Bluemour Discussion XXXV - 'Loopy' Season has begun

[DangerousD]

Plus the mental/ psychological damage which I think has been done

Did you see the bloke go back on and play in total pain to try get a result for his team? He will be fine.

 

[DangerousD]

Thank you. So we don't really know. It could be less than that or it could be accurate.

Williams moved as a free agent, so the deal we offered had to be submitted to the AFL to determine compensation, if you google it said $5.4M over 6 years,

 

[bradfisher14]

Petraca would be 31 in Walkers first season, why would we be falling off a cliff? I’d be surprised if Carlton were giving much thought to Walker coming in the 2026 draft when considering potential trades this year.

2026 is a fair way a way, a lot can change between now and then, to be making assumptions on Walker and changing a recruiting strategy around him.

We would be falling off a cliff because Cripps, Petracca, Newman, Doc, Saad, Williams, McGovern, Acres, and others that I can't think of atm would be either retired or close to hanging up the boots in 2027. And because of the Petracca trade, we would likely be without Cerra and have no talented youngsters breaking into the team alongside Cody. As you said yourself, it would cost around 3 first rounders to get the deal done - that would be catastrophic for our long term prospects. As good as Petracca is, we have a team that is capable of winning premierships right now. Instead, we should focus on building depth, getting our coaching right, and fixing our injury issues before throwing our entire future at a trade that I simply do not think moves the needle significantly for us.

The only position I would consider a deal like this for is an AA level key position defender that can partner Weitering for the next 10 years.

 

[Coops93]

Shmurf with a pearler out of nowhere!

Next thing you know Barass70 and ericpascoe will be back dropping dimes...

 

[Prem17]

Yep. Spleens are like calves...once they start to go...

I injured mine in a hunting accident 10+ years ago. Was going to be removed but was decided against by the medical team at the last minute because I'm type 1 diabetic.
I've never had a problem with it since.

Petracca will be fine.

 

[BluStreak]

Williams moved as a free agent, so the deal we offered had to be submitted to the AFL to determine compensation, if you google it said $5.4M over 6 years,

I have googled it and it ranges from $800K over 5 years to $900K over 6 years and variations in between depending on the site.

 

[BringFevBack2021]

We would be falling off a cliff because Cripps, Petracca, Newman, Doc, Saad, Williams, McGovern, Acres, and others that I can't think of atm would be either retired or close to hanging up the boots in 2027. And because of the Petracca trade, we would likely be without Cerra and have no talented youngsters breaking into the team alongside Cody. As you said yourself, it would cost around 3 first rounders to get the deal done - that would be catastrophic for our long term prospects. As good as Petracca is, we have a team that is capable of winning premierships right now. Instead, we should focus on building depth, getting our coaching right, and fixing our injury issues before throwing our entire future at a trade that I simply do not think moves the needle significantly for us.

The only position I would consider a deal like this for is an AA level key position defender that can partner Weitering for the next 10 years.

Walsh and Berry will be in their prime then

Ben Campo looks sublime, Lucas very good too but further back

You’d just need to back in a couple of our young players to develop, it doesn’t change our profile dramatically

 

[Coops93]

Walsh and Berry will be in their prime then

Ben Campo looks sublime, Lucas very good too but further back

You’d just need to back in a couple of our young players to develop, it doesn’t change our profile dramatically

Agree, given we have a couple gem f/s picks and potential academy selections we can probably afford to toss a first or 2 out there for a gun. Rare position to be in.

 

[AT97]

Nope! Decision probably lead to a culture killer too

Could be right. it’s been quoted a few times the “big names” made a pact to stick together for less coin.

 

[Alice]

The only position I would consider a deal like this for is an AA level key position defender that can partner Weitering for the next 10 years.

We have systemic failures. Montagna highlighted in one game what has been an issue for years. Is it the coaching or are the players ‘rogue’.
We can add a KPD but with this system and/or players not prepared to defend then it won’t matter
Likewise we have problems in the F50. None more so than the Coleman medalist who fails to apply pressure
This isn’t a recent “shit I’m injured “ situation either. It’s his standard. How in hell do you put pressure on to retain the ball in the F50 when you are outnumbered due to a player not contributing
Our mids lack speed. Our team lacks speed. And class. I’m not saying get Petracca but we need that type
Maybe it will allow us to get to more contests and then clear more efficiently. Maybe when we don’t have possession we can close the ridiculous space that currently exists in our zoning and apply more pressure. The bottom line is the midfield is the engine room for the team. That and demanding FULL buy in/excellence are the starting points for success

 

[FlowersByIrene]

If you were Melbourne... would you take that?

I know I wouldn't...

Depends if they have a choice. Most trades in the AFL you don't. All depends on what Petracca decides. You can hold a player to one year like we did Gibbs. But anything longer than that, you need to take a deal or risk tanking the players value long term. If Petracca wants out the equivalent of three-four first rounders (two+Cerra) is more than fair compensation.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

Wouldn’t be 2 firsts, we’d have to give one of our guns because otherwise we just couldn’t afford his dollaroos in the cap.
Harry and pick currency whatever it is for Trac and Fritsch, not comfortable giving Harry when we don’t have a third tall to fall back on.

Absolutely zero chance of happening


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

They'd be sending a pick our way for Harry. Demons are desperate for a key forward. Harry is worth more than Petracca easily.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

What’s petracca going to be like after he recovers from these horrific injuries still the same ?

A broken rib?? He'll be fine.

 

[bradfisher14]

Walsh and Berry will be in their prime then

Ben Campo looks sublime, Lucas very good too but further back

You’d just need to back in a couple of our young players to develop, it doesn’t change our profile dramatically

I back in all of our players to develop but the reality is you pick up the best kids in the first round. We need to continue taking those picks to stretch our premiership window as far as possible.

As for the players you mentioned, you need to take off the blue tinted glasses imo:

• Walsh - yes he’s class, but he also seems to have a chronic back issue that is affecting his performances. Does that get better or worse over time? I’m not sure.
• Berry - I assume you mean Sam? He’s not on our list and he’s a plodder.
• B. Campo - sublime is a massive stretch. He has afl level traits but he’s one of the worst kicks I’ve seen for a while.
• L. Campo - we will have done extremely well if he ever becomes a regular at senior level. At this point in time I don’t see it happening.

 

[passmark]

I find that whisper about overtraining mid week mind boggling.

Our best football is based on smashing bodies, particularly our own.

Surely Voss can’t overrule someone supposedly an expert?

 

[bradfisher14]

We have systemic failures. Montagna highlighted in one game what has been an issue for years. Is it the coaching or are the players ‘rogue’.
We can add a KPD but with this system and/or players not prepared to defend then it won’t matter
Likewise we have problems in the F50. None more so than the Coleman medalist who fails to apply pressure
This isn’t a recent “shit I’m injured “ situation either. It’s his standard. How in hell do you put pressure on to retain the ball in the F50 when you are outnumbered due to a player not contributing
Our mids lack speed. Our team lacks speed. And class. I’m not saying get Petracca but we need that type
Maybe it will allow us to get to more contests and then clear more efficiently. Maybe when we don’t have possession we can close the ridiculous space that currently exists in our zoning and apply more pressure. The bottom line is the midfield is the engine room for the team. That and demanding FULL buy in/excellence are the starting points for success

That all sounds great to me.

But we still need a genuine KPD to partner Weitering. I refuse to watch Kempy get eaten alive by Esava Ratugolea ever again. And don’t get me started on the way Gov flails around looking for free kicks when he’s up against bigger bodies.

We can address our personnel issues while also fixing the coaching/system they play under. They’re not mutually exclusive.

 

[SkyhorseTamer]

Having spoken to a few in and around the club, the issues usually seem to stem back to the players. Players not working or training hard or smart enough, lazy attitudes, selfish decision making on the field, etc.

The coach is the easy scapegoat, but the fact that this same group has had similar issues with multiple coaches is what is ringing alarm bells for me. Coaching I’m sure has something to do with it, but the players are the ones who ultimately must execute. And if they aren’t putting themselves in the best place to do that, then there’s not much a coach can do

complete nonsense.

 

[Duigan Alley34]

If we assume this is true, it begs the question, where are the fitness staff?

Where’s the injury management, injury prevention, the fitness staff standing up and saying, sorry mate players A,B,C need to be able to recover?

Unfortunately I'm lead to believe this is fairly poor in the AFL system. I'm not sure if it's a soft cap thing but the last few years the treatment time for players has apparently halved. Players are left to seek their own treatment from osteopaths, physio's etc external to the club.

 

[SkyhorseTamer]

I think if you go back and have a look at our drafting in the lead up to Judd and after he arrived, you will find miss after miss, after miss and if you believe what you hear, an absolute mess off the field

So..... SPS, philp, Lob, dow, stocker, finbar, macreadie, Polson, Schumacher, lebois, Ramsey, honey, Phillips and something like 3 ND picks over 2020 and 21.... We could definitely still be exactly the same club. That possibility is real.

 

[KingCharles]

We have no coin for him.

We would need one of the big guys to leave. So are people happy giving up a star?

Will have a lot more coin in a few months

 

[carlton_99]

Will have a lot more coin in a few months

Interesting. Wouldn't have thought the likely delistings/trade options would be on much money

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Depends if they have a choice. Most trades in the AFL you don't. All depends on what Petracca decides. You can hold a player to one year like we did Gibbs. But anything longer than that, you need to take a deal or risk tanking the players value long term. If Petracca wants out the equivalent of three-four first rounders (two+Cerra) is more than fair compensation.

I hope you're right... would love to get Petracca especially if it only costs us a guy who can't get on the park and a couple of speculative 1st rounders...

 

[Wickzki]

Interesting that Schmurf posted the Petracca thing.

Someone on one of the FB groups - who has a strong track record like Schmurf does here - said the same thing a day or so ago.

Where there's fire, I suppose.

 

[Wickzki]

We have no coin for him.

We would need one of the big guys to leave. So are people happy giving up a star?

My concern is still the injury suffered earlier this year.

Get the all clear and this is a Greg Williams-level trade. It's a trade that helps take a good team that underperforms to the next level. You can get the cream players cheap who would premiership chase. Just like the so-called "recycled' 1995 premiership players were.

If it doesn't involve Cripps, Walsh, Weitering, Curnow, McKay, De Koning then everything else should be on the table for discussion.

I'm in if he's going to be healthy.

 

[Wickzki]

Petraca would be 31 in Walkers first season, why would we be falling off a cliff? I’d be surprised if Carlton were giving much thought to Walker coming in the 2026 draft when considering potential trades this year.

2026 is a fair way a way, a lot can change between now and then, to be making assumptions on Walker and changing a recruiting strategy around him.

IF you read/heard what Vossy said to the media about our trading and drafting strategy the past couple of years in regards to the NGA and father son rules then you'd know that we thought about the Campo twins this far out too.