Preview AFL Rd 22 - Collingwood v WCE - MCG Friday night - Changes and Prematch Discussion

[Pera]

2-3 if it isn't too bad

Huh?

Sinclair, who has impressively reinvented himself as a defender in the second half of the year, hurt a shoulder in the early minutes of the match against Hawthorn last Friday night while Elliott came from the field late in the same match due to hamstring tightness. Both players are expected to vie for selection in the final home and away match of the season, against North Melbourne on Sunday, September 1.

 

[good4footy]

Out: Sinclair, Elliot, Lynch
In: Didak, Seedsman, Jolly

Exactly.

 

[SuperSub17]

Huh?

Hopefully that's true, Elliott's been pretty valuable for us this year. 30 goals isn't a bad return for a second year player - throw in a couple of MOTY contenders as well

 

[PerthBoy87]

Hi all,

For those interested, see below a historical view of Collingwood vs West Coast. I always do this for the Richmond board (as they are my team) so I thought I would do this for the Collingwood board.


Collingwood vs West Coast: Head-To-Head

Overall:Played - 42, Collingwood: 20, West Coast: 21, 1 draw


Collingwood Home Record: Played 25 – won: 16, lost: 8, 1 draw

Collingwood Away Record: Played 17 - won: 5, lost: 12

West Coast Home Record: Played 17 - won: 12, lost: 5

West Coast Away Record: Played 25 – won: 8, lost: 16, 1 draw


Collingwood vs West Coast – Record at Grounds:

MCG: Played 9 – Collingwood: 8, West Coast: 1

Waverley Park: Played 3 – Collingwood: 1, West Coast: 1, 1 draw

Victoria Park: Played 7 – Collingwood: 3, West Coast: 4

Colonial Stadium (Telstra Dome, now known as Etihad Stadium): Played 6 – Collingwood: 4, West Coast: 2

WACA: Played 3 – Collingwood: 0, West Coast: 3

Subiaco (Paterson’s Stadium): Played 14 – Collingwood: 4, West Coast: 10


Past 5 Games –Collingwood: 4, West Coast: 1

Past 5 Seasons (2008-2012): Collingwood: 7, West Coast: 1

Last Time They Met: Semi-Final, 2012: Collingwood: 10.13 (73) defeated West Coast: 9.6 (60) – MCG

Overall Finals Record: Played 6 – Collingwood: 4, West Coast: 1, 1 draw


Interesting Fact:

As this Round 22 fixture between Collingwood and West Coast is played at the MCG, it’s interesting to point out that the last time West Coast beat Collingwood at the MCG was Round 2, 1995 which was 18 years ago and in that game West Coast won by 4 points. Now admittedly since Round 2, 1995 there has only been a further 7 games played between these two clubs at the MCG (with Collingwood winning all of them) in that 18 year period because Victoria Park and Etihad Stadium (Colonial Stadium) were the venues used for Collingwood vs West Coast games in Melbourne.

It’s also interesting to note that the gap between Round 2 1995 and the next time these two clubs would meet at the MCG again was a 7 year period with Round 2, 2002 being the next time these clubs would meet at the MCG.

In recent times however since 2011, Collingwood have won the last four games at the MCG against West Coast by an average margin of 22 points – the highest margin being 52 points in Round 10, 2011 and the lowest margin being 3 points in Round 13, 2012.



All Games - Collingwood vs West Coast:

Round 10, 1987: West Coast: 19.23 (137) defeated Collingwood: 11.14 (80) – Subiaco

Round 4, 1988: Collinwood: 13.16 (94) defeated West Coast: 8.7 (55) – Victoria Park

Round 21, 1988: West Coast: 16.15 (111) defeated Collingwood: 7.9 (51) – Subiaco

Round 11, 1989: Collingwood: 17.14 (116) defeated West Coast: 11.15 (81) – Subiaco

Round 22, 1989: Collingwood: 20.9 (129) defeated West Coast: 11.14 (80) – Victoria Park

Round 1, 1990: West Coast: 14.16 (100) defeated Collingwood: 8.6 (54) – Subiaco

Round 14, 1990: Collingwood: 15.12 (102) defeated West Coast 11.10 (76) – Victoria Park

Qualifying Final, 1990: Collingwood: 13.12 (90) drew West Coast: 13.12 (90) – Waverley Park

Qualifying Final, 1990: Collingwood: 19.12 (126) defeated West Coast 9.13 (67) – Waverley Park

Round 2, 1991: West Coast: 13.7 (85) defeated Collingwood: 8.10 (58) – Waverley Park

Round 17, 1991: West Coast: 20.15 (135) defeated Collingwood: 8.6 (54) – WACA

Round 13, 1992: Collingwood: 8.15 (63) defeated West Coast: 8.14 (62) – Subiaco

Round 13, 1993: West Coast: 14.10 (94) defeated Collingwood: 11.5 (71) – Victoria Park

Round 13, 1994: Collingwood: 18.13 (121) defeated West Coast: 12.12 (84) – MCG

Qualifying Final, 1994: West Coast: 11.16 (82) defeated Collingwood: 12.8 (80) – WACA

Round 2, 1995: West Coast: 11.14 (80), defeated Collingwood: 11.10 (76) – MCG

Round 17, 1995: West Coast: 18.21 (129) defeated Collingwood: 11.13 (79) – Subiaco

Round 11, 1996: West Coast: 16.19 (115) defeated Collingwood: 9.8 (62) – Subiaco

Round 12, 1997: West Coast: 11.5 (71) defeated Collingwood: 7.13 (55) – Victoria Park

Round 2, 1998: West Coast: 17.14 (116) defeated Collingwood: 8.8 (56) – Subiaco

Round 17, 1998: West Coast: 13.8 (86) defeated Collingwood: 9.11 (65) – Victoria Park

Round 3, 1999: West Coast: 16.15 (111) defeated Collingwood: 11.9 (75) – Victoria Park

Round 18, 1999: West Coast: 16.12 (108) defeated Collingwood: 10.12 (72) – WACA

Round 11, 2000: West Coast: 18.20 (128) defeated Collingwood: 13.14 (92) – Colonial Stadium

Round 12, 2001: Collingwood: 26.17 (173) defeated West Coast: 14.8 (92) – Colonial Stadium

Round 2, 2002: Collingwood: 17.18 (120) defeated West Coast: 18.11 (119) – MCG

Round 17, 2002: West Coast: 17.12 (114) defeated Collingwood: 8.8 (56) – Subiaco

Round 8, 2003: West Coast: 18.11 (119) defeated Collingwood: 15.13 (103) – Telstra Dome

Round 11, 2004: Collingwood: 14.9 (93) defeated West Coast: 11.9 (75) – Telstra Dome

Round 9, 2005: Collingwood: 18.10 (118) defeated West Coast: 15.5 (95) – MCG

Round 7, 2006: West Coast: 16.16 (112) defeated Collingwood: 15.8 (98) – Subiaco

Round 16, 2006: Collingwood: 19.13 (127) defeated West Coast: 13.12 (90) – Telstra Dome

Round 2, 2007: West Coast: 12.15 (87) defeated Collingwood: 11.9 (75) – Subiaco

Semi-Final, 2007: Collingwood: 13.15 (93) defeated West Coast: 10.14 (74) – Subiaco

Round 10, 2008: Collingwood: 27.11 (173) defeated West Coast: 10.13 (73) – MCG

Round 9, 2009: Collingwood: 12.16 (88) defeated West Coast: 9.12 (66) – Subiaco

Round 14, 2010: Collingwood: 20.15 (135) defeated West Coast: 7.19 (52) – Etihad Stadium

Round 10, 2011: Collingwood: 16.9 (105) defeated West Coast: 7.11 (53) – MCG

Qualifying Final, 2011: Collingwood: 12.10 (82) defeated West Coast: 9.8 (62) – MCG

Round 13, 2012: Collingwood: 12.13 (85) defeated West Coast: 12.10 (82) – MCG

Round 22, 2012: West Coast: 15.17 (107) defeated Collingwood: 8.19 (68) – Patersons Stadium

Semi Final, 2012: Collingwood: 10.13 (73) defeated West Coast: 9.6 (60) - MCG

 

[SuperSub17]

^^ So interestingly West Coast is one of only two teams to have a positive win-loss record against us. Time to cross that one off.

Unfortunately the other one might take a few years

 

[SuperSub17]

Round 14, 2010: Collingwood: 20.15 (135) defeated West Coast: 7.19 (52) – Etihad Stadium


Round 22, 2012: West Coast: 15.17 (107) defeated Collingwood: 8.19 (68) – Patersons Stadium

Thanks a lot for this preview

For some reason (don't ask me why) I noticed these however...

 

[millsy29gopies]

Those saying that both Krakouer and Didak will come back are kidding themselves. It will be one or the other, they both lack a defensive side of their game and so they could only replace Elliott. Either would give a spark to the side.

I do think that Martin and Seedsman deserve senior games but in the circumstances there is no spot for them.

As much as he is despised on this board, I feel the only guy capable of taking on Sinclair's role is Russell. Oxley is too inexperienced at this stage.

Like many others I thought Lynch's game was terrible and he must be dropped. I would like to see Paine in and experiment with Keeffe in the ruck while moving Reid down back especially against a poor West Coast outfit but I realise this is a dream. Jolly comes in.

 

[eddiebankbalance]

I was at Vic Park in 1999, what a shit game

 

[Pera]

Can't believe the amount of people who want Jolly in. Has everyone forgotten how much of a complete liability he is once the ball hits ground level? Lynch is probably playing the hardest role in football, and now we suddenly want a 19 y.o kid with under 6 games experience to move into that role for part time duties?

Grundy is EASILY our #1 ruckman. So we have to now propose a better option for Lynch's, not change Grundy's role. Can Darren Jolly seriously give more in the 2nd ruck role than Lynch? No chance at all.

Lynch wasn't great against the Hawks, but he needs to stay in this role for weeks on end leading into finals, otherwise we'll be having some serious problems with the issue in a finals series

 

[4#Didak#4]

Can't believe the amount of people who want Jolly in. Has everyone forgotten how much of a complete liability he is once the ball hits ground level? Lynch is probably playing the hardest role in football, and now we suddenly want a 19 y.o kid with under 6 games experience to move into that role for part time duties?

Grundy is EASILY our #1 ruckman. So we have to now propose a better option for Lynch's, not change Grundy's role. Can Darren Jolly seriously give more in the 2nd ruck role than Lynch? No chance at all.

Lynch wasn't great against the Hawks, but he needs to stay in this role for weeks on end leading into finals, otherwise we'll be having some serious problems with the issue in a finals series

I hear what you are saying. It would be great to have Lynch step up & lock that position away, but you can't deny he has been largely disappointing.

He is not deemed any sort of a threat of scoring by the opposition....because he doesn't score....but also because he doesn't mark the ball inside 50 and is hopeless when the ball hits the ground. As a result of the oppositions disdain of him he is not even doing the job of drawing defenders away from Cloke & Reid. For me this is a minimium requirement if he does nothing else, at least draw the defense away from the key forwards.

Last week Hawthorn saw fit to play a much smaller man in Hodge on him, as they knew Hodge could beat him in the air & also run off him at will to help his defense out and also be an offensive rebounder. Hodge is a start but, you can be assured this will be the template for the type of player they will play on Lynch from now on and it will work a treat. Really we should have done something to stop this, but the only thing we could have done is swapped Grundy & Lynch - which again is a win for the Hawks this time in the ruck.

I think Jolly & Grundy are going to be a far more damaging combination than Lynch & Grundy.

Playing Grundy flat out in the #1 ruck position is probably going to see him burnt out by finals. We need to look after the kid. If he can play first ruck he can certainly play Lynch's role. Not only will he be an threat in the air, his ground work is amazing, he is quick and will land tackles. He is also obviously better equipped to give Jolly a chop out in the ruck for longer.

I think having two quality rucks will mean the opposition cannot rape us as they used to when Jolly went for rests. It means the opposition second ruck is suddenly under huge pressure (an opposition advantage turned into a disadvantage). Jolly will also be able to have more impact for longer as he does not need to play the huge minutes he has in the past.

Jolly playing forward for long periods is not a great idea, but he is a different prospect to a Grundy or even Lynch that will keep the defense thinking while he rests down there. He has been doing this for years now & it works in short bursts. He is not someone they can afford to play a running defender on inside 50, he requires a big body. He is intelligent & does kick goals. It might be a case of pushing Jolly to the square for a rest & let Cloke off the leash up the ground to use his running abilities.

We have a lot more strings to our bow and variety that is going to worry sides with Jolly & Grundy.

 

[iGNITER]

Be an interesting week at selection with the injuries. Hopefully we see a club favourite get a gig this week.

I think we need to play 2 genuine ruckman. Grundy is a beast and tackles very well, need to see how he fares up forward. Yes when the ball hits the deck Jolly is basically almost out of the contest but Lynch has been as well in recent weeks, especially with Hodge running off him at will last week.

INS: Jolly, Didak, Seedsman
OUTS: Lynch, Elliott, Sinclair

B - Maxwell Brown Williams
HB - Shaw Keeffe O'Brien
C - Beams Swan Sidebottom
HF - J.Thomas Cloke Dwyer
F - Didak Reid Grundy
R - Jolly Ball Pendlebury
INT - Seedsman Macaffer Goldsack
SUB - Blair

 

[Rusty22]

95% of people here all agree with the ins, jolly, didak, seedsman, make it happen.

 

[maace]

http://www.collingwoodfc.com.au/news/2013-08-19/mixed-news-on-the-injury-front

Didak for Elliot and Seedsman for Sinclair?

.. a little bit more wary about Sinclair

 

[Krueger]

I'd rather Kennedy over krak and dids.. at least he can chase and tackle !

Showed a lot in the AFL so far, played a few quiet games too though.
I would prefer ben ken, but if krak gets a game i would understand

Dont get your hate for Didak, he has worked his guts out in the VFL. Not all players can be tackling machines. Didak's offensive abilities, disposal and creativity far outweight his defensive deficiencies.

 

[Quicky]

I'd rather Kennedy over krak and dids.. at least he can chase and tackle !

Showed a lot in the AFL so far, played a few quiet games too though.
I would prefer ben ken, but if krak gets a game i would understand

Kennedy has shown plenty this season as a slight outside half forward but he is inexperienced and I believe would get eaten up in finals. Krakouer and Didak are proven big game players that make things happen in tight contests and can open up a game. I would select either over Kennedy in a do or die final in a flash. And that's no slight on Kennedy either. We are very fortunate to have those two waiting in the wings as depth.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

Kennedy has shown plenty this season as a slight outside half forward but he is inexperienced and I believe would get eaten up in finals. Krakouer and Didak are proven big game players that make things happen in tight contests and can open up a game. I would select either over Kennedy in a do or die final in a flash. And that's no slight on Kennedy either. We are very fortunate to have those two waiting in the wings as depth.

Precisely my sentiments. Kennedy is not ready for AFL footy, let alone finals. Both Krakouer and Didak have good current VFL form. Now is the time to play them. We have nothing to lose by giving them an opportunity to strut their stuff on the big green stage.

 

[Who_can_say]

Exactly.

Elliot was actually good up forward for us. What a stupid omission.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

Elliot was actually good up forward for us. What a stupid omission.

He is only being omitted by posters because he is injured - hamstring soreness. Sinclair also has a shoulder problem.

 

[TheWing121]

Precisely my sentiments. Kennedy is not ready for AFL footy, let alone finals. Both Krakouer and Didak have good current VFL form. Now is the time to play them. We have nothing to lose by giving them an opportunity to strut their stuff on the big green stage.

I also think, Didak will add some class with his disposal. We are really missing an effective kick who can hit a leading target like Fas.

 

[Gambit78]

We should select our oldest possible team for these last two rounds and give them an 'audition' for the finals...

 

[themulletking]

Hi all,

For those interested, see below a historical view of Collingwood vs West Coast. I always do this for the Richmond board (as they are my team) so I thought I would do this for the Collingwood board.


Collingwood vs West Coast: Head-To-Head

How good's this guy? Loving your contributions to our board

 

[Old Spice]

Just having watched the highlights of Jolly in the VFL, it is notable that he can barely get off the ground.

http://www.collingwoodfc.com.au/video/2013-08-20/vfl-darren-jolly-dominates-the-ruck

Don't think his inclusion is a lock.

 

[MyManLynch]

Just having watched the highlights of Jolly in the VFL, it is notable that he can barely get off the ground.

http://www.collingwoodfc.com.au/video/2013-08-20/vfl-darren-jolly-dominates-the-ruck

Don't think his inclusion is a lock.

I don't think it's a situation that Jolly cannot jump, just that every time he does jump the ground follows him.​

Bucks mentioned today: Grundy in number one ruck at the moment/on form; a Grundy/Jolly combo may work; Lynch played poorly against Hawthorn.​

Frome those comments, one could assume a Jolly for Lynch scenario.​

 

[Old Spice]

I don't think it's a situation that Jolly cannot jump, just that every time he does jump the ground follows him.​

Bucks mentioned today: Grundy in number one ruck at the moment/on form; a Grundy/Jolly combo may work; Lynch played poorly against Hawthorn.​

Frome those comments, one could assume a Jolly for Lynch scenario.​

Pendles said in a post game interview on SEN that we missed Q 3-4 times with poor delivery (which of course was effected by the windy conditions).

 

[mattys123]

Bucks talking up Swanny in this week's brief;

http://www.collingwoodfc.com.au/fan...d-21.workstation?camefrom=EMCL_122644_6976117