News AFL Drugs Claims Bombshell

[1970crow]

Wada is concerned with any person within a registered testing pool, is taking prohibited substances at any time, in completion or out of competition.

From what it sounds like, the AFL and AFLPA have some from of policy that "random" testing only occurs after matches or within a certain time frame on match day (hence the teams can pull a player out before the test). From what I can gather the AFL testing is not random (other than maybe not all players are tested) and is not at any random time in or out of competition (which is that the WADA policy wants). This is similar to the NFL drug testing policy not fully complying to the WADA policy because the players don't want that.

The AFL is acting as cover for the players between them and the testing authority. This is the crux of the matter. They are not being subjected to the same scrutiny as other athletes who don't have a professional organisation providing that coverage (e.g. track and field athletes) and this has allowed a drug culture to continue in the competition. It's been going on for years, and I can name at least four players in the 00's (back when I was going out) I have seen doing drugs first hand.

So even though the club doctor has pulled the player from competition, WADA will still test if that player's number comes up? So what's being circumvented? You also know it's not the AFL doing the testing, it's the club doctors at a club level. This is not an AFL conspiracy.

 

[Geoffa32]

I assume going forward that when a player is out under this loophole it will be disclosed as this.

Not a minor injury or managed.



I now don't believe Tex had back spasms as a result of picking his kid up.



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[Bearded Clam]

This is just another example of how arsebackward our modern societies are.

Time to legalise, regulate and tax this shit.

50 or more years of desperately criminalising drugs, especially recreational ones like mull, meth, coke, etc etc to try and kerb use has been a policy failure of EPIC proportions.

How much has it cost us in policing, how many lives have been lost, how many underworld figures, bikies, crime gangs etc etc have been able to make billions off the back of the black market its created.

And here we are… it hasnt stopped a fxxkn thing!..

The biggest failure in the history of modern government policy.

Legalise it ffs.

 

[Geoffa32]

I wonder how the wagering industry feels about this.

Given the close relationship the AFL have with them.



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[Geoffa32]

People appear to be conflating the 2 external testing regimes with internal club doctor process. The testing regimes are random and outside of the control of the club.

If you test positive, on game day, as Smith did, then you’re caught up in the WADA system. If you test positive in an AFL out of comp test, you’re caught up in their 3 strikes policy. If you rack a few lines on Thursday night and turn up to work on game day Friday, do a piss test with Doc that shows substances, then they have a duty to pull you from the game.

Can’t see what’s wrong with this at all. No different to hundreds of workplaces around the country. That player was still subject to random testing by the other regimes.

Pretty good synopsis of the three processes.


Personally have no issue with the club doctor pulling a player for drug use.

But, feel it must be disclosed when teams are released.

Not the code words.

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[Coopers]

Far out - that’s almost 15% of the playing group.

Way more than just a couple.

Those are also just the ones that are found out. You could safely assume it's higher.

 

[Coopers]

This is just another example of how arsebackward our modern societies are.

Time to legalise, regulate and tax this s**t.

50 or more years of desperately criminalising drugs, especially recreational ones like mull, meth, coke, etc etc to try and kerb use has been a policy failure of EPIC proportions.

How much has it cost us in policing, how many lives have been lost, how many underworld figures, bikies, crime gangs etc etc have been able to make billions off the back of the black market its created.

And here we are… it hasnt stopped a fxxkn thing!..

The biggest failure in the history of modern government policy.

Legalise it ffs.

I'm pro that model, mostly. Meth and Heroin a big concern I'd think to be legalized... need to be looking at properly funding harm reduction on those, not full legalization.

However it has been a ridiculous money sink fighting a criminal problem the government created a market for, copying US and UK policies in the 60s through 80s.

I don't see any attempt to put a policy like this through the government getting any legs though.

 

[Sanders]

Don’t see the issue. By design, WADA is only concerned with athletes taking the field on match day with certain substances in their system. Their job is to keep competition clean. Players being removed assists that end, given the likelihood they’re WADA tested is pretty slim. And it wouldn’t stop a random AFL test as there’s no interaction between the player/doctor and the AFL’s contracted testing agency.

WADA wants them to stop doping, this is no different to athletes avoiding random tests which is an automatic ban in itself

 

[baldandbroke]

WADA wants them to stop doping, this is no different to athletes avoiding random tests which is an automatic ban in itself

Yep. Going to be interesting to see their perspective isn’t it.

This idea that WADA are only interested in the in-competition days doesn’t ring true to me.

Also, this line that the AFL are all above board with this is rubbish. If it was all about the medical approach and harm reduction … why wasn’t it shouted from the mountain top? The process is secret and hidden and smells.

Confidentiality around individuals does not mean there has to be confidentiality around the broader process and its goals.

I think this will blow up.

Oh, and the Crows definitely will have had players that have used this process. No doubt. We will not be immune.

 

[Interloperer]

This idea that WADA are only interested in the in-competition days doesn’t ring true to me.

WADA have two lists of banned substances, which are basically "Banned outright" and "Banned on Matchday/in competition".

SIA can test athletes at any time. But they only care about the second list if it shows up in a test on a competition day.

Cocaine is in the second list, which is why the AFL wants to avoid positive tests on matchday at all costs.

 

[DJ75]

Have any journo's asked Crows or Port players about this yet? Does it operate in SA?

 

[footy4ever]

Have any journo's asked Crows or Port players about this yet? Does it operate in SA?

Don't be silly. Crows and Port players don't do drugs. No use asking them.

 

[CrowEater888]

We all know Brad Crouch

5

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Age

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86kg

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Career

Season

Last 5

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T

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CL

2.6

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was caught with coke in the city (with Tyson Stengle

18

Tyson Stengle

Age

26

Ht

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Wt

71kg

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Career

Season

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5.8

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T

2.6

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G

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), and he was very injury prone.

Read into that as you will.

 

[woofsson]

I think this is a whole lot of meh.

Crystal meh?

 

[DJ75]

Don't be silly. Crows and Port players don't do drugs. No use asking them.

I'm not that silly. I've seen it.
My question is more about the AFL coverup. The reports are very specific about the lab where these pre-tests were being done in Melbourne's case. Is it the same lab for Victorian teams? Or does every team have their own place they use?

 

[Interloperer]

We all know Brad Crouch was caught with coke in the city (with Tyson Stengle), and he was very injury prone.

Read into that as you will.

Did he go on a two year bender?

 

[SugarShane]

Oh, and the Crows definitely will have had players that have used this process. No doubt. We will not be immune.

I'd give us the benefit of the doubt. Surely if we'd attempted to do something as wily as this we'd have ****ed it up and been found out.

 

[footy4ever]

I'm not that silly. I've seen it.
My question is more about the AFL coverup. The reports are very specific about the lab where these pre-tests were being done in Melbourne's case. Is it the same lab for Victorian teams? Or does every team have their own place they use?

I was joking. Should have used an emoji.

 

[George Kramer]

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/news/afl-2024-sam-mitchell-on-the-illict-drugs-policy-as-the-fallout-to-the-bombshell-revelations-continues/news-story/a814fae9685c8de4c9e1ad736713fed7

AFL 2024: Sam Mitchell on the illicit drugs policy as the fallout to the bombshell revelations continues​

Hawthorn’s Sam Mitchell has joined the chorus of AFL coaches in pleading innocence since Tuesday’s drugs bombshell. But he says its something that he should know about.

Hawthorn coach Sam Mitchell believes senior coaches should be privy to information about players within the league’s illicit drugs policy after bombshell revelations that players had been drug tested with the option of pulling out of matches.
Coaches across the AFL have pleaded innocence since it was revealed that players can be tested by club doctors for illicit substances and removed from games that weekend if the results are positive, by using false excuses like injury or illness.

Mitchell said on Thursday that that practice was “certainly not something that I had any clue about” but coaches should be let in to know more about if a player had been failing drug tests.
urrently, doctors keep player details private and coaches, or other people within the club, are not told if they test positive to substances.

Even if a player receives a strike under the league’s three-strike policy, that doesn’t become common knowledge to their club or any potential clubs looking to trade for that player.

Some have suggested knowledge about players taking drugs passing to coaches or other football department members could lead to a breakdown in relationships, but Mitchell said club leaders would help player welfare if they knew the truth.

“I’m certainly far from an expert in the area but I know that in the position I am in you are really trying to make the best chances for your players to be the best they can be,” he said.

“If you have the information that you think will help you make the best for them, that is really a big part of your job as a senior coach.

“Whatever information you have and we need to make the player the best they can be not just as players but people as well, I think that is pretty important. Mitchell said the practice of drug tested was “not something that was in my world” during his glittering 329-game playing career, of which 13 seasons came after the AFL illicit drugs policy was enacted in 2005.
The coach said that the revelations about players being potentially removed from games under false excuses could cast a cloud over any player who was pulled out of a match late in the week.

“We are not in a position where we would strategically pull someone out of a team late to try and get an advantage … and that is something that I hadn’t considered up to this point and that is now going to be looked upon differently,” he said.

“I don’t know how this will play out, which is why I am glad the AFL is having a look into this and they are trying to improve the process.”

“I think the people that are in charge of your wellbeing and your welfare should know about your wellbeing and your welfare.”

These recent ex players haven’t known about a program that’s been in for 20 years, yeah right

 

[1970crow]

I assume going forward that when a player is out under this loophole it will be disclosed as this.

Not a minor injury or managed.



I now don't believe Tex had back spasms as a result of picking his kid up.



On SM-A325F using BigFooty.com mobile app

Why would it change? The AFL isn’t involved in decisions surrounding late withdrawals. There is a fine, from memory, for bringing in a player outside of the emergency list. But otherwise, who takes the field is a club decision.

 

[1970crow]

Pretty good synopsis of the three processes.


Personally have no issue with the club doctor pulling a player for drug use.

But, feel it must be disclosed when teams are released.

Not the code words.

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I think that naming and shaming would be pure bloody mindedness and contrary to the ‘welfare’ intent of the AFL’s own policy. Why does it matter for what reason a player is withdrawn?

 

[1970crow]

WADA wants them to stop doping, this is no different to athletes avoiding random tests which is an automatic ban in itself

What random tests are being avoided? WADA can still test them, they can test at anytime. Or have I been misinformed?

Serious question. Do you reckon WADA would prefer a form of self-report and the athlete not compete or for the athlete to compete in the hope they’re randomly selected for an in-competition test?

 

[1970crow]

Yep. Going to be interesting to see their perspective isn’t it.

This idea that WADA are only interested in the in-competition days doesn’t ring true to me.

Also, this line that the AFL are all above board with this is rubbish. If it was all about the medical approach and harm reduction … why wasn’t it shouted from the mountain top? The process is secret and hidden and smells.

Confidentiality around individuals does not mean there has to be confidentiality around the broader process and its goals.

I think this will blow up.

Oh, and the Crows definitely will have had players that have used this process. No doubt. We will not be immune.

What’s almost always forgotten in the ‘won’t somebody think of the children handwringing’ is that the entire AFL illicit testing regime is allowed only due to the agreement of the players. The other option is to bin it altogether and just rely on the WADA system.

Then the question is whether players should be able to do piss tests and feign mild illness. They can do this without a discussion with the club doctor simply by buying the test kit themself.

 

[Anzacpaul]

Not really, it's putting a microscope on how scripted the AFL are trying to make the sport. They are essentially trying to circumvent there own rules in order to ensure certain players can take the field.

How is that not ****ed?

Lets go a layer deeper.

AFL have shills that are mates of players, encouraging them to get on the gear mid-week in order to fail a test so they can't play that week and helping to manufacture a result.

 

[Interloperer]

What random tests are being avoided? WADA can still test them, they can test at anytime. Or have I been misinformed?

They can test at anytime. But the drugs being discussed here will only result in a ban if the positive test is on matchday as they are only on the "banned in competition" list.

Serious question. Do you reckon WADA would prefer a form of self-report and the athlete not compete or for the athlete to compete in the hope they’re randomly selected for an in-competition test?

By my reading a lot of the players would already be guilty by WADA regulations. As they were intending to play despite knowing they will likely test positive for a prohibited substance.

2.2 Use or Attempted Use of a Prohibited Substance or a
Prohibited Method.
2.2.1 The success or failure of the Use of a Prohibited
Substance or Prohibited Method is not material. It is sufficient
that the Prohibited Substance or Prohibited Method was Used or
Attempted to be Used for an anti-doping rule violation to be
committed.