List Mgmt. 2024 Trade & List Management Thread - Part 3

[giantroo]

Player moves

Player	Original Club	Trade/FA	New Club	Result
Isaac Cumming	GWS	UFA	Adelaide	End of Round 1 Compo (pick 21) to GWS
Josh Battle	St Kilda	UFA	Hawthorn	Round 1 Compo (Pick 8) to St.Kilda
Tom Campbell	St Kilda	DFA	Melbourne	No Compensation
Harry Perryman	GWS	UFA	Collingwood	Round 1 Compo (Pick 16) to GWS
Elliott Himmelberg	Adelaide	UFA	Gold Coast	No Compensation
Nick Haynes	GWS	UFA	Carlton	No Compensation
Alex Neal-Bullen	Melbourne	Trade	Adelaide	Round 2 Pick (28) to Melbourne
Jack Darling	West Coast	Trade	North Melbourne	Round 4 pick (67) to WCE
Jack Graham	Richmond	UFA	West Coast	TBC

Spoiler: 2024 Draft Picks

 

[Makeshift Park]

Seems like a good time to put up the list of the 16 players we have traded in or recycled from other clubs in the last four years.

Atu Bosenavulagi, Jaidyn Stephenson, Lachie Young, Aidan Corr, Connor Menadue, Callum Coleman-Jones, Hugh Greenwood, Tom Lynch, Griffen Logue, Darcy Tucker, Liam Shiels, Zac Fisher, Bigoa Nyuon, Dylan Stephens, Toby Pink, Brynn Teakle

Not sure what the point is of bringing up players who were traded in before Viney and Clarko came on board?

Might as well bring up John Blakey and Winston Abraham too, given they’re about as relevant?

 

[Tiberius]

Some of the things we've done in the past haven't worked, for various reasons some of which were beyond our control. The clear lesson seems to be that we should just stop trying to get better and accept that we're crap and always will be. Our drafting is terrible, our recruiting is terrible, our coffee cart is terrible, so we should just give up on all of those things.

 

[My Left Foote]

What people need to consider with Darling, Parker and Daniel is they are upgrades on the spuds we currently have on our list. Think of Luke Parker

26

Luke Parker

Age

31

Ht

183cm

Wt

88kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

24.2

5star

K

12.6

5star

HB

11.6

5star

M

3.8

4star

T

5.6

5star

CL

5.8

5star

D

22.1

5star

K

12.3

5star

HB

9.9

5star

M

3.9

4star

T

5.0

5star

CL

5.5

5star

D

21.2

5star

K

11.4

4star

HB

9.8

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

8.0

5star

CL

5.2

5star

as a Yukon Gold Potato an “all-purpose” potato, that works well in a variety of different positions.

Caleb Daniel

35

Caleb Daniel

Age

28

Ht

171cm

Wt

72kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

21.3

5star

K

11.5

4star

HB

9.8

5star

M

3.5

4star

T

2.9

4star

CL

1.4

4star

D

19.5

4star

K

11.1

4star

HB

8.4

4star

M

3.6

4star

T

2.0

3star

CL

1.0

3star

D

16.4

4star

K

7.2

3star

HB

9.2

5star

M

3.4

4star

T

2.6

4star

CL

0.2

2star

is Russet Potato, arguably the best potato for baking, if he doesn't perform Clarko will give him a bake. Caleb, like the Russet potato, is thick-skinned he's perfectly suited to be North Big Footy's new whipping boy.

Jack Darling

27

Jack Darling

Age

32

Ht

191cm

Wt

95kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.1

3star

K

7.9

3star

HB

4.2

3star

M

5.0

5star

T

3.0

5star

G

1.9

5star

D

8.0

2star

K

4.3

2star

HB

3.7

3star

M

2.7

3star

T

2.4

3star

G

1.3

5star

D

14.6

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

7.0

5star

M

6.0

5star

T

4.0

5star

G

1.4

5star

is a Fingerling Potato, a mature potato that whose firm interior can withstand high pressure without losing his shape.

 

[krakouers]

Some of the things we've done in the past haven't worked, for various reasons some of which were beyond our control. The clear lesson seems to be that we should just stop trying to get better and accept that we're crap and always will be. Our drafting is terrible, our recruiting is terrible, our coffee cart is terrible, so we should just give up on all of those things.

Well, if they hired a barista like I emailed the club, it would be one less issue....

 

[DocSholl]

Whats a recent example of where this strategy has worked? I mean Collingwood, a powerhouse club, just had to offer Harry Perryman at 7 year deal at 900K+ to get him over the line and he wouldn't be in the top dozen players at GWS. We are one of the least desirable clubs in the league to play for and that needs to be reflected in the size and value of contracts we offer so we can bring in any players let alone high end talent. Until we improve on field and off field as a club, this will continue to the be the case.

I dont have an issue with giving long deals to get players across, I fully understand you have to overpay to convince someone ro move. I have an issue with doing it for someone like Daniel who is the opposite to how the league is going in terms of half back, just for the sake of experience.

 

[DocSholl]

Maybe but what's plan b then.... we can't keep relying on the draft


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Plan B could be playing the half back we gave four years to in 2023?

 

[Shinboner1]

Viney indicated in the QnA that we may be going back towards the more attacking game style we saw earlier in the year. If we don't bring in someone that uses the ball in an elite way off half back like Caleb Daniel, then we are farked.

Surprised we haven't thought about using our 2nd rounder on that elite HB from werribee. Apparently he's pretty good

 

[perplexed]

Not sure what the point is of bringing up players who were traded in before Viney and Clarko came on board?

Might as well bring up John Blakey and Winston Abraham too, given they’re about as relevant?

Okay, here is the Viney / Clarko period.

Griffen Logue, Darcy Tucker, Daniel Howe, Liam Shiels, Zac Fisher, Bigoa Nyuon, Dylan Stephens, Toby Pink, Brynn Teakle, Jack Darling

Hard to believe, but I forgot Daniel Howe from the previous list. Logue has been unlucky, Shiels and Tucker have been useful in minor roles, the rest are fringe or worse.

 

[giantroo]

 

[The Filth Wizard]

What people need to consider with Darling, Parker and Daniel is they are upgrades on the spuds we currently have on our list. Think of Luke Parker as a Yukon Gold Potato an “all-purpose” potato, that works well in a variety of different positions.

Caleb Daniel is Russet Potato, arguably the best potato for baking, if he doesn't perform Clarko will give him a bake. Caleb, like the Russet potato is thick-skinned he's perfectly suited to be North Big Footy's new whipping boy.

Jack Darling is a Fingerling Potato, a mature potato that whose firm interior can withstand high pressure without losing his shape.

As long as they all come cheap as chips I'm sure we'll all handle it.

 

[BlueandWhiteinmyBlood]

Surely the longer Daniel leaves it, the more likely he is leaving the dogs?

 

[New_Roo]

Plan B could be playing the half back we gave four years to in 2023?

The small fwd trying to play hb? You think maybe the reason we are reaching out to two other hbs maybe signals the fact that it's not worked so he maybe heading back fwd?


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[The Dingrel]

Cornes does have a point (which makes me feel a little bit ill saying, even when it is to our advantage) but also,

"I hate Bevo so much I'm taking North's side on this one..."

I've just gone and had a good hard look at myself in the mirror.......agreeing with something Korne dog said, must be off my A game.

 

[Snowy off the Tram]

**** the haters Caleb Daniel is a baller and will be worth it, trust the process.

Agree. His great asset obviously is his kicking. He can find a teammate just about every time coming out of the back half. And in a team full of butchers, hackers, helicopter kickers, mongrel punters and panic merchants, that’s a skill to be treasured. Sure, he has his shortcomings (!) but that one elite talent makes him considerably more valuable than half our list. When you put him up against the rest of the back six, inc Fisher, Tucker, McDonald, Scott etc - there’s no contest. He’s a much better option and can only improve us …

 

[My Left Foote]

As long as they all come cheap as chips I'm sure we'll all handle it.

Kicking myself I didn't think of that.

 

[Souup]

I like Caleb Daniel

35

Caleb Daniel

Age

28

Ht

171cm

Wt

72kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

21.3

5star

K

11.5

4star

HB

9.8

5star

M

3.5

4star

T

2.9

4star

CL

1.4

4star

D

19.5

4star

K

11.1

4star

HB

8.4

4star

M

3.6

4star

T

2.0

3star

CL

1.0

3star

D

16.4

4star

K

7.2

3star

HB

9.2

5star

M

3.4

4star

T

2.6

4star

CL

0.2

2star

and I have no issue giving him 4 years.

Versatile, excellent skills, great endurance base and was in the leadership group at the Bulldogs. He'll allow Mckercher to move further up the ground. He's won a premiership, been in another Grand Final and generally part of a contending team over his career.

I think he can be more direct with his ball use and that's more a matter of role and instruction.

Are there negatives? Yeah sure; he's going to struggle to defend due to his height, but modern-day footy tries to limit the amount of times your defenders actually need to defend 1-out and so he'll get plenty of help. Every team has back flankers who are less accountable with teams banking on their offensive value outweighing their defensive slackness (mostly due to role and not necessarily effort).

 

[giantroo]

 

[The Dingrel]

I think he would rate his chances of getting back into dogs 22 with Mac and Williams potentially leaving so not sure that's a big selling point needs more... hence longer deal, more money...


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you'd think Sanders be the first to be getting more game time, but you do have a point!

 

[New_Roo]

Surely the longer Daniel leaves it, the more likely he is leaving the dogs?

You would hope. Hopefully the time is trying to come up with a trade which won't be easy when dogs still claim he is wanted


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[AnEmptyChair]

Re: Caleb Daniel and to a lesser extent Jack Darling…

Haven’t we learnt our lesson from Polec/Fisher/Stephens/CCJ and co that overpaying, with trade capital, money and contract lengths is fraught with list clogging danger?

Daniel is a fringe player now at the dogs, what are we seeing in him that justifies a 4 year deal? Because I don’t see it. He is a slight upgrade on Fisher but even worse at one on one defending.

My concern is that if we are willing to offer him a 4 year deal then we’d be more than willing to part with a F2 selection or something along those lines which would be incredibly stupid.

You're underrating fisher. He was mostly good this year, especially 2nd half of the season, and will be better next year as the team gets better

Also Daniel wouldn't be Fringe if bevo wasn't a ****ing moron. What he's doing to that list is criminal. That's why he could be available and there's great value to be had for a player of his talent

 

[Roosurgence]

On my reading, Power's comments don't suggest Daniel is moving.

'Required player,' 'contracted for 2 years' and 'deputy vice captain' sound like only an offer too good to refuse would do it, and given Brady's comments about not diluting our draft hand too much that doesn't seem likely.

Who really knows? Power might just be playing games to see what he can extract?

You don’t keep that type of coin on your books to play in the VFL or sub.

At the end of the day if they want to keep him that badly then we just walk away.

Unless they have massively changed their tune on playing him more regularly, then I think you will find they will be happy to get the money out of their cap and take a pick.

 

[Snowy off the Tram]

We got Fisher and pick 17 (that turned into pick 22) for a pick that ended up as pick 29. So yeah, we got a seven pick upgrade that became Wil Dawson from taking Fisher on and he hasn't been that bad either. Just not great.

Not that bad? He’s been terrible. Supposedly picked up for his elite disposal. But his kicking is woeful / and he’s soft in the contest. Carlton fans laughing fit to burst; North fans shaking their heads and wondering how we could get it so wrong - again.

 

[Better Loosen Up]

I like Caleb Daniel and I have no issue giving him 4 years.

Versatile, excellent skills, great endurance base and was in the leadership group at the Bulldogs. He'll allow Mckercher to move further up the ground. He's won a premiership, been in another Grand Final and generally part of a contending team over his career.

I think he can be more direct with his ball use and that's more a matter of role and instruction.

Are there negatives? Yeah sure; he's going to struggle to defend due to his height, but modern-day footy tries to limit the amount of times your defenders actually need to defend 1-out and so he'll get plenty of help. Every team has back flankers who are less accountable with teams banking on their offensive value outweighing their defensive slackness (mostly due to role and not necessarily effort).

Agree with that. His value is moving the ball out of defensive rather than his 1 on 1 capabilities. Problem is, I think you can only have 1 of those type of players on the ground in the backline at any one time. Meaning it wouldn't be a great idea to be playing both Fisher and Daniel.

 

[Snowy off the Tram]

Seems like a good time to put up the list of the 16 players we have traded in or recycled from other clubs in the last four years.

Atu Bosenavulagi, Jaidyn Stephenson, Lachie Young, Aidan Corr, Connor Menadue, Callum Coleman-Jones, Hugh Greenwood, Tom Lynch, Griffen Logue, Darcy Tucker, Liam Shiels, Zac Fisher, Bigoa Nyuon, Dylan Stephens, Toby Pink, Brynn Teakle

oh, the horror ….

 

[Makeshift Park]

Okay, here is the Viney / Clarko period.

Griffen Logue, Darcy Tucker, Daniel Howe, Liam Shiels, Zac Fisher, Bigoa Nyuon, Dylan Stephens, Toby Pink, Brynn Teakle, Jack Darling

Hard to believe, but I forgot Daniel Howe from the previous list. Logue has been unlucky, Shiels and Tucker have been useful in minor roles, the rest are fringe or worse.

When old players retire, list spots have to be filled. You know that.

We havent been attractive to FAs lately.

Logue and Tucker got done for PP. A second and a fourth rounder, with a swap of thirds.Can't blame the club on Griff doing his ACL. That’s a great deal. How can you argue otherwise.

Howe, Shiels, Nyuon, Teakle, Pink and Darling all cost nothing, or extremely speculative picks. They filled spots cheaply so we could spend most of our draft capital on kids. Tell me what you would have done otherwise, bearing in mind the highest pick you’re allowed to use is in the sixties.

Fisher and Stephens are the only ones who cost substantial picks. But they were acquired with PP that had to be used last year. Nevertheless, happy to debate the merits of those decisions.