List Mgmt. Contracts, trades, draft - 2022 superstar edition

[Keys]

Link to contract status of all players -

The Contracts Thread

2024 List Changes : Out: Retired- Gaff Delisted - Jones, Trew(R), Baker(R), Witherden, Burgiel, Culley(R), Rotham, L Edwards Traded - Darling (NM) Barrass (Hawthorn) In: Trade/FA acquisitions - Graham (Richmond) Baker (Richmond) Owies (Carlton) Draft - Allan (Pick 16) Shanahan (Pick 30) Gross...

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[bzparkes]

Dark mode . It's better for your brain . You concentrate , retain and all sorts of scientific reasons it is actually better for you .

That ain't dark mode, dark mode looks like the below. That's some weird, high-contrast, mode.

 

[the harry]

He had his time as flavour of the month, now it's all about Baker.

Roberton faded as quickly as his form too.

Someone with spare time needs to graph player mentions or posts mentioning player by day to see how we go from trade target to trade target

 

[Chump Change]

Anyone who thinks Liam baker is an average player either doesn't watch any Richmond games or doesn't have a clue. Started as a defender and has shown he can play forward and midfield, and do all well. Heart and soul kind of player, would lift everyone else around him.

He's good, but we need top end talent and should focus on that first and foremost. If you don't have the top end talent it is very hard to win a flag. Baker is not this player. A Liam Baker will be available pretty much every year or two.

Have a look at the expats we've taken over the years;

Group 1: Yeo, Stenglein, Cripps, Chick, Jetta

Group 2: Prior, Merenda, Wellingham, Colica etc

We could argue the players in Group 1 are a cut above those in Group 2, but there's something else:

Timing.

Almost all players in the AFL are subject to the team the play in. Typically they play well in top 4 side, ok, in middling sides, and dogshit in bottom 4 sides.

All those players in Group 2 were taken when we were shit. Either sliding down the ladder, or at the start of rebuilds. They came into a team which wasn't conducive to playing their best footy.

The players in Group 1, we took them when the rebuild was well and truly on. They could come in and play their best footy. Another part of this is, that when we go and recruit expat players when the rebuild is "well and truly on", we can attract better players - because they can see things are about to happen. We also have that advantage of knowing which pieces of the jigsaw we need and can target specific players to fit our game plan (Stenglein and Jetta perfect examples).

Furthermore, most of those players above are standard players - the players' whose form is subject to the team around them. They're pretty easy to get. The players who are not subject to the team around them are called superstars (or A+ or whatever you want to call them). These are the hardest players to find and they are by far the most important ingredient to winning a flag.

I like Baker, but there will be another Baker next year, and the year after, and the year after.

 

[ArdentEagle]

He's just using an old IBM from the late 70s.

On SM-N985F using BigFooty.com mobile app

First thing I thought when I saw it was Amstrad.

 

[ArdentEagle]

"Took a bird home from the pub the other night, gave her the ol' reverse Ebert "



On SM-N985F using BigFooty.com mobile app

So this means you have really poor endurance, not very good hands but you're excellent by foot
Cool trick Bro!!!

 

[Tugga27]

He's good, but we need top end talent and should focus on that first and foremost. If you don't have the top end talent it is very hard to win a flag. Baker is not this player. A Liam Baker will be available pretty much every year or two.

Have a look at the expats we've taken over the years;

Group 1: Yeo, Stenglein, Cripps, Chick, Jetta

Group 2: Prior, Merenda, Wellingham, Colica etc

We could argue the players in Group 1 are a cut above those in Group 2, but there's something else:

Timing.

Almost all players in the AFL are subject to the team the play in. Typically they play well in top 4 side, ok, in middling sides, and dogshit in bottom 4 sides.

All those players in Group 2 were taken when we were s**t. Either sliding down the ladder, or at the start of rebuilds. They came into a team which wasn't conducive to playing their best footy.

The players in Group 1, we took them when the rebuild was well and truly on. They could come in and play their best footy. Another part of this is, that when we go and recruit expat players when the rebuild is "well and truly on", we can attract better players - because they can see things are about to happen. We also have that advantage of knowing which pieces of the jigsaw we need and can target specific players to fit our game plan (Stenglein and Jetta perfect examples).

Furthermore, most of those players above are standard players - the players' whose form is subject to the team around them. They're pretty easy to get. The players who are not subject to the team around them are called superstars (or A+ or whatever you want to call them). These are the hardest players to find and they are by far the most important ingredient to winning a flag.

I like Baker, but there will be another Baker next year, and the year after, and the year after.

I know you keep going on about high end talent, but at the end of the day, we're only going to have one high draft pick which we have to nail.
Most of our drafting after that will be second and 3rd round picks.

I disagree with your comments "there will be another Baker year after year".
He's in the prime of his career, and is a local boy who, according to all reports might want to come home.

They don't grow on tree's.

 

[DanWCE]

Reverse Ebert or Reverse Wheelbarrow?

What the hell is a reverse wheelbarrow? Is that a BJ where she grabs her own ankles?

Maybe my pr0n IS too vanilla like Phil said!

 

[Godfather32]

Dark mode . It's better for your brain . You concentrate , retain and all sorts of scientific reasons it is actually better for you .

It hurts my eyes

 

[Keys]

He's good, but we need top end talent and should focus on that first and foremost. If you don't have the top end talent it is very hard to win a flag. Baker is not this player. A Liam Baker will be available pretty much every year or two.

Have a look at the expats we've taken over the years;

Group 1: Yeo, Stenglein, Cripps, Chick, Jetta

Group 2: Prior, Merenda, Wellingham, Colica etc

We could argue the players in Group 1 are a cut above those in Group 2, but there's something else:

Timing.

Almost all players in the AFL are subject to the team the play in. Typically they play well in top 4 side, ok, in middling sides, and dogshit in bottom 4 sides.

All those players in Group 2 were taken when we were s**t. Either sliding down the ladder, or at the start of rebuilds. They came into a team which wasn't conducive to playing their best footy.

The players in Group 1, we took them when the rebuild was well and truly on. They could come in and play their best footy. Another part of this is, that when we go and recruit expat players when the rebuild is "well and truly on", we can attract better players - because they can see things are about to happen. We also have that advantage of knowing which pieces of the jigsaw we need and can target specific players to fit our game plan (Stenglein and Jetta perfect examples).

Furthermore, most of those players above are standard players - the players' whose form is subject to the team around them. They're pretty easy to get. The players who are not subject to the team around them are called superstars (or A+ or whatever you want to call them). These are the hardest players to find and they are by far the most important ingredient to winning a flag.

I like Baker, but there will be another Baker next year, and the year after, and the year after.

Cripps (Group 1) and Wellingham (Group 2) were both recruited to the club in 2012.

That said I broadly agree with you in that a list should be built initially through the draft and then topped up to fill gaps through trades

There’s no doubting Baker is a good player and would be best 22 at West Coast as he is at Richmond. Whether he can have the same impact with less quality around him and a game plan less suited to his strengths is debatable

The Cripps/Wellingham comparison helps here.

Wellingham had been at Collingwood for 5 seasons finding success as a rotation in a deep and talented midfield group. He struggled to have the same impact at West Coast and only found a place eventually at half back. It’s hard to mount a case he justified the first round pick we coughed up for him

Cripps on the other hand was younger having only been at the Saints for two years and less established. He’s repaid the effective 3rd round pick (that we got for Koby Stevens) many times over.

What we should learn from this is that if we’re trading someone in now, it should ideally be someone younger so a Bruhn/Robertson type (not necessarily those specific players) has more appeal than a Baker type

At the very least it should mean that Baker is not seen as a must get and our trade offer should reflect that. Ports 2nd round pick should be the maximum we offer even if Richmond would justifiably ask for more

 

[Flarn Rarn]

He's good, but we need top end talent and should focus on that first and foremost. If you don't have the top end talent it is very hard to win a flag. Baker is not this player. A Liam Baker will be available pretty much every year or two.

Have a look at the expats we've taken over the years;

Group 1: Yeo, Stenglein, Cripps, Chick, Jetta

Group 2: Prior, Merenda, Wellingham, Colica etc

We could argue the players in Group 1 are a cut above those in Group 2, but there's something else:

Timing.

Almost all players in the AFL are subject to the team the play in. Typically they play well in top 4 side, ok, in middling sides, and dogshit in bottom 4 sides.

All those players in Group 2 were taken when we were s**t. Either sliding down the ladder, or at the start of rebuilds. They came into a team which wasn't conducive to playing their best footy.

The players in Group 1, we took them when the rebuild was well and truly on. They could come in and play their best footy. Another part of this is, that when we go and recruit expat players when the rebuild is "well and truly on", we can attract better players - because they can see things are about to happen. We also have that advantage of knowing which pieces of the jigsaw we need and can target specific players to fit our game plan (Stenglein and Jetta perfect examples).

Furthermore, most of those players above are standard players - the players' whose form is subject to the team around them. They're pretty easy to get. The players who are not subject to the team around them are called superstars (or A+ or whatever you want to call them). These are the hardest players to find and they are by far the most important ingredient to winning a flag.

I like Baker, but there will be another Baker next year, and the year after, and the year after.

Timing can be a factor in how much you pay when trading in a player, but not whether you should do it or not. In the window, you pay a premium (like we did for Wellingham, Stenglein etc).

The rest of your argument hinges on the assumption that only the top-end talent dictates whether a team is good or not, which is questionable.

 

[mattyc75]

It'd be nice to trade in a player whose playing well. Sps,langdon and witherden all hadnt played particularly well for their previous teams especially in the year we traded for them. I understand this means they were cheaper but none of them have set the world alight with us either. Witherden has been the pick and i think as we move to a new game plan hes the only 1 worth keeping past their current contracts. But if he can't improve his disposal he's not even worth keeping
Baker is in career best form which coincides with him playing in a position we need most



Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk

 

[Bender_]

Culley is clearly a bust, I say we see if Richmond will take him for Baker.

 

[Chump Change]

I know you keep going on about high end talent, but at the end of the day, we're only going to have one high draft pick which we have to nail.
Most of our drafting after that will be second and 3rd round picks.

I'm pretty sure this is not the case. NicNat will make a clear difference, and Yeo is starting to get his mojo. But we beat a 16th placed Essendon side without Parish and McGrath, at home. We've changed how we play - this will take time to learn, tweak, and nail. And then we have a heap of older players. Hurn and Kennedy will be big losses. I like how we played against Essendon (because we're moving away from what hasn't been working), but we'd have been flogged by mid table sides.

Furthermore, we'll have a top 3 pick this year, but even if we do improve, it's likely we'll still have a top 6 or 7 pick next year. It's possible, but I can't see us magically jumping up the ladder next year by more than a few spots.

I disagree with your comments "there will be another Baker year after year".
He's in the prime of his career, and is a local boy who, according to all reports might want to come home.

They don't grow on tree's.

Bruhn, Robertson, Baker, Georgeades....

Can't have them all. Probably only 0ne. Which one?

 

[Chump Change]

Timing can be a factor in how much you pay when trading in a player, but not whether you should do it or not. In the window, you pay a premium (like we did for Wellingham, Stenglein etc).

The rest of your argument hinges on the assumption that only the top-end talent dictates whether a team is good or not, which is questionable.

I'm not saying we shouldn't do it. In order, I'd like Bruhn, then Robertson, then Baker with our second pick. But if nothing eventuates, that's ok too. I'm just not into the whole, "must get this expat player or else" business.

My argument is not that you can't be a good side without A+ players (I don't think Swans really have any.). My argument is it's very hard to win a flag without having them. Like most other people, I don't want just "a good side", I want a flag side.

 

[Chris_6678]

He's good, but we need top end talent and should focus on that first and foremost. If you don't have the top end talent it is very hard to win a flag. Baker is not this player. A Liam Baker will be available pretty much every year or two.

Have a look at the expats we've taken over the years;

Group 1: Yeo, Stenglein, Cripps, Chick, Jetta

Group 2: Prior, Merenda, Wellingham, Colica etc

We could argue the players in Group 1 are a cut above those in Group 2, but there's something else:

Timing.

Almost all players in the AFL are subject to the team the play in. Typically they play well in top 4 side, ok, in middling sides, and dogshit in bottom 4 sides.

All those players in Group 2 were taken when we were s**t. Either sliding down the ladder, or at the start of rebuilds. They came into a team which wasn't conducive to playing their best footy.

The players in Group 1, we took them when the rebuild was well and truly on. They could come in and play their best footy. Another part of this is, that when we go and recruit expat players when the rebuild is "well and truly on", we can attract better players - because they can see things are about to happen. We also have that advantage of knowing which pieces of the jigsaw we need and can target specific players to fit our game plan (Stenglein and Jetta perfect examples).

Furthermore, most of those players above are standard players - the players' whose form is subject to the team around them. They're pretty easy to get. The players who are not subject to the team around them are called superstars (or A+ or whatever you want to call them). These are the hardest players to find and they are by far the most important ingredient to winning a flag.

I like Baker, but there will be another Baker next year, and the year after, and the year after.

Bit rough on Wellingham. Simmo turned him into an important cog of our backline like Jetta. Wellingham went on to play in a GF.

You missed out Redden too.

 

[Tugga27]

I'm pretty sure this is not the case. NicNat will make a clear difference, and Yeo is starting to get his mojo. But we beat a 16th placed Essendon side without Parish and McGrath, at home. We've changed how we play - this will take time to learn, tweak, and nail. And then we have a heap of older players. Hurn and Kennedy will be big losses. I like how we played against Essendon (because we're moving away from what hasn't been working), but we'd have been flogged by mid table sides.

Furthermore, we'll have a top 3 pick this year, but even if we do improve, it's likely we'll still have a top 6 or 7 pick next year. It's possible, but I can't see us magically jumping up the ladder next year by more than a few spots.



Bruhn, Robertson, Baker, Georgeades....

Can't have them all. Probably only 0ne. Which one?

Baker is playing a lot better than those you mentioned.

Bruhn is not Western Australian and today the AFL website says he's considering a move back home to Victoria.
I think Georgiades is contracted and has been in and out of the side.
Robertsen dropped.

Obviously a lot will depend on what you have to pay for them.

 

[Chump Change]

Bit rough on Wellingham. Simmo turned him into an important cog of our backline like Jetta. Wellingham went on to play in a GF.

You missed out Redden too.

We took Wellingham as a midfield jet and he wasn't up to it. Easy to look a million bucks in a top 4 side, hard to do in a team that is struggling. That's why I'm wary of timing.

I had Redden in but took out because he's a Croweater. But, yeah, he's in that Group 1 as well.

 

[Chump Change]

Baker is playing a lot better than those you mentioned.

Bruhn is not Western Australian and today the AFL website says he's considering a move back home to Victoria.
I think Georgiades is contracted and has been in and out of the side.
Robertsen dropped.

Obviously a lot will depend on what you have to pay for them.

He's better than them now. I'm not saying the other two will end up better, just saying it's short sighted to judge them on a right-now snapshot.

 

[Tugga27]

He's better than them now. I'm not saying the other two will end up better, just saying it's short sighted to judge them on a right-now snapshot.

I'm not judging them at all.

I said uncontracted Western Australians who are playing good footy don't grow on trees.

Out of the examples you gave me, one isn't from WA, the other is contracted and Robertson can't get a game.

 

[Chris_6678]

We took Wellingham as a midfield jet and he wasn't up to it. Easy to look a million bucks in a top 4 side, hard to do in a team that is struggling. That's why I'm wary of timing.

I had Redden in but took out because he's a Croweater. But, yeah, he's in that Group 1 as well.

True but the same was said of Jetta who traded in to replace Rosa and add some class on a wing. He didnt work out and was sent to the backline after 18 months.

 

[Chump Change]

I'm not judging them at all.

I said uncontracted Western Australians who are playing good footy don't grow on trees.

Out of the examples you gave me, one isn't from WA, the other is contracted and Robertson can't get a game.

That's a pretty inflexible way of looking at footy. If you are only judging people on the now, then you're limited. You sound like one of the people who only want to trade players once they have no market value left, and only want to trade in players when their market value is peak. That is ridiculously short sighted.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

True but the same was said of Jetta who traded in to replace Rosa and add some class on a wing. He didnt work out and was sent to the backline after 18 months.

And you campaigners know what happened next.

 

[WCE_phil]

What the hell is a reverse wheelbarrow? Is that a BJ where she grabs her own ankles?

Maybe my pr0n IS too vanilla like Phil said!

For all sexual or whore island related questions just inbox me.

 

[Tugga27]

That's a pretty inflexible way of looking at footy. If you are only judging people on the now, then you're limited. You sound like one of the people who only want to trade players once they have no market value left, and only want to trade in players when their market value is peak. That is ridiculously short sighted.

Don't know how you come to that conclusion.
How many times do I have to tell you, I wasn't judging anyone.

I've already told you, I said "there aren't too many uncontracted WA boys playing good footy who want to come home".
You gave me 3 examples that didn't fit into those parameters and because of that I'm short sighted?

If you don't know the answer, just say so or ignore it and stop being a dick.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

That's a pretty inflexible way of looking at footy.