List Mgmt. 2024 List Mismanagement and Trading

[baldandbroke]

How many All Australians in that lot?

How many premiership players in that lot?

 

[wimpy]

This rubbish about "didn't have the benefit of hindsight" really annoys me. That's why we have specialist recruiters and pay them well. Surely on the basis of law of averages they should have done a lot better. These recruiters should be in the business of seeking out the best. My main concern is missing the obvious high end picks.
With the McAsey selection, I thought there was a football saying "never use a high pick to select a fullback or CHB, you will always find one or make one", there are plenty of examples to prove this. Just lately I mention Murray and Keane. I went back and took a look at high end selections (pick 6 or higher) CHB/Fullbacks, the only one I could find was Weitering at pick one and fully deserved. Look further down the draft lists and a lot of sensational CHBs/FBs can be found, we panicked.
Why would you pick Josh Rachele at 6 - a Victorian half forward flanker ahead of Nasiah Wanganeen-Milera (pick 11), a South Australian who had been showing great form at U18 level and in a couple of reserves games I saw, he played sensationally. I could also go on about Will Day.

What a rubbish generalised response. McAsey was a ridiculous pick although he won the B&F for Vic at the national carnival, CHBs just don't get picked this early as their development takes longer. Apart from Weitering prove me wrong.
Mark Bickley was calling for the Crows to select Will Day (surely DNA had to be taken into account) and Nasiah W-M had exposed good form in South Australia. The "eye test" reveals the Crows got it wrong. N W-M is a far better player and not a showoff.

Come up with some meaningful evidence and facts.

 

[ABAB]

What a rubbish generalised response. McAsey was a ridiculous pick although he won the B&F for Vic at the national carnival, CHBs just don't get picked this early as their development takes longer. Apart from Weitering prove me wrong.
Mark Bickley was calling for the Crows to select Will Day (surely DNA had to be taken into account) and Nasiah W-M had exposed good form in South Australia. The "eye test" reveals the Crows got it wrong. N W-M is a far better player and not a showoff.

Come up with some meaningful evidence and facts.

Neither were projected to go that early, can you still trade down further after trading pick 4 to 6?

 

[bonehilda]

People on this board also forget the general consensus on this board was Jackson Hately was their favoured pick in 2018, at least Chayce and Neddy are still on an AFL list in 2024.

This isn’t something to boast about

 

[steve9798]

Truly horrific. You’d think even by chance he might have gotten one right, but consistently got every one wrong.

Kind of impressive he keeps his job really.

Someone gave you the thumbs down. Must be on the AFC Board.

 

[Mutineer]

What a rubbish generalised response. McAsey was a ridiculous pick although he won the B&F for Vic at the national carnival, CHBs just don't get picked this early as their development takes longer. Apart from Weitering prove me wrong.
Mark Bickley was calling for the Crows to select Will Day (surely DNA had to be taken into account) and Nasiah W-M had exposed good form in South Australia. The "eye test" reveals the Crows got it wrong. N W-M is a far better player and not a showoff.

Come up with some meaningful evidence and facts.

Michael Hurley, Lachie Ploughman, Jacob Weitering and Caleb Marchbank were all KPD's and drafted Pick 6 or higher.

 

[1990crow]

Someone gave you the thumbs down. Must be on the AFC Board.

I'm presuming Bicks has a personal relationship with Hamish, so takes it personally.

 

[Mutineer]

I'm presuming Bicks has a personal relationship with Hamish, so takes it personally.

Nope I've seen him at numerous U18's games but I've only met him the once at an U18's game at Mars Stadium and the discussion centred around whether Scott Thompson was going to go on the next year, he basically said Scotty definitely wants to but he wasn't sure whether Don Pyke wanted him to at that point. Seems Pyke wanted him to because he got the final year. It was a Rebels game featuring Hugh McCluggage, Jarrod Berry and Willem Drew so I remember it well.

 

[Ham]

Tex has re-signed

Good!


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[CDC60]

Other than McAsey who are the early 1st round misses you describe, Chayce Jones is 6 years ago, that's more than a few years and he has played 91 AFL games after all and Ned McHenry 70 games.

If you go back even 10 years and discount the 1st rounders used in the Bryce Gibbs and Izak Rankine (3 1st round picks that the recruiters didn't have access to).

2014 - Pick 14 Jake Lever
2015 - Pick 11 - Wayne Milera - Pick 17 Tom Doedee
2016 - Pick 15 - Jordan Gallucci
2017 - Pick 12 - Darcy Fogarty - 2 1st rounds picks out for Gibbs
2018 - Pick 9 Chayce Jones - Pick 16 Ned McHenry
2019 - Pick 6 Fischer McAsey trade down that netted 2020 Pick 10 - Most likely Noah Anderson bar for Suns AFL gift.
2020 - Pick 2 Riley Thilthorpe - Pick 10 Luke Pedlar - Pick 25 Brayden Cook
2021 - Pick 6 Josh Rachele
2022 - Pick 5 used to acquire Izak Rankine - Pick 17 Max Michalanney
2023 - Pick 8 Dan Curtin (trade up) - Pick 21 Charlie Edfwards - Pick 27 Oscar Ryan.

Gallucci is a massive miss, players after him were Todd Marshall, Jarrod Berry, Tim English, Sam Power-Pepper, Isaac Cumming, Will Hayward and Jordan Ridley. Jones and McHenry are bad misses...they've played games in a bottom four team most of their careers. 2018 proved to be a super draft and we got pantsed. Cook is a likely bust, Rachele is no guarantee to be a top selection and the 2023 picks can not be judged

 

[BRL121]

Yep. A while back I looked at Hamish vs the free Phantom Form Guide article on AFL.com.au from Cal Twomey (not the phantom draft, the form guide). No hindsight required at all because those rankings were available months before the draft.



I don't think paid club employee Hamish outperforms the resource provided for free online

I don't think that list proves your point.

 

[Scorpus]

I don't think that list proves your point.

Would you rather have

Lever
Thilthorpe
Rachele
Soligo
Doedee
Milera
+
Jones
Hamill
McAsey
Pedlar
Poholke
Gallucci

Or

Curnow
Serong
English
Caldwell
McDonald
Bruhn
+
Laverde
Hobbs
Draper
Graham
Taylor
Balic

Bit of a wash IMO. Hamish isn't clearly drafting better despite being the paid employee out of the two

 

[BRL121]

Would you rather have

Lever
Thilthorpe
Rachele
Soligo
Doedee
Milera
+
Jones
Hamill
McAsey
Pedlar
Poholke
Gallucci

Or

Curnow
Serong
English
Caldwell
McDonald
Bruhn
+
Laverde
Hobbs
Draper
Graham
Taylor
Balic

Bit of a wash IMO. Hamish isn't clearly drafting better despite being the paid employee out of the two

Curnow, Bruhn massive go-home factors, recognised at the time. McDonald instead of TT: no.
We know the interference on English. Serong, sure, but if we didn't do the shocker in McAsey, we would have got Stevens, the board favourite, and another bust.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Let's just say that, by some miracle, there are a number of players who are keen to come to us in the off season.
Obviously, we are going to need to capital to trade for this - and I'm also going to say that pick 4 is absolutely off the table.
We are going to need to find some players we can trade, that also have some value for other teams. The questions then is what positions do we have an excess of players?

Let's start with defence.

Key defenders:
Murray
Worrell
Keane
Butts
Borlase

Mid sized defenders:
Max M
Hinge
Nankervis
Dawson
Milera
Smith
O Ryan

Small defenders:
Bond
Max M
Laird
Jones
Hamill
Parnell

I haven't included Curtin as I suspect he will play mid/forward and not defence.

I will assume Parnell and Hamill are delists. I also believe Smith has met his triggers for a contract next year.

I would say we have 1 surplus in Key defenders and 1 in mid sized defenders, although this is tricky because it depends on Milera and Smith.

If we need assets to trade for Cummins and Lukosious, out of the defenders I would reluctantly be willing to trade out one of Butts/Keane (I think Keane would have more value) and possibly Nankervis (although I really like him as a player).

Both might offer some value in a trade and we have cover for both.

I will look at midfield depth next.

Thoughts here?

Nank untouchable

Keane at the right price but preferably not

Laird is the one I’d trade , follow the hawks model

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Yeah, been a great clubman, but I hope Smithers gets the message

I suspect he won’t retire whilst still under contract, though

Could be a Luke brown moment where he realises his career is done and gets a pay out

Can see Smithers in the media

 

[1990crow]

Nank untouchable

Keane at the right price but preferably not

Laird is the one I’d trade , follow the hawks model

I'd trade Laird just to get his salary and toxic behaviour off the books.

 

[huludicidal]

The problem with trading Laird is that someone has to want him.

Spoiler alert: they don’t.

 

[1990crow]

The problem with trading Laird is that someone has to want him.

Spoiler alert: they don’t.

Laird for Oliver?

 

[Jeffcrowe]

In the next two years, we will or should have to replace:

Smith (retired)
Walker (retired)
Himmelberg (free agent)
Berry (trade)
Gollant (trade/delist)
ROB (trade)
Murphy (trade/delist)
Parnell (delisted)
McHenry (delisted)
Strachan (delisted)
Burgess (delisted)
Hamill (free agent)

That’s 12 players over two seasons and still leaves the likes of Schoenberg, Laird, Crouch, Borlase on the list.

Anyone who thinks our rebuild is over is absolutely kidding themselves.

Doesn’t look like we’re losing anyone important outside of Walker there

Those changes will help

 

[Jeffcrowe]

The problem with trading Laird is that someone has to want him.

Spoiler alert: they don’t.

Laird would get plenty of interest as a half back

 

[huludicidal]

Laird for Oliver?

A rare trade where both clubs somehow lose

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Schoenberg is lucky he is contracted. Him and Berry aren't AFL standard and we need to move them on. Too much of our list is taken up by potential mids

I’d say the Achilles injury will see him out

Very hard to come back from those and he was already battling due to ball handling at afl level

 

[Jeffcrowe]

I'd trade Laird just to get his salary and toxic behaviour off the books.

He’s the main one to trade

Keane id rather keep

Berry 50/50 prob trade but not for peanuts

 

[1990crow]

Laird would get plenty of interest as a half back

He was moved into the midfield largely because his back flank form was that bad.
This was 4 years ago.

 

[huludicidal]

Laird would get plenty of interest as a half back

Did we successfully destroy the Showdown footage where he played half back and absolutely botched everything he went near?

He’s slow, can’t kick, and makes horrendous decisions by hand and foot routinely. If anyone is looking for a 30 year old half back with those traits, good luck to them.