Toast Conca Coming Of Age

["The Roar Is Back"]

Your constant knocking of Conca is sickening RP, your judgement is way off on this one.

Also RP, what are your thoughts on Cotchin turning the ball over 30 mtrs out in front of the NM goals when the game was on a knife edge.

But I'm sure the only thing stuck in your mind is Concas turn over that happened out on the wing under immense pressure on his non preferred and lands in the hands of a NM player that had just come off the bench.

RP you tell us which turnover was more costly.

My knock is and continues to be that done of you think he is a elite player with elite skills and decision making , which I strongly oppose , don't forget I didn't start this thread . The thread was started as a result of concerns about his game being discussed within another thread .
Don't forget only a couple of weeks ago he was dropped , hardly the form of a player coming of age .
I am simply just trying to bring some balance to the discussion . Saying he is elite by foot , a 200 game player and/or is a elite decision maker is severly over selling him IMO . Likewise so is saying he was highly touted for his decision making and foots kills , because he wasn't amongst many recruiters , and that is fact !

The Cotchin turnover and the Conca turnover were of equal cost they both resulted in the opposition in getting the footy . The big difference is that the kick from Cotchin to Houli was in front of Houli and in the direction he was heading and have Houli the opportunity to be involved in the contest and was late in the game, possible exhaustion . Conca's was early in the game and missed the target by 10 metres , provided his teammate no opportunity to be involved in the contest .
His biggest issue is that he gets lost with congestion and often gets caught ball watching .
Sure I could just sit here and get wound up in excitement with every player that joins the club and pump them up to be something I truly don't believe . Arguing with all and sundry that our players have no flaws and they are all the best players within the competition and to ever grace the game .
But sorry I'm realistic and realise we to have players with significant flaws within their game and the fact they are RFC players doesn't cloud my judgement nor prevent me from seeing flaws within their game .

 

["The Roar Is Back"]

have to say no to the op's opinion. clearly you have a set theory when you say you will never change it suggests your obstinate about it. anyway i agree with rubber and i think when fitness gets better less fatigue late in games(which is mostly when some of these clangers kick in),ans with that comes feeling you belong and thats when i think he will be a gem.

If this is directed to myself rather than the OP , I won't change my opinion on whether he was highly touted for his kicking and decision making before being drafted, as I was privy to numurous personal discussions which are to the contrary and from people whose opinion can be trusted .

 

[Stylo]

He was rarely touted as having a high skill level when recruited , many in fact thought his lack of skill and decision making was a significant factor , something I seen again yesterday .

Uuuuhh... He was recruited at least in part because of his elite decision making. He makes mistakes, but rarely picks a wrong target.

Not sure why you're out to get him, did he run over your cat or something?

 

[TigerTime88]

My knock is and continues to be that done of you think he is a elite player with elite skills and decision making , which I strongly oppose , don't forget I didn't start this thread . The thread was started as a result of concerns about his game being discussed within another thread .
Don't forget only a couple of weeks ago he was dropped , hardly the form of a player coming of age .
I am simply just trying to bring some balance to the discussion . Saying he is elite by foot , a 200 game player and/or is a elite decision maker is severly over selling him IMO . Likewise so is saying he was highly touted for his decision making and foots kills , because he wasn't amongst many recruiters , and that is fact !

The Cotchin turnover and the Conca turnover were of equal cost they both resulted in the opposition in getting the footy . The big difference is that the kick from Cotchin to Houli was in front of Houli and in the direction he was heading and have Houli the opportunity to be involved in the contest and was late in the game, possible exhaustion . Conca's was early in the game and missed the target by 10 metres , provided his teammate no opportunity to be involved in the contest .
His biggest issue is that he gets lost with congestion and often gets caught ball watching .
Sure I could just sit here and get wound up in excitement with every player that joins the club and pump them up to be something I truly don't believe . Arguing with all and sundry that our players have no flaws and they are all the best players within the competition and to ever grace the game .
But sorry I'm realistic and realise we to have players with significant flaws within their game and the fact they are RFC players doesn't cloud my judgement nor prevent me from seeing flaws within their game .

RP the club always intended to rest him halfway through the year so he was not in fact dropped for form rather to give his body a spell. Info comes from player sponsor.

I think you have picked the wrong target here. His kicking is fairly sound and he seems to run very hard. The more pre seasons he does the better he will run out games and his body won't lactate as much which should see improved fourth quarter kicking if that is what you are referring to.

I like the way he is tracking and think that you are way off. Especially questioning his spot in our best 22...would think Dea, Maric, Jackson and others would be out before Conca.

 

["The Roar Is Back"]

RP the club always intended to rest him halfway through the year so he was not in fact dropped for form rather to give his body a spell. Info comes from player sponsor.

I think you have picked the wrong target here. His kicking is fairly sound and he seems to run very hard. The more pre seasons he does the better he will run out games and his body won't lactate as much which should see improved fourth quarter kicking if that is what you are referring to.

I like the way he is tracking and think that you are way off. Especially questioning his spot in our best 22...would think Dea, Maric, Jackson and others would be out before Conca.

I don't buy into him being rested so close to the bye and I don't see the comments of a player sponsor adding any weight to such a theory , I know quite a few and they are fed very little .
I don't think A.Maric is in our best 22.

 

["The Roar Is Back"]

Uuuuhh... He was recruited at least in part because of his elite decision making. He makes mistakes, but rarely picks a wrong target.

Not sure why you're out to get him, did he run over your cat or something?

Naturally decision making comes into consideration when a player is recruited , I ain't out to get him , I simply think he has flaws in his game which some don't seem to acknowledge .

 

[TigerTime88]

I don't buy into him being rested so close to the bye and my source is a tad closer .

As I said my source is his player sponsor who he is regular contact with so I think your source is no good.

 

[Drunken Wookie]

RP the club always intended to rest him halfway through the year so he was not in fact dropped for form rather to give his body a spell. Info comes from player sponsor.

I think you have picked the wrong target here. His kicking is fairly sound and he seems to run very hard. The more pre seasons he does the better he will run out games and his body won't lactate as much which should see improved fourth quarter kicking if that is what you are referring to.

I like the way he is tracking and think that you are way off. Especially questioning his spot in our best 22...would think Dea, Maric, Jackson and others would be out before Conca.

I wondered what those dark patches on the front of his jumper were...

 

[Wallaby]

I think when you are half-way through your second season, and have played most of the games in that time we can forget about U18 performances. We know how unreliable and optimistic draft reports can be - particularly Sheehan's.

Ok - so what have we seen from Conca so far. I'm not going to break things down into categories (skills, marking, pressure, 'toughness', inside-outside) - I just care that the guy can play football, contribute to the team, and create a few special moments.

So far - I haven't seen anything special. Sure, the kid can play - he's been on a football field probably since he was 5. He knows the game. His skills are acceptable. He's not slow. He's brave. But the concern I have is I never see him in Richmond highlights. He is rarely in our Great moments - he doesn't perform any special highlight where he wins a tough contests or creates some opportunity for another player.

He's fine, he can play as link mid. He'll probably play well over 100 games. But so far, I haven't seen anything that makes me think he will be a better player than say, Jackson or Grigg.

And the problem is - if he was a pick 60 we would be excited. But high draft picks are valuable resources. In my opinion, I am questioning whether we got value for our Pick 6.

He's still young, though and things can change. But generally, you get a pretty good guide in a (midfield) player's first couple of years.

 

[HighFlyer]

Do you think his kicking errors yesterday where under pressure or that of a elite decision maker or exponent of kicking ?

Playing devil's advocate here. Fitness can play a large part in kicking effeciency. Plenty of quality footballers when fatigued can't kick properly. I've seen elite young footballers turn from perfect precision kicking during training to not being able to hit a player within 20 metres after we've run the pants off them intentionally. It's very hard to execute a skill properly or make the correct decision all the time when your struggling for air. Give him another preseason or two then assess his kicking and decision making.

 

[TigerTime88]

As I said above I think he is going fine, but I should add that I wasn't happy about the pick at the time of the draft and tend to think we could have gotten a better player. Conca will be fine but I wanted Heppell/Caddy/Harper/Atley at the time of the draft. None of those guys have really out performed him but I think they all have a bit more x-factor.

 

[Kyusss]

RT you have obviously searched far and wide for any sort of support and a couple of throw away lines which incidentally the only one mentioning him having great skills is the one from the recruiter at the club who drafted him.
He wasn't highly touted for his decision making nor skills and nothing you have come up with has and never will prove to me opposite to what I was privy to in person.
Do you think his kicking errors yesterday where under pressure or that of a elite decision maker or exponent of kicking ?
The kid could be a good AFL player , no doubt about it, but I don't buy into the theory that he is currently a lock in our best 22, nor that he has elite kicking or decision making, because he simply doesn't.
When he goes onto the ball I cringe and past experience has indicated the sides competiveness in clearances drops off.

hahahah scratched far and wide, he has used the 2 main draft opinions on bigfooty and richmonds head recruiter hahah he has hardly gone far and wide and dug up some throw away lines, thats nonsense

 

[Groupie_]

Really needs to improve his kicking.

 

[Spanish_Fly]

His biggest issue is that he gets lost with congestion and often gets caught ball watching .

Have to agree with this. He cost us a goal on Sunday with a poor decision in the 2nd qtr, I think it was Firrito who had the ball at Fullback, North had a player in the pocket with 5-10 yards space on I think it was Nahas. Conca was at about 50 manning up Harper. For some reason Conca left his man and made a bee line to the player in the pocket even though he was covered and the ball was drilled staright over his head to the free player who basically ran the length of the field and goaled. He also made another poor error when he was easily brushed off the ball by Harvey, was very naive the way he went at the contest which resulted in another goal. At the moment I dont think his kicking is all that flash either. But all players make mistakes in games its just that I thought both of these examples were really poor ones and came about because of poor decision making.

He may well end up a great player in the James Kelly mould, but from what I can see that would be his absolute optimum level (which is pretty darn good just quielty), but he is no certainty to get to a level anything beyond say a Mark Chaffy, which for a pick 6 is not necessarily a great return. Especially when we overlooked Heppel who was training with us before the draft and I think will be a Star.

Hey but I have been known to be wrong before.

 

[Stylo]

Naturally decision making comes into consideration when a player is recruited , I ain't out to get him , I simply think he has flaws in his game which some don't seem to acknowledge .

Fair enough RP, but I, like many others, reckon those flaws are far outweighed by the positive aspects of his game, which will be ironed out with more experience and fitness. Personally I think the kid will be a jet, but no doubt he does have some problems to address.

 

[The Goon]

I do seem to recall him making a howler or two in most games this season but it always seems to be late in the game, which lends credence to the theory he'll improve when his tank does. But, he does get to the ball, extract the ball, provide viable options for his teammates, attempt the right options more often than not, go hard at it and run all day.

At the very worst will be a solid contributer for years to come. Whether he was a good choice at 6 or not the next 2 years will tell, but I suspect he'll be seen as at worst in the 10-15 bracket from his draft, which isn't so bad really.

 

["The Roar Is Back"]

As I said my source is his player sponsor who he is regular contact with so I think your source is no good.

That's your opinion .

 

["The Roar Is Back"]

hahahah scratched far and wide, he has used the 2 main draft opinions on bigfooty and richmonds head recruiter hahah he has hardly gone far and wide and dug up some throw away lines, thats nonsense

Can you point me to where Kevin sheehan has posted his draft opinions upon BF ?

 

[tugga]

I'm not sold on Reece yet.
But I will wait until he has had three years in the system until I make a judgement.
He has some good attributes and some deficiencies. I don't think he is a very good kick, but then I think he as brave as they come.
We were told ad nauseum that he was a safe option at No 6 and I can see why. He doesn't possess any party tricks, but he is a hard worker. Compare that with someone like, say, Martin who has party tricks galore but isn't perceived to have the highest work ethic and you can see why they went the safe option.
If I was forced to make a call right now (which would be unfair in just his 2nd year) I'd say his past month or so has made me think he will be a keeper. If he keeps developing, he will be a good footsoldier at worst.
Don't forget, it only takes one link in the chain to be broken and the whole chain is broken. Players like Conca will ensure the chain is not broken.

 

[rammbo]

Conca is tracking ok and certainally is not a player to b concerned about.

 

[wart101]

He is ****ing 18 years old, his balls have barley dropped and still has 3 to 4 years till he is a man, he's going to be a star.

 

[DerpWerls]

He is ******* 18 years old, his balls have barley dropped and still has 3 to 4 years till he is a man, he's going to be a star.

He is 20 in 2 weeks.

I thought he was fumbly on the weekend, wasn't overly impressed by him. Has had better games.
Also wasn't impressive last week either! Not writing him off just saying he has a way to go!

 

[TOOs_Finest]

Geez RP, if you really think that the Cotchin turnover was Houli's fault, then you may as well conclude that Conca's single howler on Sunday was also Houli's fault. Simple.

And just because you say "And that is a fact" doesn't make it so. At least the OP went to the effort to backup his opinion with facts. You then twisting the words and removing context doesn't suddenly change those facts.

Next time RT, I suggest just you save yourself the time and effort and just place in big bold letters at the end of your posts "And that is fact!"*. Your credibility will go right out the window, but that doesn't seem to matter around here.

* Whatever you do, don't forget the exclamation point!

Personally, I have no fears whatsoever that in three years time, Conca will be a top 10 player in our team. Currently he sits somewhere in the middle 10 I'd say - not top six and not bottom six.

The problem I see when discussing players is that so many people have two categories - gun and dud. Words like elite get used simply when a player shows promise. I rate Conca's decision making and disposal both good, and expect that to rise to very good once he has fully matured.

I think the idea of him being a safe draft choice will turn out to be justified by the fact that he won't go missing during tough games, eg. finals. Seems to have a pretty consistent output, regardless of opponent, and I'm seeing a similar trait in Ellis.

 

[scarecrow2k1]

Always rated him, really like him.

 

[Stylo]

Really needs to improve his kicking.

Don't get why so many have this attitude? His field kicking is excellent from what I've seen. Great, precise action when he thinks it through properly. The ones he does shank tend to be hurried snaps made under pressure, which I would call a composure issue rather than a kicking one. I can't actually remember him missing a target under no pressure.