List Mgmt. 2024 Trade Thread - No.1

[gringo2011]

How do we know who recruited who when you have maybe 5 recruiter Gringo keeps spruiking Toce' how would you know he picked them and selected them.

If he's the head recruiter you imagine he has ultimate say. How do we know Dalrymple had any of the good picks he has been credited with? There was suggestions at Sydney that there was a bit of tension between Dalrymple and Beatson who was moved to a list management role but found it hard to let go of recruiting.

 

[The Punter]

Lobb is leaving the Doggies because he expects to play seniors every week.

I don't think we need someone who doesn't recognise form and fit might play a role in his selection from week to week.

 

[gringo2011]

It was a great move by SOS wasn't it. Giants and Suns have so many picks that they don't value them. Hopefully we can do something similar again.

Love him or hate him, the thing about SOS is he tries different strategies to improve. In our position as a club I think that's what we need.

I don't think he's particularly good but at least he's not Gags who threw away picks and players like they had no value. At least he's trying to maximise value. He's traded out a lot of capital from this draft and he'll now have to go on a selling spree to recover them but he's definitely an upgrade on the last lot of morons.

 

[Dr Spaceman]

He's an upgrade on Campbell. We have the salary cap room to afford the contract and using that space for someone who could support Max and Marshall is a decent use of it.

 

[Sully111]

The game plan going into the forward is dictated by movement from the forwards, hard to get a responce and good ball movement from statues.
Daniel Hoyne explained this on SEN & said we are 3rd for ball movement in the comp.

The notion that the coaches are completely devoid of responsibility when it comes to poor performances is absolutely ridiculous.

 

[gringo2011]

Lobb is leaving the Doggies because he expects to play seniors every week.

I don't think we need someone who doesn't recognise form and fit might play a role in his selection from week to week.

He's actually been pretty good lately and won back a lot of their fans who absolutely hated him. I think they'll whinge if they let him go now. He dropped back in defence and was good even.

He's a limited player but he's one of only a few true ruck forwards in the comp. They are really hard to find and why he's one of the best paid players in the comp but a middling talent. Same as Battle with his intercept game and ability to swing forward. He's going to be a very well paid player because they are both unicorns in AFL footy.

We will miss Battle more than we realise if Ari doesn't meet his ceiling.

 

[Dr Spaceman]

He's actually been pretty good lately and won back a lot of their fans who absolutely hated him. I think they'll whinge if they let him go now. He dropped back in defence and was good even.

He's a limited player but he's one of only a few true ruck forwards in the comp. They are really hard to find and why he's one of the best paid players in the comp but a middling talent. Same as Battle with his intercept game and ability to swing forward. He's going to be a very well paid player because they are both unicorns in AFL footy.

We will miss Battle more than we realise if Ari doesn't meet his ceiling.

When he sported that hideous peroxided hair hat he looked and played like an absolute goose.

Since getting rid of it he seems to have played a little better and at least looks like something born on the same planet as us.

Though to many, me included, he is still a vomit inducing critter, especially if I stop to imagine him wearing our magnificent jumper

 

[Klaatu]

If he's the head recruiter you imagine he has ultimate say. How do we know Dalrymple had any of the good picks he has been credited with? There was suggestions at Sydney that there was a bit of tension between Dalrymple and Beatson who was moved to a list management role but found it hard to let go of recruiting.

We don't that's my point it's a recruiting group not 1 specific person, on ultimate say how many times have we vetoed our selection McCarten/Petracca so the head recruiter doesn't have ultimate say.

 

[Klaatu]

Lobb is leaving the Doggies because he expects to play seniors every week.

I don't think we need someone who doesn't recognise form and fit might play a role in his selection from week to week.

I agree but Bevo sold him the idea now Bevo has to honour it.

 

[Klaatu]

The notion that the coaches are completely devoid of responsibility when it comes to poor performances is absolutely ridiculous.

Fair enough everyones got an opinion, but champion data beg to differ & my eyes proved it last week because our forward line wasn't static and most times very chaotic which means the opposition can't set up behind the ball.

 

[Klaatu]

I wouldn't be surprised if we looked at GC players in Alex Davies & Brayden Fiorini

8

Brayden Fiorini

Age

27

Ht

187cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

22.9

5star

K

13.9

5star

HB

9.1

5star

M

4.7

4star

T

4.0

5star

CL

2.9

4star

D

16.3

4star

K

11.0

4star

HB

5.3

3star

M

4.0

4star

T

1.7

3star

CL

0.7

3star

D

21.2

5star

K

10.2

4star

HB

11.0

5star

M

4.6

5star

T

4.2

5star

CL

3.2

5star

they would at a minimum add more depth to the squad.

 

[The_Steadier]

Honestly mate, we've looked like a dogs breakfast for large parts of games this year. If you want to believe that's 100% on the players, and coaches shouldn't be held accountable, knock yourself out.

I think our skills have looked a dogs breakfast all year.
That's a lot on the players' shoulders.

However

I also think that the coaching needs looking at in our forward line.
Our fwds do look like headless chooks and/or statues- no real system for creating space/leading patterns etc.

Chalk and cheese compared with how enright has the backline working as a unit.


Midfield coaching is adequete i think- we are missing top end talent; so not much more the coaching can do there.

Game plan/style- coaching gets a tick from me.
Ross has us playing a style that should stand up in finals.
Problem is that it requires good hand and foot skills across the park- something we don't have.

Overall- i think the coaching is ok- except in the fwd line.

 

[Joffaboy]

Except that GWS deal was nothing to do with the Henry deal. Still lucky that GWS wanted Leake so badly. We also used up all our later picks for this season last year. Pretty sure we only have our first and second round picks left.

I think that's why they want to trade out Membrey, Paton, Hayes, Howard etc and let Battle walk. None of the apart from Battle will get much back but they could possibly use them to sell to teams with FS or academy players for points. Or use them in trades for some of the spuds mentioned.

Membrey will get little Hayes will be delisted, and have heard nothing about Paton who is getting seniors game time and Howard being traded.
Battle is not being 'let go' or culled or any other term you continue to use. He is a UFA and the club is doing g everything to keep him.
In my opinion we should give Battle the 9 year deal and trade give King a smaller deal and if he still is lacklustre, trade him to the Suns.
We need to keep Howard and Battle imo.

The GWS was not part of the Henry trade it was opportunistic and great work by SoS, but the washup was basically Henry for one spot later in 2nd round or possibly one spot earlier.
If you dont think that is a good deal, well that's up to you.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Membrey will get little Hayes will be delisted, and have heard nothing about Paton who is getting seniors game time and Howard being traded.
Battle is not being 'let go' or culled or any other term you continue to use. He is a UFA and the club is doing g everything to keep him.
In my opinion we should give Battle the 9 year deal and trade give King a smaller deal and if he still is lacklustre, trade him to the Suns.
We need to keep Howard and Battle imo.

The GWS was not part of the Henry trade it was opportunistic and great work by SoS, but the washup was basically Henry for one spot later in 2nd round or possibly one spot earlier.
If you dont think that is a good deal, well that's up to you.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

I'm very happy we ended up with that second round pick in this years draft.

 

[Joffaboy]

I don't think he's particularly good but at least he's not Gags who threw away picks and players like they had no value. At least he's trying to maximise value. He's traded out a lot of capital from this draft and he'll now have to go on a selling spree to recover them but he's definitely an upgrade on the last lot of morons.

So Paddy Ryder, Butler, Howard, Hill, and Higgins have no value and the picks were thrown away.
ok

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[marcus1232]

You would have been one of the plonkers justifying trading out high picks to top up when we hadn't drafted a core. We have been drafting and should continue drafting. We shouldn't be selling off young best 22 players to go harder into the draft and make ourselves less competitive.

We are finally getting to a point where we could literally have the best of both worlds and potentially challenge while Wilkie, Sincs and Marshall types are still on the list.

Instead we are looking at hacking right back and hoping that in 5 to 8 years we can have more weapons than North and Gold Coast type lists. Even Brisbane keeps getting gifts from the AFL that should make them even better in a few years.

Waiting for some goldilocks list will buy them time but they promised to stay competitive while building the youth. If Lyon has brought in his people and remodelled the list how he wants it he should be able to do what he promised. Should be playing finals next year.

6 games we have lost by under 10 pts this year.
3 less than 4 goals.

It’s disappointing but to say we have gone wickedly backwards is just incorrect.

If anything we have normalised this year.
We overachieved last year with a fast start and basically limped over the line into finals.

 

[Joffaboy]

I'm very happy we ended up with that second round pick in this years draft.

I am very critical of the AFL and the way they conduct the draft but need to give credit where it is due with live draft trading.

Our Intel must have known GWS were after Leake. It gave us the opportunity to call them and say, were are very interested in Leake, what can you do for us. They have a lazy second rounder they don't need or think we actually want Leake so we swap frdp positions get a second equilivent to ours and get Wilson.
We must have had some interest in Leake or otherwise I wouldn't want to play Poker with SOS, as it was a bold move.
I think SOS doesn't get the credit he deserves for that live trade and that draft
Wilson
Hastie
Garcia
Shoenmaker at 62.

All look like they are AFL capable.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[St Neil]

Lobb is leaving the Doggies because he expects to play seniors every week.

I don't think we need someone who doesn't recognise form and fit might play a role in his selection from week to week.

He’s a serial under performer. At his third club.

Over rated. Rarely makes a significant contribution. List clogger.

Do not want.

 

[marcus1232]

He’s a serial under performer. At his third club.

Over rated. Rarely makes a significant contribution. List clogger.

Do not want.

Agreed
Would rather funnel some games into heath down the stretch see what we have

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I am very critical of the AFL and the way they conduct the draft but need to give credit where it is due with live draft trading.

Our Intel must have known GWS were after Leake. It gave us the opportunity to call them and say, were are very interested in Leake, what can you do for us. They have a lazy second rounder they don't need or think we actually want Leake so we swap frdp positions get a second equilivent to ours and get Wilson.
We must have had some interest in Leake or otherwise I wouldn't want to play Poker with SOS, as it was a bold move.
I think SOS doesn't get the credit he deserves for that live trade and that draft
Wilson
Hastie
Garcia
Shoenmaker at 62.

All look like they are AFL capable.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

Garcia was spotted by old man Hughes ( Former Carlton recruiting manager ).

 

[gringo2011]

We don't that's my point it's a recruiting group not 1 specific person, on ultimate say how many times have we vetoed our selection McCarten/Petracca so the head recruiter doesn't have ultimate say.

I think you’ll find if there is a normal set up the head recruiter makes the ultimate call.

 

[Sully111]

I think our skills have looked a dogs breakfast all year.
That's a lot on the players' shoulders.

However

I also think that the coaching needs looking at in our forward line.
Our fwds do look like headless chooks and/or statues- no real system for creating space/leading patterns etc.

Chalk and cheese compared with how enright has the backline working as a unit.


Midfield coaching is adequete i think- we are missing top end talent; so not much more the coaching can do there.

Game plan/style- coaching gets a tick from me.
Ross has us playing a style that should stand up in finals.
Problem is that it requires good hand and foot skills across the park- something we don't have.

Overall- i think the coaching is ok- except in the fwd line.

Agree on skills, but I think decision making has been poor too. Players have looked lost. Those things can be influenced by coaching.

Don't know how many times I've read the list is just shit, in an effort to lay all the blame on the players.

It's the responsibility of the coaches to get the players up and about and playing well. I don't think our coaching group, with maybe the exception of Enright, have had a good year.

It doesn't mean I want Lyon gone.... I don't.

Clearly the players need to take responsibility too.

This list is capable of much better footy than we've shown this year. Here's hoping we turned a corner on the weekend.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

That running half backline and the wings are elite. I reckon we have the best set up in the comp. Nas, Hill, Wood, Wilson, Sincs and Ari and Battle even as attacking distributors. Even Bonner who cops shit is above average as a kicking distributor.

Our inside game and depth is shit and our forward line is not very cohesive and too tall.

Toce wasn’t even our recruiter when we got Windy and Owens. Hotton and Van Es are both injury prone but had talent. These guys look a massive step up on anything Trout or Libba did in the previous decade.

Windy and Owens were NGA prospects. We were worried that Owens would go earlier than we could pick him.
If i explained the situation to a guy who is cleaning the floor outside my office, he would have said, "yes get windy and owens " Those two do not constitute a recruiting decision.

Toce's title at the time was "Recruiting Manager S.A. and Vic.
We got Sharman, Naz, Adams, and Hayes out of S.A. ( Sharman from vic but playing in S.A.), We got Heath from Victoria.

Not sure of the timing the previous year when we got Alison, whether Toce was our victorian recruiter at that time. He was certainly S.A, and Highmore was a decent choice for that covid year.

We'd only taken victorian kids for a while, then when Toce was moved from QLD/NSW/Tas to W.A/S.A we got Wilkie and Parker. ( Must have been a directive to target matures though, we also got Hind from Vic ).

 

[gringo2011]

He’s a serial under performer. At his third club.

Over rated. Rarely makes a significant contribution. List clogger.

Do not want.

He’s not a serial under performer. He’s a bit of a GOP that gets paid like a star. He led Freo’s goal kicking the year they moved him on. He has been the victim of high expectations more than anything. Partially his fault for chasing the big dollars. All fans hate guys who take money but don’t perform to the perceived value.

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

Just looked through our list again & trying to predict who will get the cut at the end of the season.

Definate's:

Allison, Campbell, Jones, Ross

Maybe's:

Bonner, Hayes, Hotton, McLennan, Membrey, Paton, Stocker, Webster

Crouch-dependant on where his knee is at?