everything you mentioned improves. Losing won’t help anything you mentioned even if your house is in order.

sure, but that's obvious and pretty simplistic.
When Collingwood and Carlton are winning spoons and losing personnel they are still getting great TV viewing numbers and attendence, just less than when they're on top. Neither club will ever feel the threat of extinction, despite the fact that they are literally next to each other and geographically serve the same purpose.

 

[plugger66]

sure, but that's obvious and pretty simplistic.
When Collingwood and Carlton are winning spoons and losing personnel they are still getting great TV viewing numbers and attendence, just less than when they're on top. Neither club will ever feel the threat of extinction, despite the fact that they are literally next to each other and geographically serve the same purpose.

That’s because of our history but I can assure Carlton aren’t going that well off the field and if it wasn’t for a couple of rich supporters could be in real trouble. The pies are a different beast. For a club like us winning is really the only thing that will fix our issues. Ratings don’t improve unless you are on the big stage. Same with memberships same with sponsorship. We could be the best run club in the world but our history means we need to win

 

[Diehard Saint]

We need bums on seats, and the only way that happens is with wins.

 

[mightymalaka]

Its a complex issue when it comes to the Saints! I have no doubt we are one of the more popular clubs in the land!
Amongst the general populace! Question is how many of that general populace are AFL Club members?

Another question is why would we be one of the more popular clubs considering our history?
Therein lies the paradox...Don't ever underestimate the pull of an underdog rags to riches story in any form of life!
This Country built itself on the battler philosophy and the more the Saints seem to shoot itself in the foot in the past
People gravitated to the whole tragic nature of the club and yearned for the day it would rise and topple the big boys in town
Who for plenty of people strangely develop a dislike for due to their monopoly of success and power in the game!

This applied much more with previous generations and for that reason StKilda always held a special place in so many
Aussie folks hearts! The huge crowds we were attracting in the mid to late 90's out at Waverley were a case where there was
some precedent of how big the club could/should be! Sadly we then disenfranchised so many of what you would call the swingers
by showing scant regard for their engagement! And then followed it up with even more disregard during our last era of success!
One area was Plugger is right is i have no doubt also we have much less general support now than what we did even only 10 years ago
let alone 20! You can only let people down so many times before they will eventually turn!

In my view it wasn't the losing culture that did it but more the public perception of StKilda the club when it did rise!
Which brings us back to Austin's point on the role and power influence the media have on the masses!
Suddenly we seemed to become public enemy no 1 in the press when we rose. Some of it can be explained by sheer jealousy
of the temerity to upset the natural order, a lot of it seemed almost vindictive to the point of genuine suspicion as to who was influencing
This agenda! Some of it was our own amateurish making with our inabilty to embrace our new support and some through sheer incompetence
from the club when it came to standing up for itself in the face of such negatitive dribble being spoken and printed about the club during so called
over inflated scandals and obvious biased reporting by journo's who were make no mistake still beholden to the traditional power base!

The problem we now have is this current generation coming through dont know any of that, nor do they care!
So our job of winning back the average punter who used to associate themselves with us is more difficult now due to our own failings
more off the field mind you and todays obsession with instant gratification and winning!
So our membership dept and marketing of the club in the big sell is more important now than ever before!
It won't be easy. And as others all agree ultimately it will have to begin with us being successful first and foremost!
And only a flag will get that ball rolling. But where Watters was right is that when and if that ever happens the opportunity for this club
to forge itself a new future and become " The Juggernaut " will be how the club deals with it! Richmond is the perfect template for us to follow
That it is indeed possible! They may have had big success in the past but it was a long long time ago and most of their members have signed up
During their reign as the worst performed Victorian club and thats including Fitzroy for the last 35 years leading into last season!
Gale and his team showed only by being bold and brave by putting out there what their mission pledge would be to the fans! That they belonged and
Were just as worthy as anyone else to be successful and embrace it! We have done nothing anything remotely like that if anything we perpetuate the notion that we
are cellar dwellers and the little kids on the block! Sadly its the inferiority complex the club has always suffered from!

I'm sensing the mission statement down at the club is thankfully starting to change an am hopeful when the time comes the
Club itself will finally stand up and be counted and consider themselves just as entitled as any other club for the success that is still
long overdue! You get what you deserve sometimes in life. I have learnt that the hard way personally, its not that much different even in club land!
When the StKilda FC sticks its chest out and says to the established order...No F*ck you...Nobody screws the StK footy club we will fight for every
right afforded to the traditional Power clubs! You think the likes of the Elliot's, Mcquire, Evans , Costa and Kennett /Gale were ever going to accept being dictated to?
No they make sure their clubs are front and centre when it comes to pretty much every single AFL initiative by making sure their club benefits whether it by the Draw
Zones..Tribunal..Money Grants the whole big picture! They are all aware where they sit amongst the publics conscience. And will fiercely fight to hold on to
that niche in the market, with the only possible exception in recent times being the Blues! They most certainly dropped the ball big time in the last 20 years
But they unlike us have a rich proud history where it will only take them winning again for them to become just as huge as they were when we were growing up!
Only by thinking BIG will this club ever fulfill its perennial potential! We f*cking belong and we are here loud and proud!

Apologies for the ridiculously long rant! But i stand by it god dammit!

 

[Brains Trust66]

Its a complex issue when it comes to the Saints! I have no doubt we are one of the more popular clubs in the land!
Amongst the general populace! Question is how many of that general populace are AFL Club members?

Another question is why would we be one of the more popular clubs considering our history?
Therein lies the paradox...Don't ever underestimate the pull of an underdog rags to riches story in any form of life!
This Country built itself on the battler philosophy and the more the Saints seem to shoot itself in the foot in the past
People gravitated to the whole tragic nature of the club and yearned for the day it would rise and topple the big boys in town
Who for plenty of people strangely develop a dislike for due to their monopoly of success and power in the game!

This applied much more with previous generations and for that reason StKilda always held a special place in so many
Aussie folks hearts! The huge crowds we were attracting in the mid to late 90's out at Waverley were a case where there was
some precedent of how big the club could/should be! Sadly we then disenfranchised so many of what you would call the swingers
by showing scant regard for their engagement! And then followed it up with even more disregard during our last era of success!
One area was Plugger is right is i have no doubt also we have much less general support now than what we did even only 10 years ago
let alone 20! You can only let people down so many times before they will eventually turn!

In my view it wasn't the losing culture that did it but more the public perception of StKilda the club when it did rise!
Which brings us back to Austin's point on the role and power influence the media have on the masses!
Suddenly we seemed to become public enemy no 1 in the press when we rose. Some of it can be explained by sheer jealousy
of the temerity to upset the natural order, a lot of it seemed almost vindictive to the point of genuine suspicion as to who was influencing
This agenda! Some of it was our own amateurish making with our inabilty to embrace our new support and some through sheer incompetence
from the club when it came to standing up for itself in the face of such negatitive dribble being spoken and printed about the club during so called
over inflated scandals and obvious biased reporting by journo's who were make no mistake still beholden to the traditional power base!

The problem we now have is this current generation coming through dont know any of that, nor do they care!
So our job of winning back the average punter who used to associate themselves with us is more difficult now due to our own failings
more off the field mind you and todays obsession with instant gratification and winning!
So our membership dept and marketing of the club in the big sell is more important now than ever before!
It won't be easy. And as others all agree ultimately it will have to begin with us being successful first and foremost!
And only a flag will get that ball rolling. But where Watters was right is that when and if that ever happens the opportunity for this club
to forge itself a new future and become " The Juggernaut " will be how the club deals with it! Richmond is the perfect template for us to follow
That it is indeed possible! They may have had big success in the past but it was a long long time ago and most of their members have signed up
During their reign as the worst performed Victorian club and thats including Fitzroy for the last 35 years leading into last season!
Gale and his team showed only by being bold and brave by putting out there what their mission pledge would be to the fans! That they belonged and
Were just as worthy as anyone else to be successful and embrace it! We have done nothing anything remotely like that if anything we perpetuate the notion that we
are cellar dwellers and the little kids on the block! Sadly its the inferiority complex the club has always suffered from!

I'm sensing the mission statement down at the club is thankfully starting to change an am hopeful when the time comes the
Club itself will finally stand up and be counted and consider themselves just as entitled as any other club for the success that is still
long overdue! You get what you deserve sometimes in life. I have learnt that the hard way personally, its not that much different even in club land!
When the StKilda FC sticks its chest out and says to the established order...No F*ck you...Nobody screws the StK footy club we will fight for every
right afforded to the traditional Power clubs! You think the likes of the Elliot's, Mcquire, Evans , Costa and Kennett /Gale were ever going to accept being dictated to?
No they make sure their clubs are front and centre when it comes to pretty much every single AFL initiative by making sure their club benefits whether it by the Draw
Zones..Tribunal..Money Grants the whole big picture! They are all aware where they sit amongst the publics conscience. And will fiercely fight to hold on to
that niche in the market, with the only possible exception in recent times being the Blues! They most certainly dropped the ball big time in the last 20 years
But they unlike us have a rich proud history where it will only take them winning again for them to become just as huge as they were when we were growing up!
Only by thinking BIG will this club ever fulfill its perennial potential! We f*cking belong and we are here loud and proud!

Apologies for the ridiculously long rant! But i stand by it god dammit!

Wow , that’s one long rant but I agree with what you are saying . Let’s hope it all comes together soon .


Go Saints

 

[Brains Trust66]

Ok , I’m bored today as it’s too hot to do anything so I’m going to talk about the things I would have done if I had won that 100 million power ball last week . It’s only a bit of fun because the odds are so against winning something like that .

Anyway 100 million is so much money that you could give away 50 million and still be set for life .
So my plan was the following-
20 million to the Saints to pay off debt and help pay for the work still to be done at Moorabbin. Anything left over the Saints can keep of course .

Then I thought about buying 10 million dollars worth of junior memberships for the club to give away to school children in the southern suburbs. Hopefully this will encourage lots of youngsters to follow the Saints helping to set up our future. Plus any child who gets a free membership and wants to go will mean most likely an adult will sign up as well .
Just out of interest I would like to know your thoughts on that idea .

I wouldn’t forget my friends at big footy either . Not sure how many saints fans are on here but I would give each one about a hundred thousand. To make sure no body signs up just to get money , you would only get the money if you have enough comments . That number would be left to the mods to decide .

Then I thought another million for the club to raffle off as this would help give the club some publicity rather than just giving the club another million for no reason . Tickets to the raffle would be on sale all season with the winner drawn at the best and fairest night .

Of course I would continue to help the Saints out in the future but hopefully I wouldn’t be needed too often lol.

Anyone have any other ideas to bring up ? Just a bit of fun to help pass the time until the season starts . What do you think of my ideas .

Oh of course I would still have to convince my wife about all of this lmao .


Go Saints

 

[Mangus]

We have always been in the bottom few in terms of support and usually converted more of our supporters into members than most. This is unlikely to change unless we have a long period of sustained success. On average if 50% of supporters inherit their allegiance from a parent and 50% choose their own team then the big clubs are just going to get bigger and the gap is going to widen. If Collingwood have 1,000,000 supporters and we have 300,000 today in a generation they can expect another 500,000 supporters they don't have to work for at all and we can expect 150,000. The only way to change that pattern is to:

1. Have a sustained era of success so those choosing their own team (lets call them swingers) choose us.
2. Focus on winning over as many of the swingers as possible. Which means focusing on, Kids Women and Migrants.

The second point is why an AFLW team is important, why initiatives like the Pride Game are important and why school and AusKick programs are vital. We need as much community engagement as possible so we become the default choice for South East Melbourne like Geelong are in their area and the Dogs attempt to be in the West.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

This is the link to the Morgan Poll.
They polled 14,544 people over the age of 14.
(0.06% of the Australian population.)
That’s roughly 5 people per postcode.
Then they’ve extrapolated their results by multiplying by the population to get the support numbers.

There are a number of key weaknesses with this poll, but I’ll only pick three.

1. If this is a national survey, then the nation as a whole needs to be polled but this ignores the geographic concentration of support. Take the Port Adelaide support: there are over a million people in Adelaide and at least one third of them support Port. To have less than that number as a result in your poll implies negative support throughout the rest of the country. That’s rubbish.
2. The conversion rates tell the story. Brisbane apparently has half a million supporters yet converts to members at an efficiency less than 5 in 100. Same with Sydney. Either support is inflated or they are incredibly inefficient clubs.
3. Support for the AFL in Victoria is less than 1 person in 5. SA/WA are 1 in 10. Does anyone believe that?

I’m not to sure if I’d be basing my business plan on this poll.
There appears to be a credibility deficit.

I would argue that the AFL numbers would have more credibility, after all they’ve got skin in the game.

http://www.roymorgan.com/findings/7345-roy-morgan-afl-supporter-ladder-2017-201709210118

i dont know for certain but i believe that the AFL data comes from multiple sources and factors things such as web site clicks, merchandise sales, readership of specific online news stories, social media reach as just the tip of the iceberg.. this information is pretty indepth hence why only small parts of it are ever shown to anyone and why its not publicly available ....
but hey what would the AFL know about who supports their game

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

Yeah, funnily enough, I was in Australia for 3 weeks over Christmas, specifically Inner east Sydney including right next to the SCG where my brother lives, Newcastle and up near Forster. The whole time there, I saw or heard only 2 things related to AFL:

the first was my brother's family discussing the local council's decision to rebuild the SCG or something and a few Swan items of clothing that my nephews have.

the only other thing was a random bloke in the queue at SeaLife in Darling Harbour wearing a brand-new looking Saints replica top.

We're out there!

mate i was in Peru... in a small bar drinking Corn beer and this guy came upto me cause i was wearing my Saints beanie to strike up a convo turns out he lived in Bolivia and was a saints supporter since a boy growing up melbourne .. friggin Peru and i bump into a saints fan ...

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

We need bums on seats, and the only way that happens is with wins.

winning does do that but a factor is as well being entertaining .... i hear the big directive from the AFL is the way the game is played and it being attractive to watch ... The AFL know dedicated fans want the win for their team but to capture the casual observer and hook them in to become dedicated fans is to make the product as attractive as possible ..

 

[CALL ME SNAKE]

Ok , I’m bored today as it’s too hot to do anything so I’m going to talk about the things I would have done if I had won that 100 million power ball last week . It’s only a bit of fun because the odds are so against winning something like that .


Go Saints

I would have bought the Essendon Football Club.
And then shut it down the next day.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

Wow , that’s one long rant but I agree with what you are saying . Let’s hope it all comes together soon .


Go Saints

second that the rant was epic but pretty spot on ...
i think the main issue is for a lot of our supporters is they dont wear their support as a badge of honour as much as they used to we havent really got that huge "rabbid saints fan" culture around as much any more we are more subdued, reserved or for lack of a better term in the closet about being saints supporters

 

[sunny3193]

i dont know for certain but i believe that the AFL data comes from multiple sources and factors things such as web site clicks, merchandise sales, readership of specific online news stories, social media reach as just the tip of the iceberg.. this information is pretty indepth hence why only small parts of it are ever shown to anyone and why its not publicly available ....
but hey what would the AFL know about who supports their game

We will never have the AFL data revealed.
Absolutely commercial in confidence stuff.
The best we can hope for is our own deduction from third party sources.
It’s the same as the % of the TPP each club is paying.
I can’t find that anywhere, and I doubt it will ever be available.

 

[gringo2011]

The best ratings for gf are when Sydney and Brisbane play. That suggests support even if nearly all of them will never be members.

It's like when the Storm play in a GF though, I will watch but not look at another game or result all year. They might have a good viewing audience but it's not really something they can monetise. St Kilda were getting good viewing numbers when we were up too, our would be much more likely to turn into members if we have a good run than the huge "supporter" base in NSW.

 

[gringo2011]

Its a complex issue when it comes to the Saints! I have no doubt we are one of the more popular clubs in the land!
Amongst the general populace! Question is how many of that general populace are AFL Club members?

Another question is why would we be one of the more popular clubs considering our history?
Therein lies the paradox...Don't ever underestimate the pull of an underdog rags to riches story in any form of life!
This Country built itself on the battler philosophy and the more the Saints seem to shoot itself in the foot in the past
People gravitated to the whole tragic nature of the club and yearned for the day it would rise and topple the big boys in town
Who for plenty of people strangely develop a dislike for due to their monopoly of success and power in the game!

This applied much more with previous generations and for that reason StKilda always held a special place in so many
Aussie folks hearts! The huge crowds we were attracting in the mid to late 90's out at Waverley were a case where there was
some precedent of how big the club could/should be! Sadly we then disenfranchised so many of what you would call the swingers
by showing scant regard for their engagement! And then followed it up with even more disregard during our last era of success!
One area was Plugger is right is i have no doubt also we have much less general support now than what we did even only 10 years ago
let alone 20! You can only let people down so many times before they will eventually turn!

In my view it wasn't the losing culture that did it but more the public perception of StKilda the club when it did rise!
Which brings us back to Austin's point on the role and power influence the media have on the masses!
Suddenly we seemed to become public enemy no 1 in the press when we rose. Some of it can be explained by sheer jealousy
of the temerity to upset the natural order, a lot of it seemed almost vindictive to the point of genuine suspicion as to who was influencing
This agenda! Some of it was our own amateurish making with our inabilty to embrace our new support and some through sheer incompetence
from the club when it came to standing up for itself in the face of such negatitive dribble being spoken and printed about the club during so called
over inflated scandals and obvious biased reporting by journo's who were make no mistake still beholden to the traditional power base!

The problem we now have is this current generation coming through dont know any of that, nor do they care!
So our job of winning back the average punter who used to associate themselves with us is more difficult now due to our own failings
more off the field mind you and todays obsession with instant gratification and winning!
So our membership dept and marketing of the club in the big sell is more important now than ever before!
It won't be easy. And as others all agree ultimately it will have to begin with us being successful first and foremost!
And only a flag will get that ball rolling. But where Watters was right is that when and if that ever happens the opportunity for this club
to forge itself a new future and become " The Juggernaut " will be how the club deals with it! Richmond is the perfect template for us to follow
That it is indeed possible! They may have had big success in the past but it was a long long time ago and most of their members have signed up
During their reign as the worst performed Victorian club and thats including Fitzroy for the last 35 years leading into last season!
Gale and his team showed only by being bold and brave by putting out there what their mission pledge would be to the fans! That they belonged and
Were just as worthy as anyone else to be successful and embrace it! We have done nothing anything remotely like that if anything we perpetuate the notion that we
are cellar dwellers and the little kids on the block! Sadly its the inferiority complex the club has always suffered from!

I'm sensing the mission statement down at the club is thankfully starting to change an am hopeful when the time comes the
Club itself will finally stand up and be counted and consider themselves just as entitled as any other club for the success that is still
long overdue! You get what you deserve sometimes in life. I have learnt that the hard way personally, its not that much different even in club land!
When the StKilda FC sticks its chest out and says to the established order...No F*ck you...Nobody screws the StK footy club we will fight for every
right afforded to the traditional Power clubs! You think the likes of the Elliot's, Mcquire, Evans , Costa and Kennett /Gale were ever going to accept being dictated to?
No they make sure their clubs are front and centre when it comes to pretty much every single AFL initiative by making sure their club benefits whether it by the Draw
Zones..Tribunal..Money Grants the whole big picture! They are all aware where they sit amongst the publics conscience. And will fiercely fight to hold on to
that niche in the market, with the only possible exception in recent times being the Blues! They most certainly dropped the ball big time in the last 20 years
But they unlike us have a rich proud history where it will only take them winning again for them to become just as huge as they were when we were growing up!
Only by thinking BIG will this club ever fulfill its perennial potential! We f*cking belong and we are here loud and proud!

Apologies for the ridiculously long rant! But i stand by it god dammit!

I got back into footy in my teens ('90s) because we were battlers coming good, I loved that we were underdogs and outsiders. I knew lots of musos who thought the plucky loser narrative was appealing too. I started out as a Blues supporter and changed in the 80s to the Saints because of my grandfather but I still think even as a kid it served as a mark of obstinate individualism. I was the only kid at my school in Carlton that followed us. Carlton, Essendon and the odd Dog were pretty much it there. I hated it at times but I think I liked the anarchic anti-socialness of being a Saint in enemy territory. It gave me an identity.

 

[plugger66]

It's like when the Storm play in a GF though, I will watch but not look at another game or result all year. They might have a good viewing audience but it's not really something they can monetise. St Kilda were getting good viewing numbers when we were up too, our would be much more likely to turn into members if we have a good run than the huge "supporter" base in NSW.

Well history suggests that's wrong. We can keep talking about the huge supporter base but until there is facts to prove it like large memberships or crowds its a myth or maybe our huge base are just like Sydney supporters, they say they follow us but have no interest in taking it further.

 

[plugger66]

We will never have the AFL data revealed.
Absolutely commercial in confidence stuff.
The best we can hope for is our own deduction from third party sources.
It’s the same as the % of the TPP each club is paying.
I can’t find that anywhere, and I doubt it will ever be available.

You should be able to get the TPP from player payments in the annual report. Wont be 100% accurate because some don't come under TPP but it will close.

 

[Diehard Saint]

winning does do that but a factor is as well being entertaining .... i hear the big directive from the AFL is the way the game is played and it being attractive to watch ... The AFL know dedicated fans want the win for their team but to capture the casual observer and hook them in to become dedicated fans is to make the product as attractive as possible ..

Except that very few of us complained when we were winning with RL’s largely dour style...although I will admit to being incredibly envious of the entertaining way the Cats played in that era. ( so shoot me)

 

[Diehard Saint]

Come on people, have a read of the mental health thread.
No need to make things personal...just ignore if need be.
( Lecture over.)

 

[Persevering Saint]

I posted this in another thread, but I think it speaks to this conversation about why people become Saints fans.

 

[mightymalaka]

Well history suggests that's wrong. We can keep talking about the huge supporter base but until there is facts to prove it like large memberships or crowds its a myth or maybe our huge base are just like Sydney supporters, they say they follow us but have no interest in taking it further.

There was that AFL report from roughly 8-10 years ago but as has been mentioned, good luck getting that info for the public!
I dont think membership numbers are an accurate portrayal of total support!
Does anyone honestly believe that Hawthorn is a more popular club than Carlton? Or that the Dogs or Melbourne are more popular than us?
Its a cyclical thing related to on field performance these days more than ever with some supporter bases!
In our case we cannot afford to be down for too long anymore due to the changing landscape of the avg fan and because we have burnt them in the past!

Does not mean we can't get them back if the club can get its act together!

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

Except that very few of us complained when we were winning with RL’s largely dour style...although I will admit to being incredibly envious of the entertaining way the Cats played in that era. ( so shoot me)

yeah thats the point us fanatical fans were just happy with the wins but for the neutral supporters or the casual observer it was not a great spectical ... the AFL im led to believe have been really strong on all clubs about the style of footy thats played... the comment i heard was "yeah you may win but whats the point if no one watches"

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

Come on people, have a read of the mental health thread.
No need to make things personal...just ignore if need be.
( Lecture over.)

trying to brother trying to...

 

[StCicatriz]

second that the rant was epic but pretty spot on ...
i think the main issue is for a lot of our supporters is they dont wear their support as a badge of honour as much as they used to we havent really got that huge "rabbid saints fan" culture around as much any more we are more subdued, reserved or for lack of a better term in the closet about being saints supporters

we are seen as a joke. openly made fun of.

 

[sunny3193]

You should be able to get the TPP from player payments in the annual report. Wont be 100% accurate because some don't come under TPP but it will close.

You cannot get % of TPP paid from the Annual Report.