Very tentative.
On Yarrans current output I'd trade him tomorrow, but Yarran has shown he is a far more valuable player (when rocking) than Crozier could ever hope to be.
I'd hope there'd be something else involved.
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Very tentative.
On Yarrans current output I'd trade him tomorrow, but Yarran has shown he is a far more valuable player (when rocking) than Crozier could ever hope to be.
I'd hope there'd be something else involved.
Jabba73
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And he thinks the sun shines out of 1AW's backside......
He should know as he has had the best view of it !!
Pros: tall, young, competent key back who can swing forward if he is in a good mood and you say pretty please with sugar on top.I am not sure I am understanding what possible interest we would have with Carlisle
Cons: is a drug cheat who may well be banned for at least next season, possibly the next two.
The cons have it by a mile. Daylight a clear second.
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Yarran, Kreuzer and Henderson aren't trade bait unless we can get a good player we need more than them.
Our needs are far too great to just plod along and rebuild via the draft and trade for fringe players from opposition teams. We need to bring in top end talent and we need to do it quickly so we have enough good players at their peak at the same time.
If trading Kreuzer, Yarran or Henderson resulted in us getting a good key forward, in which there are at least two of in this years draft then we should not hesitate on making the move. Generally you needs to sell the farm to get a ready made key forward or you need a high draft pick. We're better off doing it via the draft and we need two key forwards and are probably going to find ourselves needing a key back soon though they generally come a lot cheaper.
Yarran is a good player but he's got a lot of flaws. Aggression, competitiveness and consistency aren't great. We can probably cover his loss easier. Henderson is by all means not a forward but is a good defender. We aren't even playing him back. We probably think we can cover the tall defensive post down the track. Kreuzer, everyone loves him but end of the day he is just a ruckman. He's a good footballer but priority wise there are a lot of other positions that come ahead of the ruckmen. Key forward, high level midfielder, key defender for a start are more important than having a decent ruckman. Ruckmen are abundant, when the times comes that we are good enough to be in the top 4 we can trade and pick up a decent ruck.
In honesty if Kreuzer, Henderson, Yarran were traded for draft picks or a young gun wanting to come back to vic that resulted in us getting a good young key forward or two and/or a good top level midfielder or a gun defender then we shouldn't hesitate to make the move. We've got to get our priorities right and we need to get top end talent in over a short period of time.
We need to build our core first, a strong midfield and two really good talls at each end. IMO if we can trade anyone who isn't one of these types and gain a really good young core player out of it then we should.
Good forwards are harder to get than backmen. If we can trade a good key back to gain a good young forward we should (Henderson/Jamison). Ruckmen are plentiful and you don't need a superstar ruck to win premierships. We could win flags with Wood. Ruckmen are low on the priority list IMO. If Kreuzer can get us a young gun key forward or onballer we must jump at it. Yarran, if he can get us a young gun core player then we should do it.
We won't go anywhere until we have two key forwards, two key backs and a minimum of three top level onballers who will all peak when the team peaks. You need to do a little more than just plod along in the draft and draft well to achieve that.
Our needs are far too great to just plod along and rebuild via the draft and trade for fringe players from opposition teams. We need to bring in top end talent and we need to do it quickly so we have enough good players at their peak at the same time.
If trading Kreuzer, Yarran or Henderson resulted in us getting a good key forward, in which there are at least two of in this years draft then we should not hesitate on making the move. Generally you needs to sell the farm to get a ready made key forward or you need a high draft pick. We're better off doing it via the draft and we need two key forwards and are probably going to find ourselves needing a key back soon though they generally come a lot cheaper.
Yarran is a good player but he's got a lot of flaws. Aggression, competitiveness and consistency aren't great. We can probably cover his loss easier. Henderson is by all means not a forward but is a good defender. We aren't even playing him back. We probably think we can cover the tall defensive post down the track. Kreuzer, everyone loves him but end of the day he is just a ruckman. He's a good footballer but priority wise there are a lot of other positions that come ahead of the ruckmen. Key forward, high level midfielder, key defender for a start are more important than having a decent ruckman. Ruckmen are abundant, when the times comes that we are good enough to be in the top 4 we can trade and pick up a decent ruck.
In honesty if Kreuzer, Henderson, Yarran were traded for draft picks or a young gun wanting to come back to vic that resulted in us getting a good young key forward or two and/or a good top level midfielder or a gun defender then we shouldn't hesitate to make the move. We've got to get our priorities right and we need to get top end talent in over a short period of time.
We need to build our core first, a strong midfield and two really good talls at each end. IMO if we can trade anyone who isn't one of these types and gain a really good young core player out of it then we should.
Good forwards are harder to get than backmen. If we can trade a good key back to gain a good young forward we should (Henderson/Jamison). Ruckmen are plentiful and you don't need a superstar ruck to win premierships. We could win flags with Wood. Ruckmen are low on the priority list IMO. If Kreuzer can get us a young gun key forward or onballer we must jump at it. Yarran, if he can get us a young gun core player then we should do it.
We won't go anywhere until we have two key forwards, two key backs and a minimum of three top level onballers who will all peak when the team peaks. You need to do a little more than just plod along in the draft and draft well to achieve that.
ferrisb
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WE'RE NOT TRADING KREUZER
Damn straight we aren't!!!! He's a free agent.....
Regardless, I agree with the sentiment.
Chinese Whispra
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Heard a whisper that Andy McKay is going to be totally honest from now until the rest of the season when reporting on our injury list...
P.S. Don't shoot the messenger folks, probably no weight to this one anyway.
P.S. Don't shoot the messenger folks, probably no weight to this one anyway.
Good read as usual Batty, love your work.
Hope you have your asbestos suit on though because you are going to get flamed with the intensity of three Hiroshima bombs for your comments on Kruezer...
Kelly_Blue
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First and Second Round pick.
Picks 12ish and 30ish...when have GWS ever had to use a pick in the 30s?
Surely some other team will outbid them.
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Honesty when reporting our injury list? I don't believe it. Must be a case of Chinese whispers.
GWS don't need picks as they will already be handed some talent early, via the academy.
They'll want the right players to make their side better in the short term. They have enough quality kids and mids that they just can't fit in as it is.
A young KPP (which we lack) who has had patches of AA form in his short career who we can get on the cheap?I am not sure I am understanding what possible interest we would have with Carlisle
HBF
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I'm still not comfortable taking someone who might have a 2 year ban hanging over there head.
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T2B_
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Hell will freeze over first.
Yep I'm aware of it. He's a fan favorite but end of the day he's just a ruckman. The footy club needs to decide what we need more. A good honest ruckman or some top line talent in the middle or a good tall forward. Big no brainer. I'm very much for trading Henderson, Jamison and Yarran if and only if it can net us a more valuable player.
3-5 years to find two really good tall forwards and 3 or 4 really good midfielders. We're going to have to offload some of our more talented yet highly rated types to get those players into the club quick enough so that they are all maturing all around the same time. Fingers crossed that we'll go alright with the father son picks. I think we have enough half backs and possibly even have some tall defenders coming through.
The importance of midfielders, key position players and attacking/creative outside players far outweigh the ruckman. If you have a ruckman who is neat enough, competitive, can with the hitouts and is physical and can get around the ground then you can win a flag with him. Having a highly rated ruckman is more a novelty than a necessity. They only have to be able to do their role and if your midfield, forward and backline is any good the rest will take care of itself.
Wouldn't want to part with Kreuzer if he was something else like a forward but he's not. For where we are at, if trading a key defender can net us a really good key forward or mid we should back our ability to find a young tall defender or back in Jaksch or Giles to make it and do it. Getting a good tall forward is the hardest thing to do in the game but it's where so many clubs start their build to success and something we absolutely must do. This is where we went wrong in the Judd trade. As good as Judd was we threw away one of the hardest types of players to find to get him and have not been able to find one (good tall forward) since. Yarran is easily replaced. As good as he is there are some good half back flankers around and always some lower in the draft. We've got a lot of impressive running half backs coming through in Docherty, Buckley, Sheehan, Byrne etc.
When trading good players you need to ask yourself what will you get back in return and which will have the biggest impact on a game. As good as Kreuzer's one percenters are (sorry folks that's all he does which is special), they have nowhere near the influence on a game that a tall forward's marks, goals, assists and ability to draw defenders and create a strong contest has. Henderson kicks a bag once a month and is easily held most other times. He's not worth keeping unless we are going to play him back. Even so. If we were able to get a good key forward for him then we are ahead. We may have to find a CHB if we lose Henderson but we only gain from this kind of trade if we do and finding good key defenders is easier than finding good key forwards. Yarran is great and you need his sort in the side but do we have a surplus quality running half backs in the side? I think we might. If you could get a real early pick for yarran and say you were able to get a player like Tom Mitchell or Ollie Wines or Dyl Shiel which you might with a high draft pick then you're miles ahead in terms of impact on the game and what you've gained and lost. Jamison still has good footy left in him which means he's tradable but he hasn't got enough good footy in him to be valuable to us. If we traded him and got a really late first round pick you would be all over that. There are usually plenty of good players around pick 13-20.
This is the only way we are going to get the extra picks at where we need them to get to the top of the ladder. We're a club desperate for top end talent and to get it we're probably going to have to finish low on the ladder and trade out some of our better players and attempt to upgrade on them.
Nori
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I disagree. Kreuzer is a Ruckman/Midfielder who can also push forward. His work ethic and physical presence around the ball during games is an example to the whole team and that's why he needs to stay.
T2B_
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We could get a technically "top-end" talent forward who could just as well end up being Jack Watts 2.0.
I'd rather keep Kreuz thanks.
I'd rather keep Kreuz thanks.
HBF
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Buyer beware trading for anyone from *.
The Old Dark Navy's
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This is the big thing. Kreuzer does what the rest of the team struggles to do consistently. They seem to follow his lead when he is out there. It's just on field leadership, not so much vocally although he is finding more voice out there. We can't underestimate how important is it to have players that spark intensity, especially for this side.
Getting rid of these types to bring more youngsters into a mental fragile group and we run the risk of ruining them too.
Kelly_Blue
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Pretty sure they can trade those players and picks....
On Treloar, Hine has said that the pies are trading completely out of the draft, so clearly they have something in the pipe line.
i wouldn't be surprised if Collingwood traded there 1st, 2nd and Witts for Treloar and maybe James Stewart.
On Yarran, if we could get Fremantles first and Crozier we should take it and run. We have guys who can fill a Yarran size hole. (Dick, VR, Docherty, Buckley, Sheehan, Bryne ect)
On Carlise i would think that Carlise plus Essendons first rounder for our first rounder is fair, gives us the opportunity to get a Parish or Matheson.
And Henderson is looking like a guy who wont be at the club next year (which is why the Carlise talk is happening) i think he'll go to Geelong and if we got there first rounder we would be very lucky, but that would put us in the box seat for my draft favorite Charlie Curnow.
i wouldn't be surprised if Collingwood traded there 1st, 2nd and Witts for Treloar and maybe James Stewart.
On Yarran, if we could get Fremantles first and Crozier we should take it and run. We have guys who can fill a Yarran size hole. (Dick, VR, Docherty, Buckley, Sheehan, Bryne ect)
On Carlise i would think that Carlise plus Essendons first rounder for our first rounder is fair, gives us the opportunity to get a Parish or Matheson.
And Henderson is looking like a guy who wont be at the club next year (which is why the Carlise talk is happening) i think he'll go to Geelong and if we got there first rounder we would be very lucky, but that would put us in the box seat for my draft favorite Charlie Curnow.
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On Yarran... if he were to vacant that half back position he's been playing this year... Bryne would slot straight in. Plus we'd have a sneaky pick 16-18 and Crozier.
T2B_
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Hope he's a better kick than his brother.
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