Ultimate Glory 2023 Trade speculation and Shinbeggars discussion

[Ned Ryerson]

if the club you nominate can fulfill the trade requirements then you go to the club of choice otherwise you go where its best for the club..

No. If we had a player coming to Victoria who nominated us and were struggling to fulfil it and the Shinbeggars sauntered in with their swag of free picks and got the player instead we would all be, rightly, ****ing furious.

 

[VandoHawk]

Howdy hawkers, I come in peace. Just on the Brockman deal, I suspect that the later picks that WCE have will be reserved for Lance Collard who is part of some academy or other, Naitanui or NG. Its not like WC to walk players to the preseason draft usually, but considering Brockman doesn't appear interested in moving to Freo despite the four year offer (crazy, right?), it seems that the hawks will just need to deal and move on.

It will happen for a future third. We're trying to get more - you would as well if a young, talented player was leaving - but we'll end up settling while you think you've given up too much.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

My gut feel of what happens now is:

• WCE retain pick 1
• NM retain picks 2 and 3
• We retain pick 4 and trade F1 + F2 for B Smith

Draft as follows:

1) WCE - Reid
2) GCS - Walter
3) NM - McKercher
4) NM - Duursma
5) HAW - Watson
6) WB - Curtin

The Bulldogs want Watson and we want Smith, a pic slide to 4 with our future first going to the dogs, will be what it takes.

 

[GerryLewis]

Amon was a free agent, he earned his right to choose where he wants to go.

OK Amon was a poor example. My point being, if Duursma or another contracted interstate player nominated us we'd expect it to get done. Not have the rest of Vic scrambling over each other to get the player.

 

[extractasam]

Howdy hawkers, I come in peace. Just on the Brockman deal, I suspect that the later picks that WCE have will be reserved for Lance Collard who is part of some academy or other, Naitanui or NG. Its not like WC to walk players to the preseason draft usually, but considering Brockman doesn't appear interested in moving to Freo despite the four year offer (crazy, right?), it seems that the hawks will just need to deal and move on.

Twomey reported today that he expects Collard to be selected between 15-20. He generally doesn’t miss and you can’t match bids inside the top 40. So you’re probably wasting your time sitting on picks

 

[Snoref]

No. If we had a player coming to Victoria who nominated us and were struggling to fulfil it and the Shinbeggars sauntered in with their swag of free picks and got the player instead we would all be, rightly, ******* furious.

Yeah it works both ways but I would be okay with it.

As it stands the players have to much power when it comes to player movements. What the point of contracts if the player has to agree to a trade?

If a player wants out that badly then why should the club be punished to accept anything less than what they want especially for someone under contract?

Players are quick to sign long term contracts but also want the ability to change to teams of their choice when they want? Isn't hat abit unfair?

Imagine if the club signs a player to a long term deal and then that player has an injury that will have long recovery time and they might not be back to their best - imagine if the clubs had the ability to just terminate the contract...imagine the up roar from the players about contract then.

 

[EdCurnowRules]

Twomey reported today that he expects Collard to be selected between 15-20. He generally doesn’t miss and you can’t match bids inside the top 40. So you’re probably wasting your time sitting on picks

oh he did? bummer... I believe he's testing well at the combine.

 

[Flukey!]

The Bulldogs want Watson and we want Smith, a pic slide to ful with our future first going to the dogs, will be what it takes.

I like that.

 

[Faraway Hawk]

The Bulldogs want Watson and we want Smith, a pic slide to ful with our future first going to the dogs, will be what it takes.

Can we also make it clear we will bid on Croft if this doesn't go through?

 

[AussieToffee15]

The Bulldogs want Watson and we want Smith, a pic slide to ful with our future first going to the dogs, will be what it takes.

I'd be thrilled with that deal. We would still get a quality player at pick 5, and back ourselves in that we are really only giving away pick 8/9 next year if we improve.

 

[bigmaxi]

Yes we go into deficit for our round 3 pick not our first.

Thanks heaps, trying to reason my way thru the week. Fingers crossed MM leaps off the couch, hurls his nap rug to the winds and snatches a diamond in the rough late in the third.

 

[Snoref]

OK Amon was a poor example. My point being, if Duursma or another contracted interstate player nominated us we'd expect it to get done. Not have the rest of Vic scrambling over each other to get the player.

Yeah if we have the capital to get it done, port shouldn't be forced to accept a 4th or 5th or 6th for him just because he nominated us if he contracted...

 

[Billyc]

The Bulldogs want Watson and we want Smith, a pic slide to ful with our future first going to the dogs, will be what it takes.

It's a fair deal though if we are traded out of Duursma/Watson, i'd then be open to splitting the pick further. Aim for Caddy and another player before McCabe

 

[BobHawk]

Wright got his targets most of the time, except when the AFL stepped in.

That is just nonsense. He kept missing - Lynch, Shiel, Coniglio. Then he and Clarkson gave away the farm for Wingard because they couldn't land an A grader. Even if we look at Brian Lake. We picked up Lake because the Bulldogs had enough of him and virtually gave him away to us. Seriously.

 

[bigmaxi]

The biased media narrative being pushed is the Hawks are unreasonable. On the other hand the Cats wont accept pick 24 for Esava and yet the media narrative is so very different.

Here is a comparison between the two players.

Esava Ratugolea	Name	Jacob Koschitzke
Geelong Cats	Team	Hawthorn Hawks
Forward, Ruck	Position	Forward
75	Career Games	48​
Murray Bushrangers	Origin	Albury
July 24, 1998	Date of Birth	July 11, 2000
25yr 2mth	Age	23yr 3mth
198cm	Height	196cm
108kg	Weight	96kg
2016 National Draft	Last Drafted In	2018 National Draft
Round 3, Pick #43	Last Draft Position	Round 3, Pick #52
Geelong Cats	Last Drafted By	Hawthorn Hawks
2023	Stats for Season	2023​
16	Games	12​
5.8	Kicks	4.7​
3.1	Handballs	3.9​
8.9	Disposals	8.6​
4.4	Marks	3.2​
0	Goals	0.8​
0	Behinds	0.8​
1.4	Tackles	2.2​
0.1	Hitouts	2.2​
0.6	Inside 50s	0.8​
0	Goal Assists	0.2​
0.6	Frees For	1.2​
0.8	Frees Against	0.2​
4	Contested Possessions	5​
4.8	Uncontested Possessions	3.8​
7.1	Effective Disposals	6.7​
79.80%	Disposal Efficiency %	77.90%​
2.2	Clangers	0.9​
1.4	Contested Marks	1.4​
0	Marks Inside 50	1.8​
0.1	Clearances	0.3​
2.3	Rebound 50s	0.2​
6.1	One Percenters	1.1​
0	Bounces	0​
83.6	Time On Ground %	78.8​
0	Centre Clearances	0​
0.1	Stoppage Clearances	0.3​
1.2	Score Involvements	3.6​
119.4	Metres Gained	84.9​
1.6	Turnovers	1.4​
5.8	Intercepts	0.8​
0	Tackles Inside 50	0.7​

Thanks for that now I want a F1.

 

[DrAbs]

HYPOTHETICAL MEGA TRADE:

Hawthorn OUT: Pick 4, Brockman, DGB, Worpel, Bramble, F-1st	Hawthorn IN: Pick 1, D'Ambrosio
Geelong OUT: Ratugolea, Pick 8	Geelong IN: Worpel, Lycett, Pick 40, Hawks F-1st
Port Adelaide OUT: Lycett, Pick 40, Pick 48	Port Adelaide IN: Ratugolea, Zerk-Thatcher
West Coast OUT: Pick 1, Pick 57	West Coast IN: Pick 4, Pick 8, Brockman, DGB
Essendon OUT: D'Ambrosio, Zerk-Thatcher	Essendon IN: Bramble, Pick 48, Pick 57

Cats give us Pick 8 in exchange for Worpel & Future 1st, which we move to West Coast along with Pick 4, Brocky & DGB for Pick 1.
North can go to the draft again for messing around with rubbish deals

 

[Braidz]

The Bulldogs want Watson and we want Smith, a pic slide to ful with our future first going to the dogs, will be what it takes.

Seems like a pretty fair trade to me. Hopefully Duursma is still on the board.

 

[theiaofseed]

HYPOTHETICAL MEGA TRADE:

Hawthorn OUT: Pick 4, Brockman, DGB, Worpel, Bramble, F-1st	Hawthorn IN: Pick 1, D'Ambrosio
Geelong OUT: Ratugolea, Pick 8	Geelong IN: Worpel, Lycett, Pick 40, Hawks F-1st
Port Adelaide OUT: Lycett, Pick 40, Pick 48	Port Adelaide IN: Ratugolea, Zerk-Thatcher
West Coast OUT: Pick 1, Pick 57	West Coast IN: Pick 4, Pick 8, Brockman, DGB
Essendon OUT: D'Ambrosio, Zerk-Thatcher	Essendon IN: Bramble, Pick 48, Pick 57

Cats give us Pick 8 in exchange for Worpel & Future 1st, which we move to West Coast along with Pick 4, Brocky & DGB for Pick 1.
North can go to the draft again for messing around with rubbish deals

I hope we have plenty of spare Vaseline

 

[DrAbs]

I hope we have plenty of spare Vaseline

What's that supposed to mean :0

 

[Braidz]

HYPOTHETICAL MEGA TRADE:

Hawthorn OUT: Pick 4, Brockman, DGB, Worpel, Bramble, F-1st	Hawthorn IN: Pick 1, D'Ambrosio
Geelong OUT: Ratugolea, Pick 8	Geelong IN: Worpel, Lycett, Pick 40, Hawks F-1st
Port Adelaide OUT: Lycett, Pick 40, Pick 48	Port Adelaide IN: Ratugolea, Zerk-Thatcher
West Coast OUT: Pick 1, Pick 57	West Coast IN: Pick 4, Pick 8, Brockman, DGB
Essendon OUT: D'Ambrosio, Zerk-Thatcher	Essendon IN: Bramble, Pick 48, Pick 57

Cats give us Pick 8 in exchange for Worpel & Future 1st, which we move to West Coast along with Pick 4, Brocky & DGB for Pick 1.
North can go to the draft again for messing around with rubbish deals

That is terrible for us

 

[Mitchell54]

My gut feel of what happens now is:

• WCE retain pick 1
• NM retain picks 2 and 3
• We retain pick 4 and trade F1 + F2 for B Smith

Draft as follows:

1) WCE - Reid
2) GCS - Walter
3) NM - McKercher
4) NM - Duursma
5) HAW - Watson
6) WB - Curtin

AFL rules in Relation to future picks state you can't trade both your future 1st & 2nd unless the AFL decides its okay for arbitrary reasons.

 

[DrAbs]

That is terrible for us

How?? We have enough midfield bulls, especially if we get Harley in. I don't rate Massimo but he's gonna come here so may as well get the Bombers involved to get Port involved with Zerk Thatcher, and then get Geelong involved with Ratugolea to steal Pick 8. If anything, Cats would be the biggest loser.

Edit - DGB will go to West Coast eventually, so why not pull the trigger now.. And Worpel will be big for Geelong. Win-win-win

 

[cryptor]

Howdy hawkers, I come in peace. Just on the Brockman deal, I suspect that the later picks that WCE have will be reserved for Lance Collard who is part of some academy or other, Naitanui or NG. Its not like WC to walk players to the preseason draft usually, but considering Brockman doesn't appear interested in moving to Freo despite the four year offer (crazy, right?), it seems that the hawks will just need to deal and move on.

Unfortunately the blood thirsty mob have decided they will be stuffing him into a cannon and firing him into the sun.

 

[Faraway Hawk]

HYPOTHETICAL MEGA TRADE:

Hawthorn OUT: Pick 4, Brockman, DGB, Worpel, Bramble, F-1st	Hawthorn IN: Pick 1, D'Ambrosio
Geelong OUT: Ratugolea, Pick 8	Geelong IN: Worpel, Lycett, Pick 40, Hawks F-1st
Port Adelaide OUT: Lycett, Pick 40, Pick 48	Port Adelaide IN: Ratugolea, Zerk-Thatcher
West Coast OUT: Pick 1, Pick 57	West Coast IN: Pick 4, Pick 8, Brockman, DGB
Essendon OUT: D'Ambrosio, Zerk-Thatcher	Essendon IN: Bramble, Pick 48, Pick 57

Cats give us Pick 8 in exchange for Worpel & Future 1st, which we move to West Coast along with Pick 4, Brocky & DGB for Pick 1.
North can go to the draft again for messing around with rubbish deals

Great effort on the fonts! That's where I'd stop.

 

[smish]

The Bulldogs want Watson and we want Smith, a pic slide to ful with our future first going to the dogs, will be what it takes.

Good point. Hopefully NM back themselves with Curtin then Duursma or Colby will slide to us.

Hypothetically if this eventuates and Curtin slides to us at 5(6), do people think we would take Curtin or look for Caddy?