List Mgmt. Collingwood Trade and FA

[rdangelo]

Your post is purely on speculation that both are going to have a wretched run with injury in 2025. Mihocek injury was a ruptured pec, which in terms of injury, is a pretty unlucky one to suffer, and McStay did an ACL, which he has made a successful return.
It's not like their both like Tom Lynch and continually suffer from hamstring or soft tissue injuries....

The fact I think we need another forward has nothing to do with those 2 getting injured.

Everyone in here cries we don't have forwards and now we have a chance to recruit and some guys are saying nah don't worry about it they'll be right. Ridiculous

 

[Jen2310]

Its carlton's fault there is an opening to swoop. Houston wants to go to carlton but Port won't answer the phone to them unless they are offering a top 15 pick.

So very interesting times coming up.

 

[rdangelo]

Of the 12 games he missed, seven were due to the freak pectoral muscle injury that’s unlikely to recur.

I think it was reasonable for me to push back on the posters “ always injured” line.

All our older players of course are at increasing injury risk but I don’t think Brody is any higher risk than his peers.

When I said "always" it was in reference to them both playing at the same time, which the other poster said and acknowledged.

 

[Apples]

It's a chance but I see us behind both Carlton and North.
I feel he wants Carlton and they could easily do the deal: pick 12, f1 and Owies gets it done every time, however Carlton don't appear to want to commit pick 12.
Port really want a pick from North but Houston seams less interested in that option otherwise they would be in the box seat imo.
For us to get it done we need GC to trade us pick 13 and then give them 13 and a combination of other picks such as f1 + Richards or pick 22 (GC) and Richards.
Even if we get all the picks necessary to satisfy Port, Carlton might come to the party late with pick 12. So I still think we are a long shot.

I read that Port were very upset with Carlton's offer, thinking it totally arrogant. They want Carlton's Pick 11. Carlton won't give 11 and has offered Owies and a future pick. No wonder Port is pissed. I like the way we are being aggressive on Houston, even if it doesn't happen.

 

[Mollythedolly]

Do we know what we will need for McGuane?
Changes coming for F/S picks. Not sure when, but I don’t think the points system will be retained in its entirety.

Changes for 2025 have been announced. Reduced discount, 20% down to 10%. Reduced points for draft picks and the number of picks that have points attached.

 

[FAIRANDBALANCED]

By what metric is Noble and a future first not enough for pick 13? They’re getting a future first rounder which could range from probably about 10-18 plus a player they’ve offered a 4 year deal to. Why would we need to give more?

Gold Coast ain't getting the future first rounder off us, Port are for Houston.

Port won't take Richards and pick 13 for Houston. They'd just keep him. He's contracted.

 

[Vinnie Vegas]

The question of drafting a key forward is a toughie. Of the top 10 in the Coleman this year:
1 trade
2 trade
3 trade
4 pick 12
5 pick 6
6 pick 10
7 pick 76
8 pick 73
9 Stengle
10 Rookie

Once you take into account the first few years being development, it's a big call to draft a key forward early in the draft, when there's just as much chance of success by either trading one in or cycling through late picks until you find a diamond.

It's murky until you realise all the traded players on the list were originally top draft prospects too, and two of them were traded for early draft picks, on big contracts.

That they were eventually traded is immaterial to the fact that you aren't getting these guys without committing significant resources to them in terms of early draft picks, whether you use them yourself or trade them to get ready made guys.

Note that none of them came from "sitting around with your thumb up your arse".

 

[SchuPie]

As much as I’d like Houston, the constant references to pick 13 and F1 (as well as past PTSD) conjures the images below in my brain



You get a F1 and you get a F1 and you get…





How I’ve seen us dealing w F1s in the past

 

[Apex36]

Makes more sense now but I still think it is more than we need to give up.

What Port receive is significantly more than what Carlton are prepared to give up? Port would receive two firsts and Richards?

But if it meant Houston and Fly wanted it then let's go.

No, Port would receive 13, Richards and Lukosious. Not sure where the extra first comes from unless you’re looking at a different deal.

 

[upnsmoke]

Cox has a couple more years of being best 22. You cannot teach 211cm and over 218cm wingspan and over 8'8 standing reach. 6'6 defenders struggle to contest Cox and he draws an extra one or two defenders every time. You don't have to take my word, just watch what the coaching staff do week in and week out. Cox is a huge contributor to Magpies system and structure. Need new rucks to also learn to be part time forwards to keep the structure up.

The two Magpie baby rucks still need development to replace Cox.


Notice Cameron tends to play defensive when he's resting, inside defensive 50. While Cox plays forward to rest. It's all in the system.

Need rucks who can contribute not just in the hit outs and middle bounce, they need to be able to play a role offensively and defensively when required.

 

[Apex36]

Gold Coast ain't getting the future first rounder off us, Port are for Houston.

Port won't take Richards and pick 13 for Houston. They'd just keep him. He's contracted.

Ok but that’s not what I asked? You said GC would want more than Noble and our future first for 13 and they would reject the deal. I’m still waiting to hear why that wouldn’t be enough because from my viewpoint it seems very generous.

As an aside, Port get 13, Richards and Lukosious in that deal. I added pick 39 as a token points pick to GC as they’ve reportedly said they want something decent for Lukosious and including him in this makes it easier for Port to get him relatively cheaply (let’s not pretend 39 isn’t in the very speculative territory even in a strong draft). 56 instead might make the deal better for Port but I’m not sure if GC would be satisfied with that.

 

[Apex36]

As much as I’d like Houston, the constant references to pick 13 and F1 (as well as past PTSD) conjures the images below in my brain

View attachment 2133069

You get a F1 and you get a F1 and you get…



View attachment 2133072

How I’ve seen us dealing w F1s in the past

I get what you’re saying but we’re talking about using our F1 on a proven dual AA player here, not on a couple of picks in the 20’s.

 

[jmac70]

As much as I’d like Houston, the constant references to pick 13 and F1 (as well as past PTSD) conjures the images below in my brain

View attachment 2133069

You get a F1 and you get a F1 and you get…



View attachment 2133072

How I’ve seen us dealing w F1s in the past

This is the image that matters (imagine he is wearing a Collingwood jumper)

 

[JLC]

No, Port would receive 13, Richards and Lukosious. Not sure where the extra first comes from unless you’re looking at a different deal.

The way i see the deal - we receive pick 13 and give up Noble. That pick 13 we choose to on trade to Port, Port retain that selection. So we had a first and chose to trade it.

Port received our future first round pick from us and choose to use it on Luko. That is the 2nd of the first.round picks.

 

[Apex36]

The way i see the deal - we receive pick 13 and give up Noble. That pick 13 we choose to on trade to Port, Port retain that selection. So we had a first and chose to come n trade.

Port received our future first round pick from us and choose to use it on Luko. That is the 2nd of the first.round picks.

Man you’re just making things up here. I’m not going around in circles with you, but us giving up our F1, Noble and Richards for Houston is a good deal for us imo.
I’m not even going to begin to try to argue with the strange logic you’ve used here.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

When I said "always" it was in reference to them both playing at the same time, which the other poster said and acknowledged.

That’s not what you said though.

 

[jakson68]

I read that Port were very upset with Carlton's offer, thinking it totally arrogant. They want Carlton's Pick 11. Carlton won't give 11 and has offered Owies and a future pick. No wonder Port is pissed. I like the way we are being aggressive on Houston, even if it doesn't happen.

Has the club said anything regarding chasing Houston?
Or is the aggressive bidding, just hopeful Bigfooty speculation.

 

[JLC]

Man you’re just making things up here. I’m not going around in circles with you, but us giving up our F1, Noble and Richards for Houston is a good deal for us imo.
I’m not even going to begin to try to argue with the strange logic you’ve used here.

It's not strange logic, It is how the deal occurs.

The deal could still work and be close to fair without a future first involved, Perhaps a future second or third instead if necessary


Step 1. We trade John Noble to Gc for Pick 13. (The Suns have Noble, Collingwood has Pick 13).

Step 2. We take Pick 13 and Richards and trade that to Port for Houston. (Collingwood has Houston, Port have Pick 13 and Richards)

Step 3. Port take pick 13 and trade that to the Suns for Luko. (Given the salary of Luko giving the Suns back their pick 13 is too much).

coll - Houston
Suns - Noble + significant salary cap relief
Port - Luko and Richards

An alternative would be in Step 3 that Port retain Pick 13 and give up a second rounder for Luko. Port are taking on a significant salary so the draft pick doesn't need to be that good.

 

[jimmy35]

We just recruited Perryman for our midfield. We could still land a kp player during the trade period. And there are a few good kpf's in the draft.

Can’t fill every hole at once. Big bodied mid keen for action is a great start, Houston, we’ll say no more, would be awesome gets. Opens up things immensely.

 

[SchuPie]

I get what you’re saying but we’re talking about using our F1 on a proven dual AA player here, not on a couple of picks in the 20’s.

Nah I’m in w Houston
…im just struggling a bit in a good draft

 

[Jafo]

Has the club said anything regarding chasing Houston?
Or is the aggressive bidding, just hopeful Bigfooty speculation.

This may be the article implied-

Port Adelaide fuming at perceived Carlton arrogance in early Dan Houston trade negotiations

Port Adelaide is refusing to deal with Carlton over Dan Houston.

www.sen.com.au

 

[3rdMan]

Wondering whether the Richards hold up is from the Port side. Has been reported that Port is not necessarily his destination. Then there's talk that Owies could be involved in a Houston deal. May be that Port have interest but it's dependent on other deals. Would make sense seeing as Richards would be fringe best 23 to start with.

If the interest is not strong, could see him staying. This would be the best outcome for us.

 

[jakson68]

This may be the article implied-

Port Adelaide fuming at perceived Carlton arrogance in early Dan Houston trade negotiations

Port Adelaide is refusing to deal with Carlton over Dan Houston.

www.sen.com.au

Thanks for that, although it states that Port have the sh*ts up with Carlton, I dont see anything linking us to him.
I was just wondering if anybody has heard something from the club itself.
Or is it just countless pages of wishful thinking, as we approach trade time.

 

[Magnanimous]

As if Port are gonna give up Houston for pick 13 and Richards. The more reasonable price would be pick 13, our future first, Richards and a Port future second to go to GC.

So it would be:

GC
Give up: Lukosious, pick 13
Gain: Noble, Port/Pies future first, Port future second

Pies
Give up: Noble, Richards, future first
Gain: Houston

Port
Give up: Houston, future second, future first
Gain: Pick 13, Richards, Lukosious, Pies future first.

Obviously Port decide which future first they want to keep.

Why don't we offer Richards, AJ and a trade pick.
Two forwards both okay (seemingly) with living in S.A and if more then maybe future picks (ideally second round).

On SM-A556E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Apex36]

Has the club said anything regarding chasing Houston?
Or is the aggressive bidding, just hopeful Bigfooty speculation.

It’s been widely reported that we have met Houston and are attempting to gain the capital for a trade. His preference is supposedly Carlton but Port are pissed at them for refusing to offer their first pick this year.