Review Freo Overrun Against the Dogs

[s_wd6]

Why has the 'we're still young' mantra dominated discourse?

We were younger last year and just missed out on Top 4. Jackson has already negated the loss of Lobb. Logue and Acres were important but don't justify this descent - Erasmus is only a sub. Makes no sense.

I think it's mostly because the game was lost during a period where our centre bounce mix included Treacy, Erasmus, Johnson - who probably haven't played 50 games between them - vs the dogs mids who all had 200+.

And we were signficantly older and more experienced last year - yes, mostly due to Mundy, but we were still older and more exprienced as a collective. We overacheived, and got found out in the second half of the year. Add to that we lose our midfield coach who was a big part of why we did so well.

We are the youngest, and second most inexperienced team this year. We were never that low last year. We don't get judged in regards to our demographic like other teams with a similar profile, we get judged relative to a season where we overachieved.

 

[Righteo]

Righteo, sorry, he's been terrific since he came back, must have Tarzan's grip on his fingers as he is grabbing everything, his disposal including shots at goal handballs and field kicking are Nick Daicos like, he never gets caught with the ball and also seems to have picked up a yard of pace.

Are you ok?

 

[DQ 4EVER]

sabre_ac look at this! Someone claiming they support teams worse than us Freo/Spurs fans

Spurs are my team in Pomgolia as well.
At the game today, it was all of the push in the backs that were not paid that my mate & I noticed.
Treacy rucking instead of Jackson?!!!!!
Jackson starred in a granny in the bloody ruck, against those eastern bulldogs, no less!!!!
Another point made when they showed our disposal efficiency at around 77%. The mistakes we made might not have been especially plentiful, but the scale of the error always seemed great.
Oh well, such is the life of a Freo supporter

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[sdfc]

Why has the 'we're still young' mantra dominated discourse?

We were younger last year and just missed out on Top 4. Jackson has already negated the loss of Lobb. Logue and Acres were important but don't justify this descent - Erasmus is only a sub. Makes no sense.

Development isn't always linear. We wouldn't be the first team to take a step back before a run at a premiership. The core of this group will only get better with the more games they play.

 

[edward powlett]

I think it's mostly because the game was lost during a period where our centre bounce mix included Treacy, Erasmus, Johnson - who probably haven't played 50 games between them - vs the dogs mids who all had 200+.

And we were signficantly older and more experienced last year - yes, mostly due to Mundy, but we were still older and more exprienced as a collective. We overacheived, and got found out in the second half of the year. Add to that we lose our midfield coach who was a big part of why we did so well.

We are the youngest, and second most inexperienced team this year. We were never that low last year. We don't get judged in regards to our demographic like other teams with a similar profile, we get judged relative to a season where we overachieved.

We lost several clearances in a row when Brayshaw was on Libritore .
Late in the third I think.
Brayshaw just not hard enough at it.
Finals are a long shot now so Erasmus should spend more time in the middle .

 

[BringBackTheAnchor]

Why has the 'we're still young' mantra dominated discourse?

We were younger last year and just missed out on Top 4. Jackson has already negated the loss of Lobb. Logue and Acres were important but don't justify this descent - Erasmus is only a sub. Makes no sense.

We were not younger last year. Last year we still had Mundy, Lobb, Logue, Acres and Taberner. This season those names have been replaced with Jackson (21), Amiss (19), Henry (21) and Johnson (20). The only outlier is O’Meara.

 

[Dockeroo]

I think we overachieved last year given our demographics and I think the majority of our current issues relate to inexperience, especially after the mini upheaval of the list last year.

I think people underappreciate how young we are and how poorly teams as young as us usually perform. We're second only to Hawthorn in inexperience most weeks. Everyone expected Hawthorn to be a spoon contender yet expected us to be a top 4 challenger. I think that speaks volumes for how talented our young team is, even if it creates unrealistic pressure in the here and now.

I also think people underrate how much having a hardened, experienced team matters in the AFL. Especially for one who has to travel ever second week.

I think we will easily be top 6 next year, if not top 4. Feel free to @ me if I'm wrong.

I can understand this to some degree but it doesn’t mean that the current list is set and we just need to wait for them all to get another 50 games.
We are still at least 3 high quality plates short of competing for a flag.

• a good quality small forward
• a good medium forward
• a explosive inside/outside mid

We are relying on a 19 year old and a 33 year old to score enough to win games.
Already the thought of amiss getting injured makes me shudder as it’s a massive drop to the next guy in.

 

[MadMac]

FYI Fyfe was subbed because his Plantar Fasciitis flared up: JL in the presser

I had the misfortune of enduring plantars fasciitis some years back and it’s not fun. My recovery took about 7 weeks and even then for a while I had to be careful not to flare it up again. I know players obviously have access to first class doctors and facilities but I was still surprised to see Fyfe back that early after it was announced that he had it.

 

[s_wd6]

We lost several clearances in a row when Brayshaw was on Libritore .
Late in the third I think.
Brayshaw just not hard enough at it.
Finals are a long shot now so Erasmus should spend more time in the middle .

Libba also has double the amount of games as Brayshaw. He's an elite player. Brayshaw is still only 23, another guy who performed way above expectations for his age last year that gets held to very high standards.

Finals may be a long shot but they are not out of the question. It's one game outside of the 8 right now. ****ing tough run home but our best is still clearly good enough to beat good teams. We won't recapture that best if we have two guys under 15 games in the guts against seasoned veterans. I'd like Ras to play more of the role he was playing before, part time wing. Worked best for him and the team.

 

[Taylor]

Serong is a gun, a workhorse.

The clearance list has Serong on top then...
Five dogs players, basically their entire midfield.

...Then Matt Johnson.

That's where we lost the game. Fyfe wasn't able to win clearances as much as we would like, he ended on the same total as Erasmus..

 

[WhoneedsMcLeod]

Are you ok?

Yep I'm OK, just apologising for my original comments cos Fyfie has been terrific since he came back, similar to Brownlow form, hope we got him signed up for another two or three (at least). I thought he was outstanding today (again). Can play on until forty I think.

 

[Dump Truck]

Spurs are my team in Pomgolia as well.
At the game today, it was all of the push in the backs that were not paid that my mate & I noticed.
Treacy rucking instead of Jackson?!!!!!
Jackson starred in a granny in the bloody ruck, against those eastern bulldogs, no less!!!!
Another point made when they showed our disposal efficiency at around 77%. The mistakes we made might not have been especially plentiful, but the scale of the error always seemed great.
Oh well, such is the life of a Freo supporter

On SM-G960F using BigFooty.com mobile app

Hopefully Angeball saves our mental health

 

[TheInjuryFactory]

The contest is not exclusively stoppages.

Is it? I'm not saying you're wrong but I always assumed the contest meant the contest ie the same as 'contested possession' stat.

When JL says 'the contest' he's talking stoppages.

 

[s_wd6]

When JL says 'the contest' he's talking stoppages.

View attachment 1726534

Contest applies to stoppage. Winning the stoppage means you win that contest. It is not exclusive to stoppage. Teams can lose stoppages and still win games. Very unlikely for teams to lose contests all over the ground and still win games. I doubt Longmuire is exclusively referring to stoppage when he talks about how we lost the contest. Stoppage is a big part of where we lost the contest, but we also lost it long down the line, in our forward 50 etc.

 

[Spirit Level]

We got royally ****ed in that 5 minute period where the momentum swung, it was cheating and this league is ****en corrupt.

We're going to have to be much better than any Vic side because they're always going to be kept in it by the umpires.

 

[TheInjuryFactory]

Contest applies to stoppage. Winning the stoppage means you win that contest. It is not exclusive to stoppage. Teams can lose stoppages and still win games. Very unlikely for teams to lose contests all over the ground and still win games. I doubt Longmuire is exclusively referring to stoppage when he talks about how we lost the contest. Stoppage is a big part of where we lost the contest, but we also lost it long down the line, in our forward 50 etc.

No matter how much stoppage we lose, we almost always win contests down back. He's not talking about our backs. He says backs when he's talking backs. When he talks not being tough enough or winning the contest, he's talking stoppages.

We can't win games when we don't significantly win clearances. We have zero answer to that.

Agree to disagree. This is semantic pedantry at it's glorious best.

 

[FreoRicci]

Did JL try to create a “coming of age moment” by putting JT, Ras and MJ in the centre at a critical time in the game? If he did then I guess that’s commendable. It was probably a courageous move and not an oversight. Obviously it didn’t work. If you’re gonna throw Ras and MJ in there then at least give them the benefit of having the best tap ruck in the league with them, and not an undersized part timer.
I actually thought JT was much better this week in the ruck around the ground, much better than his effort against GWS. At least he showed he can chop out in the ruck if we need to call on him in the future. That was a real positive from the game.
I agree with others about our lack of quality and class with our small forwards, that seems to be the area we need to address most with our list.

100%. A game like this needed a small to create something out of nothing. Walters can’t always do it every week.

 

[FreoRicci]

We got royally ****ed in that 5 minute period where the momentum swung, it was cheating and this league is ****en corrupt.

We're going to have to be much better than any Vic side because they're always going to be kept in it by the umpires.

Yes and no.
The frees were there v Erasmus.
Ryan wasn’t.

Momentum was on Fremantle’s side having hit the front.
2 goals to start the quarter. Then bulldogs kicked 4-5 in a row. That’s inexcusable

 

[blue shark]

I think it's mostly because the game was lost during a period where our centre bounce mix included Treacy, Erasmus, Johnson - who probably haven't played 50 games between them - vs the dogs mids who all had 200+.

And we were signficantly older and more experienced last year - yes, mostly due to Mundy, but we were still older and more exprienced as a collective. We overacheived, and got found out in the second half of the year. Add to that we lose our midfield coach who was a big part of why we did so well.

We are the youngest, and second most inexperienced team this year. We were never that low last year. We don't get judged in regards to our demographic like other teams with a similar profile, we get judged relative to a season where we overachieved.

Last year Brodie had a solid year and Mundy was serviceable too. NOD and Acres on the wings.
This year who knows what our best midfield looks like?
It should be Brayshaw, Serong, Johnson, Erasmus, O’Meara, Brodie,
Switta and try Young in bursts.
Fyfe looks best suited to the sub position or maybe rotated with Young.
Worner needs to at least get a game.
We miss Mundy’s inside/outside game, or a player with breakaway pace.
Who hits the scoreboard?
We need to find that type of player, trade, draft, to have any chance of success.
Losing Acres and injury to NOD and we have no ideal replacements.

 

[chinggis77]

Why do we always blame the forwards? So many comments about the need to bring in better forwards. Does anyone not pay any attention to modern football and other teams?

You need a spread of goal kickers including midfield and at the moment it is coming almost all from the forwards with virtually nothing from the midfield.

Our midfield is vanilla. We rely on a kick inside 50 to a forward for almost all our goals. Hardly any running goals with a mid getting on the end of it.


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[s_wd6]

No matter how much stoppage we lose, we almost always win contests down back. He's not talking about our backs. He says backs when he's talking backs. When he talks not being tough enough or winning the contest, he's talking stoppages.

We can't win games when we don't significantly win clearances. We have zero answer to that.

Agree to disagree. This is semantic pedantry at it's glorious best.

That's not the point. The contest still refers to everything that goes on around the ground. Our backs generally won their contests, our mids and forwards didn't.

My point was that no team is going to win if they are losing the majority of their contests. You countered by saying that teams can still win through turnover, d50 transitions etc. but they don't score from those if they aren't winning contests.

We have no plan B when we lose clearance and stoppage. That's correct. But no teams have a plan B when they lose contests all over the ground.

 

[s_wd6]

Yes and no.
The frees were there v Erasmus.
Ryan wasn’t.

Momentum was on Fremantle’s side having hit the front.
2 goals to start the quarter. Then bulldogs kicked 4-5 in a row. That’s inexcusable

Ryan wasn't, which directly lead to the Ras one, which was there. But then the bounce directly after that treacy was held without the ball for longer than Bont had been and nothing was called our way, and they get a clearance and goal. THAT fully shifted momentum. You can't argue that Bulldogs fought the momentum back themselves. We had all momentum, and the umpires handed it straight back to the dogs.

What happened after that was entirely our fault, probably mentally more than anything.

 

[Spirit Level]

Yes and no.
The frees were there v Erasmus.
Ryan wasn’t.

Momentum was on Fremantle’s side having hit the front.
2 goals to start the quarter. Then bulldogs kicked 4-5 in a row. That’s inexcusable

If the frees were there on Erasmus it was there when it happened to Treacy in the middle.

Not saying we didn't shit the bed, but we got ****ed

 

[blue shark]

Fyfe should of been subbed earlier, bringing Erasmus into the midfield in the last quarter cold was a mistake.

 

[E Shed]

Not really surprised. The Dogs are older, harder & more experienced than us & they came to play today. The bookies & all the tipsters had them clear favorites for a reason.

I was actually quite impressed with how well we went with them for most of it. Honestly if Fyfe was anything like his best he cancels out Bont & we might have won. Apparently he was playing sore but his touch & game sense seems to have completely deserted him. I reckon put him on ice & see if he can get properly fit for next season. We’re pretty much out of contention for finals now.

Liked Henry, Amiss, Clark, Cox & Walker at times & Young was decent. Serong & Darcy went ok & of course Walters.

Jacko had a mare & our smalls are all out of form. Shultz, Switta & Freddy all continue to be ineffective. Treacy was just ok. Aish poor.

Like others I’m bemused by how we ended up with the poor center setup with the game on the line & some very questionable umpires. I simply have no idea how they adjudicate HTB or decide on what constitutes a mark or a push out at times. Players can take possession, take on 3 tackles & go to ground & that somehow doesn’t constitute HTB. You can throw it, drop it, but only sometimes. It’s maddening.