4th test Australia v India at the Gabba 1030 AEDT

[Ron The Bear]

Langer isn't a good coach and starc and lyon needs to be replaced. Aussies need to send players for ranji praactice

There have been a lot of layoffs at CA due to COVID, including coaches. Not sure if it has had an effect.

I also think India played us with all the talk about not going to Brisbane and wanting to go home ASAP. But good luck to them, they played inspired cricket and deserved to win the series.

 

[Topkent]

Not even sure they are down the track. We haven't ever fallen to the level of basket case, although we flirted with that around 2013, but it's certainly been a frustrating decade or so.

We aren't gonna be far off West Indies levels soon, people aren't playing cricket anymore.

There's like 5 people in Australia who arent in the test team who average over 40 in first class cricket. That's insanely bad. We can keep shoving new names into the test team but reality it is they will more than likely fail because they are barely succeeding at first class level.

If Smith drops off in the next couple years coupled with Warner coming to the end. We ain't going to win many series against good teams.

 

[Topkent]

Not even sure they are down the track. We haven't ever fallen to the level of basket case, although we flirted with that around 2013, but it's certainly been a frustrating decade or so.

We aren't gonna be far off West Indies levels soon, people aren't playing cricket anymore.

There's like 5 people in Australia who arent in the test team who average over 40 in first class cricket. That's insanely bad. We can keep shoving new names into the test team but reality it is they will more than likely fail because they are barely succeeding at first class level.

If Smith drops off in the next couple years coupled with Warner coming to the end. We ain't going to win many series against good teams.

 

[rocker_oz33]

Told you guys 2-1

Where have you been.?

Enjoy your win.

 

[rocker_oz33]

Told you guys 2-1

Where have you been.?

Enjoy your win.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

Smith was a capable captain, Warner, while a bit wild, was a capable deputy.

Warner? Really? Not only did he want to cheat because he was angry about De Kock sledging his wife, he didn't even have the guts to do it himself, he coerced the junior into doing his dirty work for him. Putting a gutless campaigner like that as a leader of anyone anywhere is a recipe for decay and indiscipline. I don't know how much Smith had to do with it in the end, possibly it was too harsh on him, but Warner had to be made an example out of for the good of the game.

Paine is also capable. But the dynamics of the way we play cricket have changed forever. Any banter or sledging, or players letting off steam is now examined forensically and other players continue to let rip ad nauseum.

Seriously, you think the problem with the team is not sledging enough? There's plenty of sledging going on, and this forensic examination is largely confined to nobodies on social media. What does this have to do with handing out bans for ball tampering?

You seem to want to blame everything under the sun except the actual players involved and their skills and form for the result. If the problem is cultural and somehow to do with sledging and ball tampering bans, why are Cummins and Hazelwood still bowling well? Why has Pucovski come into the team and outperformed every other opener? Are they sledging in secret or something?

Maybe, just maybe, half the players in the team are not that good. They've been coddled through long bouts of poor form and given chance after chance by fools like Trevor Hohns, due to the favouritism and NSW bias permeating CA. And the same players keep getting recycled periodically unless some young blokes like Pucovski and Green manage to break through.

Any loss and fans wanna sack half the team and the coaches. As if that has ever changed anything.

It has actually, multiple times. Canning players who don't perform and giving opportunities to deserving toilers is the only way forward. Anything else is rewarding mediocrity and encouraging complacency instead of getting the absolute best out of players and making them earn their test caps.

 

[CricketingErrors]

England were humiliated on their last tour of India - they almost conceded 800 an innings to top it off. As much as I find the Indian's tedious, boy I would love to see them do the same to England again.

It wont be as embarrassing as this drubbing which Aus have got. I expect England to give a respectable performance.

 

[The Passenger]

We aren't gonna be far off West Indies levels soon, people aren't playing cricket anymore.

There's like 5 people in Australia who arent in the test team who average over 40 in first class cricket. That's insanely bad. We can keep shoving new names into the test team but reality it is they will more than likely fail because they are barely succeeding at first class level.

If Smith drops off in the next couple years coupled with Warner coming to the end. We ain't going to win many series against good teams.

Our batting stocks are bad no doubt. But I don't think we'll ever get to West Indies bad.

Like I said earlier today, we flirted with basket case territory earlier in the decade without ever quite getting there, but overall it's been a very frustrating decade.

Whilst I'm pretty bullish about our top five batsmen (Smith, Labu, Warner, Puc, Green) even if two of them are rookies, I can't remember our batting depth ever being this bad. We have no room for error on converting our top batting talents into good test cricketers and any injury to one of those five exposes us badly.

It's unreasonable to expect it to be like the golden era - ooo well Damien Martyn and Matt Hayden failed in their first crack at test cricket so we'll sit them on the sidelines for 6 years to develop.

That's not the norm and the only comparable situation a cricketing nation has found themselves in was the West Indies with their fast bowling production line of the 70's and 80's and guys like Colin Croft only get to play 27 tests.... But we don't even have a couple of guys we can turn to and be confident they could average just 40 over a semi-sustained period (say 3 years) - or if they did it would be like Usman Khawaja where his average is severely inflated by big scores on roads in Australia.

 

[CricketingErrors]

naah man no more dust bowls - we will see.

surely turners if not dust bowls

 

[Johnny Bananas]

I think we need to make some small but significant changes to this team and more importantly the coaching staff. This is honestly a cataclysmic result. Probably the worst I've seen on home soil in my life time given the context (2010 was more humiliating but at least it was kind of expected given our line-up at the time).

Bravo, excellent post. I don't know the answer to most of the questions you pose, but there might be a few moldable talents toiling away in the Shield. Maybe Whiteman from WA as an opener.

 

[CricketingErrors]

I was one of those people and I'm very much enjoying the more competitive summers we've been having lately.

Our dominant era holds a special place in my heart but only because it was out of the ordinary. If cricket was always like that the sport would get boring.

No. Not true at all. That domination from Australia was very watchable. Australia will lose fans because of the current softness and unpredictability.

 

[CricketingErrors]

Expecting some interest on this forum for this series. Expecting England to give a tough fight- India's squad for first two Tests against England: Virat Kohli (c), Ajinkya Rahane, Rohit Sharma, Shubman Gill, Mayank Agarwal, Cheteshwar Pujara, Wriddhiman Saha, Hardik Pandya, KL Rahul (subject to fitness), Rishabh Pant, Jasprit Bumrah, Ishant Sharma, Mohammad Siraj, Shardul Thakur, Ravi Ashwin, Kuldeep Yadav, Washington Sundar, Axar Patel.

 

[CricketingErrors]

Very sorry looking faces of Australian players today. Never seen like this. Not even after the 2005 Ashes loss.

 

[The Passenger]

Very sorry looking faces of Australian players today. Never seen like this. Not even after the 2005 Ashes loss.

I think they were mentally prepared for India to fight out a draw, especially with the rain forecast. But very few would have seen an Indian win coming.

It's a loss that will see a lot of soul searching no doubt.

 

[CricketingErrors]

I think they were mentally prepared for India to fight out a draw, especially with the rain forecast. But very few would have seen an Indian win coming.

It's a loss that will see a lot of soul searching no doubt.

All too late buddy. Series is gone. Losers just talk such stuff and nothing major really happens. It’s a space Australia hasn’t been in. India will bully Australia from now on. Any format any place. Even fans will. Indians already are.

 

[The Passenger]

All too late buddy. Series is gone.

Huh? Obviously the series is gone. It wasn't 24 hours ago. India certainly have the wood on us at the moment, both in India (which is standard) and Australia (less standard).

Not sure of your point.

My point was it's no surprise the players are shell shocked. Coming into day five they could have certainly foreseen not getting 10 wickets, but not many had India chasing down over 300 on the fifth day. Like I said a soul searching result - Similar to when a team comes back from 5 goals in the last quarter.

 

[CricketingErrors]

Huh? Obviously the series is gone. It wasn't 24 hours ago. India certainly have the wood on us at the moment, both in India (which is standard) and Australia (less standard).

Not sure of your point.

My point was it's no surprise the players are shell shocked. Coming into day five they could have certainly foreseen not getting 10 wickets, but not many had India chasing down over 300 on the fifth day. Like I said a soul searching result - Similar to when a team comes back from 5 goals in the last quarter.

My point is there won’t be soul searching. It’s not like the bowlers did not try. What soul searching are you expecting ?

 

[The Passenger]

My point is there won’t be soul searching. It’s not like the bowlers did not try. What soul searching are you expecting ?

Think of it as a Hawthorn line in the sand moment for this squad (or hopefully it is).

Given India's injuries we shouldn't have lost that test, but you can forget their injuries because the guys that came in performed well. They deserve full credit for doing that. The more concerning thing is we shouldn't have lost that test from the position the game was in at stumps day four. Draw? Sure. No doubt it would have been frustrating. But if Pujuara and Rahane or someone else dig in and we just can't get break them down, that's test cricket. But conceding 300+ in the fifth day to lose a test is tough thing to deal with mentally.

And that's not a one off now. We've lost 2 test (Headlingly 2019, Brisbane 2021) and a test we've drawn (Sydney 2021) that shouldn't have happened. You could spot my inconsistency by being "OK we drew Brisbane, India batted well, deal with it" and saying we shouldn't have drawn Sydney, but we had a lot more time in Sydney to takes those wickets (130 overs) and the most concerning thing is we didn't even get close.

I think most would agree on the whole we have a very good bowling unit, and the majority of our problems lay at the feet of the batsmen, but those matches stick as some pretty serious black marks against the bowling unit.

 

[CricketingErrors]

Think of it as a Hawthorn line in the sand moment for this squad (or hopefully it is).

Given India's injuries we shouldn't have lost that test, but you can forget their injuries because the guys that came in performed well. They deserve full credit for doing that. The more concerning thing is we shouldn't have lost that test from the position the game was in at stumps day four. Draw? Sure. No doubt it would have been frustrating. But if Pujuara and Rahane or someone else dig in and we just can't get break them down, that's test cricket. But conceding 300+ in the fifth day to lose a test is tough thing to deal with mentally.

And that's not a one off now. We've lost 2 test (Headlingly 2019, Brisbane 2021) and a test we've drawn (Sydney 2021) that shouldn't have happened. You could spot my inconsistency by being "OK we drew Brisbane, India batted well, deal with it" and saying we shouldn't have drawn Sydney, but we had a lot more time in Sydney to takes those wickets (130 overs) and the most concerning thing is we didn't even get close.

I think most would agree on the whole we have a very good bowling unit, and the majority of our problems lay at the feet of the batsmen, but those matches stick as some pretty serious black marks against the bowling unit.

thank you for a detailed post.I can’t say how CA works but rarely such events change much. This is more a defining moment in Indian cricket and Ind Aus rivalry. No soul searching will change that. Live with it till the next series at least and may be for decades.

 

[The Passenger]

thank you for a detailed post.I can’t say how CA works but rarely such events change much. This is more a defining moment in Indian cricket and Ind Aus rivalry. No soul searching will change that. Live with it till the next series at least and may be for decades.

Who knows, the proof will be in the pudding. Is this Hawthorn line in the sand, or a breakdown in confidence.

I have full confidence in Cummins and Hazlewood, but Lyon and Starc were well out of sorts this series. It's not the end of their careers, but they are gonna need a big response because in 12 to 18 months from now they could become yesterday's men.

Headingly was a blow, but you could write off as an aberration and one of this generations most explosive batsmen doing the extraordinary. Sydney was frustrating and drawing wasn't necessarily the issue, but not even looking like getting close was the problem. But there's no way to spin Brisbane - there's no way we should have walked off the field with an L. But we did, and that's three very concerning matches now.

 

[happy punter]

What is more concerning for Aussie fans - inability of our batsmen to score 400+ in an first innings or inability to bowl out an opposition on a day 5 pitch 2 consecutive times?

 

[MelVilander]

surely turners if not dust bowls

dont know where they will play it might be Kolkata , Mohai, Dharamshala etc they will aid pace but with SG ball. it unlikely Aus will get spinning tracks cause Lyon would also be able to exploit it like Swan did for England and i cant remember Jason Kreza was it ?

With SG ball Umesh and Shami will be different proposition , Aus will get targeted next time when they meet in whites. But we are some way away, some more mellow series/ friendlies and same team games in IPL etc in between. This series was just so ****ing good, max possible battle in a game without actual physical contact. Good one.

 

[EskimoPAFC]

What a series... honestly Aus-India is THE rivalry in world cricket right now. Just have to win over there next time to get the ledger back to even.

I didn't rate Paine's decision making in this series - we should have been 2-1 up after the third test and this may have gone differently. Opting to spend his time sledging Ashwin while having Lyon burn overs on a deck and against players that clearly wasn't achieving anything was the day this series was lost.

Take nothing away from India though, Pujara and Pant just insanely good.

 

[MelVilander]

Given India's injuries we shouldn't have lost that test, but you can forget their injuries because the guys that came in performed well. They deserve full credit for doing that. The more concerning thing is we shouldn't have lost that test from the position the game was in at stumps day four. Draw? Sure.

i think Aus f'd it up previous game when they let India play a draw - Ashwin/Vihari beat you - Ashwin got into and stayed rent free in your captains head. This game was just one of those where the new comers were just too good for debutants and together had too many variables for Aus old guard to quickly decipher. If this was a 5 game series would we still think India will win the next test match with the same team, i feel the Indian team that played this game is weak still. A full strength India might have won here but might have still dropped this game if they had played. Like i said a very special series against two very very good sides, this is a rivalry now the last series in India, the one last India won here and this one - there is story now.

 

[Glacier]

It isnt hard to understand.

Australian fans have themselves to blame for this.

After the ball tampering episode, there was a total over reaction and embarrassing exercise in hand wringing.

CA bent over to outraged fan's demands and excessively banned Warner and Smith for 12 months. Sentences generally reserved for drug cheats and criminals. I can still see the twitter feed now full of idiots with no idea.

We were even lectured by an ex Goldman Sachs employee about morals. Yes, Goldman Sachs. A company who sucks money out of any orifice it can gets hand into and was neck deep in causing the GFC.

Smith was a capable captain, Warner, while a bit wild, was a capable deputy.

Paine is also capable. But the dynamics of the way we play cricket have changed forever. Any banter or sledging, or players letting off steam is now examined forensically and other players continue to let rip ad nauseum.

Any loss and fans wanna sack half the team and the coaches. As if that has ever changed anything.

We are still playing with one hand behind our back. More concerned with image then winning the game.

You sooks are to blame.

What a load of crap
Those players should never have played again
I find it amazing that they are there yet Bancroft has been the one sacrifices