Ultimate Glory 2023 Trade speculation and Shinbeggars discussion

[Hawthorn2023]

A tanking team doesn’t trade back the second and third rounders

huh?

 

[HairyO]

The younger Hawks supporters absolutely love him.

Us older supporters do too. My partner doesnt watch Aussie Rules but loves him and Daniel Rich.

Rich is more for the beard and thighs. I tell her I have those things too but apparently its not the same.

 

[Dipper]

I don't understand this comment. Can you explain to me why he's Bambi? Is this like when Luke Darcy continues to mention how athletic he is???

I think you're barking up the wrong tree with your implication.

He's clearly alluding to the fact that CJ is so loved by Hawthorn fans that trading him then becomes analogous to the shooting of the similarly much loved Bambi.

With Bambi's mother also being killed the movie was actually very traumatising to many children and with CJ seemingly the most popular player amongst our young supporters the inevitable collective trauma of his trading out might not be palatable to the decision makers, as implied by the post that he replied to and the crafting of his rather witty response.

 

[Hawthorn2023]

I think you're barking up the wrong tree with your implication.

He's clearly alluding to the fact that CJ is so loved by Hawthorn fans that trading him then becomes analogous to the shooting of the similarly much loved Bambi.

With Bambi's mother also being killed the movie was actually very traumatising to many children and with CJ seemingly the most popular player amongst our young supporters the inevitable collective trauma of his trading out might not be palatable to the decision makers, as implied by the post that he replied to and the crafting of his rather witty response.

Just holding Trent Croad's beer..

 

[tl92]

Alright hear me out…

Haynes Whitfield and GWS first pick in a Salary dump deal.

We take Reid with our first pick and Watson with GWS first pick.

FB: Hardwick Frost Haynes
HBF: Whitfield Sicily CJ
MID: Amon Newcombe Nash
HFF: Watson Ramsden Moore
FF: Breust Lewis Wingard
FOL: Reeves Day Worpel
Int: Reid Mackenzie Ward Impey

Emg: brockman mcdonald Greene Butler Weddle Morrison DGB meek O’Sullivan Mitchell McCabe

Let me dream.

 

[killerspud]

Totally. I love CJ and it would definitely be a risk. Not gonna get a first rounder for a player we want to delist though. Only other way is to try a salary dump deal or package other picks (and likely pay a premium). Just as we could get a Lovell, we could also get a star. That’s the gamble.

But it's never going to be a top 5 pick probably not a top 10 pick so the question is a speculative 11-18 pick worth a guy with obvious talent with 4 years in our system who is liked inside the team and among fans???

 

[HairyO]

Alright hear me out…

Haynes Whitfield and GWS first pick in a Salary dump deal.

We take Reid with our first pick and Watson with GWS first pick.

FB: Hardwick Frost Haynes
HBF: Whitfield Sicily CJ
MID: Amon Newcombe Nash
HFF: Watson Ramsden Moore
FF: Breust Lewis Wingard
FOL: Reeves Day Worpel
Int: Reid Mackenzie Ward Impey

Emg: brockman mcdonald Greene Butler Weddle Morrison DGB meek O’Sullivan Mitchell McCabe

Let me dream.

Quite a dream. GWS dump the players they want. GCS do the firesales and Geelong control all of those.

 

[kenneje]

Doedee this year and Todd Marshall

4

Todd Marshall

Age

26

Ht

198cm

Wt

94kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

9.0

2star

K

6.4

3star

HB

2.5

2star

M

3.3

3star

T

2.5

4star

G

1.1

4star

D

8.9

2star

K

7.1

3star

HB

1.8

1star

M

3.8

4star

T

3.0

4star

G

1.1

5star

D

9.6

3star

K

5.6

3star

HB

4.0

3star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.4

4star

G

1.6

5star

next year would be outrageous business.

 

[tommyk72]

My thinking is that we have an excess of small/mid-sized backs. Some great talent is coming through, and we have an excess that are already AFL standard. We need to trade one of them to target other positions on the ground - it's the second spillover effect of Clarko's drafting strategy (after the Tom/JOM/Chad recruitment that has nearly been resolved). In my mind, the only ones with any kind of currency are (in no order):

- Hardwick
- Scrimshaw
- CJ
- Morrison (though more of a wingman)

I doubt we'd get a first for any of them. While I love all of those players (yes, even Morrison - I know there are haters watching on) I'd be ok with getting the best currency we can from any of them.

 

[Hawksboy72]

Not sold on Himmelberg... Doesn't to enough for me.
I'd rather Cumming from GWS he's an elite ball user and can give it a fair roost.
The only way we get another 1st round pick is if we put up a player and 2 second round picks (one being a future one).
We'll most likely be bottom 5 next year which should land us another top 10 pick.
If we could land either Oscar Allan or Todd Marshall

4

Todd Marshall

Age

26

Ht

198cm

Wt

94kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

9.0

2star

K

6.4

3star

HB

2.5

2star

M

3.3

3star

T

2.5

4star

G

1.1

4star

D

8.9

2star

K

7.1

3star

HB

1.8

1star

M

3.8

4star

T

3.0

4star

G

1.1

5star

D

9.6

3star

K

5.6

3star

HB

4.0

3star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.4

4star

G

1.6

5star

that would be a huge bonus.
We'll also started to soon look at the defence as Dimna, frost & Sicily ain't getting any younger.

 

[almuz]

I’m all for taking risks but trading CJ ain’t it

In return, we could draft for example- a talented, fast, high flying flanker with a big tank… kinda sounds familiar

I’d rather keep playing him and get him to use his A+ strengths compared with replacing him with an unknown 18 yo talent.

 

[peetoo]

More than anything I think the team needs the next Cyril.

I too can dream

 

[peetoo]

I don't understand this comment. Can you explain to me why he's Bambi? Is this like when Luke Darcy continues to mention how athletic he is???

It’s like when commentary said ‘Amon calling’ I had to explain to my daughter

 

[FB19]

We don’t have a player we would be prepared to trade that would get a first outright. IMO our only options for another first are salary dump with Gws for tigers first pick or a pick upgrade, giving suns a player and dogs second for their first. Suns need a midfielder as they have no depth and we have too many inside mids. Only player I think they would take would be Worps. I would do that deal especially if it meant adding Reid and Watson.

 

[HairyO]

I’m all for taking risks but trading CJ ain’t it

In return, we could draft for example- a talented, fast, high flying flanker with a big tank… kinda sounds familiar

I’d rather keep playing him and get him to use his A+ strengths compared with replacing him with an unknown 18 yo talent.

Only trade CJ for 2 x 1sts and noone is paying that.

He is relentless even when we suck. We need more of that. And we dont need trades where its only because we offer the most $. We need players who want us to get better and win more.

GWS is full of players who stayed because the $ was awesome and they are the most talented but lazy list in the comp.

 

[Billyc]

I’m all for taking risks but trading CJ ain’t it

In return, we could draft for example- a talented, fast, high flying flanker with a big tank… kinda sounds familiar

I’d rather keep playing him and get him to use his A+ strengths compared with replacing him with an unknown 18 yo talent.

We play our best footy when CJ is on. He is one of the players opposition sides put work into because he is damaging. The key is working through form issues and opposition tactics to find his highest and best use, which is definitely not on the trade table. Even when out of form his defensive running is underrated. He's an unbelievably hard worker.

I do accept agree that we are overstocked for half backs and back pockets. Even looking at selection this week it is hard to find spots for everyone in that part of the ground, so it's one area where will we have AFL level players stuck in the VFL. That means it is a part of the list where we could be looking to trade.

 

[BurnaHawks]

Exactly. It’s like saying Luke Davies Uniacke is one of the best 5 players in the competition. Makes no sense.

If you don’t think Parish is a top 50 player you’re watching a different sport.

If you don’t think Parish is a top 50 player you’re watching a different sport.

You are entitled to your opinion and vice versa.

All good.

Yeah, this bloke throws opinion like he’s been present at the Hawthorn draft strategy meetings!

 

[BurnaHawks]

Alright hear me out…

Haynes Whitfield and GWS first pick in a Salary dump deal.

We take Reid with our first pick and Watson with GWS first pick.

FB: Hardwick Frost Haynes
HBF: Whitfield Sicily CJ
MID: Amon Newcombe Nash
HFF: Watson Ramsden Moore
FF: Breust Lewis Wingard
FOL: Reeves Day Worpel
Int: Reid Mackenzie Ward Impey

Emg: brockman mcdonald Greene Butler Weddle Morrison DGB meek O’Sullivan Mitchell McCabe

Let me dream.

After yesterdays performance no way we are finishing last mate. WC will get Reid....

 

[BurnaHawks]

It’s looks like we may have our BIG key defender in Will McCabe this year, think he’s listed at 197cm and hopefully grows a couple more cm’s. Adding his to DGB, Weddle, Blanck and Sic We have our future well set up down back.

Say we finish bottom 4, we focus on using our first pick on the best Key position player available. Archer Reid, Nate Caddy, Daniel Curtin.

Then we use our salary cap space to buy another first round pick or two (dreaming) from GWS or GCS via salary dump. Use this pick to focus on a Dynamic / X-Factor type forward. Nick Watson, Ashton Moir, Zane Duursma.

Our forward line is where we should be focusing… If we can nail this scenario, we would be well on our way to fixing our problem area (forward line) and to playing finals…

 

[Noel Gallagher]

After yesterdays performance no way we are finishing last mate. WC will get Reid....

You would think so at this stage but I really think it will come down to injuries for both sides. I.E if WCE manage to get some of their better players back in the coming weeks and we then loose a few key players ourselves, it will be close. Also think that alot of our younger players will start feeling the pinch as the year drags on: Not a lot of preseason miles in the tank with a majority of the list

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Yeah, this bloke throws opinion like he’s been present at the Hawthorn draft strategy meetings!

Hawthorn have been very clear with their strategy, whether it’s via SEN, the HUN, fox footy, Hawks Insiders or other media, Rob McCartney and Mark McKenzie have been outlining the list strategy and answering questions on it for the last 2 years.

I don’t get how you’re against me being aware of it and referencing it.

 

[Billyc]

You would think so at this stage but I really think it will come down to injuries for both sides. I.E if WCE manage to get some of their better players back in the coming weeks and we then loose a few key players ourselves, it will be close. Also think that alot of our younger players will start feeling the pinch as the year drags on: Not a lot of preseason miles in the tank with a majority of the list

Yes we have actually had a pretty full list to choose from so far this year, save for Lewis. Things can change but I reckon it's us, North and West Coast for bottom 3, and the health of lists will play a large role in that. At the moment, i'd have West Coast as wooden spoon favourites for that exact reason.

 

[Lickmesocks]

Alright hear me out…

Haynes Whitfield and GWS first pick in a Salary dump deal.

We take Reid with our first pick and Watson with GWS first pick.

FB: Hardwick Frost Haynes
HBF: Whitfield Sicily CJ
MID: Amon Newcombe Nash
HFF: Watson Ramsden Moore
FF: Breust Lewis Wingard
FOL: Reeves Day Worpel
Int: Reid Mackenzie Ward Impey

Emg: brockman mcdonald Greene Butler Weddle Morrison DGB meek O’Sullivan Mitchell McCabe

Let me dream.

I have seen some wishful thinking before but there is more chance of the Easter Bunny being real.

 

[hawkinoz]

But it's never going to be a top 5 pick probably not a top 10 pick so the question is a speculative 11-18 pick worth a guy with obvious talent with 4 years in our system who is liked inside the team and among fans???

but that teens pick can be packaged with the WB 2nd rounder to get to top 10. Or it could be packaged in GWS/GC salary dump deals to push them over the line. All picks have value.
Other than our top 20, I would consider offers for rest. I still believe we should have played hardball for Tom Mitchell's trade & I can see him playing another 4-5 years at the pies.

The ones with value are likely to be CJ, Scrimma, Hardwick, Frost, Worpel, Kozi, Bramble etc lot of them for 2nd of 3rd rounders.. some in late 1st round. We either package them to move higher or trade for future picks.

We need to open 4-5 list spots for next yrs crop.

 

[smish]

What do we reckon we could get for Worpel?