List Mgmt. Contract, Trade & Draftee Discussion - 2022 Off Season Edition

[Keys]

Contract status of all players now fully updated

The Contracts Thread

2024 List Changes : Out: Retired- Gaff Delisted - Jones, Trew(R), Baker(R), Witherden, Burgiel, Culley(R) Traded - Darling (NM) Barrass (Hawthorn) In: Trade/FA acquisitions - Graham (Richmond) Baker (Richmond) Owies (Carlton) Current contract status (Updated 18/10/24) : Total 39 Players -...

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[AsterixTheGaul]

I'll give you my two reasons:
1. at selection 8 he's likely to not be the best player available. IMO Mackenzie has been unquestionably better than him this year and Tsatas too if he miraculously is available. I also would take Hollands before Ginbey. Not because he has a bigger ceiling, he doesn't, but I think he was also consistently better at both U18 and colts level this year. There's an argument that Ginbey might project to be a great player on potential, however, if we're drafting on potential ceiling I think a player like Philippou projects better and would prefer we take him;
2. if we do take Ginbey (and three other WA players as projected) it demonstrates a mindset that is unlikely to enable us to rebuild for a serious tilt at the flag. Now admittedly the issue of the "go home factor", if it does exist for us, also exists for a number of other clubs. So it is something that the AFL has to legitimately consider as it will definitely have an impact on many interstate clubs chances of being competitive going forward. Having said that I do not think we can subscribe to the "only take WA talent mantra" and, to that end, I hope we don't take Ginbey because there are likely to be other better non-WA players who will be available at pick 8 (see point 1). This argument is basically, we have selected best available/needs based all the way up to this year and backed ourselves in to keep interstate talent (and we typically have succeeded), accordingly, we should not change our mindset now when it is so critical to get the best players for a rebuild and continue on our good club culture.

Ginbey is not my desired target at 8. Like you, I would prefer either Mackenzie and Hollands. I prefer my top end mids to be balanced and I sense that Ginbey is more one dimensional as an inside mid.

What I do not hear from the club is that we are only going WA talent. We have in fact a very good track record of keeping interstate talent at the club. What I think the media heard was that we were concerned on the go home factor hence we slid back. Indeed both Sheezel and Wardlaw have given enough cause for concern since the trade period to say that the 2 best after Cadman are a risk.

When pressed and asked about local WA talent, the club has been reported as saying that there is some good local talent at our picks. Typical Pieman, he gives nothing away. Remember this is the guy who was interviewed going into the Trade week saying that we are interested in Jackson. Very interested. What he did not say was that we wold not be offering up much in trade value and that Jackson's manager had made it clear he was Purple Bound.

I also look it that a tall at 8 or 12 or 20 would be OK. This is a strong midfield draft with great options all the way through to our 4th pick. So long as we get 2 genuine mids and someone who can have a run in the midfield is OK. So Humphrey + Hollands + Hotton + Barnett or Mackenzie + Busslinger + Hewett + Clarke are good examples or what would make me happy.

 

[AP24]

Ginbey is not my desired target at 8. Like you, I would prefer either Mackenzie and Hollands. I prefer my top end mids to be balanced and I sense that Ginbey is more one dimensional as an inside mid.

What I do not hear from the club is that we are only going WA talent. We have in fact a very good track record of keeping interstate talent at the club. What I think the media heard was that we were concerned on the go home factor hence we slid back. Indeed both Sheezel and Wardlaw have given enough cause for concern since the trade period to say that the 2 best after Cadman are a risk.

When pressed and asked about local WA talent, the club has been reported as saying that there is some good local talent at our picks. Typical Pieman, he gives nothing away. Remember this is the guy who was interviewed going into the Trade week saying that we are interested in Jackson. Very interested. What he did not say was that we wold not be offering up much in trade value and that Jackson's manager had made it clear he was Purple Bound.

I also look it that a tall at 8 or 12 or 20 would be OK. This is a strong midfield draft with great options all the way through to our 4th pick. So long as we get 2 genuine mids and someone who can have a run in the midfield is OK. So Humphrey + Hollands + Hotton + Barnett or Mackenzie + Busslinger + Hewett + Clarke is good examples or what would make me happy.

Mckenzie + Busslinger + Hewett + Clarke would be a sensational result.

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[Cuzz09]

U reckon Carl, StK or Bull would sneakily take Hewett in between 8 and 12 picks?



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[Wooshaaaa]

We should then select Hustwaite (194cm) at pick 20 to get the trifecta.
Also swap Ginbey for Phillipou (192cm) at pick 8 to really make it the land of the giants.

And then guarantee that for the next 5 yrs we will again be last in the comp in ground ball gets and post clearance contested possessions. No thanks



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[Nuffington Post]

U reckon Carl, StK or Bull would sneakily take Hewett in between 8 and 12 picks?



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I would say unlikely. Carlton looking at Hollands, Saints Mackenzie/Phillipou and bulldogs Busslinger. Jefferson and Hayes in the mix there too.


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[AsterixTheGaul]

I would say unlikely. Carlton looking at Hollands, Saints Mackenzie/Phillipou and bulldogs Busslinger. Jefferson and Hayes in the mix there too.


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Don't be surprised if Blues go tall and Dogs go a midfielder

 

[shooshka]

I am not convinced that there is a load of interest with Allan prior to pick 20. Players usually reinforce interest at the combine and rarely does a player jump up 10 or more places into the first round based on testing.

Carlton are supposedly interested (the HUN keep banging on). I think they are right BUT I doubt it is with their first pick. Now if they saw value in selling to GWS or Sydney and taking a couple of picks later in the first round, then yes.

Would Sydney's 14 and 17 get them 10 and 29? It might be tempting. the could go Hayes and Allen. It would depend on who the Swans want. Swans do not burn picks like GWS.

GWS have 15 and 18. Blues could ask for 15 and 18/19 for 10 and 49.

I suggest that GWS and Sydney will leave their offers for multiple first round picks until draft night and it will depend on who is left on the table.

I would be very tempted at Carlton to go for Hayes at 10. I think he is a better fit for them than Busslinger.

So back to Allan, the Pieman has likely said that he is a player of interest to the club but I cannot see the Pieman stating a pick number. Hence the confusion with the media.

Carlton are more likely to try to grab a pick off GWS or Sydney by dangling a future 1st for a pick in the teens (to then reach for a player... Allen probably fits that bill).

I'm assuming Carlton have a F1st, haven't checked!

But I definitely think the GWS pick (19/20 wherever it lands) will be for sale. Hopefully the buyer isn't trying to get ahead of us!

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[Keys]

Carlton are more likely to try to grab a pick off GWS or Sydney by dangling a future 1st for a pick in the teens (to then reach for a player... Allen probably fits that bill).

I'm assuming Carlton have a F1st, haven't checked!

But I definitely think the GWS pick (19/20 wherever it lands) will be for sale. Hopefully the buyer isn't trying to get ahead of us!

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Carlton still have their F1 and F2 but not their F3

So they wouldn’t be able to trade their F1 without getting a F3 from somewhere. Which wouldn’t be all that difficult

 

[Goroyals22]

This board is not equipped to have a Ginbey and Gilbey in the squad

As long as it’s not Gumby

 

[Get_The_Gaff]

There seems some reluctance to us drafting Ginbey at 8. Why? Is it based on the fact that 2022 was a break out year and that he was not the underage representative in earlier year? A load on the board bag the Pieman for liking guys who were performed better in their bottom age!

Why would I like Ginbey?
1. He is a proven midfielder - more inside mid at the coal face but we do not have many of those and they usually help you win contested football.
2. He showed in the carnival that he can lift to play consistently at the higher level. Winning the MVP for WA shows he has toughness as there were a load of softer players in the carnival that faded or were too easily run over.
3. He is a left footer and as a mid, they often have a difference when defending and leaving stoppages. I suggest he has a load more to learn about that skill which is fine.
4. He coped when he played at East Perth league late in the year and that is a great sign.
5. He can play HBF as well meaning he might start there and get rotations in the midfield. Simmo is more likely to play a rookie when he knows they can play multiple positions.

So if we take him at 8, great. If he goes earlier, then another great prospect will drop out to us at 8.

Reason I don't like ginbey despite his athletic profile and hardness at the ball is the fact he doesn't find enough ball .

It would be ok if like chesser he was an elite user of the ball .

But from what I have seen his kicking is average and slams it on the boot without looking too much .

Ginbey's low production with poor disposal seems a waste of a pick when you have guys like clark makenzie and phillipou still on the board

 

[Obeanie1]

Don't be surprised if Blues go tall and Dogs go a midfielder

Hollands would be a very Western Bulldogs like pick imo.

As would Darcy Jones.

The Dogs draft quality no matter the height.

 

[Obeanie1]

Come draft night worse case.

1. Cadman
2. Ashcroft
3. Wardlaw
4. Sheezle
5. Phillapou
6. Tsatas
7. Clark
8. McKenzie

So if all the top rated mids are already taken

9. Whats left? Humphrey, Busslinger, Ginbey, Hewett, Hollands, Jefferson,......Allen?

Not a bad choice.

If there take Phillapou IMO.

Play safer with 12.

 

[dinnaz]

This board is not equipped to have a Ginbey and Gilbey in the squad

G-bey the movie director

 

[Eastcoasteagle]

Been watching Claremont vs E.Freo game to see a bit more of Ed Allan and Kaleb Smith.

Few highlights on Kaleb Smith below, he's got some wheels on him and took a few nice intercept marks. He takes all the kick ins and generally looked to have a run and kick long to a contest each time. Good one on one defender, and has agility to wriggle out into space, just the quality of this kicking isn't the greatest all the time. Likely because he's unbalanced or at speed.
Apology for the quality, did it with my phone.



Also, got one of Monocle's man for next year - Daniel Curtin. He's an absolute ripper, oozes quality for a tall CBH/CHF.



My thoughts and comments on Ed Allan tomorrow! Plus a video of him.

 

[Nuffington Post]

G-bey the movie director

Let’s get Rebecca Gibney on our board of directors


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[Avalor]

Let’s get Rebecca Gibney on our board of directors


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Now I could give a tick of approval to that idea.

 

[eaglespremiers]

And then guarantee that for the next 5 yrs we will again be last in the comp in ground ball gets and post clearance contested possessions. No thanks

 

[mattyc75]

Been watching Claremont vs E.Freo game to see a bit more of Ed Allan and Kaleb Smith.

Few highlights on Kaleb Smith below, he's got some wheels on him and took a few nice intercept marks. He takes all the kick ins and generally looked to have a run and kick long to a contest each time. Good one on one defender, and has agility to wriggle out into space, just the quality of this kicking isn't the greatest all the time. Likely because he's unbalanced or at speed.
Apology for the quality, did it with my phone.



Also, got one of Monocle's man for next year - Daniel Curtin. He's an absolute ripper, oozes quality for a tall CBH/CHF.



My thoughts and comments on Ed Allan tomorrow! Plus a video of him.

Holy moley, he can run!! Smooth mover

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[KERRPOW]

Let’s get Rebecca Gibney on our board of directors


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Our board will be packed to the rafters.

 

[Eastcoasteagle]

Holy moley, he can run!! Smooth mover

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He was in the centre square in seconds! That was late in the 3rd quarter, prior to that I didn't know he was that quick. So he doesn't use it that often. You see him use little bursts combined with agility out of a contest, but if he can use that more that is a weapon.

 

[ziad]

Come draft night worse case.

1. Cadman
2. Ashcroft
3. Wardlaw
4. Sheezle
5. Phillapou
6. Tsatas
7. Clark
8. McKenzie

So if all the top rated mids are already taken

9. Whats left? Humphrey, Busslinger, Ginbey, Hewett, Hollands, Jefferson,......Allen?

Not a bad choice.

If there take Phillapou IMO.

Play safer with 12.

Good thing we ditched #2 it seems

 

[Cornelius Roy]

He was in the centre square in seconds! That was late in the 3rd quarter, prior to that I didn't know he was that quick. So he doesn't use it that often. You see him use little bursts combined with agility out of a contest, but if he can use that more that is a weapon.

Any idea how he stacks up vs Gilbey? From what I hear Gilbey probably a better kick but not as explosive?

Who's the better defender?

 

[ArdentEagle]

Smith and Gilbey. Not just the combo were want. The combo were need.

This is a weird draft. Not weak though

 

[Bleedblueandgold]

Hopefully Kaleb Smith is available in the RD.

 

[Eastcoasteagle]

Any idea how he stacks up vs Gilbey? From what I hear Gilbey probably a better kick but not as explosive?

Who's the better defender?

Ohh, tough one but I'm still in the Gilbey camp as being a better footballer.

Kaleb Smith

• Great one on one defender, both on ground and in air
• Tough
• Intercept marking, more chest type marking than overhead. But it's his pace that he reads the flight well, then pounces to get there first.
• Legit speed
• Good agility to weave out into space
• Just needs to improve his kicking, but I think it's more to do with being balanced when kicking rather than being a bad kick. When composed, he's kicking is fine.

Sam Gilbey

• Left foot is a weapon, especially when streaming from half back.
• Has really good run and carry from half back, knows where to receive the ball in space to then launch an attack forward.
• Originally I thought his defending might be a bit weak, but at the champs he really impressed me with his ability to beat his defender and then provide drive forward. I actually really rate his defensive game, thought he played really well on some half forward types that are ranked in the 20s (Clarke, Davey).
• Can take nice defensive marks, although wouldn't call him an intercept marker.
• Not explosive, but when he builds into his run he can be hard to catch.
• Biggest knock for mine, is his injury history. He's had plenty already!!!

So Gilbey the better footballer for mine, but when you plot both in the draft I think Smith is a better option for us. Gilbey should go 30-45 range, where Smith would be 40+. So I think you could pick Smith up a lot cheaper in the draft than Gilbey, plus as much as I love Gilbey as a footballer his injury history is concerning.