List Mgmt. 2025 List Mismanagement and Trading

[cleanhands]

Nicks certainly is nowhere near Blighty levels!

One for you George Kramer

 

[WaynesWorld19]

The argument is that they have to go bang before you can claim its amazing list. Pretty simple really.

On that basis ....all of the Draftees cannot be assessed based on U18 form only .....you cannot say player "A" is good, or better than player "B"

Do you believe this ?

Do you believe Thilthorpe will be a great player, or Rachele ....or Curtin ect ...or Soligo

Because your premise is no judgements can be made on players until they go bang

My position is I've listed the above players & others, believing there already is enough evidence to support my position

 

[Danger in Texas]

On that basis ....all of the Draftees cannot be assessed based on U18 form only .....you cannot say player "A" is good, or better than player "B"

Do you believe this ?

Do you believe Thilthorpe will be a great player, or Rachele ....or Curtin ect ...or Soligo

Because your premise is no judgements can be made on players until they go bang

My position is I've listed the above players & others, believing there already is enough evidence to support my position

Clearly those guys have the potential to become A graders

But potential is just a word until it’s actually realised. There’s still a lot of growth to be done to take us from a bottom 4 spot to a top 4 spot

 

[Mostyn]

If only the forum administrators would bless me with that option.

Block him, if you don't like it.

Other than his punctuation, I think Wayne is one of the more entertaining posters.

 

[1990crow]

Block him, if you don't like it.

Other than his punctuation, I think Wayne is one of the more entertaining posters.

You realise that's not actually an option?

 

[baldandbroke]

It can be judged... just not now.

We are clearly now in a position to judge the 2014 list, having seen what those players were capable of at their peaks. Similarly, we'll be able to properly judge the 2025 list in 2034 or 2035.

As for which is "Best Ever", that's always going to be a subjective judgement.

You can't separate out the list when looking at success - because it's way more than just the list that determines that. For instance 1997 cf 2014 cf 2024. Was it the list or the coaching or the depth or the elite talent?

So to rank lists from different years accurately is impossible. There is no way to work that out definitively.

So to say "THIS IS OUR BEST LIST EVER" is not something that can proven.

Also, you seem to contradict yourself?

Can the BEST EVER be judged or not? You say "It can be judged... just not now" AND "always going to be a subjective judgement"?

 

[Vader]

You can't separate out the list when looking at success - because it's way more than just the list that determines that. For instance 1997 cf 2014 cf 2024. Was it the list or the coaching or the depth or the elite talent?

So to rank lists from different years accurately is impossible. There is no way to work that out definitively.

So to say "THIS IS OUR BEST LIST EVER" is not something that can proven.

Also, you seem to contradict yourself?

Can the BEST EVER be judged or not? You say "It can be judged... just not now" AND "always going to be a subjective judgement"?

The point is that we shouldn't be judging this list by the success they've had to date - which is minimal. We should be judging this list by the success the players will have had by the ends of their careers, which is currently unknown.

As for which is the best list - players vs coaching vs depth - the best way of looking at this is what the players achieved individually, and any player honours they received (e.g. Brownlow, AA selection). Scorpus did an excellent assessment of our 2014 team list, using this exact methodology.

I agree that arguing one list is "the best ever" is subjective, and impossible to achieve a consensus on. It will always be a case of one person's opinion vs another's. However, it may yet prove that WW may end up having a reasonable case - the only problem is that we won't know whether or not he does for another 10 years.

 

[GreyCrow]

Its not subjective. Its fact. The list as it is now is not the best ever. No amount of philosophical roundabouts can change that

Its an absolute that the current list is not the best

Saying to wait 10 years is bollocks and you know it , I know it and even WW knows it.

Its pure rubbish

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Its not subjective. Its fact. The list as it is now is not the best ever. No amount of philosophical roundabouts can change that

Its an absolute that the current list is not the best

Saying to wait 10 years is bollocks and you know it , I know it and even WW knows it.

Its pure rubbish

You simply have zero idea

You can't logically argue the list cannot be the best we've had .....and then argue the list is the worst and the rebuild has been a failure ....and this is what many (majority) were saying thru the season

You can't have it both ways ....the rationale being used to dismiss my argument cannot then be ignored to reflect an opposite POV .....speculativeness is a two way street

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Another fun fact, which has me laughing

1. We've got to play the kids !

2. Lets get games into these kids !

THEN

3. We wasted getting games into the new kids.... because we wasted games on failed kids

Well, they weren't bad kids when posters were harping on about having to play them ......and then the developmental question is, how many games are required to determine if a player is up to standard ? ......10, 20, or the nominal 50 games ?
Wasted games, or a necessary by product of the drafting process ?

The reality is, it's the law of the jungle ......you hold your list spot, until "the AFL Draft process" eases you out ....or a better prospect comes along

 

[jackster83]

Another fun fact, which has me laughing

1. We've got to play the kids !

2. Lets get games into these kids !

THEN

3. We wasted getting games into the new kids.... because we wasted games on failed kids

Well, they weren't bad kids when posters were harping on about having to play them ......and then the developmental question is, how many games are required to determine if a player is up to standard ? ......10, 20, or the nominal 50 games ?
Wasted games, or a necessary by product of the drafting process ?

The reality is, it's the law of the jungle ......you hold your list spot, until "the AFL Draft process" eases you out ....or a better prospect comes along

Not all kids will make it.

Our issue was we had a heap of duds drafted between 2016-19.

We put a lot of games into these guys, which you have to do during a rebuild. Unfortunately guys like Gallucci, McAsey, Himmelberg, Jones, McHenry and co just weren't up to it. Plus Doedee and Milera being ravaged by injury.

That's a lot of fails, from a lot of early picks.

Was it poor drafting, poor development or a combination of both?

Fortunately we now have guys like Soligo, Max, TT, Murray, Worrell and Rachele who do all look up to it.

The jury is out on the next lot - Dowling, Taylor, Nank, Bond and Curtin.

There are still big question marks over our development of players. Even Rankine is yet to put together a whole season of what he is capable of - let's be honest he should be winning AA's and B&F's by now.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

There are still big question marks over our development of players. Even Rankine is yet to put together a whole season of what he is capable of - let's be honest he should be winning AA's and B&F's by now.

You do realise Rankine missed 7 games this season .....30% of the season

Supporters determination to keep Rankine as a small FWD, has held him back as well .....finally I think there can be agreement, Rankine is an elite midfielder

 

[jackster83]

You do realise Rankine missed 7 games this season .....30% of the season

Supporters determination to keep Rankine as a small FWD, has held him back as well .....finally I think there can be agreement, Rankine is an elite midfielder

You're blaming the supporters? Lol.

The coaches were the ones who didn't want to play him in the midfield. It was only after the media labelled us "vanilla" after a 0-4 start did the coaches make the move.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

You're blaming the supporters? Lol.

The coaches were the ones who didn't want to play him in the midfield. It was only after the media labelled us "vanilla" after a 0-4 start did the coaches make the move.

Fair comment

 

[Eddie Murphy]

You're blaming the supporters? Lol.

The coaches were the ones who didn't want to play him in the midfield. It was only after the media labelled us "vanilla" after a 0-4 start did the coaches make the move.

Took us effectively ending our season in the opening month to try something new. The salt in the wound is that it was significantly better for both our short term AND long term.

 

[George Kramer]

Another fun fact, which has me laughing

1. We've got to play the kids !

2. Lets get games into these kids !

THEN

3. We wasted getting games into the new kids.... because we wasted games on failed kids

Well, they weren't bad kids when posters were harping on about having to play them ......and then the developmental question is, how many games are required to determine if a player is up to standard ? ......10, 20, or the nominal 50 games ?
Wasted games, or a necessary by product of the drafting process ?

The reality is, it's the law of the jungle ......you hold your list spot, until "the AFL Draft process" eases you out ....or a better prospect comes along

Care to provide examples of which kids youre talking about that posters have asked to play and then criticised the club for playing them?

Because I think you’ll find this is another Waynism trying to make a point based on fluff.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Take this rumour from a respected SAINT's supporter as you wish ....must admit I was a bit surprised

Keep eye on Arie Schoenmaker over the pre season. I believe he is a good chance to play regularly football next season.

Stay away from Philipou! Has come back in terrible shape with poor training standards. Kid is going to be a dud!

 

[Danger in Texas]

Take this rumour from a respected SAINT's supporter as you wish ....must admit I was a bit surprised

I mean, the poster in question has Phillipou as his avatar

You sure he’s not just jokingly trying to turn people off MP so that he can have a SC point of difference?

 

[fuic08]

Take this rumour from a respected SAINT's supporter as you wish ....must admit I was a bit surprised

I'm assuming he's taking the piss, had a read of the Saints preseason thread and sounds like he's leading the pack with Wilson.

 

[1990crow]

I mean, the poster in question has Phillipou as his avatar

You sure he’s not just jokingly trying to turn people off MP so that he can have a SC point of difference?

Probably scared Adelaide will recruit him.

 

[Mutineer]

Take this rumour from a respected SAINT's supporter as you wish ....must admit I was a bit surprised

LOL

Seriously Wayno there is absolutely zero chance that's correct , the lad is an absolute footy head.

 

[Floating Doughnut]

Take this rumour from a respected SAINT's supporter as you wish ....must admit I was a bit surprised

Arie far more likely to be on the P155 again and Poo breaking records.
He is having a lend for sure.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Take this rumour from a respected SAINT's supporter as you wish ....must admit I was a bit surprised

Perhaps double check before posting an incorrect rumour from a nobody.

 

[Multiballz]

On that basis ....all of the Draftees cannot be assessed based on U18 form only .....you cannot say player "A" is good, or better than player "B"

Do you believe this ?

Do you believe Thilthorpe will be a great player, or Rachele ....or Curtin ect ...or Soligo

Because your premise is no judgements can be made on players until they go bang

My position is I've listed the above players & others, believing there already is enough evidence to support my position

Just slip the words potential,or potentially in there somewhere and it all makes sense. Until they have achieved something they are nothing more than potential.

 

[aussierulesrules]

I think the first part of the rumour is true and the 2nd part is having a very big lend.

Arie has come back looking like this (someone said he’s dropped 7kg and is set to play the role Bonner was playing):



While the only one ahead of Pou in the running on Monday was the athletic freak of nature that is Darcy Wilson.