Rumour Bluemour Discussion XXXV - 'Loopy' Season has begun

[charred_fate]

So you want any debate to ignore all the realities and just focus on the fantasy?

Oh boy ... clearly not picking up what I’m putting down.

The proviso is that Carlton deem that he’ll return fit and healthy and that it won’t cause disharmony. If either of those things are judged to be too great of a risk then we’re all on the same page - there is no point debating it.

 

[goreds]

And then when they're retired or coming to the end, we have giant holes in the age profile.

And to make matters worse Tasmania are getting the bulk of high draft picks.

I can guarantee you that normal football clubs who don't have a messiah complex are looking to hit the draft over the coming years. We don't need to get Petracca to win a flag. We can get value from cheap pick ups, like Hawthorn have done, and identify the right young talent. We have enough stars on the list.

We have 4 years to win multiple flags then!

The Hawks will win ZERO with their current list. If you want to be that ‘we play finals’ team that goes out week 1 or 2, then go with the ‘afl players’ in the draft.

We are in a lucky spot that we get a gun mid (Walker) father son in a couple of years!

 

[smit_is]

Can we just assume that everyone in the pro-Trac camp is on that side of the ledger on the proviso that he will return fully fit and healthy and that it won’t cause disharmony in the playing group. That part of it is a given and I can’t be arsed mentioning it in every other post.

The debate is purely whether people would be willing to get the trade done for a fit and firing Trac being brought into a team ready to embrace him regardless of what we give up. No attention needs to be given to whether losing, for example, Harry would damage culture, but rather whether losing H and gaining Trac would take us closer to a flag (which in my view is a very obvious ‘Yes’).

That’s the point though, it’s not a given.

And as I said, I’d love Petracca at the Blues, but not at the cost of Harry or Charlie.

 

[HarryFlashman]

True. But why not trade Durds instead? Owies is handy durable and tough.

As the post before it said- it’s a chance for Owies to get a contract.
He’s at his high water mark & if we are being honest - we want a better forward then him as our small.
Good luck to him if he can snag a good deal somewhere and we got something reasonable back.

 

[goreds]

So you want any debate to ignore all the realities and just focus on the fantasy?

Realities?

They play footy to win flags, not to make friends.
Just like a workplace, it’s a team not a family.
If the club wants Trac, then they will get him and the players will enjoy playing with him.

These are the realities of footy in 2024 and society for that matter.

Not saying I agree with it…!

 

[FlowersByIrene]

This is why you get him. He fits the system Vossy seemingly wants to use.

Thats why you move Harry.

We're not moving Harry...

 

[myblueroan]

Because Durds is more talented, a lot quicker, and 5 years younger.

Oh you think he's more talented? Maybe he is. Not durable though. Fog is miles ahead of both for mine.

 

[Stamos]

Realities?

They play footy to win flags, not to make friends.
Just like a workplace, it’s a team not a family.
If the club wants Trac, then they will get him and the players will enjoy playing with him.

These are the realities of footy in 2024 and society for that matter.

Not saying I agree with it…!

More realities like the salary cap, trade costs, balancing our list.

The fact that Petracca will be 29 in early January, and has yet to recovery from a very traumatic injury means the risk factor for taking on one of the highest paid players in the League is not something you can just ignore.

 

[mochacinolatte]

More realities like the salary cap, trade costs, balancing our list.

The fact that Petracca will be 29 in early January, and has yet to recovery from a very traumatic injury means the risk factor for taking on one of the highest paid players in the League is not something you can just ignore.

Melbourne want signifcant compensations from the leagues best.

Everyone else don't want to pay that signifcant compensation with the injury concern.

It will be stand-off till someone cracks.

 

[Stamos]

Oh you think he's more talented? Maybe he is. Not durable though. Fog is miles ahead if both for mine.

Durdin is way more talented than Owies.

Unfortunately, Fog isn't very durable either. And his kicking abandons him on the regular.
Hopefully they both get good pre-seasons in.

 

[Juddrockz]

True. But why not trade Durds instead? Owies is handy durable and tough.

Or Motlop?

 

[smit_is]

Realities?

They play footy to win flags, not to make friends.
Just like a workplace, it’s a team not a family.
If the club wants Trac, then they will get him and the players will enjoy playing with him.

These are the realities of footy in 2024 and society for that matter.

Not saying I agree with it…!

While it's true that winning premierships is the primary goal, it's overly simplistic to suggest that they'll pursue this goal at all costs, disregarding players happiness. In reality, the relationship between success and happiness is more nuanced.

Disunity within a team can lead to poor performance, which in turn makes it less likely to win the flag. Conversely, failing to win premierships can create disunity, and so the cycle repeats.

Therefore, prioritising happiness and team cohesion is not a luxury, but in my opinion, a necessity for long-term success.

And as you’ve rightly pointed out, this is even more so in 2024!

 

[BigFrizz36]

Remember the happy days when we had plenty of cap space and could throw it at whoever we liked?

Better to forgot that we weren't much chop and the ones that took it were generally taking advantage of us though..

 

[goreds]

More realities like the salary cap, trade costs, balancing our list.

The fact that Petracca will be 29 in early January, and has yet to recovery from a very traumatic injury means the risk factor for taking on one of the highest paid players in the League is not something you can just ignore.

100% agree with doing due diligence…

If it was a money issue for us, Cook would have already laughed it off.
List balance, we have 3-4 years to win a flag.
Trade cost, see above.
Injury, he’s pissed at the club for his treatment, it was the last straw in his eyes. That’s why the Dees will trade him or he will whack them on the way out, rightly so from what I’ve heard…

 

[4flagsin5yrs]

Ashton Moir has shown in his brief cameo why.

Owies has been good, but isn't taking us to the next level.

one shouldn't look at the individuals, look at the collective.

A forward line with Owies, Moir, Kemp (maybe, i think JSOSs' future is in the back 6 or 7)) and another small - Williams (or a fit Martin - oxymoronic i know) - complementing Harry and Charlie is a very good forward six.

 

[charred_fate]

That’s the point though, it’s not a given.

And as I said, I’d love Petracca at the Blues, but not at the cost of Harry or Charlie.

No one here is in disagreement over whether we should trade for Trac if the professionals/club conclude that there are question marks over fitness/health and player harmony, thus there is no point debating it.

All bets are off if either of those are the case.

Thus, the debate is only whether we would trade for a fit Trac, who is ready to be welcomed by the Carlton footy players, regardless of what it took to get him.

 

[Blue Reaper]

Petracca doesn't want a small club.

 

[smit_is]

100% agree with doing due diligence…

If it was a money issue for us, Cook would have already laughed it off.
List balance, we have 3-4 years to win a flag.
Trade cost, see above.
Injury, he’s pissed at the club for his treatment, it was the last straw in his eyes. That’s why the Dees will trade him or he will whack them on the way out, rightly so from what I’ve heard…

I think you’ve just argued against your earlier point about playing footy to win flags and not make friends.

Petracca not happy with the club and hence wants to leave. This doesn’t bode well for their chances of winning another flag anytime soon.

 

[Blue Reaper]

Yes, and I also think (IMO) that Petracca would need to take a significant pay cut as well...

I reckon that could be negotiated and he be compensated through Blues business connections to bolster his brand thingy.

 

[Stamos]

Thus, the debate is only whether we would trade for a fit Trac, who is ready to be welcomed by the Carlton footy players, regardless of what it took to get him.

You can't disregard what it would take to get him though, that's the major component.

If he was a free agent, and there was no salary cap, then of course you would get him.

 

[GT619]

Don’t rule out SOS and Ross getting in on the action.

 

[goreds]

I think you’ve just argued against your earlier point about playing footy to win flags and not make friends.

Petracca not happy with the club and hence wants to leave. This doesn’t bode well for their chances of winning another flag anytime soon.

The individual plays footy to win flags, the club is the tool to make that happen. If the tool is blunt or superseded by a new one or has become dangerous, then the individual will change it…

 

[smit_is]

No one here is in disagreement over whether we should trade for Trac if the professionals/club conclude that there are question marks over fitness/health and player harmony, thus there is no point debating it.

All bets are off if either of those are the case.

Thus, the debate is only whether we would trade for a fit Trac, who is ready to be welcomed by the Carlton footy players, regardless of what it took to get him.

Alright, so for the purposes of your debate, you can choose to ignore all other factors and focus solely on my statement: I'd love to have Petracca at the Blues, but not if it means losing Harry or Charlie.

 

[Beer n Skittles]

Durdin is way more talented than Owies.

Unfortunately, Fog isn't very durable either. And his kicking abandons him on the regular.
Hopefully they both get good pre-seasons in.

Durdin is physically much more talented than Owies, as were Dow, Stocker, Fisher, Boekhorst, et al.

Owies still consistently kicks goals though. We do need at least one forward with some footy smarts.

 

[mochacinolatte]

Anyone who has ever played any form of footy or team sports understand that you play to win and make friends along the way....... its not one or either.......