Oppo Camp Brodie Grundy (Traded to Melbourne 2022)

[Lime22]

Great player Tuddy but WHY OH WHY DID HE HAVE TO STEAMROLL MACCA IN THE '79 GF???? - we had the scum by the scruff of the neck - GRRR.

1970 GF.

 

[Lime22]

Grundy's kicking is not good enough to be another mid, he shanks many around the ground. He is more value when he gives our other mids a helping hand.

 

[jonbe54]

1970 GF.

OOPS agreed typo lol.

 

[jimmy35]

Brodes is no doubt a generational ruckman but at this stage of his career I’d have in 3rd in line for Pies ruckman behind Big Len and Peter Moore. Moore was a force at FF but a revelation in the ruck, superb player.
I‘m confident by the time Brodes career is over he’ll be at the top of that list though.

 

[partypie]

Sport Thought: Is signing Grundy for seven years too big a risk?

Collingwood's decision to give ruckman Brodie Grundy the seven-year deal he desired is worth debating.

www.theage.com.au

Does the media every have much Postive things to say about Collingwood?

If Adelaide had signed him they (the media) would be gushing over how how fantastic it was and how the Crows were smart for making it happen, whilst on the flip side lambasting Collingwood for not doing what it takes to retain him.

You should know by now Dave that Collingwood just can't win with the media as they are heavily invested in waxing lyrical about on field troubles, off field strife or discontent and, ultimately, seeing us fail as it sells newspapers and subs for the millions of non-Collingwood fans out there.

Having said that the article has some balance in that somewhat frustrating "what if?" kind of way that second-guessing media types lean on when the hoped-for story (in this case player and club not coming to an agreement) doesn't eventuate.

 

[jmac70]

I don't think that's quite how salary caps work...

If Grundy leaves we have an extra million to sign others and / or go the FA market

Players could leave if the strength of the side was reduced. Grundy staying reaffirms to the playing group that we are a team going places.

In my opinion, Grundy will win multiple premierships in black and white.

 

[jmac70]

Then we should have signed them first.

I disagree. Others will follow suit because of Grundy’s commitment to the club.

 

[Nuwanda]

I would ask him to take unders then promise him a coaching role post his playing career. Whatever the minimum he is willing to play for, hopefully around 450

Yeah I was thinking around $500k-$550k pa. I actually think it may come down to Pendles as to how likely we are to hang on to JDG and Moore.
Of the 2, I have greater confidence in retaining Moore. Given North already offered JDG $1m pa before he really ‘broke out’, they may come back at $1.4m pa. It’s really going to be Dusty situation in whether JDG takes a lot less $$ to remain a 1 club player.

 

[Pragmatic Shill]

So now we've secured him, Moore and Jordy will be wanting to up the ante to either raise their value or the ultimate - flag. Like the rest of the squad.

The conversation has largely been about the $ but let's be honest players play for flags first and foremost. So why did Brodes stay and not go home for more $?

In part I reckon the reason is he can see a flag or two with this group (should've had one already)

IF the group still have the belief (hard to argue otherwise) then there's a likelihood we'll see one or two soon enough.

Yeah I know there's arguments both here and from the opp fan base to the counter, and let's be honest you all know I'm the least confident about a flag in this forum group.

What I think does not matter, so long as that squad think they're good enough and play to their strengths (system) they'll believe they're going to win one or two.

I don't think you can make a blanket statement about what players play for. Brad Crouch absolutely tried to get the Suns throwing $1m/year at him last trade period and I reckon even with the Crows in the situation they are I'm more confident about their short-term flag prospects as opposed to Gold Coast.

 

[Nuwanda]

So now we've secured him, Moore and Jordy will be wanting to up the ante to either raise their value or the ultimate - flag. Like the rest of the squad.

The conversation has largely been about the $ but let's be honest players play for flags first and foremost. So why did Brodes stay and not go home for more $?

In part I reckon the reason is he can see a flag or two with this group (should've had one already)

IF the group still have the belief (hard to argue otherwise) then there's a likelihood we'll see one or two soon enough.

Yeah I know there's arguments both here and from the opp fan base to the counter, and let's be honest you all know I'm the least confident about a flag in this forum group.

What I think does not matter, so long as that squad think they're good enough and play to their strengths (system) they'll believe they're going to win one or two.

It would be interesting how players see themselves. That is do they measure themselves against others in the team or just look for the most $$ they can get regardless? If Grundy is taking say $900k pa, do JDG and Moore believe they are better players or have performed better than Grundy? If not, does Grundy set the benchmark and the others adjust their expectations against against his contract? Realistically, Moore shouldn’t be taking any more than $650k pa. JDG being a potential match winner, but missing a number of games each year with injury should maybe be on $800k pa.
Obviously it doesn’t work that way but I can see when Moore’s manager comes to the club asking for $1m pa that the club asks the question ‘he is really better than Grundy? An 2x All Australian, Copeland winner, who reliably gets on the park each week’.

 

[jonbe54]

I don't think you can make a blanket statement about what players play for. Brad Crouch absolutely tried to get the Suns throwing $1m/year at him last trade period and I reckon even with the Crows in the situation they are I'm more confident about their short-term flag prospects as opposed to Gold Coast.

A lot of whether players stay or leave comes down to the impact of club administration and the coaching and support staff.

An open an inclusive atmosphere from these goes a long way to fostering good club culture and the ability to retain top shelf talent.

 

[sr36]

I thought it was a pretty balanced article Dave. There was certainly no criticism of Collingwood in there. Only pros and cons of the deal.

I thought it was a load of shite. Let's stop recruiting gun rucks because Grundy and Gawn haven't won a flag. Should we also stop recruiting gun mids because Fyfe, Danger and Cripps haven't won a flag. The article is a large extrapolation of the idea that there is a big difference between gun and serviceable KPFs and mids, but not much difference between gun and servicable rucks, but the article does nothing to justify that idea. Personally, I think that idea is a complete load of malarky. If anything, it's the other way around.

 

[35Daicos]

Sport Thought: Is signing Grundy for seven years too big a risk?

Collingwood's decision to give ruckman Brodie Grundy the seven-year deal he desired is worth debating.

www.theage.com.au

Does the media every have much Postive things to say about Collingwood?

It's probably fair to point out that Peter Ryan (who wrote the article) is known for being a Collingwood supporter! The book Side by Side: A Season with Collingwood was his work.



I'm still trying to figure out why this is in the Tom Wilson thread, BTW!

 

[Nuwanda]

I thought it was a load of shite. Let's stop recruiting gun rucks because Grundy and Gawn haven't won a flag. Should we also stop recruiting gun mids because Fyfe, Danger and Cripps haven't won a flag. The article is a large extrapolation of the idea that there is a big difference between gun and serviceable KPFs and mids, but not much difference between gun and servicable rucks, but the article does nothing to justify that idea. Personally, I think that idea is a complete load of malarky. If anything, it's the other way around.

I think also that there just haven’t been many gun ruckman in the league over the years. So are so rare that clubs just give up and focus on players in other areas which are easier to find. Much easier to find a gun midfielder when there are so many that play that position. Why else did we get an opportunity to pick up Grundy? And now, why did Melbourne use pick 3 to select a ‘Grundy-like’ future ruckman? Really, Cox has been the only real gun ruckman in the past 30 years and his club has a premiership.

 

[sr36]

I think also that there just haven’t been many gun ruckman in the league over the years. So are so rare that clubs just give up and focus on players in other areas which are easier to find. Much easier to find a gun midfielder when there are so many that play that position. Why else did we get an opportunity to pick up Grundy? And now, why did Melbourne use pick 3 to select a ‘Grundy-like’ future ruckman? Really, Cox has been the only real gun ruckman in the past 30 years and his club has a premiership.

The stupid thing in this whole "haven't won a premirship" argument is that one of the big reasons why we didn't win the 2018 GF is that WCE successfully tagged Grundy. We didn't win becasue we didn't get our normal input from our star ruckman. But somehow us not winning that game shows that ruckman don't matter much?

 

[ClaytonM]

The stupid thing in this whole "haven't won a premirship" argument is that one of the big reasons why we didn't win the 2018 GF is that WCE successfully tagged Grundy. We didn't win becasue we didn't get our normal input from our star ruckman. But somehow us not winning that game shows that ruckman don't matter much?

If serviceable ruckmen can negate a top notch ruckman then it doesn’t matter. Why pay top dollar for a ruck who can be negated but players on much less coin. That I think is the argument.

 

[jackcass]

If serviceable ruckmen can negate a top notch ruckman then it doesn’t matter. Why pay top dollar for a ruck who can be negated but players on much less coin. That I think is the argument.

Or is it reasonable to expect a developing 24 year old ruck to have down days matched against older more physically mature opponents?

And was a 49 hit-out (v a combined 29 for Lycett and Vardy) such a bad performance or are we just marking it harder due to expectations of greater impact beyond the ruck contest?

 

[sr36]

If serviceable ruckmen can negate a top notch ruckman then it doesn’t matter. Why pay top dollar for a ruck who can be negated but players on much less coin. That I think is the argument.

Is there a player in the AFL who has never been negated by a serviceable player? WCE tried it again this year and it didn't work. He's a star. He beats his opponent more often and by a bigger margin than anyone else in the league. In my mind that makes him the most valuable player in the league.

 

[Lime22]

It would be interesting how players see themselves. That is do they measure themselves against others in the team or just look for the most $$ they can get regardless? If Grundy is taking say $900k pa, do JDG and Moore believe they are better players or have performed better than Grundy? If not, does Grundy set the benchmark and the others adjust their expectations against against his contract? Realistically, Moore shouldn’t be taking any more than $650k pa. JDG being a potential match winner, but missing a number of games each year with injury should maybe be on $800k pa.
Obviously it doesn’t work that way but I can see when Moore’s manager comes to the club asking for $1m pa that the club asks the question ‘he is really better than Grundy? An 2x All Australian, Copeland winner, who reliably gets on the park each week’.

Exactly, Moore can't ask that money but 650k would be too low unless he is really injury-prone again. Other clubs will offer more than that. With Moore, he's already finished a degree at Melbourne uni. I notice that most of the others studying are drawing theirs out to as far as 2023 etc. but he had asked Bucks if he could spend breaks in summer training trying to get a 12 week semester into 6. So he already has another career waiting for him post footy. That could mean that if really wants to stay with the Pies he could consider accepting less because there are benefits in being a 1 club player.

Jordy hasn't an academic pathway to fall back on.

 

[TradeDraft]

Exactly, Moore can't ask that money but 650k would be too low unless he is really injury-prone again. Other clubs will offer more than that. With Moore, he's already finished a degree at Melbourne uni. I notice that most of the others studying are drawing theirs out to as far as 2023 etc. but he had asked Bucks if he could spend breaks in summer training trying to get a 12 week semester into 6. So he already has another career waiting for him post footy. That could mean that if really wants to stay with the Pies he could consider accepting less because there are benefits in being a 1 club player.

Jordy hasn't an academic pathway to fall back on.

Reckon Moore might take 2-3 Year Deal to see IF his Body holds up and IF it does he be in for a Big Payrise

 

[sr36]

Exactly, Moore can't ask that money but 650k would be too low unless he is really injury-prone again. Other clubs will offer more than that. With Moore, he's already finished a degree at Melbourne uni. I notice that most of the others studying are drawing theirs out to as far as 2023 etc. but he had asked Bucks if he could spend breaks in summer training trying to get a 12 week semester into 6. So he already has another career waiting for him post footy. That could mean that if really wants to stay with the Pies he could consider accepting less because there are benefits in being a 1 club player.

Jordy hasn't an academic pathway to fall back on.

I read it differently. To me, that says Darcy is already preparing for life after footy, thus he's more likely to push the contract size.

 

[Nuwanda]

I read it differently. To me, that says Darcy is already preparing for life after footy, thus he's more likely to push the contract size.

Yes I’d think having completed a Uni degree and negotiating a new contract are mutually exclusive.

 

[Kappa]

Players could leave if the strength of the side was reduced. Grundy staying reaffirms to the playing group that we are a team going places.

In my opinion, Grundy will win multiple premierships in black and white.

Its bloody hard to make a grand final Jmac. I'd take 1 premiership in the next 7 years in a heartbeat. We need to strike now though because our midfield is aging and we don't have 20 year old Pendles Beams and Sidebottoms coming through.

 

[Pistol Night]

Exactly, Moore can't ask that money but 650k would be too low unless he is really injury-prone again. Other clubs will offer more than that. With Moore, he's already finished a degree at Melbourne uni. I notice that most of the others studying are drawing theirs out to as far as 2023 etc. but he had asked Bucks if he could spend breaks in summer training trying to get a 12 week semester into 6. So he already has another career waiting for him post footy. That could mean that if really wants to stay with the Pies he could consider accepting less because there are benefits in being a 1 club player.

Jordy hasn't an academic pathway to fall back on.

The way Jordy rejected Norfs massive offer last time, and the way he spoke about how much he loves the club and money isnt a driving factor on Jock and Journo podcast gives me fair confidence he'll be a Pie for life. Loves the big stage, not 8 degree days in Tassie and Canberra with 17000 in the crowd.

 

[Pistol Night]

Its bloody hard to make a grand final Jmac. I'd take 1 premiership in the next 7 years in a heartbeat. We need to strike now though because our midfield is aging and we don't have 20 year old Pendles Beams and Sidebottoms coming through.

Unfortunately with our strike rate, if we make the next 7 well probably only win 1.