News Assistant coach changes for 2018... BUMPED p42, now discussing potential 2019 promotions to other clubs

[Maggie5]

I had similar views on Harvey like many on here however listening to Howe interviewed on radio after the Melbourne game he was complimented on his consistency compared to his demons days. He actually credited Harvey and said that had been working closely with him.

 

[KrispyKremePie]

Found this quote on Robert Harvey on Collingwood's website: "He continued as leader of the midfield group in 2013, winning the AFL Coaches Association's Assistant Coach of the Year award."

I suspect this helped him keep his role...

http://m.collingwoodfc.com.au/season/coaches/robert-harvey


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[jmac70]

Well then I guess you can sign up to champion data and find out for us then.

From the naked eye and my memory, we still gave up far too many Coast to coast goals, points and scoring opportunities. It happened regularly from kick outs.

Considering we scored an extra 34 points in total on 2016, I don't think we've much to crow about re: scoring Coast to coast.

Something for the coaching team to work on next season.

 

[doodles98]

Good to have kept Lockyer.

Mostly to stick it up all the armchair critics that have NFI and no insight.

And nothing to do with being a Lockyer fan boy. Hey Tarkyn _24?

 

[doodles98]

Sooo.. we identify that the FD has failed and needs a clean out. We reappoint the head coach for two years, get rid of two assistants, one of whom is so well known to be shit at his job he is immediately poached by Hawthorn. And we get rid of Davoren which is great news just also the most obvious decision in history.
Keep up the great work ED

 

[MagpieJoel]

I don't pretend to know if Burns has been competent or ineffectual at the Pies. But Hawthorn want him and he seems a class above Rocca, Lockyer or Harvey.

The only person you should be comparing him against there is Harvey. The other two aren't even assistant coaches.

As for Hawthorn wanting Burns. Well it could be more about Burns wanting a change of scenery to broaden his horizons (under a proven coach). Did you consider that?

 

[MagpieJoel]

Sooo.. we identify that the FD has failed and needs a clean out. We reappoint the head coach for two years, get rid of two assistants, one of whom is so well known to be shit at his job he is immediately poached by Hawthorn. And we get rid of Davoren which is great news just also the most obvious decision in history.
Keep up the great work ED

Nothing will ever please the people on here.

Burns had been at the Pies for 4 years. It's a smart move by him if he ever wants to coach at senior level.

 

[doodles98]

Nothing will ever please the people on here.

Burns had been at the Pies for 4 years. It's a smart move by him if he ever wants to coach at senior level.

I will be pleased if we become a well run and competitive football team again. That will please me no end.

 

[MagpieJoel]

I will be pleased if we become a well run and competitive football team again. That will please me no end.

You would have complained if we kept Burns.

 

[doodles98]

You would have complained if we kept Burns.

He was setting a bad example to Kirby. Had to go.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

R.Harvey has won an assistant coach of the year award, is one of 7 assistant coaches - with Goodwin, Dew, Barker, Kingsley - to have completed the new level 4 accreditation designed by the Afl to groom the next senior coaches.

What makes him a poor assistant coach? Industry clearly rates him highly!

Because bigfooty doesn't rate him.
Hence dud,

Stuff the AFL endorsements.

Declaration: for some reason I've not felt Harvey is particularly effective. It's just a long held instinct. But if he's been given assistant coach of the year, by the AFL, done the level 4 course, the players like him and respect him (I assume) I'm happy enough that we don't take him out the back and shoot him.

I'll have to accept the industry verdict over my own feelings and the bigfooty death squad.

 

[Darkyprotector]

In relation to James Hird, I don't really care about the history. If he is the right person for the job that's all that matters.

My issue with Hird is that he has been out of the game a while now and would've lost touch. 2 years out of the game is huge these days, and I doubt he watched a lot of footy in this time.

I think we need tactical nous more than anything. A coach he hasn't kept up to date is not going to know enough about the latest tactics, and also the way certain teams are playing.

I'd prefer someone fresh like Boyd who can bring some IP.

But overall, I want a high quality assistant with experience and is a good tactician.

The best coach to get is A collins
Very good coach, educator , winner

 

[Saintly Viewed]

By completing a course that one cannot fail?. Since the course was implemented 5 years ago, only coaches that have completed the course as won Assistant Coach of the Year.

That is true it seems.

I do suspect that whatever changes happen at our club, regardless there will be ongoing pot shots taken.

Because it's not really about a real discussion, About assistants, it's about the death squad being out and about shooting everything in sight.

(A little literary licence taken)

 

[shizzle]

Harvey was regarded that highly as an assistant that he was awarded the assistant coach of the year by the aflca.

You are aware of how that is awarded, it's entirely done from people at your own club. So he got voted in by a dysfunctional Collingwood coaching panel which may have just been Nathan doing all the voting, and the players, that's it.

There's no argument he's a "very nice bloke", no surprise the players liked him, the players also like the people that dish up the food and the property steward because they're nice. Yet he's such a great coach his next career move was seen to be moving down a grade into the VFL to coach Frankston, who themselves were so dysfunctional at every level they got booted out of the VFL in 2016 and have only just regained a license to participate again next season.

 

[Roverjg]

The best coach to get is A collins
Very good coach, educator , winner

This is on Williamstown FC's Website
"There is a distinctive educational presence among the Williamstown coaching staff in 2016, with seven of the nine coaches having an educational background.
What motivates people to become teachers? A passion to help others become better, says Williamstown premiership coach Andrew Collins.

"The great thing is that most of our coaches were involved in community work before starting their teaching careers," said Collins. "Combine that with an academic degree over four years and their work experience in teaching young people, they really bring a great skill set."

The individual teaching backgrounds of the coaches cover a vast array of areas, from Physical Education and Maths, to Art and Religion. "No matter what people say about coaching and teaching, teachers are not all the same," Collins joked.

"As a coaching group we want to be the best coaches we can be for our young playing group."

When Collins retired from league football at the end of 1996, he turned to coaching. He returned to his old club Sandringham in the VFL, and coached there for two years, leading the club to the premiership in 1997. He served as an assistant coach at AFL club St Kilda from 2000–2003, then as an assistant coach at Hawthorn in 2004 and 2005. While at Hawthorn, he also coached its VFL affiliate club. In 2006 and 2007 he coached VFL club Coburg, taking the team to a losing Grand Final in 2007.

In 2008, Collins moved to South Australia and coached SANFL club West Adelaide for six years from 2008 to 2013. He led the club to the 2012 SANFL GF where they were defeated by Norwood, and he coached the Bloods to win the 2013 Foxtel Cup over (WAFL) side East Fremantle.

In 2014, Collins returned to Victoria and signed to coach VFL club Williamstown in its first season as a stand-alone club not affiliated with an AFL club. He led the club to a premiership in 2015.

Well, he certainly has the Hawthorn coaching philosophy down pat.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Because bigfooty doesn't rate him.
Hence dud,

Stuff the AFL endorsements.

Declaration: for some reason I've not felt Harvey is particularly effective. It's just a long held instinct. But if he's been given assistant coach of the year, by the AFL, done the level 4 course, the players like him and respect him (I assume) I'm happy enough that we don't take him out the back and shoot him.

I'll have to accept the industry verdict over my own feelings and the bigfooty death squad.

This exactly. I don't rate Harvey that much because (a) he seems to be quietly spoken and (b) my long standing dislike and therefore bias against almost all things Stkilda.

But what would I know? If an expert panel rates him coach of the year who am I to argue?

It's impossible from a distance to judge how anybody behind the scenes are performing without first hand knowledge.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

As for the "death squad", you're spot on, saintly. They just want blood.

A wide ranging review should and will go deeper than just sacking a few people. It's also about what your people do, how they do it, and how they can do it better.

 

[Scodog10]

Sooo.. we identify that the FD has failed and needs a clean out. We reappoint the head coach for two years, get rid of two assistants, one of whom is so well known to be shit at his job he is immediately poached by Hawthorn. And we get rid of Davoren which is great news just also the most obvious decision in history.
Keep up the great work ED

Only a thought that I've been working on this morning, but perhaps the board are hedging their bets?

It's difficult I know, but let's consider that they aren't complete morons. Perhaps they considered that we can't just keep handing him contract after contract without him producing results (this is his third since our last final). Say he fails again next year and the two year contract won't save him so we have to find a replacement. Does it make any sense to turf everyone out on the coaches panel when the next coach would want there own panel anyway? There'd be mass payouts unless all the new line coaches were signed on one year deals and why would anyone of quality join us on a one year deal?

So far the only coach it appears we've chosen to give the boot was Rocca. Burns was poached, Pert was pushed because he and Walsh couldn't work together and Davoren was a no brainer. Ed is a fool for sticking by Buckley, IMO, but there's every chance they gave him the deal because they felt they couldn't source anyone better (moronic I know).

All the moves we've made then revolve around that thinking. It will hamstring us for 2018, but logically it makes sense that the second year is extremely conditional. Perhaps Suma as an assistant makes more sense if you consider who he's been working with the past few years and Buckley's reaction to the Hardie "rumour"...

 

[swoop42]

So on one hand we have people telling us how can we possibly know Harvey is a dud unless we're involved with the club and yet the same people suggest an award voted on by people outside the club as justification for his retention.

Guess what most of us thought Davoren and Lappin were junk from the beginning and slowly, eventually the club saw the light of day and replaced them.

Oh and that award was given in 2013 and we haven't played finals since so he and Buckley certainly aren't no Hardwick and Caracella.

All aboard the merry go round everyone as we're the masters of spin.

I hope you enjoy the ride.

 

[wicksy]

Sooo.. we identify that the FD has failed and needs a clean out. We reappoint the head coach for two years, get rid of two assistants, one of whom is so well known to be shit at his job he is immediately poached by Hawthorn. And we get rid of Davoren which is great news just also the most obvious decision in history.
Keep up the great work ED

I'm sorry but you're being critical of him doing the right thing because it was obvious?
Would you have rathered him keep Davoren because it was the less obvious option?

You're just about the most boring poster on this entire site.
Doodles... An insomniac's best friend.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

So on one hand we have people telling us how can we possibly know Harvey is a dud unless we're involved with the club and yet the same people suggest an award voted on by people outside the club as justification for his retention.

Guess what most of us thought Davoren and Lappin were junk from the beginning and slowly, eventually the club saw the light of day and replaced them.

Oh and that award was given in 2013 and we haven't played finals since so he and Buckley certainly aren't no Hardwick and Caracella.

All aboard the merry go round everyone as we're the masters of spin.

I hope you enjoy the ride.

I'm saying people in the industry have more clue than outsiders. That's not too difficult a concept is it?

Burns is a good example. Hawthorn liked him. They poached him. If hawthorn hadn't poached him the Bigfooty nuffies would be asking why hadn't he been sacked and another favorite son had been retained.

 

[doodles98]

I'm sorry but you're being critical of him doing the right thing because it was obvious?
Would you have rathered him keep Davoren because it was the less obvious option?

You're just about the most boring poster on this entire site.
Doodles... An insomniac's best friend.

You're a posting excitement machine Wicksy and my very own BigFooty Stalker. Hope you can move on at some stage.

 

[doodles98]

Only a thought that I've been working on this morning, but perhaps the board are hedging their bets?

It's difficult I know, but let's consider that they aren't complete morons. Perhaps they considered that we can't just keep handing him contract after contract without him producing results (this is his third since our last final). Say he fails again next year and the two year contract won't save him so we have to find a replacement. Does it make any sense to turf everyone out on the coaches panel when the next coach would want there own panel anyway? There'd be mass payouts unless all the new line coaches were signed on one year deals and why would anyone of quality join us on a one year deal?

So far the only coach it appears we've chosen to give the boot was Rocca. Burns was poached, Pert was pushed because he and Walsh couldn't work together and Davoren was a no brainer. Ed is a fool for sticking by Buckley, IMO, but there's every chance they gave him the deal because they felt they couldn't source anyone better (moronic I know).

All the moves we've made then revolve around that thinking. It will hamstring us for 2018, but logically it makes sense that the second year is extremely conditional. Perhaps Suma as an assistant makes more sense if you consider who he's been working with the past few years and Buckley's reaction to the Hardie "rumour"...

There is still a flicker of optimism in you I see Sco. I lost my faith in cunning plans and long term plays back with the Gubby saga and the last trade period debacle. I was sure Fyfe was our prize for Mayne!

Undoubtedly though, Bucks does not have an unconditional 2 years and the club would have a fall back strategy... you would think.

Lots more to play out but at the moment I'm underwhelmed by the scope of the "organisational change". The calibre of the new appointees is yet to be seen of course and that is the crucial thing. In my view they will need to be extremely forceful types if we are to see any benefit out of it. Freakin Boyd is not what we need!!!

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

There is still a flicker of optimism in you I see Sco. I lost my faith in cunning plans and long term plays back with the Gubby saga and the last trade period debacle. I was sure Fyfe was our prize for Mayne!

Undoubtedly though, Bucks does not have an unconditional 2 years and the club would have a fall back strategy... you would think.

Lots more to play out but at the moment I'm underwhelmed by the scope of the "organisational change". The calibre of the new appointees is yet to be seen of course and that is the crucial thing. In my view they will need to be extremely forceful types if we are to see any benefit out of it. Freakin Boyd is not what we need!!!

How can you draw such conclusions if as you admit there's more to play out yet?

 

[wicksy]

You're a posting excitement machine Wicksy and my very own BigFooty Stalker. Hope you can move on at some stage.

Oh I thought you were my stalker
I am sad.