Memberships 2019 St.Kilda Membership Thread (FINAL TALLY 42,910)

[st_trav_ofWA]

That's not a supporter. That is someone just saying they support a club because they have too. They aren't the ones who will buy a membership or go to games so basically no use to us. And if we have millions of supporters as I believe you claimed and they were burnt when members we must have had large membership numbers or huge churn. We have never had either of those so how are these non members being burnt.

Love your large post to sunny. Childish at best. I give you facts and you give me opinions and then crack it when I challenge the opinions and say I don't get it. I suggest you are not getting it because you are yet to provide anything at all that has some fact in it. if you come on here and don't like being challenged them maybe prove me wrong and I will shut up. And I completely understand the difference between a supporter and member. My dead grandmother would understand but you don't understand that you have provided no facts to back up these claim of a big supporter base. You even told me some strange story about our supporters don't follow local clubs. Based on what may I ask.

Get some confidence trav and don't tell another poster he is wasting his time because I don't understand. Luckily sunny will provide some sort of proof and then I can say sorry.

what ever buddy im done bashing my head against the brickwall that is you ... in the end its not important and im not giving it any more of my time George has stated he has seen the document provided by the AFL i have said i have seen a similar snip it of a similar document but you do you and believe what you want to ...

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

i 100% agree with that. i know people who have turned away, but when they play here, they'll tune in or atleast check the score as you say or if we get on a roll i have no doubt they'll actively watch. but getting them to be members, ****** if i know how you do that! they just dont seem to be interested in that

look its a struggle but it can be done ... our group here has done it a couple of times but it comes down to the personallity of the person ... if the person does like the social aspect of being around likeminded fans then its a much easier sell over time to get them to want to be part of something but some guys they are so deeply out of faith with the club it would take a mountain of work to win them back ...

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

I saw that vid link posted on here back in 2017......…..to say I was absolutely amazed at the detail that Richmond and their marketing company went to... to grow their membership base would be an understatement.

As you say st_trav and George.....the Saints are following that template too.....and it's starting to work....how else do you explain us in an absolute crap year nearly getting 47,000 members.

it most certainly is starting to work ... the way the club is working on the emotional attachment to the club its very smart marketing, we dont have the history of success to sell on but what we do have is a long history and a rich history of coming together in adversity we have a history of finding the good in a shit situation and more recently a history of standing for something ... the way they have made the "with St Kilda" videos being warts and all is smart we could easily edit out the negative from them and make them pure fluff pieces but we have kept them authentic so they are relatable

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

One positive for me was what I saw at the open training session at the start of last July.

It was a cold afternoon and the school holidays were on but I was amazed at the huge number of kids running around in Saints jumpers and scarves.....in what was a huge crowd.

They'll be our members/reserved seats holders in 10-15 years.

We have to start somewhere.

Maxy King....Parker....Gresh...Members …Joshy Bruce.......they will be these kids hero's in years to come.

for sure ... the last game at subi oval we had an open training at the ground this was the wettest most miserable day in perth for ages it was a Friday afternoon during the school week with the session being pretty much bang on peak hour ... we had nearly 100 people turn up for that .. my group run competitions via facebook for kids and the volume of kids who enter is really pleasing (and thats just WA fans)

 

[Diehard Saint]

We just came back from camping in NSW, we were in a National park where there are about 20 campsites, there were 5 campsites with St Kilda stickers or beach towels showing, another lot of kids came to hang out with our kids and they were Saints supporters, the people we were camping with there were 3 more. At my kids footy club in Caulfield there are more Saints supporters than any other club etc. I think they are out there, doesn't mean they buy memberships. We have plenty that are extremely half interested, at the kids primary school there were lots but not many that were buying memberships.

When (not if) we start winning games the band-wagoners will climb back on board. The secret then will be to keep them, unlike in 2009 and 2010 when poor fan engagement, a la the bubble, added to huge disappointment just bruised and deflated so many fans, with many of them giving it away.

Next time we will do it better, of that I am convinced. We are a different club now and we cannot underestimate what moving back to Moorabin will add as well.

 

[plugger66]

what ever buddy im done bashing my head against the brickwall that is you ... in the end its not important and im not giving it any more of my time George has stated he has seen the document provided by the AFL i have said i have seen a similar snip it of a similar document but you do you and believe what you want to ...

No worries. I will believe the facts. You can believe what you want. No idea why you are upset as I only used facts where as you keep using opinion.

 

[plugger66]

When (not if) we start winning games the band-wagoners will climb back on board. The secret then will be to keep them, unlike in 2009 and 2010 when poor fan engagement, a la the bubble, added to huge disappointment just bruised and deflated so many fans, with many of them giving it away.

Next time we will do it better, of that I am convinced. We are a different club now and we cannot underestimate what moving back to Moorabin will add as well.

The problem is you can’t trust the numbers anymore. We may get 60 k memebers and only make as much as 30 k because to be a member is so much easier. We are clearing $60 a member at the moment. I just don’t get why it’s so low. Makes no sense.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

When (not if) we start winning games the band-wagoners will climb back on board. The secret then will be to keep them, unlike in 2009 and 2010 when poor fan engagement, a la the bubble, added to huge disappointment just bruised and deflated so many fans, with many of them giving it away.

Next time we will do it better, of that I am convinced. We are a different club now and we cannot underestimate what moving back to Moorabin will add as well.

you are not wrong ... even for us in WA the move to Moorabbin shouldnt mean a thing to us but it suprisingly does the fans i speak to are all really positive about the return home

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

No worries. I will believe the facts. You can believe what you want. No idea why you are upset as I only used facts where as you keep using opinion.

what ever mate im not engaging .... choose some other shulb to do your whirlpool circle go nowhere conversation im done ... not upset at all just i dont want to waste more time on you ... you can keep your facts for someone else
im not interested in circle work with you anymore its boring and it brings the overall mood of this place down...

 

[gringo2011]

When (not if) we start winning games the band-wagoners will climb back on board. The secret then will be to keep them, unlike in 2009 and 2010 when poor fan engagement, a la the bubble, added to huge disappointment just bruised and deflated so many fans, with many of them giving it away.

Next time we will do it better, of that I am convinced. We are a different club now and we cannot underestimate what moving back to Moorabin will add as well.

My Richmond mates all went nuts and bought memberships when they won the flag. One is an AFL member and hadn't bothered for years and he's now got a family membership and enough merchandise to fill a room.

 

[plugger66]

what ever mate im not engaging .... choose some other shulb to do your whirlpool circle go nowhere conversation im done ... not upset at all just i dont want to waste more time on you ... you can keep your facts for someone else
im not interested in circle work with you anymore its boring and it brings the overall mood of this place down...

It’s going no where because you yes you keep giving opinions but not one fact. If you gave me at least one fact it may help. And then you lack so much confidence you put the blame on me so you can get your likes up. It’s only circle work because you can’t provide even one fact. So far you have said we have millions of supporters and our supporters for some unknown reason don’t follow local footy. Ok then.

 

[plugger66]

My Richmond mates all went nuts and bought memberships when they won the flag. One is an AFL member and hadn't bothered for years and he's now got a family membership and enough merchandise to fill a room.

Did you see their membership before they won the flag. Surely we need to compare us to a similar club not the tigers.

 

[gringo2011]

Did you see their membership before they won the flag. Surely we need to compare us to a similar club not the tigers.

Apparently we a similar amount of "supporters", we just aren't good at making them into members. Richmond only missed finals once in a pretty successful era. They get to capitalise.

 

[plugger66]

Apparently we a similar amount of "supporters", we just aren't good at making them into members. Richmond only missed finals once in a pretty successful era. They get to capitalise.

Apparently we have a similar amount of supporters but no one can show us anything to prove that. If you google supporters of footy clubs in Australia we don't have anywhere near the support. The only facts we can go on is crowd numbers and members and we don't get close. And Richmond had more members when they were struggling than we do now and lets face it to be counted as a member now is so much easier than 5 or 10 years ago. That is proven by our revenue for membership and reserved seating this year was 2.9 million and it was the same revenue in 2014 with many many less members and a less cost to become a member.

 

[George]

Nobody can prove that we are as big as Richmond and nobody can prove that we aren't.

I have seen it first hand, if you don't believe me, I don't care.

This is going nowhere.

Please stop bringing down the quality of discussion with inane conversation. Move it to PM if you still feel the need to discuss it.

 

[Diehard Saint]

The problem is you can’t trust the numbers anymore. We may get 60 k memebers and only make as much as 30 k because to be a member is so much easier. We are clearing $60 a member at the moment. I just don’t get why it’s so low. Makes no sense.

I don’t think you can ever really trust the numbers bc clubs have various memberships including pets, memberships where you just sign up to get emails etc. Still, it is a positive to see the numbers grow even though, as you say, I’m not sure exactly how much you can take out of it.

With no uniform me,berships across the clubs it’s pretty hard to judge where we sit. I do believe we have a lot of latent support, hope they become more visible in the next few years.

 

[gringo2011]

Apparently we have a similar amount of supporters but no one can show us anything to prove that. If you google supporters of footy clubs in Australia we don't have anywhere near the support. The only facts we can go on is crowd numbers and members and we don't get close. And Richmond had more members when they were struggling than we do now and lets face it to be counted as a member now is so much easier than 5 or 10 years ago. That is proven by our revenue for membership and reserved seating this year was 2.9 million and it was the same revenue in 2014 with many many less members and a less cost to become a member.

The ones you reference are Morgan polls where the call 1000 people and then expand that to fit the population. I guess it's going to depend on who and where they polled. Sydney always come out as the most supported club and Lions poll well. Have you ever asked anyone from NSW or Queensland who they support? You would struggle to find one in 10,000 who had seen one game a year, they might "support" the Swans but I can guarantee we have more actual real support.

 

[plugger66]

The ones you reference are Morgan polls where the call 1000 people and then expand that to fit the population. I guess it's going to depend on who and where they polled. Sydney always come out as the most supported club and Lions poll well. Have you ever asked anyone from NSW or Queensland who they support? You would struggle to find one in 10,000 who had seen one game a year, they might "support" the Swans but I can guarantee we have more actual real support.

I think you are backing what I’m saying. Any questionnaire that just asks who you support is a waste of time because like you point out some just give their state team or the area they live without any hope of ever becoming members. Just on the poll though that is how all of them are done. I don’t think 25 million people are polled.

Having said that the biggest grand final tv ratings are when Sydney play.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

It’s going no where because you yes you keep giving opinions but not one fact. If you gave me at least one fact it may help. And then you lack so much confidence you put the blame on me so you can get your likes up. It’s only circle work because you can’t provide even one fact. So far you have said we have millions of supporters and our supporters for some unknown reason don’t follow local footy. Ok then.

oh FFS ....
even when i tell you ive had enough of your bullshit you just cant let it go ... FFS mate give it a friggin break you have already been shunned out of Saintsational because of this bullshit dont bring it here ... enough already
no one wants to read you and me go back and forth arguing a frigging pointles argument ... thats not me getting my likes up that me trying to make the forum a better more readable place and not have it decend into the petty prattle you had a major role in creating over at Saintsational that drove it to the ground
you dont belive what i have seen fine i really dont care ... you want to be right fine your right you are not but FFS if it will shut you the Feck up your right ...
now please quietly feck off and stop baiting me into an argument i dont want to have with you

 

[plugger66]

oh FFS ....
even when i tell you ive had enough of your bullshit you just cant let it go ... FFS mate give it a friggin break you have already been shunned out of Saintsational because of this bullshit dont bring it here ... enough already
no one wants to read you and me go back and forth arguing a frigging pointles argument ... thats not me getting my likes up that me trying to make the forum a better more readable place and not have it decend into the petty prattle you had a major role in creating over at Saintsational that drove it to the ground
you dont belive what i have seen fine i really dont care ... you want to be right fine your right you are not but FFS if it will shut you the Feck up your right ...
now please quietly feck off and stop baiting me into an argument i dont want to have with you

That hurts deeply. I still get help from being shunned out of ss. Anyway I love you.

 

[austinnn]

This discussion makes me reflect on the bigger picture. I have had my head out of the footy for the past 6 weeks so I'm having trouble thinking about it all again.

What numbers are the most important to St Kilda FC? Attendance? TV viewers? Members? Dormant supporters?

Yes, it would give us a lot more pride to see the Saints at the top of the membership ladder than at the bottom, but pride isn't enough for a club like ours.

One problem is that despite being one of the clubs with the longest time in the comp, we're still not really respected or seen as essential to the sport in the way that the big 4 vic clubs and Geelong are. We have the air of expendability.

Another problem is that we don't have much money, which means we are reliant on the AFL's generosity. For now, things are good, but you never know when the tide will turn and people look at the 10 clubs in Victoria and sharpen their axe... back to problem 1.

Another problem is that we didn't grow during our last period of on-field dominance; this prompts one to consider if we ever will grow. We've strengthened our organisation, become more professional, upgraded our facilities, but so far this has had little effect in terms of making the club more attractive to players, sponsors and most of all, Aussie Rules fans. Perhaps it's too early to measure the effect (Dan Hannebury did mention the facilities as one of the positives of his move, but I don't know if it was a swaying factor for his choice.)

So dormant fans that keep an eye out for our progress and will only potentially jump onboard the bandwagon at the very last moment won't do us any good until we pull into the Premiership station.

TV ratings will dictate when we play, which will in turn influence our attractiveness to sponsors and fans, which will dictate finances.

Attendances will do the above, plus has the potential to influence the outcomes of games with the power of a crowd boosting our players and spooking oppo players.

Good membership profit numbers look nice on a table and give the club security to plan for long term investment.

All of the above ensure our safety in an unstable marketplace where at any stage an AFL administrator could decide to reduce the numbers of Vic clubs or move some out interstate. They also partially dictate our reputation/image within the industry (ie if we're seen as a 'minnow' or a big fish, which in turn will influence young people in their choice of club)

Not sure where the people of the media fit into this. They are swayed by onfield progress but also by popularity. They also - like it or not - have the ability to influence popularity and create pressure on the team, umpires, AFL admin and even fans in any direction they choose.

What is important to us as a club?

 

[plugger66]

This discussion makes me reflect on the bigger picture. I have had my head out of the footy for the past 6 weeks so I'm having trouble thinking about it all again.

What numbers are the most important to St Kilda FC? Attendance? TV viewers? Members? Dormant supporters?

Yes, it would give us a lot more pride to see the Saints at the top of the membership ladder than at the bottom, but pride isn't enough for a club like ours.

One problem is that despite being one of the clubs with the longest time in the comp, we're still not really respected or seen as essential to the sport in the way that the big 4 vic clubs and Geelong are. We have the air of expendability.

Another problem is that we don't have much money, which means we are reliant on the AFL's generosity. For now, things are good, but you never know when the tide will turn and people look at the 10 clubs in Victoria and sharpen their axe... back to problem 1.

Another problem is that we didn't grow during our last period of on-field dominance; this prompts one to consider if we ever will grow. We've strengthened our organisation, become more professional, upgraded our facilities, but so far this has had little effect in terms of making the club more attractive to players, sponsors and most of all, Aussie Rules fans. Perhaps it's too early to measure the effect (Dan Hannebury did mention the facilities as one of the positives of his move, but I don't know if it was a swaying factor for his choice.)

So dormant fans that keep an eye out for our progress and will only potentially jump onboard the bandwagon at the very last moment won't do us any good until we pull into the Premiership station.

TV ratings will dictate when we play, which will in turn influence our attractiveness to sponsors and fans, which will dictate finances.

Attendances will do the above, plus has the potential to influence the outcomes of games with the power of a crowd boosting our players and spooking oppo players.

Good membership profit numbers look nice on a table and give the club security to plan for long term investment.

All of the above ensure our safety in an unstable marketplace where at any stage an AFL administrator could decide to reduce the numbers of Vic clubs or move some out interstate. They also partially dictate our reputation/image within the industry (ie if we're seen as a 'minnow' or a big fish, which in turn will influence young people in their choice of club)

Not sure where the people of the media fit into this. They are swayed by onfield progress but also by popularity. They also - like it or not - have the ability to influence popularity and create pressure on the team, umpires, AFL admin and even fans in any direction they choose.

What is important to us as a club?

Winning fixes nearly everything especially if you have the house in order. It’s just about that matters. You win and everything you mentioned improves. Losing won’t help anything you mentioned even if your house is in order.

 

[sunny3193]

The ones you reference are Morgan polls where the call 1000 people and then expand that to fit the population. I guess it's going to depend on who and where they polled. Sydney always come out as the most supported club and Lions poll well. Have you ever asked anyone from NSW or Queensland who they support? You would struggle to find one in 10,000 who had seen one game a year, they might "support" the Swans but I can guarantee we have more actual real support.

This is the link to the Morgan Poll.
They polled 14,544 people over the age of 14.
(0.06% of the Australian population.)
That’s roughly 5 people per postcode.
Then they’ve extrapolated their results by multiplying by the population to get the support numbers.

There are a number of key weaknesses with this poll, but I’ll only pick three.

1. If this is a national survey, then the nation as a whole needs to be polled but this ignores the geographic concentration of support. Take the Port Adelaide support: there are over a million people in Adelaide and at least one third of them support Port. To have less than that number as a result in your poll implies negative support throughout the rest of the country. That’s rubbish.
2. The conversion rates tell the story. Brisbane apparently has half a million supporters yet converts to members at an efficiency less than 5 in 100. Same with Sydney. Either support is inflated or they are incredibly inefficient clubs.
3. Support for the AFL in Victoria is less than 1 person in 5. SA/WA are 1 in 10. Does anyone believe that?

I’m not to sure if I’d be basing my business plan on this poll.
There appears to be a credibility deficit.

I would argue that the AFL numbers would have more credibility, after all they’ve got skin in the game.

http://www.roymorgan.com/findings/7345-roy-morgan-afl-supporter-ladder-2017-201709210118

 

[austinnn]

We just came back from camping in NSW, we were in a National park where there are about 20 campsites, there were 5 campsites with St Kilda stickers or beach towels showing, another lot of kids came to hang out with our kids and they were Saints supporters, the people we were camping with there were 3 more. At my kids footy club in Caulfield there are more Saints supporters than any other club etc. I think they are out there, doesn't mean they buy memberships. We have plenty that are extremely half interested, at the kids primary school there were lots but not many that were buying memberships.

Yeah, funnily enough, I was in Australia for 3 weeks over Christmas, specifically Inner east Sydney including right next to the SCG where my brother lives, Newcastle and up near Forster. The whole time there, I saw or heard only 2 things related to AFL:

the first was my brother's family discussing the local council's decision to rebuild the SCG or something and a few Swan items of clothing that my nephews have.

the only other thing was a random bloke in the queue at SeaLife in Darling Harbour wearing a brand-new looking Saints replica top.

We're out there!

 

[plugger66]

This is the link to the Morgan Poll.
They polled 14,544 people over the age of 14.
(0.06% of the Australian population.)
That’s roughly 5 people per postcode.
Then they’ve extrapolated their results by multiplying by the population to get the support numbers.

There are a number of key weaknesses with this poll, but I’ll only pick three.

1. If this is a national survey, then the nation as a whole needs to be polled but this ignores the geographic concentration of support. Take the Port Adelaide support: there are over a million people in Adelaide and at least one third of them support Port. To have less than that number as a result in your poll implies negative support throughout the rest of the country. That’s rubbish.
2. The conversion rates tell the story. Brisbane apparently has half a million supporters yet converts to members at an efficiency less than 5 in 100. Same with Sydney. Either support is inflated or they are incredibly inefficient clubs.
3. Support for the AFL in Victoria is less than 1 person in 5. SA/WA are 1 in 10. Does anyone believe that?

I’m not to sure if I’d be basing my business plan on this poll.
There appears to be a credibility deficit.

I would argue that the AFL numbers would have more credibility, after all they’ve got skin in the game.

http://www.roymorgan.com/findings/7345-roy-morgan-afl-supporter-ladder-2017-201709210118

The best ratings for gf are when Sydney and Brisbane play. That suggests support even if nearly all of them will never be members.