List Mgmt. 2023 List Management

[The Return of the Paf]

Enough examples of players who didn’t flourish at Gold Coast who left and then became stars, if we like what we see and the numbers make sense we should def bring him in.

I'd rather judge each case individually, though. He'd be a worthy option if we are 'under-budget' so to speak but everyone knows we are tight for list spots and trade capital.

 

[katmanblue]

I'm not talking about giving up two 1st rounders or anything ridiculous, but if we rate him, then do what it takes to get him over.

Remember when we paid "overs" for Saad?

We actually made out like bandits in that trade.

Go for the player don't worry about the pick (within reason).

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[Bamboo Harvester]

Remember when we paid "overs" for Saad?

We actually made out like bandits in that trade.

Go for the player don't worry about the pick (within reason).

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Great post Kat.

And what people tend to forget is that we also received pick 48 from * as part of that deal....which we were then able to trade onto Sydney in order to upgrade our 2nd round pick to secure Corey Durdin ahead of Adelaide.

These deals most often aren't done in isolation, but part of an overall list strategy.

For mine, Austin and his crew are doing an incredible job, and whatever deals they have in place the end of the year, I have full faith....even if it may be paying 'overs' for a player we're targeting.

 

[Stiffler's Dad]

Welcome back Soapy

Jeez I've seen some posts from Soapy and the Penny didn't drop. Welcome home Soapy.

 

[marcmurphy3]

Very good if true.

I think it is crazy that a club could offer a contracted AFL quality player a 5 year deal on good money and then expect to trade a nothing pick at the end of the draft to get them.

I will be disappointed if we roll over. Push for North’s future 2nd. Flip it for Hollands and develop him into the player he projected to become.

Agree. While I like Austin's work so far he has been pretty nice to trade with. We don't have much currency this year so he needs to extract as much as possible for a guy like Fisher. If North get a mid first round compo pick and pick 3 for McKay they have no reason to play hardball.

 

[marcmurphy3]

Concerns about paying a future 2nd for Hollands just proves how overated draft picks continue to be. Hollands is so much more talented then any player we would have access to with that pick it's not funny. Probably nore talented then any player we will get with this year's first for that matter (not suggesting we should trade it). If we can get Hollands for our F2 that would be a steal.

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

Concerns about paying a future 2nd for Hollands just proves how overated draft picks continue to be. Hollands is so much more talented then any player we would have access to with that pick it's not funny. Probably nore talented then any player we will get with this year's first for that matter (not suggesting we should trade it). If we can get Hollands for our F2 that would be a steal.

The way I see it is if we can brake even with what we get for Dow it’s about right and puts us in a good position.

 

[The Return of the Paf]

Concerns about paying a future 2nd for Hollands just proves how overated draft picks continue to be. Hollands is so much more talented then any player we would have access to with that pick it's not funny. Probably nore talented then any player we will get with this year's first for that matter (not suggesting we should trade it). If we can get Hollands for our F2 that would be a steal.

That oft reprinted phrase is meaningless. However, to take it on face value, how do you know that pick 7 from 2020 wasn't overrated? It's selective logic.

 

[BigFrizz36]

Agree. While I like Austin's work so far he has been pretty nice to trade with. We don't have much currency this year so he needs to extract as much as possible for a guy like Fisher. If North get a mid first round compo pick and pick 3 for McKay they have no reason to play hardball.

Being nice is not necessarily a bad thing. We played nice doing the Cerra deal and went back this year and stole Acres.

 

[marleyblue]

Concerns about paying a future 2nd for Hollands just proves how overated draft picks continue to be. Hollands is so much more talented then any player we would have access to with that pick it's not funny. Probably nore talented then any player we will get with this year's first for that matter (not suggesting we should trade it). If we can get Hollands for our F2 that would be a steal.

I hope you're right and based on his draft profile he projects as a genuine need but history is littered with talented players that never reach their potential and the strike-rate is even lower at a second club (Samo, Menzel, Schache just a couple of examples). Will trust the list management team to know whether he is worth pursing and would love us to find a partner/successor for Jack Martin but Holland's GC form doesn't give me much hope.

Fingers crossed a change of atmosphere and a new coaching/development team can unlock the talent...

 

[bigblueboy]

I hope you're right and based on his draft profile he projects as a genuine need but history is littered with talented players that never reach their potential and the strike-rate is even lower at a second club (Samo, Menzel Schache just a couple of examples). Will trust the list management team to know whether he is worth pursing and would love us to find a partner/successor for Jack Martin but Holland's GC form doesn't give me much hope.

Fingers crossed a chance of atmosphere and a new coaching/development team can unlock the talent...

There was talk he was a top five pick.
But like a lot of juniors, Elijah missed a lot of footy due to COVID and he had the added complication of an ACL injury. Is a good size and comes from good stock but his output has been minimal. I think your caution is warranted.
Unlike Ollie, Elijah was not a Carlton supporter ...

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

There was talk he was a top five pick.
But like a lot of juniors, Elijah missed a lot of footy due to COVID and he had the added complication of an ACL injury. Is a good size and comes from good stock but his output has been minimal. I think your caution is warranted.
Unlike Ollie, Elijah was not a Carlton supporter ...

Was talk of a number 1 pick prior to injury and also didn't miss any footy due to to Covid. His ACL was in his draft year right before Covid hit.

His debut year at Gold Coast he showed plenty of signs. Had speed, penetration in his kicking and showed toughness over the ball. This year he has looked woeful from start to finish. Soft, slow, disinterested and weak.

If Austin and the team are keen on chasing him along with half a dozen other clubs I'd infer that he's either been injured or dealing with homesickness, personal issues etc that the clubs aware of which has effected his performance.

Just as Bobby Hill really didn't look much chop at GWS but has turned his form around and looked incredible for the Pies this year or even Liam Henry who looked similarly soft and crap up until about half way through this season, we just don't know whats going on with half these players and why their form can fluctuate so drastically.

 

[DangerousD]

Interesting that Sanders has been granted selection into Norths NGA, although North don’t have priority yet he’s expected top 10, but i think its only a matter of time.

If North do get access to Sanders then North would probably want to trade their second 1st rounder this year, which is 15 i think, id love to see us try get it with our F1 and have a strong presence this draft.

We could take future picks for Dow and Fish to give us plenty of flexibility next year.

 

[DangerousD]

Was talk of a number 1 pick prior to injury and also didn't miss any footy due to to Covid. His ACL was in his draft year right before Covid hit.

His debut year at Gold Coast he showed plenty of signs. Had speed, penetration in his kicking and showed toughness over the ball. This year he has looked woeful from start to finish. Soft, slow, disinterested and weak.

If Austin and the team are keen on chasing him along with half a dozen other clubs I'd infer that he's either been injured or dealing with homesickness, personal issues etc that the clubs aware of which has effected his performance.

Just as Bobby Hill really didn't look much chop at GWS but has turned his form around and looked incredible for the Pies this year or even Liam Henry who looked similarly soft and crap up until about half way through this season, we just don't know whats going on with half these players and why their form can fluctuate so drastically.

I remember lots of people being critical of Hill at trade time last year, he’s been fantastic this year.

 

[marleyblue]

I remember lots of people being critical of Hill at trade time last year, he’s been fantastic this year.

Hard to believe its the same player

 

[Bletch]

I'd suggest that for every Hill there's 4 or 5 SPS's. I'm not against picking up Elijah, but it's certainly a punt. Junior talent is one thing, transferring that to the big stage another. All we've really got to go on is current output, and that's been well below par. I'd still be hopeful that he can turn it around, but I'm not paying the farm for him. Future 2nd is about the limit of what I'd consider paying. And given we're probably happy to offload it anyway, given it'd be swallowed up by bids next year, then fine, go for it.

 

[Benaly28]

Just looked back at the 2018 draft/trade period and noticed we got Newman for a future 4th rounder…Wow!

Just FYI we also picked up Gov/Walsh and Cottrell that year.


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[ctwenty1]

Was talk of a number 1 pick prior to injury and also didn't miss any footy due to to Covid. His ACL was in his draft year right before Covid hit.

His debut year at Gold Coast he showed plenty of signs. Had speed, penetration in his kicking and showed toughness over the ball. This year he has looked woeful from start to finish. Soft, slow, disinterested and weak.

If Austin and the team are keen on chasing him along with half a dozen other clubs I'd infer that he's either been injured or dealing with homesickness, personal issues etc that the clubs aware of which has effected his performance.

Just as Bobby Hill really didn't look much chop at GWS but has turned his form around and looked incredible for the Pies this year or even Liam Henry who looked similarly soft and crap up until about half way through this season, we just don't know whats going on with half these players and why their form can fluctuate so drastically.

this is where the support a club provides to a junior player varies. Some clubs don't do it as well as others, which is why you will see the significant improvement in some junior players once they have moved.

Not saying we should or shouldn't go after Elijah Hollands, but I know that we provide that support much better than GC do.

 

[SurreyBlue]

I'd suggest that for every Hill there's 4 or 5 SPS's. I'm not against picking up Elijah, but it's certainly a punt. Junior talent is one thing, transferring that to the big stage another. All we've really got to go on is current output, and that's been well below par. I'd still be hopeful that he can turn it around, but I'm not paying the farm for him. Future 2nd is about the limit of what I'd consider paying. And given we're probably happy to offload it anyway, given it'd be swallowed up by bids next year, then fine, go for it.

Speaking of SPS. That is just so sad and mind boggling. The kid has the talent.

 

[Bamboo Harvester]

There was talk he was a top five pick.
But like a lot of juniors, Elijah missed a lot of footy due to COVID and he had the added complication of an ACL injury. Is a good size and comes from good stock but his output has been minimal. I think your caution is warranted.
Unlike Ollie, Elijah was not a Carlton supporter ...

Yeah, he followed the Cows. I reckon Ollie would give him some pretty honest feedback about the culture and environment at Carlton though....

For mine, he looks like the type of player that could thrive at a bigger club with more support. If nothing else, he did nothing to harm his chances when he auditioned in the Carlton vs GCS VFL match about a month ago, where he picked up 30 possessions and a goal playing mid/forward.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

this is where the support a club provides to a junior player varies. Some clubs don't do it as well as others, which is why you will see the significant improvement in some junior players once they have moved.

Not saying we should or shouldn't go after Elijah Hollands, but I know that we provide that support much better than GC do.

Yep, one of my friends brothers is involved up at GCS and said that the clubs been a total circus compared to many VIC clubs who's programs and on and off field networks etc are streets ahead.

 

[bigblueboy]

Speaking of SPS. That is just so sad and mind boggling. The kid has the talent.

Yes, AFL is far too demanding and competitive to get by on talent alone these days.

 

[TENACIOUS]

If Dow and Fisher are moving on...

We could ask for future picks, to satisfy Camporeale boys next year...
Norths F2 Fisher
Saints F3 Dow

Would give us more flexibility to trade our F1 into this year, for players or picks...

If we can't get further early draft currency this year..
I could see us, just taking our first Pick then upgrading rookies onto the main list with the next 2x picks...

Then picking through the rookie draft or preseason train on players... We could also be looking at a FAs or Hollands...

Depends where Lewis and the Club see each other...
Lewis Young

33

Lewis Young

Age

26

Ht

202cm

Wt

99kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.6

3star

K

7.5

3star

HB

4.1

3star

M

4.4

4star

T

1.6

4star

MG

197.9

3star

D

4.0

1star

K

3.0

1star

HB

1.0

1star

M

3.0

3star

T

0.0

1star

MG

26.0

1star

D

14.4

4star

K

8.2

4star

HB

6.2

4star

M

6.4

5star

T

2.0

4star

MG

181.6

3star

, could bring unwarranted overs in a trade... KPD are in fair demand this year...

 

[Bamboo Harvester]

If Dow and Fisher are moving on...

We could ask for future picks, to satisfy Camporeale boys next year...
Norths F2 Fisher
Saints F3 Dow

Would give us more flexibility to trade our F1 into this year, for players or picks...

North would be odds on to finish bottom 3 again next year, so we aint gonna get a pick at around 18-21 for Fish.....unless the AFL throw them a few future picks to trade as part of an assistance package, similar to what they received last year.

A future 3rd would probably be more around the mark - this year they have pick 39, which seems about right. You're on the mark though that the pick is less relevant than the points attached to it.

Future 3rd from the Aints for Dow may be somewhere around pick 50ish based on this year's results. I'd be looking for something a little more than that. Could even be their future 2nd, with our's or North's future 3rd heading back their way.

 

[branedotorg]

Fwiw Hollands suits our needs, was drafted as a HFF and was decent playing in that role. Been stuck on a wing this year and it doesn't suit him, unlike his little brother.

Think Jack Martin

21

Jack Martin

Age

29

Ht

186cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.2

4star

K

10.0

4star

HB

6.3

4star

M

4.9

5star

T

3.7

5star

G

0.9

4star

D

14.9

4star

K

7.9

3star

HB

7.0

4star

M

4.3

4star

T

3.6

4star

G

1.1

5star

D

8.2

2star

K

4.6

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.0

4star

G

0.6

3star

who has been excellent this season but just can't be relied on, historically