Can Hawthorn succeed while ignoring the elite end of the draft? - Part 2

[maddog37]

Kane Lambert 2.0

More like Ben Nason 2.0

 

[TylerDurden]

Moore will become a serious player. Turned the game on it's head last night.

 

[QuietB]

Didn't they have to talk him out of retiring a year or two ago. He is going to really hate footy with all the extra crap he is going to have to do as captain.

He’ll just buy another farm - all good

 

[QuietB]

Don’t worry guys, Hawks of Worpel, Day and Lewis to resurrect the clubs fortunes


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Will Day ey

 

[satadaynitefeva]

Thread's going well Flunk
Still on crutches from all the gun shot wounds to your own feet?
Easington Potato Farm looking good - what end of the draft you find the latest gems? You guys can pick 'em!!!
Shiels 2 X firsts - just amazing list management!!!! Gold
Carn druggies

 

[hk89]

Don’t worry guys, Hawks of Worpel, Day and Lewis to resurrect the clubs fortunes

Replace Worpel with Howe and we've got Daniel Day-Lewis. 3 academy awards ain't nothin to **** with.

 

[MinerBoy]

If Hawthorn beat Richmond, the lid is coming off!

 

[mattwa]

This thread gets better with age. Got told Worpol and Mitchell Lewis

2

Mitchell Lewis

Age

25

Ht

199cm

Wt

99kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

9.5

2star

K

5.9

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

3.4

3star

T

1.3

3star

G

1.2

4star

D

4.3

1star

K

2.8

1star

HB

1.5

1star

M

0.8

1star

T

0.3

1star

G

0.3

3star

D

8.6

3star

K

4.6

2star

HB

4.0

3star

M

2.6

3star

T

1.8

4star

G

0.6

3star

were guns haha the last two drafts have been much better for the Hawks

 

[Roby]

This thread gets better with age. Got told Worpol and Mitchell Lewis were guns haha the last two drafts have been much better for the Hawks

You've gone early... You still have time...

 

[Hawk Dork]

All anyone needs is a NSW academy
First round picks are over rated unless you get them for free every year

 

[SimToo]

What a disaster the 2016-2018 off-seasons turned out to be for Hawthorn. They got false hope in 2018, but like North Melbourne, they completely failed to realise the time to start the full rebuild was 2016.

They have got a long long long way to go, and by the time they'll have a good enough list, all of Mitchell, O'Meara, Gunston, Breust, Shiels and others will either be retired or near retirement.

Seriously, what merit was there in keeping a guy like Puopolo on the list for so long? So stupid.

 

[Number37]

All anyone needs is a NSW academy
First round picks are over rated unless you get them for free every year

Maybe Clarko could have a meeting with the Umps about the academies?

 

[Hawk Dork]

Maybe Clarko could have a meeting with the Umps about the academies?

Dont think the umps make money from a larger TV audience in NSW

 

[WillHayward]

Hawks fwd line is atrocious.
Needs a lot of work.

 

[Red Bull]

Frost is worth the price of an admission ticket every weekend.
Hilarious watching the headless chook cavorting around the backline

 

[RUNVS]

All anyone needs is a NSW academy
First round picks are over rated unless you get them for free every year

Where did that drive by come from? The person who bumped this thread was a Bulldogs fan.

 

[Hawk Dork]

Where did that drive by come from? The person who bumped this thread was a Bulldogs fan.

Just stating the facts
There hasnt been a better harvest of free first round draft choices so quickly in AFL history
The Dees Blues and Saints wallowed around on the bottom of the ladder for a generation and got nowhere the Swans just harvest their academies and bounce back in 5 minutes

 

[RUNVS]

Just stating the facts
There hasnt been a better harvest of free first round draft choices so quickly in AFL history
The Dees Blues and Saints wallowed around on the bottom of the ladder for a generation and got nowhere the Swans just harvest their academies and bounce back in 5 minutes

Guys like Rowbottom, Warner, Wicks, McDonald, McInerney and McCartin were available to everyone. To say the Swans build was solely down to academies is massively misleading.

 

[Brunswick Trap King]

Where did that drive by come from? The person who bumped this thread was a Bulldogs fan.

Jealousy

 

[Blackhawk42]

What a disaster the 2016-2018 off-seasons turned out to be for Hawthorn. They got false hope in 2018, but like North Melbourne, they completely failed to realise the time to start the full rebuild was 2016.

They have got a long long long way to go, and by the time they'll have a good enough list, all of Mitchell, O'Meara, Gunston, Breust, Shiels and others will either be retired or near retirement.

Seriously, what merit was there in keeping a guy like Puopolo on the list for so long? So stupid.

Most Hawthorn fans recognise this. However, players we brought in during that period who look to be long term players or possible future stars includes....

Mitchell, Wingard, Impey, O'Meara, Worpel, Moore, Morrison, Cousins, Kosi, Lewis, Scrimshaw, Jiath to name a few.

Since then Day, Brockman, Maginness, Downie, DGB who all come with big wraps.

We are coming from a long way back due to incorrectly judging where our list was at at the end of 2016. But the corrections have already started and we're quite happy with the development and improvement we've seen in a small 2021 sample size.

 

[Mercy Seat]

Most Hawthorn fans recognise this. However, players we brought in during that period who look to be long term players or possible future stars includes....

Mitchell, Wingard, Impey, O'Meara, Worpel, Moore, Morrison, Cousins, Kosi, Lewis, Scrimshaw, Jiath to name a few.

Since then Day, Brockman, Maginness, Downie, DGB who all come with big wraps.

We are coming from a long way back due to incorrectly judging where our list was at at the end of 2016. But the corrections have already started and we're quite happy with the development and improvement we've seen in a small 2021 sample size.

I don’t think we incorrectly judged our list. We took a gamble not knowing Cyril would retire, JOM wouldn’t return to what he could be, long term injuries to some stars including Tom Mitchell, and missing out on 2-3 free agents we thought were in the bag. It was a gamble, but it didn’t pay off.

 

[Psicosis]

I see a lot of North 2016-2018 about Hawthorn with a reluctance to properly rebuild.

What that means exactly? Well to me, that means not trading some senior players for high picks when they have high value (Gunston 2020), targeting players in the wrong age profile (Hartigan), not prioritising their promising young players (worpel playing on a flank).

A big reason North is in the situation it is today, is for those exact reasons above. They didn’t trade senior players when they had value instead doing it once it was too late (Brown, Higgins). They brought in average middle aged players (Polec, Hall, Pittard). They didn’t prioritise the development of youth (McKay couldn’t get a game under Scott, yet finished top 10 in our bnf off half a season under Shaw).

Unless the Hawks don’t pivot their approach to list management, I think they’re at risk of sustained mediocrity.

 

[RUNVS]

I see a lot of North 2016-2018 about Hawthorn with a reluctance to properly rebuild.

What that means exactly? Well to me, that means not trading some senior players for high picks when they have high value (Gunston 2020), targeting players in the wrong age profile (Hartigan), not prioritising their promising young players (worpel playing on a flank).

A big reason North is in the situation it is today, is for those exact reasons above. They didn’t trade senior players when they had value instead doing it once it was too late (Brown, Higgins). They brought in average middle aged players (Polec, Hall, Pittard). They didn’t prioritise the development of youth (McKay couldn’t get a game under Scott, yet finished top 10 in our bnf off half a season under Shaw).

Unless the Hawks don’t pivot their approach to list management, I think they’re at risk of sustained mediocrity.

Too late now in terms of trading out their older players. Gunston would not be worth much due to his age. Perhaps Mitchell is worth something, and Shiels but I am not sure how much that would be due to a few issues.

 

[Psicosis]

The thing with the hawks players and north players they're not absolutely gutless when things don't go there way and that is why you are getting pumped by 130 points . There are some seriously talented players on the list at North but so lazy and soft. Atm hawks have a way to go but im happy they're having a crck despite lacking the polish.

Congratulations.

I think you’re missing the point.

 

[Scotland]

Most Hawthorn fans recognise this. However, players we brought in during that period who look to be long term players or possible future stars includes....

Mitchell, Wingard, Impey, O'Meara, Worpel, Moore, Morrison, Cousins, Kosi, Lewis, Scrimshaw, Jiath to name a few.

Since then Day, Brockman, Maginness, Downie, DGB who all come with big wraps.

We are coming from a long way back due to incorrectly judging where our list was at at the end of 2016. But the corrections have already started and we're quite happy with the development and improvement we've seen in a small 2021 sample size.

The thread title is Can Hawthorn succeed while ignoring the elite end of the draft? I don't think Will Day and DGB fit into that narrative.

Are you saying 2016-2018 was a success or failure? The critics among us said topping up in that period wouldn't lead to much because the players coming in weren't as good as the players going out, the cost to bring in ready made players is high and the remaining core of experienced players wasn't that good.

Of the big name trades, anyone with half a footy brain recognises 23 year old Tom Mitchell was a good trade (for both clubs actually), giving up a lot for O'Meara was iffy and giving up a lot for Wingard to add to a Dad's Army team that was bounced in straight sets was also iffy. Are you better off with O'Meara and Wingard than a couple more first and second round picks on the list with a few years development?

Hawthorn have showed a bit in 2021 (didn't see any of Rd 2 but the Rd 1 trolling of Essendon was great) but if the improvement is coming from the 19-22 year olds what is the likely timeline of success? Wingard and Mitchell are 28 this year, Shiels, Gunston, Ceglar 30, Breust 31, McEvoy 32, Burgoyne 87.