List Mgmt. Carlton's 2018 Draft Thread (cont. in Part 2)

[Jimmae]

They have 4 spots on the list.

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Three at the moment actually, but they've got two blokes they can jettison in Leslie and Lonergan, especially after grabbing Collins and Hombsch. There's also the option of moving Scheer to the rookie list (they're already doing this with Rischitelli).

5 picks is an option for them.

 

[dlb99]

Three at the moment actually, but they've got two blokes they can jettison in Leslie and Lonergan, especially after grabbing Collins and Hombsch. There's also the option of moving Scheer to the rookie list (they're already doing this with Rischitelli).

5 picks is an option for them.

And they have 5 picks in the draft.

 

[dlb99]

I get all the dialogue that GCS have a heap of picks and have to rebuild and add players etc etc etc. But Sam Walsh is the perfect player for them. All the perceived assets he brings as a footballer and then leadership are all but dwarfed by the fact he has come out and said he will fully commit to whoever selects him. That is huge for GCS. They seriously can’t go past him. The SA boys have been vocal and so have the SA teams. The King brothers are no given to stay around either. None of them are leaders either, something GCS just lost two of.

I think they’ll trade up for Walsh.

So, why would we not draft him then?

Sounds like the type of draftee we could do with.

If GC wants him, they need to Godfather up, picks 2 & 6 for pick 1.

 

[dlb99]

Adelaide give 8 ,13 and 21 for pick 3 + 29

Adelaide give us 3 + 16 for pick 1 and their future 3rd

Adelaide get Lukosius at 1
Gold coast get Walsh at 2
We take Smith at 3 and O'Halloran at 16

My dream outcome, but unlikely to happen as adelaide sell the farm in that scenario even though on points it's balanced

That gives GC 6 draft slots for max 5 available list positions.

So that ain't happening.

 

[slashin_velvet]

That gives GC 6 draft slots for max 5 available list positions.

So that ain't happening.

Good point. What about if the trade was done live in the draft, and then they used their later pick capital to shuffle back up the order

 

[dlb99]

Good point. What about if the trade was done live in the draft, and then they used their later pick capital to shuffle back up the order

It takes a seller willing to do.

They run the risk of a draft pick that may need to be forfeited.

 

[tuma]

Would we trade no1 for
5&10 from port?

 

[dlb99]

Would we trade no1 for
5&10 from port?

Some here would.

I absolutely would not since I genuinely believe that Sam Walsh will be a star.

I would however trade 1 for 2 & 6, and may have my arm twisted for 3 & 6.

But, I don't think such trades are realistic since Gold Coast would be mad to give up the slots they have.

 

[Iva Bigun]

Suggestions GC should trade picks 3 and 6 for our #1 are nuts. This is a strong draft and GC nicely poised to pick up three excellent players. Our lack of draft picks in the 20-40 bracket a weakness when we need mature aged bodies to bolster the team.

Agree, you can throw a blanket over the top 5-7 players and we have 3 picks in that range. It makes zero sense

 

[Ninja Worrier]

I think they’ll trade up for Walsh.

They can EAD

 

[Stamos]

Betting they finish below us next year.

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But is that really worth trading out Walsh?

 

[B if i Know]

Why?

Thought about this a bit more and am still a bit yeah, nah.
This is based on 2 things, GC finish last next year and we want Kelly....fair call?
1 more thing, I know nothing about how good the kids are, just going on what's been posted.

So, pass on Walsh and take Rankine.
I have great hope for Pickett....really want a Cyril type....Rankin and Pickett both going off would be amazing.
Fallback on Rankine....If Rankine gives the slightest signall he wants home, I'd put him up for trade end of next year while in contract....highest SA bidder wins....otherwise he signs a contract extension late 2019.

End of next year, we have pick 1 for Kelly....they allegedly offered Shiel, Setterfield and Scully this year for #1.
Would not take much more for Kelly....(another gun mid touted at 1 next year)....maybe future 2nd?

Not selling the farm, but getting the types i think we need by end of next year.

We're not winning the flag 2019, but 2020 onwards, anything is possible.

If GC really want Walsh, they can pay up....otherwise we go to the draft this year with #1.

Just a thought....and still very yeah, nah.

 

[The Smoking Gun]

The Smoking Gun TerryWallet LemmingMaster (plus anyone else who's had a good look)

The top end of the draft has been done to death. I love this time of the year and you guys provide great input to this thread, who are some realistic late draft/rookie options that you like?? Please (if you feel inclined) also give some comments to the ones I've raised.

Pick 1 options

• Sam Walsh for me if we keep it, Equally as happy if we traded it for picks and got Bailey Smith and Chayce Jones (gonna bang this drum all the way to the draft - I love him plus he's a Tassie boy).

Late Draft & Rookie options

• Fisher (just like his NB play and think he deserves another crack at AFL level)
• Mitch Maguire (I know it's NEAFL so hard to tell, but is it just me or does he scream Zorko??)
• Mitch Podhajski (19yo in the TAC, overlooked last year, may go earlier but a bit of the Bailey Banfield type pick for me)
• F/S (I reckon we'll take both as rookies but not fussed about either TBH)
  • BSOS - showed bits but not enough for me
  • Hickmott - tested well but not sure he can football like his slower, shorter brother. Combine Liam's grunt and pill gathering with Wil's athleticism and you might have a fair player tho.

• CAT B:
  • Penrith - yes for me, especially as we have a gap at lock down small defender, has his "rabbit in the headlights" kicking/decision making by foot improved enough?
  • Brazier and Wild (really interested to know if anyone seen much of these guys this year. Sunny B was a bull from memory)

DFA options - this will change as more list lodgements happen, but as it stands I'd discuss

• One of Kieran Collins or Hugh Goddard and invite the other one to play with NB with a rookie carrot - pondering if Russell might be able to unlock something with these guys, sort of feel they were discarded a bit early as KPD's
• Josh Williams from Kangas - would love to know WTF happened here, serious wheels and talent, is he the Kangas reverse Scrimshaw after bidding early on him from GC Academy?? Anyone know??
• Mitch Hibberd - great runner, good size, paper body to date. Why would Kangas delist one of their talented youth, maybe I've answered my own question, body might struggle and they seem to be pretty good medical wise.

Cheers all !!

Those selections will all come in a bit, because Norf and the Swans will use a large number of picks on Tarryn Thomas, Bailey Scott & Nick Blakey.
I've tried to come up with 3 different ones to LemmingMaster, TerryWallet & Arr0w.

Tom Lewis 179cm 80kg, 18/2/2000, Sturt SA, Inside Midfielder

Was an integral cog in a very well drilled and organised SA midfield. Lewis is one of those players you're shocked to find out is only 179cm, because he looks like he's mid 180s when you watch him live. Was given the role of a defensive midfielder throughout much of U18 Carnival, which he carried out with aplomb and great maturity, yet still finished within the Top 25 for accumulating possessions. So good were his efforts that another highly rated mid, Kai Pudney, struggled to get a gig. Plays a very tough and combative style of footy whether he's attacking the ball or an opponent where he literally bullocks his way through a stoppage, quite often with 2 or 3 opponents hanging off him. Lewis is exceptionally strong through the core, hips, arse and legs for someone his size and age and much bigger opponents really struggled with trying to bring him down.


Left: Lewis accidentally on purpose dumps Chayce Jones head first into the ground to give Tom Sparrow (behind) access to the ball. Right: Lewis running alongside Hayden Sampson ready dish out a heavy shepherd if required. All photos by yours truly.

Lewis plays with a great team ethos often sacrificing his own game for the betterment of the team. He'll execute a nice bump, grab a fist full of the opposition's jumper if he's on the blind side of the umpire, take an opposition players' run, lay a heavy shepherd, provide a block or create a path for a team mate to access the ball. Not many 18yo kids do these one percenters on a regular basis, let alone up to a dozen times per match. For this reason a 15 possession game from Lewis is equivalent to 20+ for most others such are the amount of sacrificial acts he performs each game. Also has a knack of knowing when is the right time to get the ball himself or perform the sacrificial act.


Those pesky Croweaters I tells ya. Lewis grabs the scruff of Rowbottom's jumper whilst keeping an arm around his waste just in case he has any thoughts of getting the clearance (left). Sampson (2) grabs a fist full of Smith's (15) jumper so he can't accelerate towards the ball (right). After missing the jump at the ball Sivior (44) grabs Rendell's (34) shoulder to impede his ability to jump at the ball. Believe it or not, no free kick was awarded. So who did win the clearance???
Photo by yours truly.


The dirtiest one of course.....Lewis (16). Photo by yours truly.

As stated earlier Lewis finished just inside the Top 25 for total possessions across the National Champs. He amassed an impressive 36 tackles throughout the Carnival finishing 2nd just behind McHenry who laid 38. He also finished =7th for clearances, which is remarkable when you consider the defensive role he played and had both Hatley and Valente in the same midfield.


Just like his namesake Jordan, no one loves a scrap more than Lewis.......and sure enough there he is right in the middle of it between Noah Anderson (24) and Riley Collier-Dawkins (26). Heck, knowing Lewis, he probably started it. JustaBattler would love this kid. Photo by yours truly

Lewis will generally release accurately by hand from a stoppage, but he'll try and draw 2 or 3 of the opposition towards him before doing so. Sometimes he'll hang on to the ball for too long which allows for the opposition to also be drawn towards his intended target. His disposal by foot out of clearances is often haphazard, but generally bought about by the immense pressure he's under trying to find space to execute. One of the reasons for this is that Lewis, despite having a good tank, he isn't very quick. Lewis' kicking when out in open space is generally clean and accurate, but he does lack penetration and struggles to get more than about 40m.


Left: Tom Lewis warms up with Finn Betterman. Right: Lewis lays a heavy block on Bailey Smith to create a path for Mihail Lochowaik to gain uncontested access the ball. All photos by yours truly.

There are a lot of areas where Lewis can be improved and I'd be looking for Bolton/Russell to strip some of the excess weight off him and replace it with lean muscle mass. Doing that should improve his agility and speed without impeding his ability to hold his body over the ball. I'd also engage a running coach for Lewis as not only is he slow, but his acceleration isn't particularly great. You only need to increase his speed, agility & acceleration by 10% and that buys him more time in the contest, which gives a second or two more to assess his options, that in turn leads to greater awareness and vision. The other thing you'd like to see happen is a dedicated weights program to increase the power in his legs and some time with Sav to add some penetration, a little more depth and consistency to his kicking.

Due to his unique skillset, Lewis is one of those kids that makes you look at what he can do rather than what he can't and then work out how feasible is it to improve him in the various areas that need attention within realistic limitations. If you put him through the development program at Sydney then he comes out as Kieran Jack, at the Crows he comes out as Matt Crouch. Put him through the wrong program and he comes out as Nick Graham. With the way Lewis can use his shoulders to shrug an opponent, the way he bulldozes through stoppages, his short kicking and his ability to play dirty and get away with it reminds me a little of Greg Williams. At his stage Lewis is expected to be selected somewhere in the 3rd Round, but depending how far our picks come in and if he slides a little, then he might just be available when our turn comes around. Lewis is someone I reckon could well thrive and take the next step in an elite AFL environment.

Jack Bytel 188cm 82kg, 14/3/2000, Calder Cannons, Inside Midfielder.

At the start of this year I suspected we'd struggle with the contested side of our midfield. Kennedy was going to be coming off a double shoulder reco and would have next to no preseason, while Dow was an 18yo kid also coming off a shoulder reco with a limited preseason......and so it proved to be the case. With that in mind I was really looking forward to monitoring the progress of a big lump of kid I'd read so much about called Jack Bytel.


Left: Not many love their footy as much as Jack Bytel. Middle: Bytel competing against Izak Rankine (14) at a centre stoppage. Right: Bytel flies for a mark against South Australia's Jez McLennan. All photos by yours truly.

Bytel had a very strong year in the TAC Cup during 2017 where he averaged around 23 disposals, more than half of them contested, nearly 7 clearances and almost 6 tackles per game. Known for his strong attack on the ball and the ability to stick a heavy tackle it was little wonder many draft watchers had him pegged as a potential Top 10 pick at the start of the year. His start to 2018 was mixed with variable performances which was at odds with the consistency he'd shown the year before. Bytel then suffered a serious back complaint which essentially killed off his season to a large extent. While he did play 3 games at the Nationals this year it was only for limited minutes and it was quite obvious he was playing under some duress that affected his performances.


Jack Bytel doing what he does best, extracting yet another clearance while Sampson (2) works hard to shut him down. Photo by yours truly.

Despite his limited amount of game time I did learn some things about Bytel I didn't know. After reading some reports, I expected him to be slow/medium pace, but he's actually a fair bit quicker than I expected when watching him live. He can also launch the ball 50m+ off either foot with good penetration, but he doesn't always take as much care as he could about its direction. If he can tidy that up then his disposal by foot has the potential to become a real weapon.

Bytel will need to reassess how he operates at stoppages at the next level. ATM now he gets the ball, tries to crash his way out of congestion with brute strength and then find an option. The likes of Hately, Valente and Lewis comfortably had his measure when Metro came up against SA and Bytel will only find it harder when he has to compete in open-age company. Right now I don't think Bytel's vision is quite where it needs to be for the role he plays and in turn this can affect his decision-making. I'd like see him take the first clear option he sees and develop his game from there.


Left: Jack Bytel and Bailey Smith head towards the centre square. Middle: Bytel snaffles another clearance. Right: Bytel sets off in pursuit of Hayden Sampson. All photos by yours truly.

The trick with Bytel will be trying to teach him to become a more effective player. Finding his own ball is not an issue and in this department he's just as accomplished as Bailey Smith or Sam Walsh, but he lacks their polish and vision. Bytel's back injury must have been reasonably significant because he's now expected to be selected with a mid 3rd Round Pick or later. Providing that issue is no worse than McKay's or Cripps' then Bytel could end up being a draft bargain. Question is, do we need another specialist inside mid with Cripps, Setterfield, Kennedy & Dow??? I think the next kid might be a better option.

Damon Greaves 186cm 74kg, 25/4/2000, East Perth/WA, Medium Defender

Wouldn't be much good being The Smoking Gun if I couldn't give a genuine left-field smokey now would it??? Greaves is medium defender who started off the 2018 Carnival in cracking fashion before injuring his elbow just after the start of the game against Vic Country down at the Cattery. He's a wonderful judge of reading the play and flight of the incoming ball, making him an exceptional interceptor.

One of the things I really like about Greaves is that he is a tremendous rebounder who can turn defence into attack with 65m+ play by running 15m and then launching the ball 50m to find a target. One of the issues with interceptors that rebound is that they're not particularly defensively accountable, but Greaves has that knack of how to balance his attacking and defensive roles. To give you an idea of what I mean, in one game against West Perth Greaves accumulated 31 possessions, but still managed to lay 10 tackles while in another against East Freo he managed to find the ball 22 times and stick 16 tackles (It should be pointed out that both those games were at Colts level).

Greaves is a very powerful and accurate kick with an unerring knack of finding a target even when under pressure. I would rate his kicking on a similar level to O'Brien's. To go with this he is quite a powerful runner with very strong endurance base, which means he could have the scope to become a very damaging winger with the ability to run both ways. At this stage Greaves is fairly lightly built and will probably need a couple of preseasons to stand up to the rigours of AFL level footy, but once he fills out he'll be a terrific addition to any teams defence.

Greaves is extremely well regarded in his home state and given our connections in the west, if he's available when the first of our 4th Rounders comes around don't be in the least surprised if SOS snaps him up. He'd be a great get. At this stage Greaves is expected to selected anywhere from the mid 3rd Round onwards.

 

[JustaBattler]

Those selections will all come in a bit, because Norf and the Swans will use a large number of picks on Tarryn Thomas, Bailey Scott & Nick Blakey.
I've tried to come up with 3 different ones to LemmingMaster, TerryWallet & Arr0w.

Tom Lewis 179cm 80kg, 18/2/2000, Sturt SA, Inside Midfielder

Was an integral cog in a very well drilled and organised SA midfield. Lewis is one of those players you're shocked to find out is only 179cm, because he looks like he's mid 180s when you watch him live. Was given the role of a defensive midfielder throughout much of U18 Carnival, which he carried out with aplomb and great maturity, yet still finished within the Top 25 for accumulating possessions. So good were his efforts that another highly rated mid, Kai Pudney, struggled to get a gig. Plays a very tough and combative style of footy whether he's attacking the ball or an opponent where he literally bullocks his way through a stoppage, quite often with 2 or 3 opponents hanging off him. Lewis is exceptionally strong through the core, hips, arse and legs for someone his size and age and much bigger opponents really struggled with trying to bring him down.

View attachment 576939
Left: Lewis accidentally on purpose dumps Chayce Jones head first into the ground to give Tom Sparrow (behind) access to the ball. Right: Lewis running alongside Hayden Sampson ready dish out a heavy shepherd if required. All photos by yours truly.

Lewis plays with a great team ethos often sacrificing his own game for the betterment of the team. He'll execute a nice bump, grab a fist full of the opposition's jumper if he's on the blind side of the umpire, take an opposition players' run, lay a heavy shepherd, provide a block or create a path for a team mate to access the ball. Not many 18yo kids do these one percenters on a regular basis, let alone up to a dozen times per match. For this reason a 15 possession game from Lewis is equivalent to 20+ for most others such are the amount of sacrificial acts he performs each game. Has also has a knack of knowing when is the right time to get the ball himself or perform the sacrificial act.

View attachment 576945
Those pesky Croweaters I tells ya. Lewis grabs the scruff of Rowbottom's jumper whilst keeping an arm around his waste just in case he has any thoughts of getting the clearance (left). Sampson (2) grabs a fist full of Smith's (15) jumper so he can't accelerate towards the ball (right). After missing the jump at the ball Sivior (44) grabs Rendell's (34) shoulder to impede his ability to jump at the ball. Believe it or not, no free kick was awarded. So who did win the clearance???
Photo by yours truly.

View attachment 576747
The dirtiest one of course.....Lewis. Photo by yours truly.

As stated earlier Lewis finished just inside the Top 25 for total possessions across the National Champs. He amassed an impressive 36 tackles throughout the Carnival finishing 2nd just behind McHenry who laid 38. He also finished =7th for clearances, which is remarkable when you consider the defensive role he played and had both Hatley and Valente in the same midfield.

View attachment 576948
Just like his namesake Jordan, no one loves a scrap more than Lewis.......and sure enough there he is right in the middle of it between Noah Anderson (24) and Riley Collier-Dawkins (26). Heck, knowing Lewis, he probably started it. JustaBattler would love this kid. Photo by yours truly

Lewis will generally release accurately by hand from a stoppage, but he'll try and draw 2 or 3 of the opposition towards him before doing so. Sometimes he'll hang on to the ball for too long which allows for the opposition to also be drawn towards his intended target. His disposal by foot out of clearances is often haphazard, but generally bought about by the immense pressure he's under trying to find space to execute. One of the reasons for this is that Lewis, despite having a good tank, he isn't very quick. Lewis' kicking when out in open is generally clean and accurate, but he does lack penetration and struggles to get more than about 40m.

View attachment 576949
Left: Tom Lewis warms up with Finn Betterman. Right: Lewis lays a heavy block on Bailey Smith to create a path for Mihail Lochowaik uncontested access the ball. All photos by yours truly.

There are a lot of areas where Lewis can be improved and I'd be looking for Bolton/Russell to strip some of the excess weight off him and replace it with lean muscle mass. Doing that should improve his agility and speed without impeding his ability to hold his body over the ball. I'd also engage a running coach for Lewis as not only is he slow, but his acceleration isn't particularly great. You only need to increase his speed, agility & acceleration by 10% and that buys him more time in the contest, which gives a second or two more to assess his options, that in turn leads to greater awareness and vision. The other thing you'd like to see happen is a dedicated weights program to increase the power in his legs and some time with Sav to add some penetration, a little more depth and consistency to his kicking.

Due to his unique skillset, Lewis is one of those kids that makes you look at what he can do rather than what he can't and then work out how feasible is it to improve him in the various areas that need attention within realistic limitations. If you put him through the development program at Sydney then he comes out as Kieran Jack, at the Crows he comes out as Matt Crouch. Put him through the wrong program and he comes out as Nick Graham. With the way Lewis can use his shoulders to shrug an opponent, the way he bulldozes through stoppages, his short kicking and his ability to play dirty and get away with it reminds me a little of Greg Williams. At his stage Lewis is expected to be selected somewhere in the 3rd Round, but depending how far our picks come in and if he slides a little, then he might just be available when our turn comes around. Lewis is someone I reckon could well thrive and take the next step in an elite AFL environment.

Jack Bytel 188cm 82kg, 14/3/2000, Calder Cannons, Inside Midfielder.

At the start of this year I suspected we'd struggle with the contested side of our midfield. Kennedy was going to be coming off a double shoulder reco and would have next to no preseason, while Dow was an 18yo kid also coming off a shoulder reco with a limited preseason......and so it proved to be the case. With that in mind I was really looking forward to monitoring the progress of a big lump of kid I'd read so much about called Jack Bytel.

View attachment 576836
Left: Not many love their footy as much as Jack Bytel. Middle: Bytel competing against Izak Rankine (14) at a centre stoppage. Right: Bytel flies for a mark against South Australia's Jez McLennan. All photos by yours truly.

Bytel had a very strong year in the TAC Cup during 2017 where he averaged around 27 disposals, more than half of them contested, nearly 7 clearances and almost 6 tackles per game. Known for his strong attack on the ball and the ability to stick a heavy tackle it was little wonder many draft watchers had him pegged as a potential Top 10 pick at the start of the year. His start to 2018 was mixed with variable performances which was at odds with the consistency he'd shown the year before. Bytel then suffered a serious back complaint which essentially killed off his season to a large extent. While he did play 3 games at the Nationals this year it was only for limited minutes and it was quite obvious he was playing under some duress that affected his performances.

View attachment 576867
Jack Bytel doing what he does best, extracting yet another clearance while Sampson (2) works hard to shut him down. Photo by yours truly.

Despite his limited amount of game time I did learn some things about Bytel I didn't know. After reading some reports, I expected him to be slow/medium pace, but he's actually a fair bit quicker than I expected when watching him live. He can also launch the ball 50m+ off either foot with good penetration, but he doesn't always take as much care as he could about its direction. If he can tidy that up then his disposal by foot has the potential to become a real weapon.

Bytel will need to reassess how he operates at stoppages at the next level. ATM now he gets the ball, tries to crash his way out of congestion with brute strength and then find an option. The likes of Hately, Valente and Lewis comfortably had his measure when Metro came up against SA and Bytel will only find it harder when he has to compete in open-age company. Right now I don't think Bytel's vision is quite where it needs to be for the role he plays and in turn this can affect his decision-making. I'd like see him take the first clear option he sees and develop his game from there.

View attachment 576891
Left: Jack Bytel and Bailey Smith head towards the centre square. Middle: Bytel snaffles another clearance. Right: Bytel sets off in pursuit of Hayden Sampson. All photos by yours truly.

The trick with Bytel will be trying to teach him to become a more effective player. Finding his own ball is not an issue and in this department he's just as accomplished as Bailey Smith or Sam Walsh, but he lacks their polish and vision. Bytel's back injury must have been reasonably significant because he's now expected to be selected with a mid 3rd Round Pick or later. Providing that issue is no worse than McKay's or Cripps' then Bytel could end up being a draft bargain. Question is, do we need another specialist inside mid with Cripps, Setterfield, Kennedy & Dow??? I think the next kid might be a better option.

Damon Greaves 186cm 74kg, 25/4/2000, East Perth/WA, Medium Defender

Wouldn't be much good being The Smoking Gun if I couldn't give a genuine left-field smokey now would I??? Greaves is medium defender who started off the 2018 Carnival in cracking fashion before dislocating his elbow just after the start of the game against Vic Country down at the Cattery. He's a wonderful judge of reading the play and flight of the incoming ball, making him an exceptional interceptor.

One of the things I really like about Greaves is that he is a tremendous rebounder who can turn defence into attack with 65m+ play by running 15m and then launching the ball 50m to find a target. One of the issues with interceptors that rebound is that they're not particularly defensively accountable, but Greaves has that knack of how to balance his attacking and defensive roles. To give you an idea of what I mean, in one game against West Perth Greaves accumulated 31 possessions, but still managed to lay 10 tackles while in another against East Freo he managed to find the ball 22 times and stick 16 tackles (It should be pointed out that both those games were at Colts level).

Greaves is a very powerful and accurate kick with an unerring knack of finding a target even when under pressure. I would rate his kicking on a similar level to O'Brien's. To go with this he is quite a powerful runner with very strong endurance base, which means he could have the scope to become a very damaging winger with the ability to run both ways. At this stage Greaves is fairly lightly built and will probably need a couple of preseasons to stand up to the rigours of AFL level footy, but once he fills out he'll be a terrific addition to any teams defence.

Greaves is extremely well regarded in his home state and given our connections in the west, if he's available when the first of our 4th Rounders comes around don't be in the least surprised if SOS snaps him up. He'd be a great get. At this stage Greaves is expected to selected anywhere from the mid 3rd Round onwards.

Thanks for the info TSG and great photos

 

[katmanblue]

But is that really worth trading out Walsh?

To me, no. But I was just guessing at the motivation for the proposed trade.

On [device_name] using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[bmaurizio]

Some here would.

I absolutely would not since I genuinely believe that Sam Walsh will be a star.

I would however trade 1 for 2 & 6, and may have my arm twisted for 3 & 6.

But, I don't think such trades are realistic since Gold Coast would be mad to give up the slots they have.

Agree 2 & 6 for 1 , I’d accept in a flash. We could snare Walsh and Rozee or Smith.

 

[Stamos]

Agree 2 & 6 for 1 , I’d accept in a flash. We could snare Walsh and Rozee or Smith.

We're not getting Walsh without #1

 

[gandaal]

A lot of discussion on this thread considering we pretty much know what two of our selections are already, and the third is so late that it'll be almost impossible to predict.

 

[footyfan1978]

Agree 2 & 6 for 1 , I’d accept in a flash. We could snare Walsh and Rozee or Smith.

If you accept pick 2 and 6 for pick 1, you actually have to accept we effectively trading Sam Walsh for pick 2 and 6.
Then you got to ask yourself is any player, even if you knew they could be as good as a number 1 pick like Luke Hodge, worth more than two picks in same draft. I think if you are very clinical you almost got to say, no. You could almost say even Chris Judd himself one of greatest players of our time, was not worth two pointy end picks of draft pool. If you consider Josh Kennedy a top 5 pick when we traded him and we also traded pick 3 and 20. At minimum we rated him two picks in top five of a draft pool. However, he was half way through his career. But we probably did that trade with more the on field effect in mind. An 18 year old does not have the extra off field market force to go with it. But the point being, it is hard ot justify any single players is worth two draft picks in top five of any draft. So if we were to be have pick 2 and 6 given to us for Sam Walsh, as much as we love what he likely to be, even he is not worth pick 2 and 6 combined from same draft pool. So if you accept the offer you also have to accept it really is effectively trading Sam Walsh for both those picks.

 

[katmanblue]

If you accept pick 2 and 6 for pick 1, you actually have to accept we effectively trading Sam Walsh for pick 2 and 6.
Then you got to ask yourself is any player, even if you knew they could be as good as a number 1 pick like Luke Hodge, worth more than two picks in same draft. I think if you are very clinical you almost got to say, no. You could almost say even Chris Judd himself one of greatest players of our time, was not worth two pointy end picks of draft pool. If you consider Josh Kennedy a top 5 pick when we traded him and we also traded pick 3 and 20. At minimum we rated him two picks in top five of a draft pool. However, he was half way through his career. But we probably did that trade with more the on field effect in mind. An 18 year old does not have the extra off field market force to go with it. But the point being, it is hard ot justify any single players is worth two draft picks in top five of any draft. So if we were to be have pick 2 and 6 given to us for Sam Walsh, as much as we love what he likely to be, even he is not worth pick 2 and 6 combined from same draft pool. So if you accept the offer you also have to accept it really is effectively trading Sam Walsh for both those picks.

TLr - yeah, nah.

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[murphbf08]

can someone explain to me how all these other teams have an advantage draft night with their academys but carlton and others don't, how is that a level pkaying field?

 

[The Dominator7]

Those selections will all come in a bit, because Norf and the Swans will use a large number of picks on Tarryn Thomas, Bailey Scott & Nick Blakey.
I've tried to come up with 3 different ones to LemmingMaster, TerryWallet & Arr0w.

Tom Lewis 179cm 80kg, 18/2/2000, Sturt SA, Inside Midfielder

Was an integral cog in a very well drilled and organised SA midfield. Lewis is one of those players you're shocked to find out is only 179cm, because he looks like he's mid 180s when you watch him live. Was given the role of a defensive midfielder throughout much of U18 Carnival, which he carried out with aplomb and great maturity, yet still finished within the Top 25 for accumulating possessions. So good were his efforts that another highly rated mid, Kai Pudney, struggled to get a gig. Plays a very tough and combative style of footy whether he's attacking the ball or an opponent where he literally bullocks his way through a stoppage, quite often with 2 or 3 opponents hanging off him. Lewis is exceptionally strong through the core, hips, arse and legs for someone his size and age and much bigger opponents really struggled with trying to bring him down.

View attachment 576939
Left: Lewis accidentally on purpose dumps Chayce Jones head first into the ground to give Tom Sparrow (behind) access to the ball. Right: Lewis running alongside Hayden Sampson ready dish out a heavy shepherd if required. All photos by yours truly.

Lewis plays with a great team ethos often sacrificing his own game for the betterment of the team. He'll execute a nice bump, grab a fist full of the opposition's jumper if he's on the blind side of the umpire, take an opposition players' run, lay a heavy shepherd, provide a block or create a path for a team mate to access the ball. Not many 18yo kids do these one percenters on a regular basis, let alone up to a dozen times per match. For this reason a 15 possession game from Lewis is equivalent to 20+ for most others such are the amount of sacrificial acts he performs each game. Also has a knack of knowing when is the right time to get the ball himself or perform the sacrificial act.

View attachment 576945
Those pesky Croweaters I tells ya. Lewis grabs the scruff of Rowbottom's jumper whilst keeping an arm around his waste just in case he has any thoughts of getting the clearance (left). Sampson (2) grabs a fist full of Smith's (15) jumper so he can't accelerate towards the ball (right). After missing the jump at the ball Sivior (44) grabs Rendell's (34) shoulder to impede his ability to jump at the ball. Believe it or not, no free kick was awarded. So who did win the clearance???
Photo by yours truly.

View attachment 576747
The dirtiest one of course.....Lewis (16). Photo by yours truly.

As stated earlier Lewis finished just inside the Top 25 for total possessions across the National Champs. He amassed an impressive 36 tackles throughout the Carnival finishing 2nd just behind McHenry who laid 38. He also finished =7th for clearances, which is remarkable when you consider the defensive role he played and had both Hatley and Valente in the same midfield.

View attachment 576948
Just like his namesake Jordan, no one loves a scrap more than Lewis.......and sure enough there he is right in the middle of it between Noah Anderson (24) and Riley Collier-Dawkins (26). Heck, knowing Lewis, he probably started it. JustaBattler would love this kid. Photo by yours truly

Lewis will generally release accurately by hand from a stoppage, but he'll try and draw 2 or 3 of the opposition towards him before doing so. Sometimes he'll hang on to the ball for too long which allows for the opposition to also be drawn towards his intended target. His disposal by foot out of clearances is often haphazard, but generally bought about by the immense pressure he's under trying to find space to execute. One of the reasons for this is that Lewis, despite having a good tank, he isn't very quick. Lewis' kicking when out in open space is generally clean and accurate, but he does lack penetration and struggles to get more than about 40m.

View attachment 576949
Left: Tom Lewis warms up with Finn Betterman. Right: Lewis lays a heavy block on Bailey Smith to create a path for Mihail Lochowaik to gain uncontested access the ball. All photos by yours truly.

There are a lot of areas where Lewis can be improved and I'd be looking for Bolton/Russell to strip some of the excess weight off him and replace it with lean muscle mass. Doing that should improve his agility and speed without impeding his ability to hold his body over the ball. I'd also engage a running coach for Lewis as not only is he slow, but his acceleration isn't particularly great. You only need to increase his speed, agility & acceleration by 10% and that buys him more time in the contest, which gives a second or two more to assess his options, that in turn leads to greater awareness and vision. The other thing you'd like to see happen is a dedicated weights program to increase the power in his legs and some time with Sav to add some penetration, a little more depth and consistency to his kicking.

Due to his unique skillset, Lewis is one of those kids that makes you look at what he can do rather than what he can't and then work out how feasible is it to improve him in the various areas that need attention within realistic limitations. If you put him through the development program at Sydney then he comes out as Kieran Jack, at the Crows he comes out as Matt Crouch. Put him through the wrong program and he comes out as Nick Graham. With the way Lewis can use his shoulders to shrug an opponent, the way he bulldozes through stoppages, his short kicking and his ability to play dirty and get away with it reminds me a little of Greg Williams. At his stage Lewis is expected to be selected somewhere in the 3rd Round, but depending how far our picks come in and if he slides a little, then he might just be available when our turn comes around. Lewis is someone I reckon could well thrive and take the next step in an elite AFL environment.

Jack Bytel 188cm 82kg, 14/3/2000, Calder Cannons, Inside Midfielder.

At the start of this year I suspected we'd struggle with the contested side of our midfield. Kennedy was going to be coming off a double shoulder reco and would have next to no preseason, while Dow was an 18yo kid also coming off a shoulder reco with a limited preseason......and so it proved to be the case. With that in mind I was really looking forward to monitoring the progress of a big lump of kid I'd read so much about called Jack Bytel.

View attachment 576836
Left: Not many love their footy as much as Jack Bytel. Middle: Bytel competing against Izak Rankine (14) at a centre stoppage. Right: Bytel flies for a mark against South Australia's Jez McLennan. All photos by yours truly.

Bytel had a very strong year in the TAC Cup during 2017 where he averaged around 23 disposals, more than half of them contested, nearly 7 clearances and almost 6 tackles per game. Known for his strong attack on the ball and the ability to stick a heavy tackle it was little wonder many draft watchers had him pegged as a potential Top 10 pick at the start of the year. His start to 2018 was mixed with variable performances which was at odds with the consistency he'd shown the year before. Bytel then suffered a serious back complaint which essentially killed off his season to a large extent. While he did play 3 games at the Nationals this year it was only for limited minutes and it was quite obvious he was playing under some duress that affected his performances.

View attachment 576867
Jack Bytel doing what he does best, extracting yet another clearance while Sampson (2) works hard to shut him down. Photo by yours truly.

Despite his limited amount of game time I did learn some things about Bytel I didn't know. After reading some reports, I expected him to be slow/medium pace, but he's actually a fair bit quicker than I expected when watching him live. He can also launch the ball 50m+ off either foot with good penetration, but he doesn't always take as much care as he could about its direction. If he can tidy that up then his disposal by foot has the potential to become a real weapon.

Bytel will need to reassess how he operates at stoppages at the next level. ATM now he gets the ball, tries to crash his way out of congestion with brute strength and then find an option. The likes of Hately, Valente and Lewis comfortably had his measure when Metro came up against SA and Bytel will only find it harder when he has to compete in open-age company. Right now I don't think Bytel's vision is quite where it needs to be for the role he plays and in turn this can affect his decision-making. I'd like see him take the first clear option he sees and develop his game from there.

View attachment 576891
Left: Jack Bytel and Bailey Smith head towards the centre square. Middle: Bytel snaffles another clearance. Right: Bytel sets off in pursuit of Hayden Sampson. All photos by yours truly.

The trick with Bytel will be trying to teach him to become a more effective player. Finding his own ball is not an issue and in this department he's just as accomplished as Bailey Smith or Sam Walsh, but he lacks their polish and vision. Bytel's back injury must have been reasonably significant because he's now expected to be selected with a mid 3rd Round Pick or later. Providing that issue is no worse than McKay's or Cripps' then Bytel could end up being a draft bargain. Question is, do we need another specialist inside mid with Cripps, Setterfield, Kennedy & Dow??? I think the next kid might be a better option.

Damon Greaves 186cm 74kg, 25/4/2000, East Perth/WA, Medium Defender

Wouldn't be much good being The Smoking Gun if I couldn't give a genuine left-field smokey now would it??? Greaves is medium defender who started off the 2018 Carnival in cracking fashion before injuring his elbow just after the start of the game against Vic Country down at the Cattery. He's a wonderful judge of reading the play and flight of the incoming ball, making him an exceptional interceptor.

One of the things I really like about Greaves is that he is a tremendous rebounder who can turn defence into attack with 65m+ play by running 15m and then launching the ball 50m to find a target. One of the issues with interceptors that rebound is that they're not particularly defensively accountable, but Greaves has that knack of how to balance his attacking and defensive roles. To give you an idea of what I mean, in one game against West Perth Greaves accumulated 31 possessions, but still managed to lay 10 tackles while in another against East Freo he managed to find the ball 22 times and stick 16 tackles (It should be pointed out that both those games were at Colts level).

Greaves is a very powerful and accurate kick with an unerring knack of finding a target even when under pressure. I would rate his kicking on a similar level to O'Brien's. To go with this he is quite a powerful runner with very strong endurance base, which means he could have the scope to become a very damaging winger with the ability to run both ways. At this stage Greaves is fairly lightly built and will probably need a couple of preseasons to stand up to the rigours of AFL level footy, but once he fills out he'll be a terrific addition to any teams defence.

Greaves is extremely well regarded in his home state and given our connections in the west, if he's available when the first of our 4th Rounders comes around don't be in the least surprised if SOS snaps him up. He'd be a great get. At this stage Greaves is expected to selected anywhere from the mid 3rd Round onwards.

Excellent TSG, thanks for that!!

 

[dlb99]

can someone explain to me how all these other teams have an advantage draft night with their academys but carlton and others don't, how is that a level pkaying field?

The northern teams (GWS, Swans, Bears, Suns) have local zone academies which is a rort.

Other teams I believe have multi-cultural based academies, which has a lower chance of yielding a top player.

But the AFL is unlikely to change the system.

The tweak I would make is putting a cap per team for father-son/academy players, maybe max 3 or 4 per team.

 

[HBF]

thankyou - crikey, young man is 18 going on 35........

Weitering like.

 

[Dravid's in]

Soapy V 's boy.

https://www.outline.com/geCna2